Revolution in Iran

[HeIsHere]

Since Calvary - The Jews being Gods chosen people is an oxymoron

Amen!

 

[Churchgoer]

Since Calvary - The Jews being Gods chosen people is an oxymoron

Since the beginning of time, God s promise always point to Jesus. Jews in God's history yes was and is and will be used as a vessel. So are all the other ethnic groups, all the big empires, Christians, .... all vessels for God.
No need to lift up a single vessel and start bow down to that.
A good start is, thou shall have no other gods before me.

 

[cv5]

God's chosen people is whoever in Christ. Has nothing to do with ***ethnic***. Enough already!!!

All clay in potter s hand.

Ah I see you have failed to understand the lesson provided in Jeremiah 18: the fact that God (The Sovereign Potter), is dealing with PEOPLES and NATIONS, the ETHNIC nation of Israel being His focus. For all intents and purposes, all other nations are in ORBIT AROUND His chosen people Israel.

Also I suspect that you have been tripped up into the quagmire of hyper-Calvinism super-determinism as well.

Let me help you by providing the CORRECT and ACCURATE exegetical treatment that you need so badly.
But.....will you hear it?

Fruchtenbaum’s handling of Jeremiah 18 is fundamentally not: “Israel is passive clay, God unilaterally determines every moral act, and therefore the nation’s response is irrelevant.”
It is closer to this:

God is absolutely sovereign over Israel’s historical destiny and over the rise, chastening, preservation, and restoration of nations; yet He deals with people and nations in a morally meaningful way, responding judicially to their real repentance or rebellion.

That is precisely why Jeremiah 18:7–10 is so important. It is not a footnote to the potter illustration; it is God’s own explanation of it.

1. The potter image teaches sovereign authority, not fatalism​

The immediate object is not an abstract theory of individual predestination. God addresses:

“O house of Israel … so are ye in mine hand” (Jer. 18:6).

The clay is Israel corporately, especially Judah/Jerusalem in the immediate context. The point is that Israel is not autonomous. God has the right and power to reshape the nation’s historical circumstances, discipline it, remove it from the land, restore it, preserve a remnant, or bring it into future blessing.

Fruchtenbaum explicitly identifies the potter as God and the clay as Israel, and notes that the marred vessel was remade while it was still workable clay.

That means the illustration is about God’s governmental dealings with His covenant nation. It is not saying, “Israel’s sins were mechanically manufactured by God, so Israel has no real culpability.”

Indeed, the vessel is described as ***becoming*** marred DURING the potter’s work. The image presupposes a real defect requiring remolding; it does not depict the potter delighting in creating a defective vessel merely to condemn it.

2. Verses 7–10 explicitly establish a conditional principle​

God says that when He announces judgment against a nation:

“If that nation … turn from their evil, I will repent of the evil that I thought to do unto them” (v. 8).

And when He announces blessing:

“If it do evil in my sight … then I will repent of the good” (v. 10).

The point could scarcely be clearer: a nation’s real moral response affects God’s historical treatment of it.
So Jeremiah 18 does not teach that a divine warning is merely theater, with repentance impossible unless an irresistible decree first causes it. The warning is a genuine call, and the stated alternative is genuine:

• 
  
• repentance → withheld or mitigated judgment;
• 
  
• rebellion → judgment proceeds;
• 
  
• obedience → continued blessing;
• 
  
• apostasy → withdrawal of a previously announced benefit.

Fruchtenbaum’s own published description of his Jeremiah 18 teaching states the balance plainly: God has given human beings freedom to make decisions, yet God remains sovereign and carries out His divine purposes in the world.
That is the framework through which he would read the passage.

3. “I will repent” does not mean God gained new information or made an error​

The KJV word repent can confuse modern readers. In this context it means that God will relent, or change the announced historical action, because the moral condition to which that warning was directed has changed.
God’s character, omniscience, and ultimate purpose do not change. But His judicial administration toward a nation can change.
A simple way to state it is:

God’s warning contains a real conditionality, even where the “if” is not verbally repeated in the initial warning.

Thus, when a nation repents, God does not say, “My prophecy failed.” Rather, the warning has accomplished its intended purpose: it has summoned repentance and thereby averted the judgment.
Nineveh in Jonah is the classic illustration. God’s announced overthrow was real; Nineveh’s repentance was real; God’s withholding of that temporal judgment was real.

4. Jeremiah 18 itself demolishes the “no meaningful choice” reading​

The chapter does not leave Israel with an abstract lesson about sovereignty. God immediately applies it:

“Return ye now every one from his evil way, and make your ways and your doings good” (Jer. 18:11).

Then Israel answers:

“There is no hope: but we will walk after our own devices” (v. 12).

That is a deliberate national refusal. They are not portrayed as victims saying, “We could not do otherwise because the Potter predetermined our evil.” They knowingly choose stubbornness over the divine summons to turn.
The chapter therefore holds together four truths:

1. 
   
2. God has sovereign authority over Israel and every nation.
3. 
   
4. God judges actual evil, not imaginary evil.
5. 
   
6. God’s calls to repent are sincere.
7. 
   
8. Human rebellion is genuinely blameworthy because the response is morally meaningful.

Hyper-Calvinism tends to make point 1 swallow points 2–4. Jeremiah will not permit that.

5. How this fits Fruchtenbaum’s covenant theology​

This is especially important in Fruchtenbaum’s system because he distinguishes between:

• 
  
• the unconditional Abrahamic, Land, Davidic, and New Covenants; and
• 
  
• the conditional Mosaic Covenant.

Israel’s obedience or disobedience affects such things as discipline, exile, blessing in the land, national prosperity, and the historical experience of a given generation. But Israel’s failures do not erase God’s unconditional covenant commitments to Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, David, and the future national restoration of Israel.
Fruchtenbaum writes that Israel’s obedience did not condition God’s ultimate fulfillment of the Abrahamic promises, even though God repeatedly disciplined Israel for disobedience.

So Jeremiah 18 is not a charter for replacement theology, as though God says:

“Israel sinned; therefore the Abrahamic promises are permanently revoked and transferred elsewhere.”

Rather, it explains how God may uproot, tear down, exile, chastise, delay, and reshape Israel in history without abandoning His covenant oath.
A useful distinction is:

Question	Fruchtenbaum-style answer
Can Israel’s disobedience bring severe national discipline?	Yes.
Can a generation lose blessing, security, land enjoyment, or survival?	Yes.
Can God genuinely call Israel to repent and respond differently if she turns?	Yes.
Does this cancel the unconditional Abrahamic covenant or God’s future restoration of Israel?	No.
Does God’s sovereignty eliminate genuine human responsibility?	No.

Fruchtenbaum repeatedly argues that the Abrahamic covenant remains operative and awaits its full physical fulfillment in the Messianic Kingdom, including the land promises to Israel.

6. The crucial distinction: conditional administration versus unconditional destination​

This is the cleanest reconciliation:

Israel’s ultimate covenant destination is secure because of God’s unconditional promises; Israel’s historical route to that destination includes real warnings, discipline, repentance, unbelief, chastisement, remnant preservation, and eventual national regeneration.

Jeremiah 18 is dealing principally with that second category: God’s conditional, historical administration of nations.
Thus the Babylonian judgment was not evidence that God had revoked Abrahamic election. It was evidence that God was faithfully enforcing His moral government and the sanctions of the Mosaic covenant.

And the future restoration is not evidence that national unbelief never mattered. It is evidence that God remains faithful to His oath and will finally bring Israel to the repentance promised elsewhere—especially in passages such as Zechariah 12:10, Ezekiel 36:24–28, and Romans 11:25–29.

 

[cv5]

Since Calvary - The Jews being Gods chosen people is an oxymoron

The Greater Joseph will surely be embracing His brethren when He reveals Himself, this is prophetically inevitable.
Likewise the promised possession of Naomi will certainly be redeemed by the Greater Boaz.

This Boaz incidentally marries gentile Ruth during this process if you care to notice.

Yes, cringeworthy Biblical illiteracy runs deep on this thread, and yes, it is inexcusable and BLAMEWORTHY.

 

[Churchgoer]

Ah I see you have failed to understand the lesson provided in Jeremiah 18: the fact that God (The Sovereign Potter), is dealing with PEOPLES and NATIONS, the ETHNIC nation of Israel being His focus. For all intents and purposes, all other nations are in ORBIT AROUND His chosen people Israel.

Also I suspect that you have been tripped up into the quagmire of hyper-Calvinism super-determinism as well.

Let me help you by providing the CORRECT and ACCURATE exegetical treatment that you need so badly.
But.....will you hear it?

Fruchtenbaum’s handling of Jeremiah 18 is fundamentally not: “Israel is passive clay, God unilaterally determines every moral act, and therefore the nation’s response is irrelevant.”
It is closer to this:

That is precisely why Jeremiah 18:7–10 is so important. It is not a footnote to the potter illustration; it is God’s own explanation of it.

1. The potter image teaches sovereign authority, not fatalism​

The immediate object is not an abstract theory of individual predestination. God addresses:

The clay is Israel corporately, especially Judah/Jerusalem in the immediate context. The point is that Israel is not autonomous. God has the right and power to reshape the nation’s historical circumstances, discipline it, remove it from the land, restore it, preserve a remnant, or bring it into future blessing.

Fruchtenbaum explicitly identifies the potter as God and the clay as Israel, and notes that the marred vessel was remade while it was still workable clay.

That means the illustration is about God’s governmental dealings with His covenant nation. It is not saying, “Israel’s sins were mechanically manufactured by God, so Israel has no real culpability.”

Indeed, the vessel is described as ***becoming*** marred DURING the potter’s work. The image presupposes a real defect requiring remolding; it does not depict the potter delighting in creating a defective vessel merely to condemn it.

2. Verses 7–10 explicitly establish a conditional principle​

God says that when He announces judgment against a nation:

And when He announces blessing:

The point could scarcely be clearer: a nation’s real moral response affects God’s historical treatment of it.
So Jeremiah 18 does not teach that a divine warning is merely theater, with repentance impossible unless an irresistible decree first causes it. The warning is a genuine call, and the stated alternative is genuine:

• 
  
• repentance → withheld or mitigated judgment;
• 
  
• rebellion → judgment proceeds;
• 
  
• obedience → continued blessing;
• 
  
• apostasy → withdrawal of a previously announced benefit.

Fruchtenbaum’s own published description of his Jeremiah 18 teaching states the balance plainly: God has given human beings freedom to make decisions, yet God remains sovereign and carries out His divine purposes in the world.
That is the framework through which he would read the passage.

3. “I will repent” does not mean God gained new information or made an error​

The KJV word repent can confuse modern readers. In this context it means that God will relent, or change the announced historical action, because the moral condition to which that warning was directed has changed.
God’s character, omniscience, and ultimate purpose do not change. But His judicial administration toward a nation can change.
A simple way to state it is:

Thus, when a nation repents, God does not say, “My prophecy failed.” Rather, the warning has accomplished its intended purpose: it has summoned repentance and thereby averted the judgment.
Nineveh in Jonah is the classic illustration. God’s announced overthrow was real; Nineveh’s repentance was real; God’s withholding of that temporal judgment was real.

4. Jeremiah 18 itself demolishes the “no meaningful choice” reading​

The chapter does not leave Israel with an abstract lesson about sovereignty. God immediately applies it:

Then Israel answers:

That is a deliberate national refusal. They are not portrayed as victims saying, “We could not do otherwise because the Potter predetermined our evil.” They knowingly choose stubbornness over the divine summons to turn.
The chapter therefore holds together four truths:

1. 
   
2. God has sovereign authority over Israel and every nation.
3. 
   
4. God judges actual evil, not imaginary evil.
5. 
   
6. God’s calls to repent are sincere.
7. 
   
8. Human rebellion is genuinely blameworthy because the response is morally meaningful.

Hyper-Calvinism tends to make point 1 swallow points 2–4. Jeremiah will not permit that.

5. How this fits Fruchtenbaum’s covenant theology​

This is especially important in Fruchtenbaum’s system because he distinguishes between:

• 
  
• the unconditional Abrahamic, Land, Davidic, and New Covenants; and
• 
  
• the conditional Mosaic Covenant.

Israel’s obedience or disobedience affects such things as discipline, exile, blessing in the land, national prosperity, and the historical experience of a given generation. But Israel’s failures do not erase God’s unconditional covenant commitments to Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, David, and the future national restoration of Israel.
Fruchtenbaum writes that Israel’s obedience did not condition God’s ultimate fulfillment of the Abrahamic promises, even though God repeatedly disciplined Israel for disobedience.

So Jeremiah 18 is not a charter for replacement theology, as though God says:

Rather, it explains how God may uproot, tear down, exile, chastise, delay, and reshape Israel in history without abandoning His covenant oath.
A useful distinction is:

Question	Fruchtenbaum-style answer
Can Israel’s disobedience bring severe national discipline?	Yes.
Can a generation lose blessing, security, land enjoyment, or survival?	Yes.
Can God genuinely call Israel to repent and respond differently if she turns?	Yes.
Does this cancel the unconditional Abrahamic covenant or God’s future restoration of Israel?	No.
Does God’s sovereignty eliminate genuine human responsibility?	No.

Fruchtenbaum repeatedly argues that the Abrahamic covenant remains operative and awaits its full physical fulfillment in the Messianic Kingdom, including the land promises to Israel.

6. The crucial distinction: conditional administration versus unconditional destination​

This is the cleanest reconciliation:

Jeremiah 18 is dealing principally with that second category: God’s conditional, historical administration of nations.
Thus the Babylonian judgment was not evidence that God had revoked Abrahamic election. It was evidence that God was faithfully enforcing His moral government and the sanctions of the Mosaic covenant.

And the future restoration is not evidence that national unbelief never mattered. It is evidence that God remains faithful to His oath and will finally bring Israel to the repentance promised elsewhere—especially in passages such as Zechariah 12:10, Ezekiel 36:24–28, and Romans 11:25–29.

If you want to follow that teaching, then go ahead.
May the almighty God reveal the truth to you.
God only, no others.

 

[HeIsHere]

If you want to follow that teaching, then go ahead.
May the almighty God reveal the truth to you.
God only, no others.

Yes, that is the truth of it, they have the choice to follow "that teaching"........thankfully that "teaching" is reaching its real time expiry

date to be marked Not Fulfilled... and then it will be seen for what it always was... a false paradigm.

 

[WayneNSO]

Ah I see you have failed to understand the lesson provided in Jeremiah 18: the fact that God (The Sovereign Potter), is dealing with PEOPLES and NATIONS, the ETHNIC nation of Israel being His focus. For all intents and purposes, all other nations are in ORBIT AROUND His chosen people Israel.

Also I suspect that you have been tripped up into the quagmire of hyper-Calvinism super-determinism as well.

Let me help you by providing the CORRECT and ACCURATE exegetical treatment that you need so badly.
But.....will you hear it?

Fruchtenbaum’s handling of Jeremiah 18 is fundamentally not: “Israel is passive clay, God unilaterally determines every moral act, and therefore the nation’s response is irrelevant.”
It is closer to this:

That is precisely why Jeremiah 18:7–10 is so important. It is not a footnote to the potter illustration; it is God’s own explanation of it.

1. The potter image teaches sovereign authority, not fatalism​

The immediate object is not an abstract theory of individual predestination. God addresses:

The clay is Israel corporately, especially Judah/Jerusalem in the immediate context. The point is that Israel is not autonomous. God has the right and power to reshape the nation’s historical circumstances, discipline it, remove it from the land, restore it, preserve a remnant, or bring it into future blessing.

Fruchtenbaum explicitly identifies the potter as God and the clay as Israel, and notes that the marred vessel was remade while it was still workable clay.

That means the illustration is about God’s governmental dealings with His covenant nation. It is not saying, “Israel’s sins were mechanically manufactured by God, so Israel has no real culpability.”

Indeed, the vessel is described as ***becoming*** marred DURING the potter’s work. The image presupposes a real defect requiring remolding; it does not depict the potter delighting in creating a defective vessel merely to condemn it.

2. Verses 7–10 explicitly establish a conditional principle​

God says that when He announces judgment against a nation:

And when He announces blessing:

The point could scarcely be clearer: a nation’s real moral response affects God’s historical treatment of it.
So Jeremiah 18 does not teach that a divine warning is merely theater, with repentance impossible unless an irresistible decree first causes it. The warning is a genuine call, and the stated alternative is genuine:

• 
  
• repentance → withheld or mitigated judgment;
• 
  
• rebellion → judgment proceeds;
• 
  
• obedience → continued blessing;
• 
  
• apostasy → withdrawal of a previously announced benefit.

Fruchtenbaum’s own published description of his Jeremiah 18 teaching states the balance plainly: God has given human beings freedom to make decisions, yet God remains sovereign and carries out His divine purposes in the world.
That is the framework through which he would read the passage.

3. “I will repent” does not mean God gained new information or made an error​

The KJV word repent can confuse modern readers. In this context it means that God will relent, or change the announced historical action, because the moral condition to which that warning was directed has changed.
God’s character, omniscience, and ultimate purpose do not change. But His judicial administration toward a nation can change.
A simple way to state it is:

Thus, when a nation repents, God does not say, “My prophecy failed.” Rather, the warning has accomplished its intended purpose: it has summoned repentance and thereby averted the judgment.
Nineveh in Jonah is the classic illustration. God’s announced overthrow was real; Nineveh’s repentance was real; God’s withholding of that temporal judgment was real.

4. Jeremiah 18 itself demolishes the “no meaningful choice” reading​

The chapter does not leave Israel with an abstract lesson about sovereignty. God immediately applies it:

Then Israel answers:

That is a deliberate national refusal. They are not portrayed as victims saying, “We could not do otherwise because the Potter predetermined our evil.” They knowingly choose stubbornness over the divine summons to turn.
The chapter therefore holds together four truths:

1. 
   
2. God has sovereign authority over Israel and every nation.
3. 
   
4. God judges actual evil, not imaginary evil.
5. 
   
6. God’s calls to repent are sincere.
7. 
   
8. Human rebellion is genuinely blameworthy because the response is morally meaningful.

Hyper-Calvinism tends to make point 1 swallow points 2–4. Jeremiah will not permit that.

5. How this fits Fruchtenbaum’s covenant theology​

This is especially important in Fruchtenbaum’s system because he distinguishes between:

• 
  
• the unconditional Abrahamic, Land, Davidic, and New Covenants; and
• 
  
• the conditional Mosaic Covenant.

Israel’s obedience or disobedience affects such things as discipline, exile, blessing in the land, national prosperity, and the historical experience of a given generation. But Israel’s failures do not erase God’s unconditional covenant commitments to Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, David, and the future national restoration of Israel.
Fruchtenbaum writes that Israel’s obedience did not condition God’s ultimate fulfillment of the Abrahamic promises, even though God repeatedly disciplined Israel for disobedience.

So Jeremiah 18 is not a charter for replacement theology, as though God says:

Rather, it explains how God may uproot, tear down, exile, chastise, delay, and reshape Israel in history without abandoning His covenant oath.
A useful distinction is:

Question	Fruchtenbaum-style answer
Can Israel’s disobedience bring severe national discipline?	Yes.
Can a generation lose blessing, security, land enjoyment, or survival?	Yes.
Can God genuinely call Israel to repent and respond differently if she turns?	Yes.
Does this cancel the unconditional Abrahamic covenant or God’s future restoration of Israel?	No.
Does God’s sovereignty eliminate genuine human responsibility?	No.

Fruchtenbaum repeatedly argues that the Abrahamic covenant remains operative and awaits its full physical fulfillment in the Messianic Kingdom, including the land promises to Israel.

6. The crucial distinction: conditional administration versus unconditional destination​

This is the cleanest reconciliation:

Jeremiah 18 is dealing principally with that second category: God’s conditional, historical administration of nations.
Thus the Babylonian judgment was not evidence that God had revoked Abrahamic election. It was evidence that God was faithfully enforcing His moral government and the sanctions of the Mosaic covenant.

And the future restoration is not evidence that national unbelief never mattered. It is evidence that God remains faithful to His oath and will finally bring Israel to the repentance promised elsewhere—especially in passages such as Zechariah 12:10, Ezekiel 36:24–28, and Romans 11:25–29.

People fail to Distinguish between Israel and Judah in the Bible. The house of Israel was Divorced by God and Taken into captivity by the Assyrians, they lost their Identity becoming like the Gentile nations:

James 1:1 James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting.


In Jeramiah 18:4-6 we see God as the potter remoulding the house of Israel. Whereas in the next chapter concerning the house of Judah, he is told to get an earthen bottle - Jeremiah 19:1-3 - and break it - Jeremiah 19:20 - Jeremiah 19:22 - it is smashed so it can not be made whole again

 

[ThereRoseaLamb]

Haha, the Bible is about Christ!!!

Not about isreal ethnic group.

That's for sure.

God is calling the Jews back to Him to this very day. Israel is the apple of His eye, that has not changed. Romans 11 is clear about what God has in store for the Jewish people.

 

[ThereRoseaLamb]

Just that simple. No privilege to anyone.

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt because you're new. No one here has even said Jews are saved any other way than through the cross.

 

[WayneNSO]

God is calling the Jews back to Him to this very day. Israel is the apple of His eye, that has not changed. Romans 11 is clear about what God has in store for the Jewish people.

Again you mix up Judah and Israel. Romans is about the tribes of Israel in the gentile nations - this is why Christianity spread in the West. The devil and Zionist deceived you all by naming that tiny anti-Christ country Israel and confused you all.

 

[ThereRoseaLamb]

Again you mix up Judah and Israel. Romans is about the tribes of Israel in the gentile nations - this is why Christianity spread in the West. The devil and Zionist deceived you all by naming that tiny anti-Christ country Israel and confused you all.

No, I am not confused, not in the least! Read your Bible. God says Israel will ever be a nation before me. Anti-Zionist is just another way to hide racism. Romans 11 is about God restoring the Jews. Clear as can be. God's love for the Jews has never changed.

 

[Churchgoer]

God is calling the Jews back to Him to this very day. Israel is the apple of His eye, that has not changed. Romans 11 is clear about what God has in store for the Jewish people.

All believers are the body of Christ. Note, believers.
Who is more important, eyes, heart, legs arms, kidney....
Stop idolizing any single group, not to mention they aren't even in the covenant with Jesus, God almighty.

God calling people back , yes, return to God, so God will return to them. Return the heart to God. Not earthly belongings.

 

[Churchgoer]

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt because you're new. No one here has even said Jews are saved any other way than through the cross.

Thank you.
Bingo.
Then what's the argument?

 

[cv5]

People fail to Distinguish between Israel and Judah in the Bible. The house of Israel was Divorced by God and Taken into captivity by the Assyrians, they lost their Identity becoming like the Gentile nations:

James 1:1 James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting.


In Jeramiah 18:4-6 we see God as the potter remoulding the house of Israel. Whereas in the next chapter concerning the house of Judah, he is told to get an earthen bottle - Jeremiah 19:1-3 - and break it - Jeremiah 19:20 - Jeremiah 19:22 - it is smashed so it can not be made whole again

What? You say that Judah is somehow exempt from this Jeremiah 19 judgement?
Demonstrably FALSE. The broken bottle undoubtedly pertains to Judah.

Jer 19:7
And I will make void the counsel of Judah and Jerusalem in this place; and I will cause them to fall by the sword before their enemies, and by the hands of them that seek their lives: and their carcases will I give to be meat for the fowls of the heaven, and for the beasts of the earth.

Jer 19:11
And shalt say unto them, Thus saith the LORD of hosts; Even so will I break this people and this city, as one breaketh a potter's vessel, that cannot be made whole again: and they shall bury them in Tophet, till there be no place to bury.

Jer 19:13
And the houses of Jerusalem, and the houses of the kings of Judah, shall be defiled as the place of Tophet, because of all the houses upon whose roofs they have burned incense unto all the host of heaven, and have poured out drink offerings unto other gods.

 

[ThereRoseaLamb]

All believers are the body of Christ. Note, believers.
Who is more important, eyes, heart, legs arms, kidney....
Stop idolizing any single group, not to mention they aren't even in the covenant with Jesus, God almighty.

God calling people back , yes, return to God, so God will return to them. Return the heart to God. Not earthly belongings.

God's special relationship with the Jews should not make you all jealous. What it should do is show you how deep God's mercy really is and His love.

 

[ThereRoseaLamb]

Thank you.
Bingo.
Then what's the argument?

With you? I don't believe there is one. With others it's that they believe they have replaced the Jews and God's through with them. The church gets all the blessings, the Jews get all the curses. That's the issue that Martin Luther revived and it hasn't quit since then, driving major Antisemitism.

 

[cv5]

All believers are the body of Christ. Note, believers.
Who is more important, eyes, heart, legs arms, kidney....
Stop idolizing any single group, not to mention they aren't even in the covenant with Jesus, God almighty.

God calling people back , yes, return to God, so God will return to them. Return the heart to God. Not earthly belongings.

Aaahhhh look @Churchgoer :
In this ***present*** "Church age" (which will certainly end and soon), SALVATION (and the blessings that come by the TYPE of the faith of Abraham) has zero ethnic or national component. This much is true.

Jew and gentile, man or woman, all tribes tongues peoples and nations, out of all of these shall be extracted the Bride of Christ.

Aaaaannnd then its over. The harpazo comes, the Bride is snatched.
And then back comes the redeemed Nation Israel as God's chosen nation of priests to stand as witnesses to the gentile world during the millennium.

Do you actually believe that this present Church age continues forever, and is of an infinite duration?
And that the Church is somehow going to "take over the world"?
There are plenty of people around here who actually believe this biblically illiterate nonsense.

 

[WayneNSO]

When Zionist are losing an argument they always resort to the Anti-Semitism trope, its sad

 

[cv5]

Again you mix up Judah and Israel. Romans is about the tribes of Israel in the gentile nations - this is why Christianity spread in the West. The devil and Zionist deceived you all by naming that tiny anti-Christ country Israel and confused you all.

Looks like you flunked out of Romans class too.
Who do you listen to and where do you get these biblically illiterate ideas?
Sounds like Herbert W. Armstrong insanity to me.

 

[ThereRoseaLamb]

When Zionist are losing an argument they always resort to the Anti-Semitism trope, its sad

Zionists believe Israel has a right to live in and defend their homeland. Explain why that should not be so.