Some things about the law that need explaining.
- Thread starter Blik
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Matthew 5
17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. 18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. 19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.
Messiah was very clear verse 19 ...
Messiah was very clear verse 19 ...
so why does KJV mistranslate 2 Corinthians 3 as 'testament', seeing it is a clear & direct parallel to Exodus 20 & 34 etc, while it is exactly the same word in the actual language of scripture, not the confused foreign tongue we speak, in Hebrews 8-9? in Exodus we're clearly using the same word that we are in Zechariah 4, in Hosea 2, and Jeremiah 31. the same word that the author of Hebrews uses in Greek is the same word Paul uses in his letter to the Corinthians and the same word Matthew, Mark & Luke use quoting Christ at their last supper together. what's this supposed context that makes the Greek language wrong and the translation of it into a foreign babble more correct?
you haven't read the preface to the KJV huh?
they purposefully translated a single Greek or Hebrew word with many different English words, and they caught a lot of flak among the scholars of their day for it. the reasoning they gave wasn't 'more accurate nuance based on interpretation of context over-ruling the plain language' as you are suggesting. their reasoning - explicitly - was to make the language more beautiful through varying vocabulary.
so i'm also wondering where you get this idea? seems like backwards-justifying to me.
you haven't read the preface to the KJV huh?
they purposefully translated a single Greek or Hebrew word with many different English words, and they caught a lot of flak among the scholars of their day for it. the reasoning they gave wasn't 'more accurate nuance based on interpretation of context over-ruling the plain language' as you are suggesting. their reasoning - explicitly - was to make the language more beautiful through varying vocabulary.
so i'm also wondering where you get this idea? seems like backwards-justifying to me.
-
1
- Show all
contrary to such traditional preaching, Hebrews actually calls them the same thing:
similarly in Genesis 15 when the LORD God sealed the covenant with Abraham, blood was shed, but neither Abraham nor the LORD died in order for it to be ratified, but the LORD passed through the parts of the animals, testifying to the promise He made.
why is the ark called both 'ark of the testimony' ((e.g. Exodus 25:16)) and 'ark of the covenant' ((e.g. Numbers 10:33))? because the English language corrects the ancient Hebrew? or because our foreign words and our human teachers make a distinction the scripture doesn't?
For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator. For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth. Whereupon neither the first testament was dedicated without blood. For when Moses had spoken every precept to all the people according to the law, he took the blood of calves and of goats, with water, and scarlet wool, and hyssop, and sprinkled both the book, and all the people, Saying, This is the blood of the testament which God hath enjoined unto you.
(Hebrews 9:16-20)
it is not that the law of the Sinai covenant ((explicitly "the first testament" -- see "the words around it")) had no effect until Moses died. it is that it is effectual because it remains in place even after he died -- and it was not the calves & goats who made the covenant/testament with Israel, but the LORD God. similarly in Genesis 15 when the LORD God sealed the covenant with Abraham, blood was shed, but neither Abraham nor the LORD died in order for it to be ratified, but the LORD passed through the parts of the animals, testifying to the promise He made.
why is the ark called both 'ark of the testimony' ((e.g. Exodus 25:16)) and 'ark of the covenant' ((e.g. Numbers 10:33))? because the English language corrects the ancient Hebrew? or because our foreign words and our human teachers make a distinction the scripture doesn't?
-
1
-
1
- Show all
@Guojing @John146
look:
same thing. in Hebrew these are two different words; in Greek it is one word. in Hebrew one is the abstraction 'covenant' and the other is the declaration or corporeal evidence of it 'testimony/testament' but in Greek the same word may be either used alternately with tangible or meta-reference.
God chose Greek to give His gospel, for a reason. a perfect reason; and it wasn't to confuse people.
look:
And thou shalt put the mercy seat above upon the ark; and in the ark thou shalt put the testimony that I shall give thee.
(Exodus 25:21)
And He declared unto you His covenant, which He commanded you to perform, even ten commandments; and He wrote them upon two tables of stone.
(Deuteronomy 4:13)
same thing. in Hebrew these are two different words; in Greek it is one word. in Hebrew one is the abstraction 'covenant' and the other is the declaration or corporeal evidence of it 'testimony/testament' but in Greek the same word may be either used alternately with tangible or meta-reference.
God chose Greek to give His gospel, for a reason. a perfect reason; and it wasn't to confuse people.
have you read the Bible?
you guys are wrong; the human doctrines you've been taught & regurgitate are contradictory to the Bible.
i'm sorry but this topic is going to do one of 3 things to you:
merry Christmas; my gift to you
For when Moses had spoken every precept to all the people according to the law, he took the blood of calves and of goats, with water, and scarlet wool, and hyssop, and sprinkled both the book, and all the people, saying,
This is the blood of the testament which God hath enjoined unto you.
(Hebrews 9:19-20 kjv)
And Moses took the blood, and sprinkled it on the people, and said,
Behold the blood of the covenant, which the Lord hath made with you concerning all these words.
(Exodus 24:8 kjv)
either the KJV is wrong in one of these places, according to your own argument -- or covenant & testament are interchangeably the same thing in the gospels & epistles, as the very language and context of scripture itself quite emphatically declares both in the old & the newyou guys are wrong; the human doctrines you've been taught & regurgitate are contradictory to the Bible.
i'm sorry but this topic is going to do one of 3 things to you:
- wreck your kjv-onlyism
- wreck your dispensationalist traditions
- make you choose to ignore what the Bible actually says
merry Christmas; my gift to you
-
2
- Show all