scripture on conspiracy

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pickles

Senior Member
Apr 20, 2009
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Ive been struggling with all the conspiracy theories we see everywhere lately.
Mostly, because it calls judgement without proof.
It also does bring a witness of fear, causing others to act in ways that bring harm.
For we see evidence of this every day.
Now I know that there are probably truths out there that need to be revieled.
But, one who in faith, has Jesus with them, should know that as Jesus said....
" I am the way, the truth and the life! "

I found this scripture and just wanted to share it.
Let it speak to you as God desires of you.

Isaiah 8:11-13
11: For thus said the Lord to me with a mighty power, and instructed me not to in the way of this
people saying,
12 You are not to say,"It is a conspiracy!" In regard to all that people call a conspiracy,
and you are not to fear what they fear or be in dread of it.
13: It is the Lord of hosts whom you should reguard as holy and He shall be your fear and He shall be your dread.

There is more in this chapter that is a good read. :)
I hope it speaks to you, as in Jesus, it spoke to me.

In the love of Jesus
God bless
pickles
 
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I was hoping for another nice juicy conspiracy theory but I think Pickles is working with some of the others hiding it from the rest of us :cool:
 
Jeremiah 11:9
Then the LORD said to me, "There is a conspiracy among the people of Judah and those who live in Jerusalem.
 
Conspiracy Theories have been part of the American culture for well over 100 years. Its become a national institution, where just about anyone can express a conspiracy theory on anything and everything. Look at all the conspiracy over Boston bombings.
 
Jeremiah 11:9
Then the LORD said to me, "There is a conspiracy among the people of Judah and those who live in Jerusalem.

But this scripture is God speaking to a conspiracy, not a people or us.
Zone, Im not trying to speak against you, I see your commitment to researching these things because you desire truth. :)
We all desire and seek truth. :)
But, these things have bothered me in heart, and just as you desire the truth, I do also.
Thus this thread, so we can discuss these things. :)

The thing is? Jesus said I am the way, the truth and the life.
And praise God that in Jesus we have and recieve the truth!
So Im asking if looking for truth in the world or worldly ways, is something we all need to consider and discuss?

God bless
pickles
 
Conspiracy Theories have been part of the American culture for well over 100 years. Its become a national institution, where just about anyone can express a conspiracy theory on anything and everything. Look at all the conspiracy over Boston bombings.

Yes they have been. :)
The truth is though, we as christians are called to a higher power and to not be in the ways of the world.
Also, to see these threories is one thing, but to be apart of such, well that is the question here in Jesus.
Now I agree there is truth in some of what is conspired, but there are also lies.
And lately, seems that there is nothing true anymore , when one looks to these theories.

One of the questions being put forth here, is that since all is often theories?
Are we not placing an unfair judgement on others when we believe some of these theories?
Also, such beliefs can bring confusion and fear.
Scripture says that God is not a God of confusion, so how does this effect our accepting these things?
Scripture says that perfect love has no fear, for fear involves torment.
So, one sees that these conspiracys bring torment to some, so we should consider this?

We are called to seek truth, so thus this thread, for scripture does give us what we need to disern.
So, let us disern and seek truth in Jesus Christ is Lord on this. :)

I have also seen scriptures warning about conspiracies, hopefully others here will find and share them. :)

Thankyou and God bless
pickles
 
Truth is found in God not this world. And while we are to seek the truth in God, we are not to be ignorant of the world. There has been a worldly conspiracy against man ever since satan first thought "hey let's go tempt Adam". But conspiracies are never to be feared. Any that are not true will have the fear put into them when exposed to God's Truth.
 
pickles...i love you:) i think you know that.
i hope you do.

this may be a long post, since i want to address your concerns thoroughly if possible.


first -
if you are conflicted or convicted about conspiracy....

honestly...i do suggest not looking at anything you feel is a conspiracy, or a "conspiracy theory".
just bypass the posts or things you see and hear that upset you.

if you are upset by political or other discussions - try to ignore or avoid them pickles...this really is the simplest way.
or find a way to process any information you think may be valuable to you, as a christian, and disregard the rest.

i will say to you personally at the start of this post..i apologize if i have caused you upset or confusion or have contributed to causing you to stumble in any way.

though i do and always have had a deep conviction from The Lord to learn about and confront and repel false teachers; altered or distorted history, etc....too often i have done this through the strength of human wisdom or willpower without connecting it to, or relying on the Good News of the Obedience of the Lord, even unto death on a Cross.

though i can not and will not (without direction from Jesus) cease fulfilling my calling in Him, nor compromise my convictions, i surely can and will try to remember to direct any conclusions back to our lives here on earth, and to keep in mind what the meaning might be for witness and the assistance of the lost.

i admit i fail regularly to keep these things in mind.
the internet is tricky, and a single discussion forum is a challenge.

but i'll try to post in the Miscellaneous thread more often, making these kinds of discussions easier to avoid if one chooses to.

thanks for addressing it pickles.

......

having said all those things, i thank you for the opportunity to discuss the whole idea and issue and the concept of conspiracies; and "conspiracy theory".

it is important, for the reasons you stated, and for another reason - why is the idea of "conspiracy theories" such a touchy subject to begin with?

maybe we can look at a couple of things that might help place actual conspiracies themselves AND talk of conspiracies in perspective:

the term "conspiracy theory" itself is used as a trigger by social engineers.
verifiable simple research has shown that social theorists and engineers (such as the Frankfurt School) researched the very concept of labeling and found it useful for many things.

they devised it according to social theorist Hegel's dialectical process (altering society through linguists and semantics).

the term itself ("conspiracy, or conspiracy theory") is used to instill a host of reactions - fear; suspicion; deflection; derision; rejection; denial...it's often used to shut down the discourse.

not all theories or discussion about conspiracies (which simply means "An agreement to perform together an illegal, wrongful, or subversive act.") are true, nor should most be given the time of day.

the words or discussions in themselves can't harm you, any more than anything else can if you are working within God's Will.

as a Christian, we have liberty to go to school; study history; read the daily newspaper; watch television. it is what we do with the information that matters.

i see nowhere in Scripture a commandment against processing information, against learning (accurate history, for example; political and geopolitical theory and practice, etc). again...it depends on our motivations, and what we do with the information.

recall Daniel's promotion in Babylon - he was of God's people, yet he advanced in all areas of learning and held positions in the pagan king's court. same with Joseph. there's no Biblical prohibition against learning. and no prohibition against knowing things.

the balance must be there, as you have rightly said - if God is our King, and His ways are our desire, this will be evident.

HOWEVER - IF we are seeking to control events; or to control others; or to work outside God's Will using knowledge of history of political or world events...THEN we are not leaning on the Lord; not primarily concerned with the good of the church; and we are likely working from our will and our wishes. i am guilty of this too often.

having said that, i do not believe we are called to ever be ignorant of satan's devices, nor ignorant or unmindful of the plans of the enemies of Christ and His church, or to be unaware of injustices taking place around us.

God is the judge, and He will avenge.
yet i see nowhere we're called to be unaware.



cont....
 
hi pickles, cont...


....

RE: CONSPIRACY

this might help clarify that words are harmless - without words we'd be in trouble concerning communication, right?:

all "conspiracy" means and has ever meant is:

n. pl. con·spir·a·cies
1. An agreement to perform together an illegal, wrongful, or subversive act.
2. A group of conspirators.
3. Law An agreement between two or more persons to commit a crime or accomplish a legal purpose through illegal action.
4. A joining or acting together, as if by sinister design: a conspiracy of wind and tide that devastated coastal areas.

so, we see the word conspiracy applies in everyday events; all the time. we're in a fallen world, and conspiracies happen millions of time every day.

it's not a huge scary word, and it is a legitimate word.
it means just what the dictionary definition means.

but, since certain recent events in the world have in fact, and on record, involved large conspiracies and cover-ups, and have on record involved persons we have elected to govern our affairs; people we have placed in positions of trust.....including inside the visisble church.......the word has been used as a method of sheep-dipping (branding; making to look alike; making something appear to be similar), or silencing anyone who merely discusses possible involvement of persons who desire to not be implicated.

it has become a label that is used more by those who have learned to reject anything they may hear once the word "conspiracy" is attached to it, than it is used by people who try to investigate history.:)

legitimate investigation, historical research and examination of current events is way too often dismissed as "conspiracy theory". from my perspective, i find this to be often a stumbling block and rather frustrating.

said another way....the ones harmed by the term "conspiracy theory" are really those who reject everything as conspiracy theory.

....

an example:

it is not unbiblical for a Christian to be employed as a police officer.

as a police officer (means of employment/professional calling); that person would be virtually useless without the ability to investigate crimes. police officers must have an objective perspective while at the same time be willing to consider any and all suspects and possibilities.

why does a Christian become a police officer? many reasons i guess...one begin a desire for justice.

can you imagine if a detective investigating a crime or potential crime was derided as a "conspiracy theorist" for following leads on a case?

....

the other word attached to the already (intentionally) loaded word "conspiracy"...is the word "theory".

okay...let's look at the word theory (the words themselves are legitimate! as is their meaning!):

the·o·ry [thee-uh-ree, theer-ee]
noun, plural the·o·ries.
1.
a coherent group of tested general propositions, commonly regarded as correct, that can be used as principles of explanation and prediction for a class of phenomena: Einstein's theory of relativity. Synonyms: principle, law, doctrine.
2.
a proposed explanation whose status is still conjectural and subject to experimentation, in contrast to well-established propositions that are regarded as reporting matters of actual fact. Synonyms: idea, notion hypothesis, postulate. Antonyms: practice, verification, corroboration, substantiation.
3.
Mathematics . a body of principles, theorems, or the like, belonging to one subject: number theory.
4.
the branch of a science or art that deals with its principles or methods, as distinguished from its practice: music theory.
5.
a particular conception or view of something to be done or of the method of doing it; a system of rules or principles: conflicting theories of how children best learn to read.

......


so the two words are simple and legitimate.

placed side by side, they ACTUALLY BECOME WEAPONIZED.


and are wielded as weapons both against the researcher and those who react negatively to the two words.

those two words are too often used against genuine investigation and search for justice, if not just truth.

what i've taken from your OP - is to remember AGAIN that i fail regularly to keep truth and love together.
i'm also aware that CC may not be the best forum for discussing global politics or varying worldviews and the like.
this doesn't effect my personal convictions or calling.
just the assumption and perhaps hope that i may find others who "multitask" (lol....can't think of a better word).
perhaps critical thinking is closer to what i mean.

this may not be the place for my contributions....if i have any.
i'll think it over.

i try not to go into crackpot postulations and krazy reptile talk. i may be failing.
i'll have to measure things overall.
perhaps this isn't the best place.


God Bless in Christ Our Lord pickles,
zone.
 
Last edited:
backspace backspace. Imagine governments conspiring.
Oh i just cant:p get out of here!
 
here is another scripture that applies very well to the debate over conspiracy theory...

2 timothy 1:7..."For God has not given us a spirit of fear, but of power and of love and of a sound mind."

and also...

colossians 2:8..."See to it that no one takes you captive through philosophy and empty deception, according to the tradition of men, according to the elementary principles of the world, rather than according to Christ."

this becomes relevant when you realize that conspiracy theory is really nothing more than the pinnacle of postmodern deconstructionism...which is ironic considering how many conspiracy theorists claim that postmodernism is part of the conspiracy...
 
pickles...i love you:) i think you know that.
i hope you do.

this may be a long post, since i want to address your concerns thoroughly if possible.


first -
if you are conflicted or convicted about conspiracy....

honestly...i do suggest not looking at anything you feel is a conspiracy, or a "conspiracy theory".
just bypass the posts or things you see and hear that upset you.

if you are upset by political or other discussions - try to ignore or avoid them pickles...this really is the simplest way.
or find a way to process any information you think may be valuable to you, as a christian, and disregard the rest.

i will say to you personally at the start of this post..i apologize if i have caused you upset or confusion or have contributed to causing you to stumble in any way.

though i do and always have had a deep conviction from The Lord to learn about and confront and repel false teachers; altered or distorted history, etc....too often i have done this through the strength of human wisdom or willpower without connecting it to, or relying on the Good News of the Obedience of the Lord, even unto death on a Cross.

though i can not and will not (without direction from Jesus) cease fulfilling my calling in Him, nor compromise my convictions, i surely can and will try to remember to direct any conclusions back to our lives here on earth, and to keep in mind what the meaning might be for witness and the assistance of the lost.

i admit i fail regularly to keep these things in mind.
the internet is tricky, and a single discussion forum is a challenge.

but i'll try to post in the Miscellaneous thread more often, making these kinds of discussions easier to avoid if one chooses to.

thanks for addressing it pickles.

......

having said all those things, i thank you for the opportunity to discuss the whole idea and issue and the concept of conspiracies; and "conspiracy theory".

it is important, for the reasons you stated, and for another reason - why is the idea of "conspiracy theories" such a touchy subject to begin with?

maybe we can look at a couple of things that might help place actual conspiracies themselves AND talk of conspiracies in perspective:

the term "conspiracy theory" itself is used as a trigger by social engineers.
verifiable simple research has shown that social theorists and engineers (such as the Frankfurt School) researched the very concept of labeling and found it useful for many things.

they devised it according to social theorist Hegel's dialectical process (altering society through linguists and semantics).

the term itself ("conspiracy, or conspiracy theory") is used to instill a host of reactions - fear; suspicion; deflection; derision; rejection; denial...it's often used to shut down the discourse.

not all theories or discussion about conspiracies (which simply means "An agreement to perform together an illegal, wrongful, or subversive act.") are true, nor should most be given the time of day.

the words or discussions in themselves can't harm you, any more than anything else can if you are working within God's Will.

as a Christian, we have liberty to go to school; study history; read the daily newspaper; watch television. it is what we do with the information that matters.

i see nowhere in Scripture a commandment against processing information, against learning (accurate history, for example; political and geopolitical theory and practice, etc). again...it depends on our motivations, and what we do with the information.

recall Daniel's promotion in Babylon - he was of God's people, yet he advanced in all areas of learning and held positions in the pagan king's court. same with Joseph. there's no Biblical prohibition against learning. and no prohibition against knowing things.

the balance must be there, as you have rightly said - if God is our King, and His ways are our desire, this will be evident.

HOWEVER - IF we are seeking to control events; or to control others; or to work outside God's Will using knowledge of history of political or world events...THEN we are not leaning on the Lord; not primarily concerned with the good of the church; and we are likely working from our will and our wishes. i am guilty of this too often.

having said that, i do not believe we are called to ever be ignorant of satan's devices, nor ignorant or unmindful of the plans of the enemies of Christ and His church, or to be unaware of injustices taking place around us.

God is the judge, and He will avenge.
yet i see nowhere we're called to be unaware.



cont....

Zone. sorry I did not answer sooner,was recovering from the dentist yesterday.

First, understand that I do not suffer from what any posts on conspiracy, for this post is not about such upsetting me.
But about what we are called to in scripture in referance to conspiracy.
But thankyou for the apoligy . :)
Ill answer the rest with your continued. :)


God bless
pickles
 
1 John 5

We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not. 19And we know that we are of God, and the whole world lieth in wickedness. 20And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

We are given so much insight through the Bible.

satan poses as an angel of light and offers much in return for worship.

We are not to fear and get carried away with the ways of the wicked.. but we must acknowledge what this world is really about.
 
hi pickles, cont...


....

RE: CONSPIRACY

this might help clarify that words are harmless - without words we'd be in trouble concerning communication, right?:

all "conspiracy" means and has ever meant is:

n. pl. con·spir·a·cies
1. An agreement to perform together an illegal, wrongful, or subversive act.
2. A group of conspirators.
3. Law An agreement between two or more persons to commit a crime or accomplish a legal purpose through illegal action.
4. A joining or acting together, as if by sinister design: a conspiracy of wind and tide that devastated coastal areas.

so, we see the word conspiracy applies in everyday events; all the time. we're in a fallen world, and conspiracies happen millions of time every day.

it's not a huge scary word, and it is a legitimate word.
it means just what the dictionary definition means.

but, since certain recent events in the world have in fact, and on record, involved large conspiracies and cover-ups, and have on record involved persons we have elected to govern our affairs; people we have placed in positions of trust.....including inside the visisble church.......the word has been used as a method of sheep-dipping (branding; making to look alike; making something appear to be similar), or silencing anyone who merely discusses possible involvement of persons who desire to not be implicated.

it has become a label that is used more by those who have learned to reject anything they may hear once the word "conspiracy" is attached to it, than it is used by people who try to investigate history.:)

legitimate investigation, historical research and examination of current events is way too often dismissed as "conspiracy theory". from my perspective, i find this to be often a stumbling block and rather frustrating.

said another way....the ones harmed by the term "conspiracy theory" are really those who reject everything as conspiracy theory.

....

an example:

it is not unbiblical for a Christian to be employed as a police officer.

as a police officer (means of employment/professional calling); that person would be virtually useless without the ability to investigate crimes. police officers must have an objective perspective while at the same time be willing to consider any and all suspects and possibilities.

why does a Christian become a police officer? many reasons i guess...one begin a desire for justice.

can you imagine if a detective investigating a crime or potential crime was derided as a "conspiracy theorist" for following leads on a case?

....

the other word attached to the already (intentionally) loaded word "conspiracy"...is the word "theory".

okay...let's look at the word theory (the words themselves are legitimate! as is their meaning!):

the·o·ry [thee-uh-ree, theer-ee]
noun, plural the·o·ries.
1.
a coherent group of tested general propositions, commonly regarded as correct, that can be used as principles of explanation and prediction for a class of phenomena: Einstein's theory of relativity. Synonyms: principle, law, doctrine.
2.
a proposed explanation whose status is still conjectural and subject to experimentation, in contrast to well-established propositions that are regarded as reporting matters of actual fact. Synonyms: idea, notion hypothesis, postulate. Antonyms: practice, verification, corroboration, substantiation.
3.
Mathematics . a body of principles, theorems, or the like, belonging to one subject: number theory.
4.
the branch of a science or art that deals with its principles or methods, as distinguished from its practice: music theory.
5.
a particular conception or view of something to be done or of the method of doing it; a system of rules or principles: conflicting theories of how children best learn to read.

......


so the two words are simple and legitimate.

placed side by side, they ACTUALLY BECOME WEAPONIZED.


and are wielded as weapons both against the researcher and those who react negatively to the two words.

those two words are too often used against genuine investigation and search for justice, if not just truth.

what i've taken from your OP - is to remember AGAIN that i fail regularly to keep truth and love together.
i'm also aware that CC may not be the best forum for discussing global politics or varying worldviews and the like.
this doesn't effect my personal convictions or calling.
just the assumption and perhaps hope that i may find others who "multitask" (lol....can't think of a better word).
perhaps critical thinking is closer to what i mean.

this may not be the place for my contributions....if i have any.
i'll think it over.

i try not to go into crackpot postulations and krazy reptile talk. i may be failing.
i'll have to measure things overall.
perhaps this isn't the best place.


God Bless in Christ Our Lord pickles,
zone.


Thankyou zone for the meaning of conspiracy, for those who might not know.

You compared looking or investigating a conspiracy to a police detective.
There is ahuge differance though.
A police detective is absolutly responcible and accountible for all all evidence collected, and must have obtained all evidence in a legal and just manner, he cannot just make an accusation or aquire that evidence with out cause.
To do so brings dismissal of that evidence, it is refured to as forbidden fruit.
Also, the accuse is innocent untill proven guilty, and has the right to be judged fairly by thier peers.

Now I agree we do need to be aware of evil, and it should be exposed when responcibly obtained, and without reckless accusations.
But some of what is seen in many quoted conspiracy claims lately compairs more to global gossip than truth.
Also, there is an accountbuility, as there are some who do act upon information they believe is true, often with violence.

Please do not missunderstand the point of this thread, it is not to say we cannot persue truth, it is speaking to the abuse of such theories, and what we as christians are asked to do or not do.
The point of this thread is accountbuility and understanding if we should have any part, or what we are accountible for.
Because words do bring harm, scripture does speak to what comes out of our moths as being the most vile and sinful.

So the perpose of this thread is to understand as christians, what we should or should not do in refrance to such disscussions or accusations.
It is not saying we cannot expose evil, but even then, the good news is God said all will be revieled and known. :)


Thankyou zone for your input, as you are correct, there is no wrong in bringing evil to light.

God bless
pickles