SPEAKING TONGUES

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Kavik

Senior Member
Mar 25, 2017
793
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believe it or not ---

A Neuroscientific Look at Speaking in Tongues

https://www.nytimes.com/2006/11/07/health/07brain.html#:~:text=Researchers at the University of,as were the language centers.

Researchers at the University of Pennsylvania took brain images of five women while they spoke in tongues and found that their frontal lobes — the thinking, willful part of the brain through which people control what they do — were relatively quiet, as were the language centers. The regions involved in maintaining self-consciousness were active. The women were not in blind trances, and it was unclear which region was driving the behavior.

The images, appearing in the current issue of the journal Psychiatry Research: Neuroimaging, pinpoint the most active areas of the brain. The images are the first of their kind taken during this spoken religious practice, which has roots in the Old and New Testaments and in Pentecostal churches established in the early 1900s. The women in the study were healthy, active churchgoers.

“The amazing thing was how the images supported people’s interpretation of what was happening,” said Dr. Andrew B. Newberg, leader of the study team, which included Donna Morgan, Nancy Wintering and Mark Waldman. “The way they describe it, and what they believe, is that God is talking through them,” he said.

Dr. Newberg is also a co-author of “Why We Believe What We Believe.”

In the study, the researchers used imaging techniques to track changes in blood flow in each woman’s brain in two conditions, once as she sang a gospel song and again while speaking in tongues. By comparing the patterns created by these two emotional, devotional activities, the researchers could pinpoint blood-flow peaks and valleys unique to speaking in tongues.


Ms. Morgan, a co-author of the study, was also a research subject. She is a born-again Christian who says she considers the ability to speak in tongues a gift. “You’re aware of your surroundings,” she said. “You’re not really out of control. But you have no control over what’s happening. You’re just flowing. You’re in a realm of peace and comfort, and it’s a fantastic feeling.”

Contrary to what may be a common perception, studies suggest that people who speak in tongues rarely suffer from mental problems. A recent study of nearly 1,000 evangelical Christians in England found that those who engaged in the practice were more emotionally stable than those who did not. Researchers have identified at least two forms of the practice, one ecstatic and frenzied, the other subdued and nearly silent.

The new findings contrasted sharply with images taken of other spiritually inspired mental states like meditation, which is often a highly focused mental exercise, activating the frontal lobes.

The scans also showed a dip in the activity of a region called the left caudate. “The findings from the frontal lobes are very clear, and make sense, but the caudate is usually active when you have positive affect, pleasure, positive emotions,” said Dr. James A. Coan, a psychologist at the University of Virginia. “So it’s not so clear what that finding says” about speaking in tongues.

The caudate area is also involved in motor and emotional control, Dr. Newberg said, so it may be that practitioners, while mindful of their circumstances, nonetheless cede some control over their bodies and emotions.

As a linguist, I’m very familiar with the study done by the Univ. of PA using SPECT imaging. The results are exactly what one would expect. The reason why the language producing centers of the brain are not overly active in the production of glossolalia (tongues-speech ) is because it is not language; it’s non-cognitive non-language utterance – random free vocalization. As such, these centers in the brain do not need to be overly active – there’s no language being produced. These results have been twisted by certain groups to “evidence” that tongues-speech is the Holy Spirit speaking through the person. Actually, what it evidences is just the opposite – that’s what’s being produced is not at all language.

That said, I'm not doubting or questioning the 'tongues experience'; glossolalia as the spiritual tool that it is, can be very powerful and, for many people, the experience is profound. As one commenter put it, “Speaking in tongues distracts the ego/analytical/conscious mind while leaving the subconscious (the heart) wide open to import the divine." Both the spiritual and physical benefits of using this tool are also well documented. Again though, it is important to note that this same statement can be made for virtually _any_ other culture that practices glossolalia. Religious and cultural differences aside, the glossolalia an Evenki Shaman in Siberia, a vodoun priestess in Togo and a Christian tongues-speaker in Alabama are producing are in no way different from each other. They’re all producing their glossolalia in the exact same way; they just have different explanations and beliefs as to why they’re doing it, and where it comes from. It is only in certain Christian denominations where is it construed as something it never was.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,501
12,954
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...it is not language; it’s non-cognitive non-language utterance – random free vocalization...
Exactly. However you will not find "glossolalia" in the Greek text of the NT. It is either glossa, glossais, or dialektos. All must be translated today as "languages" (as to several modern bible versions). So the gift of "languages" (spoken supernaturally) was presented in both Acts 2 and 1 Corinthians 12-14. Paul therefore insisted that there be an interpreter, since all languages can be interpreted.

The modern concept of glossolalia is a deviation from this, even though the people who originally promoted tongues in the early 20th century believed that the gift would be actual languages for missionary work. Now one poster said that this actually has happened on the mission field, but I requested documentation to support that, and so far I have not seen any. Missionaries have continued to put time and effort into learning foreign languages and then ministering to those to whom they went.

So Pentecostals and Charismatics have therefore changed the NT understanding and call glossolalia "prayer language". Once again, the NT does not tell Christians to pray in any such language, but simply pray in the language they use. As to modern tongues as evidence of being "filled with the Spirit" it cannot be true, since many Christians are filled with (or controlled by) the Holy Spirit without glossolalia. All biblical examples of being filled with the Spirit show those people simply speaking in their own language.
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
15,054
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So how does this help a lost person to know how to be saved?
What is the benefit to a lost person that does not know the need for salvation or how to get salvation?
God himself/herself knows, that be why it is important for us to be willing for God to do what is needed to be done through us each personally as said


Luke 21:14-15

Authorized (King James) Version

14 Settle it therefore in your hearts, not to meditate before what ye shall answer: 15 for I will give you a mouth and wisdom, which all your adversaries shall not be able to gainsay nor resist.
I am daily learning this truth for me to be out of the way daily, not easy to learn or take this truth on willingly, thanks as God reaches out to us all by his done work of Son for us all to turn to (Repent) and see willingly new, thank you
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
12,353
4,067
113
God himself/herself knows, that be why it is important for us to be willing for God to do what is needed to be done through us each personally as said


Luke 21:14-15

Authorized (King James) Version

14 Settle it therefore in your hearts, not to meditate before what ye shall answer: 15 for I will give you a mouth and wisdom, which all your adversaries shall not be able to gainsay nor resist.
I am daily learning this truth for me to be out of the way daily, not easy to learn or take this truth on willingly, thanks as God reaches out to us all by his done work of Son for us all to turn to (Repent) and see willingly new, thank you



"God himself/herself knows, "


Please clarify here. I think it's a typo.
 
Mar 4, 2024
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As with most gifts (and salvation), Christians get filled with the HS and start speaking in tongues before they even really know what’s happening. Only later do they (we) start to understand it. But with any gifts, it’s purpose is to help bring people to God and salvation,
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
14,742
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As with most gifts (and salvation), Christians get filled with the HS and start speaking in tongues before they even really know what’s happening. Only later do they (we) start to understand it. But with any gifts, it’s purpose is to help bring people to God and salvation,
Gifts are to edify the body of Christ.
 
Mar 4, 2024
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Gifts are to edify the body of Christ.
True, so they can spread the gospel. Same with praying and reading the Bible. It edifies the individual in order to spread the gospel more effectively.
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
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True, so they can spread the gospel. Same with praying and reading the Bible. It edifies the individual in order to spread the gospel more effectively.
My only point is that they are spiritual gifts. The natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit. Spirit filled people will be blessed.
 
Mar 4, 2024
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My only point is that they are spiritual gifts. The natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit. Spirit filled people will be blessed.
I mean yeah, we all need to pray in tongues more than we do for sure. When people in a church are getting saved, that’s a good marker if a healthy church. Spiritual gifts aid in this.
 
Jan 2, 2024
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Here are other examples of Jesus that he is Speaking in Tongues:
Spiritual Temple: His Body
JOHN 2:19-21
19
Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.
20 Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?
21 But he spake of the temple of his body.

Spiritual Leaven: Wrong Doctrines.
MATTHEW 16:6-12
6
Then Jesus said unto them, Take heed and beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees.
7 And they reasoned among themselves, saying, It is because we have taken no bread.
8 Which when Jesus perceived, he said unto them, O ye of little faith, why reason ye among yourselves, because ye have brought no bread?
9 Do ye not yet understand, neither remember the five loaves of the five thousand, and how many baskets ye took up?
10 Neither the seven loaves of the four thousand, and how many baskets ye took up?
11 How is it that ye do not understand that I spake it not to you concerning bread, that ye should beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees?
12
Then understood they how that he bade them not beware of the leaven of bread, but of the doctrine of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Since Speaking in Tongues has been heard to the disciples on the Day of Pentecost.
Speaking in Tongues is a sign of salvation.

We are not referring to Speaking in Tongues after the understanding of Man but after the Divine Revelation from God.

What is The Speaking in Tongues according to Man?
These are the words coming from the mouth which can't be found in a dictionary

What is Speaking in Togues according to Revelation from God?
These are words that can be read in a dictionary but the meaning is different from Man's Understanding.
Examples:
LEAVEN: Matthew 16:6-12
Man's understanding is Concerning Bread
Divine Revelation is Wrong Doctrines
TEMPLE: John 2:19-21
Man's understanding is literal temple and the equivalent today are the Churches, Cathedrals & Chapels
Divine Revelation is Jesus Body

Therefore: Speaking in Tongues are Heavenly Words because Jesus is from Heaven.
And Jesus is speaking in The Voice of The Sheep.

Why the Jews did not understand Jesus in The New Testament despite of they believing the word of God in the Old Testament?
Because they used Man's understanding in The Word of God and in the eyes of God, they re not sheep but a goats
MATTHEW 25:33
33
And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.
The Voice of the sheep

This is what Jesus referring to Nicodemus.
It requires to be born again in order to become a sheep.
The born again is from Goats to Sheep.
JOHN 3:1-5
3
There was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews:
2 The same came to Jesus by night, and said unto him, Rabbi, we know that thou art a teacher come from God: for no man can do these miracles that thou doest, except God be with him.
3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
4
Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?
5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
 
Jan 2, 2024
117
15
18
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Since Speaking in Tongues has been heard to the disciples on the Day of Pentecost.
Speaking in Tongues is a sign of salvation.

We are not referring to Speaking in Tongues after the understanding of Man but after the Divine Revelation from God.

What is The Speaking in Tongues according to Man?
These are the words coming from the mouth which can't be found in a dictionary

What is Speaking in Togues according to Revelation from God?
These are words that can be read in a dictionary but the meaning is different from Man's Understanding.
Examples:
LEAVEN: Matthew 16:6-12
Man's understanding is Concerning Bread
Divine Revelation is Wrong Doctrines
TEMPLE: John 2:19-21
Man's understanding is literal temple and the equivalent today are the Churches, Cathedrals & Chapels
Divine Revelation is Jesus Body

Therefore: Speaking in Tongues are Heavenly Words because Jesus is from Heaven.
And Jesus is speaking in The Voice of The Sheep.

Why the Jews did not understand Jesus in The New Testament despite of they believing the word of God in the Old Testament?
Because they used Man's understanding in The Word of God and in the eyes of God, they re not sheep but a goats
MATTHEW 25:33
33
And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.
The Voice of the sheep

This is what Jesus referring to Nicodemus.
It requires to be born again in order to become a sheep.
The born again is from Goats to Sheep.
JOHN 3:1-5
3
There was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews:
2 The same came to Jesus by night, and said unto him, Rabbi, we know that thou art a teacher come from God: for no man can do these miracles that thou doest, except God be with him.
3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
4
Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?
5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
Goats can't speak in tongues
Sheep can speak in togues;

These are Goats in the eyes of God:
MATTHEW 7:22-23
22
Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
3 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
 
Jan 2, 2024
117
15
18
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Since Speaking in Tongues has been heard to the disciples on the Day of Pentecost.
Speaking in Tongues is a sign of salvation.

We are not referring to Speaking in Tongues after the understanding of Man but after the Divine Revelation from God.

What is The Speaking in Tongues according to Man?
These are the words coming from the mouth which can't be found in a dictionary

What is Speaking in Togues according to Revelation from God?
These are words that can be read in a dictionary but the meaning is different from Man's Understanding.
Examples:
LEAVEN: Matthew 16:6-12
Man's understanding is Concerning Bread
Divine Revelation is Wrong Doctrines
TEMPLE: John 2:19-21
Man's understanding is literal temple and the equivalent today are the Churches, Cathedrals & Chapels
Divine Revelation is Jesus Body

Therefore: Speaking in Tongues are Heavenly Words because Jesus is from Heaven.
And Jesus is speaking in The Voice of The Sheep.

Why the Jews did not understand Jesus in The New Testament despite of they believing the word of God in the Old Testament?
Because they used Man's understanding in The Word of God and in the eyes of God, they re not sheep but a goats
MATTHEW 25:33
33
And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.
The Voice of the sheep

This is what Jesus referring to Nicodemus.
It requires to be born again in order to become a sheep.
The born again is from Goats to Sheep.
JOHN 3:1-5
3
There was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews:
2 The same came to Jesus by night, and said unto him, Rabbi, we know that thou art a teacher come from God: for no man can do these miracles that thou doest, except God be with him.
3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
4
Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?
5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Look at John The Baptist.
He baptize people in water and he said, whoever did not baptize by him will face damnation in hell.
When people in our times today read that John the Baptist is Baptizing in Water, so every group in Christianity conduct Baptism in Literal Water because of what John said.

But since John is a Chosen of God same with the Disciples on the Day of Pentecost, John is Speaking in Tongues.
The Water used by John The Baptist requires A Divine Revelation before we know it.
The evidence on this is, despite every group in Christianity are conducting Baptism with Water but each group has different doctrines and way of salvation.
MATTHEW 3:10-11
10
And now also the axe is laid unto the root of the trees: therefore every tree which bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
11 I indeed baptize you with WATER UNTO REPENTANCE



mmmm
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
15,054
113
63
"God himself/herself knows, "


Please clarify here. I think it's a typo.
No typo God can be anything, anyone God needs to be Male or Female
There is no male, Female, Jew or Greek in my daddy's sight we are made one under the Son, thanks to Jesus doing wart needed to be done. Even as John said to the Pharisees, God can make these stones into Israelites
The wall between the /Gentiles and Jews has gotten removed for su all to be one under the Son.

Have you by chance seen the Movie "The Shack" Religion does not like that movie, to me it was enlightening, yet not to all. Hope you well and not being judgmental, if you are okay, God knows us all and will straighten us all out in love and mercy as is done by Son first for us all to relent from being right over others being right too.
He went to that cross without a fight, that says much to me
Thanks
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
12,353
4,067
113
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Look at John The Baptist.
He baptize people in water and he said, whoever did not baptize by him will face damnation in hell.
When people in our times today read that John the Baptist is Baptizing in Water, so every group in Christianity conduct Baptism in Literal Water because of what John said.

But since John is a Chosen of God same with the Disciples on the Day of Pentecost, John is Speaking in Tongues.
The Water used by John The Baptist requires A Divine Revelation before we know it.
The evidence on this is, despite every group in Christianity are conducting Baptism with Water but each group has different doctrines and way of salvation.
MATTHEW 3:10-11
10
And now also the axe is laid unto the root of the trees: therefore every tree which bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
11 I indeed baptize you with WATER UNTO REPENTANCE



mmmm
I think you have your John mixed up.


John, known as the Baptist, was a Prophet. He said in the gospel of John chapter ONE that THERE is one coming after him who will baptized with THe Holy Ghost.

There is no record of John the Baptist speaking in tongues in the word of God .
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
12,353
4,067
113
No typo God can be anything, anyone God needs to be Male or Female
There is no male, Female, Jew or Greek in my daddy's sight we are made one under the Son, thanks to Jesus doing wart needed to be done. Even as John said to the Pharisees, God can make these stones into Israelites
The wall between the /Gentiles and Jews has gotten removed for su all to be one under the Son.

Have you by chance seen the Movie "The Shack" Religion does not like that movie, to me it was enlightening, yet not to all. Hope you well and not being judgmental, if you are okay, God knows us all and will straighten us all out in love and mercy as is done by Son first for us all to relent from being right over others being right too.
He went to that cross without a fight, that says much to me
Thanks
I'm sorry that is wrong. God is not a woman, nor has he revealed Himself to be one. The word of God is clear: God is Spirit until He comes in the flesh of a man. Not a woman.


The idea God can be whatever he wants to be is a half-truth. God can't be a woman Because His word tells us who He is that is Settled.

God placed His word above His name to say: "God can be anything; anyone who God needs to be is male or female."
That is not Biblical; therefore, it is not true.
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
12,353
4,067
113
No typo God can be anything, anyone God needs to be Male or Female
There is no male, Female, Jew or Greek in my daddy's sight we are made one under the Son, thanks to Jesus doing wart needed to be done. Even as John said to the Pharisees, God can make these stones into Israelites
The wall between the /Gentiles and Jews has gotten removed for su all to be one under the Son.

Have you by chance seen the Movie "The Shack" Religion does not like that movie, to me it was enlightening, yet not to all. Hope you well and not being judgmental, if you are okay, God knows us all and will straighten us all out in love and mercy as is done by Son first for us all to relent from being right over others being right too.
He went to that cross without a fight, that says much to me
Thanks
FYI, Shack is a movie and not Biblically correct.
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
12,353
4,067
113
No typo God can be anything, anyone God needs to be Male or Female
There is no male, Female, Jew or Greek in my daddy's sight we are made one under the Son, thanks to Jesus doing wart needed to be done. Even as John said to the Pharisees, God can make these stones into Israelites
The wall between the /Gentiles and Jews has gotten removed for su all to be one under the Son.

Have you by chance seen the Movie "The Shack" Religion does not like that movie, to me it was enlightening, yet not to all. Hope you well and not being judgmental, if you are okay, God knows us all and will straighten us all out in love and mercy as is done by Son first for us all to relent from being right over others being right too.
He went to that cross without a fight, that says much to me
Thanks
And no, I am not being judgemental, nor is it to say what is not Biblically correct. I am fine no need to create a false narrative.

are you okay?
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
15,054
113
63
I think you have your John mixed up.


John, known as the Baptist, was a Prophet. He said in the gospel of John chapter ONE that THERE is one coming after him who will baptized with THe Holy Ghost.

There is no record of John the Baptist speaking in tongues in the word of God .
I do not think I said John ever spoke in tongues ever, yet you got that impression, I did not and do not say that, John was the forerunner of the Son Jesus that was not recognized as having the Spirit of Elias that was to tell the first Chosen the Messiah has arrived. He did that. That ids when John the Baptized's job was over, once he announced this truth, that all there at that time heard too, Father stating this is my Son listen to him, Thunder and lightning happened and not a cloud in the sky as many saw it and heard it, some believed and some did not and blamed it on sorcery

And John the prophet was the first Prophet for 300 years prior.

The people there when Jesus was water Baptized, heard and saw this too. Amazing Grace not understood then yet, especially when he went to that cross willingly without a fight over it to go there.
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
15,054
113
63
And no, I am not being judgemental, nor is it to say what is not Biblically correct. I am fine no need to create a false narrative.

are you okay?
Yes. I am well, thanks to God even if and whenever in adversities here on earth contentment is what I seek to learn no matter what, thanks. Glad you are well too
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
15,054
113
63
I'm sorry that is wrong. God is not a woman, nor has he revealed Himself to be one. The word of God is clear: God is Spirit until He comes in the flesh of a man. Not a woman.


The idea God can be whatever he wants to be is a half-truth. God can't be a woman Because His word tells us who He is that is Settled.

God placed His word above His name to say: "God can be anything; anyone who God needs to be is male or female."
That is not Biblical; therefore, it is not true.
okay, thank you