Saved by faith alone?

[scarletthread]

you concept is nuts grace empowers works it does not cancel them

Jn 15:4
Romans 1:5
Colossians 1:6

2 Corinthians 12:9
And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.

does His strength cancel or replace our weakness?

thks

It is God's grace that saves us. The scripture does teach that we are justified by faith, but salvation involves other things beside justification (new birth, adoption, sanctification, etc)

So faith does not save us, the power and mercy of God does, but it must be received.

 

[Inquisitor]

40The King will reply, ‘I tell you, whenever you did this for one of the least important of these followers of mine, you did it for me!’

Read the line above carefully.

Only Christians can spiritually and physically look after other Christians but especially the weakest.

But you cannot look after the followers of Jesus without first having the Holy Spirit.

The Holy Spirit is the seal of your election by Jesus Himself and is a gift.

 

[BartholomewB]

Read the line above carefully.

Only Christians can spiritually and physically look after other Christians but especially the weakest.

But you cannot look after the followers of Jesus without first having the Holy Spirit.

The Holy Spirit is the seal of your election by Jesus Himself and is a gift.

Yes, I have read it carefully. Have you?

Note the words: Whenever you did this. “Did.” Do you understand what the word “did” means? To “do” something is to perform an action.

What Jesus is saying here is that, in order to be considered righteous, we have to perform certain actions. He lists six such actions, from feeding the hungry to visiting prisoners. Those six actions subsequently became known as “the corporal works of mercy.”

 

[scarletthread]

Yes, I have read it carefully. Have you?

Note the words: Whenever you did this. “Did.” Do you understand what the word “did” means? To “do” something is to perform an action.

What Jesus is saying here is that, in order to be considered righteous, we have to perform certain actions. He lists six such actions, from feeding the hungry to visiting prisoners. Those six actions subsequently became known as “the corporal works of mercy.”

Good works are essential to a Christian life, but only the death, resurrection, and present Priestly ministry of Jesus can take away sins, propitiate, and make a sinner clean.

Good works follow and result from justification. The FRUIT, not the root. ( Not sure who said that. )

 

[scarletthread]

I was declared righteous and received the Holy Spirit before I did any good work at all.

 

[BartholomewB]

Good works are essential to a Christian life, but only the death, resurrection, and present Priestly ministry of Jesus can take away sins, propitiate, and make a sinner clean.

Good works follow and result from justification. The FRUIT, not the root. ( Not sure who said that. )

Going back to the passage in Matthew 28 that I cut-and-pasted in my post #3280, is Jesus saying here that a person who has performed the corporal works of mercy will be saved whereas a person who has not performed them will not be saved? That’s what it looks like to me. Just that, nothing else.

 

[BartholomewB]

Correction: Matthew 25

 

[Mem]

Yes, I have read it carefully. Have you?

Note the words: Whenever you did this. “Did.” Do you understand what the word “did” means? To “do” something is to perform an action.

What Jesus is saying here is that, in order to be considered righteous, we have to perform certain actions. He lists six such actions, from feeding the hungry to visiting prisoners. Those six actions subsequently became known as “the corporal works of mercy.”

Your interpretation has made a sterile, clinical formula for love, which is the underlying running theme in the entire chapter of Matt 25. The context you of your reference verses reflect the consequence of love or indifference as do the parables of the ten virgins and that of the talents that precede it.

 

[BartholomewB]

Your interpretation has made a sterile, clinical formula for love, which is the underlying running theme in the entire chapter of Matt 25. The context you of your reference verses reflect the consequence of love or indifference as do the parables of the ten virgins and that of the talents that precede it.

No, I am not "interpreting" anything at all. I am simply reading the words on the printed page.

 

[Inquisitor]

Yes, I have read it carefully. Have you?

Note the words: Whenever you did this. “Did.” Do you understand what the word “did” means? To “do” something is to perform an action.

What Jesus is saying here is that, in order to be considered righteous, we have to perform certain actions. He lists six such actions, from feeding the hungry to visiting prisoners. Those six actions subsequently became known as “the corporal works of mercy.”

You need to be first empowered by the Holy Spirit to perform a good deed.

The Holy Spirit works in you and through you to accomplish the Lord's task.

You seem to have this idea that you can do something in the spiritual realm?

 

[BartholomewB]

You need to be first empowered by the Holy Spirit to perform a good deed.

The Holy Spirit works in you and through you to accomplish the Lord's task.

You seem to have this idea that you can do something in the spiritual realm?

No, my idea is a much simpler one than that. In this passage Jesus lists a series of six actions and says people who did those things are saved and people who didn’t are not saved. That is the only idea I’m expressing here.

 

[Inquisitor]

No, my idea is a much simpler one than that. In this passage Jesus lists a series of six actions and says people who did those things are saved and people who didn’t are not saved. That is the only idea I’m expressing here.

If someone does a prison visit and is kind to a prisoner then that person is saved?

 

[Mem]

No, I am not "interpreting" anything at all. I am simply reading the words on the printed page.

Interpreting the words on the printed page, correctly, is absolutely necessary in the exercise of reading anything at all.

 

[BartholomewB]

@Inquisitor and @Mem,

I’m suddenly surprised to find that I need to ask you both a very basic question ― so basic, in fact, that it hadn’t previously crossed my mind that your answer might be anything other than a plain “Yes.” Now I'm not so sure. The question is this: In your view, did Jesus truly speak the words that, in these sixteen verses, Matthew is reporting him as saying?

To refresh your memory here they are again:

31 “When the Son of Man comes as King and all the angels with him, he will sit on his royal throne, 32and the people of all the nations will be gathered before him. Then he will divide them into two groups, just as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33He will put the righteous people at his right and the others at his left. 34Then the King will say to the people on his right, ‘Come, you that are blessed by my Father! Come and possess the kingdom which has been prepared for you ever since the creation of the world. 35 I was hungry and you fed me, thirsty and you gave me a drink; I was a stranger and you received me in your homes, 36naked and you clothed me; I was sick and you took care of me, in prison and you visited me.’ 37The righteous will then answer him, ‘When, Lord, did we ever see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you a drink? 38When did we ever see you a stranger and welcome you in our homes, or naked and clothe you? 39When did we ever see you sick or in prison, and visit you?’ 40The King will reply, ‘I tell you, whenever you did this for one of the least important of these followers of mine, you did it for me!’

41“Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Away from me, you that are under God's curse! Away to the eternal fire which has been prepared for the Devil and his angels! 42I was hungry but you would not feed me, thirsty but you would not give me a drink; 43I was a stranger but you would not welcome me in your homes, naked but you would not clothe me; I was sick and in prison but you would not take care of me.’ 44Then they will answer him, ‘When, Lord, did we ever see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and we would not help you?’ 45The King will reply, ‘I tell you, whenever you refused to help one of these least important ones, you refused to help me.’ 46 These, then, will be sent off to eternal punishment, but the righteous will go to eternal life.”

 

[DavidLamb]

If someone does a prison visit and is kind to a prisoner then that person is saved?

Well, on the subject of prisons, when the jailer at Philippi asked how he could be saved, the apostles didn't say, "Be kind to your prisoners and you will be saved," but:

"Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved." (Acts 16:31)

 

[Inquisitor]

40The King will reply, ‘I tell you, whenever you did this for one of the least important of these followers of mine, you did it for me!’

The caveat is your kindness, love, compassion, is for the brethren.

 

[Cameron143]

@Inquisitor and @Mem,

I’m suddenly surprised to find that I need to ask you both a very basic question ― so basic, in fact, that it hadn’t previously crossed my mind that your answer might be anything other than a plain “Yes.” Now I'm not so sure. The question is this: In your view, did Jesus truly speak the words that, in these sixteen verses, Matthew is reporting him as saying?

To refresh your memory here they are again:

31 “When the Son of Man comes as King and all the angels with him, he will sit on his royal throne, 32and the people of all the nations will be gathered before him. Then he will divide them into two groups, just as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33He will put the righteous people at his right and the others at his left. 34Then the King will say to the people on his right, ‘Come, you that are blessed by my Father! Come and possess the kingdom which has been prepared for you ever since the creation of the world. 35 I was hungry and you fed me, thirsty and you gave me a drink; I was a stranger and you received me in your homes, 36naked and you clothed me; I was sick and you took care of me, in prison and you visited me.’ 37The righteous will then answer him, ‘When, Lord, did we ever see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you a drink? 38When did we ever see you a stranger and welcome you in our homes, or naked and clothe you? 39When did we ever see you sick or in prison, and visit you?’ 40The King will reply, ‘I tell you, whenever you did this for one of the least important of these followers of mine, you did it for me!’

41“Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Away from me, you that are under God's curse! Away to the eternal fire which has been prepared for the Devil and his angels! 42I was hungry but you would not feed me, thirsty but you would not give me a drink; 43I was a stranger but you would not welcome me in your homes, naked but you would not clothe me; I was sick and in prison but you would not take care of me.’ 44Then they will answer him, ‘When, Lord, did we ever see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and we would not help you?’ 45The King will reply, ‘I tell you, whenever you refused to help one of these least important ones, you refused to help me.’ 46 These, then, will be sent off to eternal punishment, but the righteous will go to eternal life.”

Yes Jesus spoke these words, but He isn't giving a list of do's and don'ts to achieve salvation. Rather, He is giving a list of behaviors that characterize how sheep live as opposed to how goats live. To believe otherwise invalidates salvation by grace and makes salvation contingent upon works. This is contrary to Ephesians 2:8-9.

 

[Wansvic]

Well, on the subject of prisons, when the jailer at Philippi asked how he could be saved, the apostles didn't say, "Be kind to your prisoners and you will be saved," but:

"Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved." (Acts 16:31)

Another thing that story reveals is what believing on the Lord Jesus involves:

Acts 16:31-34 should be read as one continuous account, not as isolated verses.

Acts 16:31

"Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house."

This is the summary answer to the jailer's question, "What must I do to be saved?" However, the account does not end there. Luke immediately records what believing in the Lord Jesus involved.


Acts 16:32

"And they spake unto him the word of the Lord, and to all that were in his house."

Verse 32 explains how the jailer could believe. Biblical faith comes by hearing God's Word (Romans 10:17).
Paul and Silas did not leave after saying, "Just believe." They taught him the message of the Lord in greater detail.


Acts 16:33

"And he took them the same hour of the night... and was baptized, he and all his, straightway."

Verse 33 shows the jailer's immediate response to what he heard. His faith was demonstrated by obedience. Even though it was the middle of the night, he and his household were baptized without delay, indicating that baptism was presented as an urgent part of responding to the gospel.


Acts 16:34

"And when he had brought them into his house, he set meat before them, and rejoiced, believing in God with all his house."

Verse 34 concludes the account by describing the result. The jailer rejoiced because he and his household had responded in faith to the message they had heard. The word "believing" here summarizes the entire response recorded in verses 32-33, not merely mental assent. Believing included hearing the Word and obeying what God commanded.

 

[Mem]

No, my idea is a much simpler one than that. In this passage Jesus lists a series of six actions and says people who did those things are saved and people who didn’t are not saved. That is the only idea I’m expressing here.

So, all you have to do is find someone hungry and feed him and you're saved. Is that what you gathered from those words you read?

 

[amazingrace]

not our works at all

Yes. Your faith in eternal life

Not your works.

We cannot persevere on own own efforts, we must must have God's grace, strength, & help!

mt 7:7 ask and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you:

If we have to ask and if we have to ask daily there can be no such thing as auto-matic perseverance!

thks