Revolution in Iran

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cv5 said:
One liner Bible tweets rendering an obtuse opinion that defy Scripture are conclusive proof that you are dead wrong.

BTW, the many proofs that I have already posted you have yet to successfully refute at any point.
Not a one of them.

I could literally post hundreds of similar nature. Enough to make your eyes bleed.
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And what is the hermeneutic for all these proofs?

Written for 2000+ years into the future is that the hermeneutic.......... maybe it is 3000+ years or maybe more...who knows really.
 
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HeIsHere said:
Written to the believers (formerly, primarily gentiles) of Church in Galatia

Paul is clear, no wonder you always have to go back to the OT.
And as many as walk according to this rule, peace be on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.
Galatians 6:16

For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
Galatians 3:26

Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise.
Galatians 4:28

Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham.
Galatians 3:7

And you know what else is clear.......

“If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise” (Galatians 3:29).

Romans 2:28–29: “A person is not a Jew who is one only outwardly, nor is circumcision merely outward and physical. No, a person is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is circumcision of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code. Such a person’s praise is not from other people, but from God.”
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Yes, everyone agrees with all of this. We agree that believers are children of Abraham by faith. That does not equate to "therefore we can erase every prophecy about the nation of Israel in the end times".
 
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Brasspen said:
I don't think Iran is going to plan on ever, letting the USA and Israel get away with what has happened.
Looks like one of those tactics, where a peace deal is made, for the purpose of building an army to attack later.
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That's what they've been trying to do in Ukraine once it became obvious that Russia wasn't going to lose. Russia has learned though that the US/NATO can't be trusted, so there's no chance of a ceasefire.
 
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cv5 said:
False. God has declared in HUNDREDS of passages that He will redeem Israel yet future.
That is the purpose of the time of Jacobs trouble. To bring Israel to the point of repentance.

But there is SO MUCH more: there are the many Biblical types and patterns proving the same.
Furthermore, massive quantities of specific prophecies and commentary that fill fully 1/3 of the Bible.

But the NATION Israel will ONLY obtain their covenant possessions AFTER receiving their Kinsman Redeemer.
Made clear by the four "UNTIL" statements of Scripture. And of course the unequivocal statement by God thru Moses, Ezekiel, Joel, Amos, Micah, Isaiah, Jerimiah and most of the prophets.

Eze 37:11
Then he said unto me, Son of man, these bones are the whole house of Israel: behold, they say, Our bones are dried, and our hope is lost: we are cut off for our parts.

Eze 37:12
Therefore prophesy and say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, O my people, I will open your graves, and cause you to come up out of your graves, and bring you into the land of Israel.

Eze 37:13
And ye shall know that I am the LORD, when I have opened your graves, O my people, and brought you up out of your graves,

Eze 37:14
And shall put my spirit in you, and ye shall live, and I shall place you in your own land: then shall ye know that I the LORD have spoken it, and performed it, saith the LORD.

*********************************************************************

National Israel will not permanently obtain her full Abrahamic/Davidic covenant possessions until she receives her Kinsman-Redeemer (Messiah) at the end of the Time of Jacob’s Trouble.

Let’s test that proposition biblically and prophetically.

1️⃣ The Land Promise Is Unconditional — But Possession Is Conditional
The Covenant Itself

In Genesis 15, God alone passes between the pieces. The land promise is unilateral and irrevocable (cf. Gen 15:18–21; 17:7–8). The covenant depends on God, not Israel’s obedience.

But…

Enjoyment of the Land Is Conditional

Deuteronomy 28 makes clear:

Obedience → security in the land

Disobedience → expulsion from the land

This establishes a pattern:
Title is unconditional; enjoyment is conditional.

2️⃣ Israel’s Final Regathering Requires Repentance

The key text is Deuteronomy 30:1–6.

Notice the order:

Scattering among the nations

National repentance

God gathers them

Then they possess the land permanently

Verse 6 is decisive:

“The LORD thy God will circumcise thine heart…”

That is New Covenant language (cf. Jer 31; Ezek 36).

Thus:
👉 Permanent possession follows spiritual transformation.

3️⃣ The “Time of Jacob’s Trouble” Produces National Repentance

Jeremiah 30:7:

“Alas! for that day is great… it is even the time of Jacob’s trouble; but he shall be saved out of it.”

The tribulation is not merely judgment — it is purification.

Compare:

Zechariah 12:10

“They shall look upon me whom they have pierced…”

Zechariah 13:8–9

A remnant refined and brought to faith.

Repentance comes at the climax of national distress.

4️⃣ The Kinsman-Redeemer Must Be Received Before the Kingdom

The pattern of the Kinsman Redeemer is seen in Ruth:

Naomi (Israel) loses possession

Ruth (Gentile bride) is gathered first

Boaz redeems only after the legal issue is settled

The land is restored through the Redeemer

Prophetic parallel:

Israel temporarily set aside

Gentile fullness gathered (Rom 11:25)

Then “all Israel shall be saved” (Rom 11:26)

5️⃣ Messiah Returns Before Israel’s Kingdom Possession

Matthew 23:39:

“Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh…”

That is national acknowledgment.

Then:

Zechariah 14:3–4
Messiah stands on the Mount of Olives and delivers Jerusalem.

Only after this intervention does Israel dwell securely.

6️⃣ Ezekiel 36–37: Cleansing Before Dwelling Securely

In Ezekiel 36:

Order matters:

Regathering

Cleansing

New heart

Indwelling Spirit

Then dwelling securely in the land

Chapter 37 (Valley of Dry Bones) shows:

National resurrection

Then “David my servant” reigns

Then everlasting covenant of peace

The kingdom follows spiritual rebirth.

7️⃣ Daniel 9 Places the Turning Point at the End of the 70th Week

Daniel 9:24 states six goals for Israel:

Finish transgression

Make an end of sins

Bring in everlasting righteousness

Those are spiritual objectives fulfilled at the climax of the 70th week — not before.

Thus covenant fulfillment waits until that moment.

8️⃣ Romans 11: National Salvation Precedes Restoration

Romans 11:25–27:

Blindness in part… until the fullness of the Gentiles…
And so all Israel shall be saved.

Paul connects:

Removal of blindness

Covenant forgiveness

Then fulfillment of promises

Restoration is tied to redemption.

Logical Flow of the Prophetic Order

Israel scattered

Partial regathering in unbelief (modern state)

Time of Jacob’s Trouble

National repentance

Reception of Messiah

Spiritual regeneration

Messianic Kingdom

Secure covenant possession

If Israel permanently possessed the covenant land before receiving the Redeemer:

Deut 30 order would be violated

Jer 31 New Covenant timing would be reversed

Zech 12 national repentance would be unnecessary

Rom 11 sequence would collapse

Theological Conclusion

Yes — Scripture consistently places permanent covenant possession AFTER national repentance and reception of Messiah at the end of Jacob’s Trouble.

The land promise is irrevocable.
But its final secure enjoyment awaits:

The appearance and acceptance of Israel’s Kinsman-Redeemer.
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Face it, you're an unbeliever in the faith of Christ. What you are promoting is altogether different
 
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@Citizen At this point both arguments have been given. What needs happen is for this fight to stop. Let the judges now decide. That is the people can decide after reading it.

Just end the figting, stop with this stressful argument. There isn't nothing else to say.
 
I personally believe that in the body of Christ, there is neither woman or man, greek or jew. We are all members, and are all equal. I also believe that the children of Israel are God's chosen people.
 
cv5 said:
The term "spiritual Israel" is not found anywhere in Scripture.
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Nowhere in scripture is it found that God wanted a natural kingdom/nation of Israel ruled by men. In fact, just the opposite. He called Israel's demand for a king rebellion and rejection of his rule over them. That is what spiritual Israel is: a nation ruled by God
 
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