Righteousness

[garee]

1 John 3 & 5
Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.

Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin, for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not.

Yes the sin will not be imputed unto them .This shows Christ our confidence has begun the good work working in us to both will and perform His good pleasure. Its what the seed of faith does . It does not mean we do not actively deny the faith 2 Timothy 2:13 but because he has begun the good work He will work in us to Finish his work of faith labor of love i till the end .

Philippians 1:5-6 For your fellowship in the gospel from the first day until now; Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:

Philippians 2:13 -14 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure. Do all things without murmurings and disputings:

If its God working in us .What is there to fight about. How to hear???

2 Timothy 2:13 If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself.

To say we actively do not sin is to call God the liar according to 1 John

1 John 1:9-10 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

 

[Finepearl]

1 John 3 & 5
Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.

Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin, for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not.

A consideration of Greek tenses helped me to clarify the meaning of the Apostle John’s words in following verses:
Firstly just to mention 1 John 1:8 clearly states we are deceiving ourselves if we say we have no sin.
John of course was a ‘born again’ Christian and was addressing his fellow ‘born again’ Christians.

At 1 John 2:1 John states ‘If any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father’. The Greek verb for ‘sin’ in this verse is in the aorist tense, hence points to one act of sinning as opposed to continuous or progressive action.

At 1 John 3:6,9 In these verses with reference to ‘sinning’ the Greek verb used is in the present tense denoting continuous action. Various modern bible translations take note of this with renderings such as: ‘does not make a practice of sinning’, ‘does not habitually sin’, does not continue to sin’

In summary what I believe John is saying is that ones ‘ Born of God’ still battle with a conflict between ‘sins law’ that is in their imperfect flesh and ‘God’s Law’. Such ones can still sin (momentarily) and will be forgiven if they openly confess such a sin (1 John 1:9). On the other hand one truly ‘Born of God’ cannot persist in or make a practice of sin.

Worthy of note is Hebrews 6:4-6 which shows that ones ‘Born of God’ can fall away and lose their righteous standing with God.

 

[Peterlag]

A consideration of Greek tenses helped me to clarify the meaning of the Apostle John’s words in following verses:
Firstly just to mention 1 John 1:8 clearly states we are deceiving ourselves if we say we have no sin.
John of course was a ‘born again’ Christian and was addressing his fellow ‘born again’ Christians.

At 1 John 2:1 John states ‘If any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father’. The Greek verb for ‘sin’ in this verse is in the aorist tense, hence points to one act of sinning as opposed to continuous or progressive action.

At 1 John 3:6,9 In these verses with reference to ‘sinning’ the Greek verb used is in the present tense denoting continuous action. Various modern bible translations take note of this with renderings such as: ‘does not make a practice of sinning’, ‘does not habitually sin’, does not continue to sin’

In summary what I believe John is saying is that ones ‘ Born of God’ still battle with a conflict between ‘sins law’ that is in their imperfect flesh and ‘God’s Law’. Such ones can still sin (momentarily) and will be forgiven if they openly confess such a sin (1 John 1:9). On the other hand one truly ‘Born of God’ cannot persist in or make a practice of sin.

Worthy of note is Hebrews 6:4-6 which shows that ones ‘Born of God’ can fall away and lose their righteous standing with God.

Yeah Paul also was a born again Christian addressing his fellow "born again" Christians when he penned Romans. Yet Romans 10:9-10 are not written to believers.

 

[Finepearl]

Yeah Paul also was a born again Christian addressing his fellow "born again" Christians when he penned Romans. Yet Romans 10:9-10 are not written to believers.

Thanks but I made no reference to Romans 10. But your statement regarding Paul is correct he was also a born again Christian and addressing his fellow brothers. Notice his words at Romans 7:21-25.
He acknowledged his inner struggle and inclination to sin. All Christians should acknowledge this and continually strive to maintain a righteous standing with God, as did Paul.

 

[garee]

Yeah Paul also was a born again Christian addressing his fellow "born again" Christians when he penned Romans. Yet Romans 10:9-10 are not written to believers.

Can't divide prophecy, the power of faith that works in us .

Unbelievers do not hear the word of God and obey its commandment in order to believe the words of the mouth of God.

Of our own mouth we have no power to confess and be heard on high . If we confess it is because he a has strengthened or empowered us. We must decrease .

His strength is made complete in our inability to confess. He makes the load lighter.

Romans 10:9-10 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For with the(newly created) heart man believeth unto (His) righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

2 Corinthians 4:7 But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us.

 

[tantalon]

Romans 10: 8,9,10. is giving a truism, in other words scriptural facts of conversion. The Bible is a closed book to the unregenerate as 1Cor. 2: 14. states, and I quote: "But the natural man RECIEVES NOT the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: NEITHER can he KNOW THEM, because they are spiritually discerned". This is saying that before conversion, a person is "dead" to the things of God, because his spirit is still dead (to God) in trespasses and sins.

 

[Peterlag]

Thanks but I made no reference to Romans 10. But your statement regarding Paul is correct he was also a born again Christian and addressing his fellow brothers. Notice his words at Romans 7:21-25.
He acknowledged his inner struggle and inclination to sin. All Christians should acknowledge this and continually strive to maintain a righteous standing with God, as did Paul.

I think you went off context concerning what we were talking about.

 

[garee]

Thanks but I made no reference to Romans 10. But your statement regarding Paul is correct he was also a born again Christian and addressing his fellow brothers. Notice his words at Romans 7:21-25.
He acknowledged his inner struggle and inclination to sin. All Christians should acknowledge this and continually strive to maintain a righteous standing with God, as did Paul.

Yes God does not lovingly command unbelievers that have "no faith" coming from hearing His word the power to believe. . By believing, exercising working out our new faith we can hear and ask for strength to do His good will. .

 

[Peterlag]

Yes God does not lovingly command unbelievers that have "no faith" coming from hearing His word the power to believe. . By believing, exercising working out our new faith we can hear and ask for strength to do His good will. .

I told someone that 1 John talking about that everyone sins was written to the unbelievers. Someone said 1 John was written to believers. I said and so was Romans but Romans 10:9-10 was written to the unbelievers.

 

[garee]

I told someone that 1 John talking about that everyone sins was written to the unbelievers. Someone said 1 John was written to believers. I said and so was Romans but Romans 10:9-10 was written to the unbelievers.

I heard what you said and clearly do not believe that kind of idea. The bible is written to them that believe it .Not one word as a loving commandment is towards those who have no faith of Christ.

Can't separate scripture form scripture. or author of books from other moved to do the will of God .Some pit Paul against James etc

We are to rightful divide the whole. Not subtract or add. Not assign one portion to a believer and the other to non believers.

We are made aware of that kind of wile of the father of lies

 

[Peterlag]

I heard what you said and clearly do not believe that kind of idea. The bible is written to them that believe it .Not one word as a loving commandment is towards those who have no faith of Christ.

Can't separate scripture form scripture. or author of books from other moved to do the will of God .Some pit Paul against James etc

We are to rightful divide the whole. Not subtract or add. Not assign one portion to a believer and the other to non believers.

We are made aware of that kind of wile of the father of lies

Not all of the bible is from God and it tells us that clearly. Paul tells us in Romans 10 that he's talking to Israel and therefore that part is not addressed to Christians. The book of James says it's addressed to the twelve tribes and 1 Corinthians 7 is where Paul tells us he speaks as a man and not from the Lord.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

Paul tells us in Romans 10 that he's talking to Israel and therefore that part is not addressed to Christians.

So when we read Romans 10:13 (for whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved), that truth is not applicable to non-Jews???

Or how about Romans 10:17 (faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God), that's only to Jews?

Then what about Hebrews 11 where God talks of believers who lived before the children of Israel (Jews) ... as well as Rahab (who lived after the children of Israel were called out of Egypt, yet was a gentile)???

 

[garee]

Not all of the bible is from God and it tells us that clearly. Paul tells us in Romans 10 that he's talking to Israel and therefore that part is not addressed to Christians. The book of James says it's addressed to the twelve tribes and 1 Corinthians 7 is where Paul tells us he speaks as a man and not from the Lord.

Every word of the bible is inspired by God. not one word or syllable by mankind as a private interpretation . Not one peep

Speaking of Israel which is Israel?. Believers as inward Jews not after the flesh but Israel after the Spirit of Christ. .In Acts God renamed his bride Israel to Christian a more befitting name for a bride made up of all the nations of the world.

When he speaks to tribes he is addressing the believers in the tribes not the unbelievers .They that have no faith and do not hear and believe the word of God .Hearing God and believing by faith is the gift with any nation and tribe any people

And of course men that prophecy declare the will of another not seen bring the gospel. They speak as men not the Lord unseen. That verse is not promoting private interpretations. And is not saying he spoke his own thoughts of the flesh.

We can not separate the authority of the word of God form the one author who wrote it.

 

[Peterlag]

Every word of the bible is inspired by God. not one word or syllable by mankind as a private interpretation . Not one peep

Speaking of Israel which is Israel?. Believers as inward Jews not after the flesh but Israel after the Spirit of Christ. .In Acts God renamed his bride Israel to Christian a more befitting name for a bride made up of all the nations of the world.

When he speaks to tribes he is addressing the believers in the tribes not the unbelievers .They that have no faith and do not hear and believe the word of God .Hearing God and believing by faith is the gift with any nation and tribe any people

And of course men that prophecy declare the will of another not seen bring the gospel. They speak as men not the Lord unseen. That verse is not promoting private interpretations. And is not saying he spoke his own thoughts of the flesh.

We can not separate the authority of the word of God form the one author who wrote it.

There are parts of the bible where it talks about the Jews and those are not Christians. Or Jewish Christians as you put it. Gentile are those who were not Jewish or Christian. They were not Greek Christians.

 

[Peterlag]

So when we read Romans 10:13 (for whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved), that truth is not applicable to non-Jews???

Or how about Romans 10:17 (faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God), that's only to Jews?

Then what about Hebrews 11 where God talks of believers who lived before the children of Israel (Jews) ... as well as Rahab (who lived after the children of Israel were called out of Egypt, yet was a gentile)???

Again, if they have to call upon the name of the Lord to be saved. Then can you understand how a guy like me might think they are not yet born again and therefore not Christians?

 

[garee]

There are parts of the bible where it talks about the Jews and those are not Christians. Or Jewish Christians as you put it. Gentile are those who were not Jewish or Christian. They were not Greek Christians.

Words have meaning attached to them .Study the meaning of the word Israel and why the Bible mentions "all Israel is not Israel" just as "a Jew is not one outwardly as to what the eyes see but one born again inwardly". And then study why God changed the name of His bride from Israel to Christian . A word when looked at its foundation . literally meaning, "residents of the heavenly city of Christ" . Renamed the bride in Acts after its founder our husband, Christ .prepared as his bride.( Revelation 21) They follow Christ.

Christian I think is a more befitting name. Seeing she is made up of all the nations and not just one. The Israelites

 

[garee]

Again, if they have to call upon the name of the Lord to be saved. Then can you understand how a guy like me might think they are not yet born again and therefore not Christians?

Ask yourself where did the power that did allow you to call come from?

The Bible say no man of his volition can come.(impossible) .

Mankind cannot come to Him unless he calls giving us ears to understand and a new will to believe .And not after the imaginations of our own faithless hearts. .Other wise a person would have no understanding how to seek after Him?

The faith of Christ that works in us is not of us. We cannot see past the horizon yet alone into eternity .

Romans 3"11“There is no one righteous, not even one; there is no one who understands; there is no one who seeks God.

 

[Peterlag]

Ask yourself where did the power that did allow you to call come from?

The Bible say no man of his volition can come.(impossible) .

Mankind cannot come to Him unless he calls giving us ears to understand and a new will to believe .And not after the imaginations of our own faithless hearts. .Other wise a person would have no understanding how to seek after Him?

The faith of Christ that works in us is not of us. We cannot see past the horizon yet alone into eternity .

Romans 3"11“There is no one righteous, not even one; there is no one who understands; there is no one who seeks God.

I'm righteous. Jesus Christ has us locked into this new covenant because this is the oath God has sworn to, and it's the covenant Christ has bonded with. It's a covenant of love that allows us to dwell in God’s love, and thus dwell in God—and God in us. It's what we have, it's who we are, and it's the right relationship with God, who has established this “new covenant.” We are heirs of God, and joint heirs with Jesus Christ, who has made us righteous, given us redemption, sanctification, and wisdom.

 

[Peterlag]

Words have meaning attached to them .Study the meaning of the word Israel and why the Bible mentions "all Israel is not Israel" just as "a Jew is not one outwardly as to what the eyes see but one born again inwardly". And then study why God changed the name of His bride from Israel to Christian . A word when looked at its foundation . literally meaning, "residents of the heavenly city of Christ" . Renamed the bride in Acts after its founder our husband, Christ .prepared as his bride.( Revelation 21) They follow Christ.

Christian I think is a more befitting name. Seeing she is made up of all the nations and not just one. The Israelites

I don't believe what you do.

 

[garee]

I don't believe what you do.

Did you study ? Words have meaning.

For instance when God said. let there be light .Light appeared. When he named his Bride Israel he purposely defined the meaning .

When he renamed her Christian there was meaning in the same way.

The whole Bible is written to His bride the church. She as the spiritual house of God is made from lively stones from all nations.