the 2 bears & their 42 victims

[posthuman]

And he went up from thence unto Bethel: and as he was going up by the way, there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head. And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the LORD. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them. ​

(2 Kings 2:2:23-24 kjv)​

​

• who are the two bears?
• who are the 42?
• why 42? why not 11? were there only 42, or more? how many total?
• why bears? why not giraffes?
• why 2? why not 31?
• how did the ones recording this know they are female bears?
• why female bears?

 

[posthuman]

there came forth little children out of the city

please note:

• "children" is not necessarily an accurate translation, and very likely not given the usage & context of this Hebrew word.

• first mention of this word is Genesis 14:24, referring to the warriors/servants who, with Abraham, defeated 5 kings & rescued Sodom. obviously not little children.
• comparing Genesis 41:1, 12 & 46, Joseph is no less than 28 and no more than 30 when he is referred to by the same word. obviously not a little child.
• the preceding context in 2 Kings 1:9,11,13 & 2 Kings 2:3,5,7 & 16 is 50 fighting servants of age to serve in the military --just like the first mention of this word in scripture in Genesis 14:24.
  • that's 6 witnesses in the immediate context. should i ignore all of them and be all 'oh but kjv is divine' and presume these are a two-busload-zize gang of unsupervised 7yr old children below the age of accountability who don't understand what they are doing?
  • or is this a gang of military-age young men in their 20's-30's?
  • how many are there in total; 50 or 42
• Elisha is between 25-30 years old at this time.
  • is he actually bald at 25 or does "go up you baldhead' mean something else?
  • are these 6yr old children or Elisha's peers who have come out of the city without their parents in a pack to threaten him?

 

[posthuman]

• how does this testify of Christ?
  • clearly that is the primary purpose: John 5:39

 

[posthuman]

thanks

 

[posthuman]

there came forth

• i've got 'servants of a king' and 'sons of prophets' over and over in the preceding context, in groups of 50.
• whose servants and whose sons are the 42 who were torn to pieces under God's curse? how do you know?
• what's significant about this happening in Bethel?
• what's "up" or "high" in Bethel in this timeframe?

 

[posthuman]

• has anyone ever thrown this passage at you and said "see? the Bible says God murders children!" ?
  • well then you'd better sort out what this passage really means, so you have an answer for them.
    • let's go for it

 

[posthuman]

what this passage really means

• this is the scripture. Who is it really about?
  • Elisha, or Christ?
  • see again John 5:39 plz.
    • OK thx.

 

[Lucy-Pevensie]

Though infrequently, it does seem that attacks by wild animals are used as a judgement.

Rev 6:
7 When he opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth living creature say, “Come!”
8 And I looked, and there was a pale green horse. Its rider was named Death, and Hades was following after him. They were given authority over a fourth of the earth, to kill by the sword, by famine, by plague, and by the wild beasts of the earth.


I will send famine and wild beasts against you, and they will leave you childless. Plague and bloodshed will sweep through you, and I will bring the sword against you. I the LORD have spoken.” ~Ez 5:17

“For this is what the Sovereign LORD says: How much worse will it be when I send against Jerusalem my four dreadful judgments—sword and famine and wild beasts and plague—to kill its men and their animals! ~ Ez 14:21

 

[oyster67]

who are the two bears?

Bears are large bulky mammals with big claws.

who are the 42?

Children who mocked a man of God.

why 42?

Because the Bible says there were 42.

why bears? why not giraffes?

Because the Bible says "bears".

why female bears?

Because the Bible says they were "she" bears.

You forgot to ask why the she bears came out of the wood and not out of the the lake.

 

[Runningman]

Sounds like they were being stubborn and creating problems for Elijah. He got fed up with all of the mocking by a mob of 42 children and cursed them in the name of the Lord. Looks like the curse actually worked as well, as these two bears wasted no time immediately immerging from the forest/wooded area and going to work.

 

[NOV25]

please note:

• "children" is not necessarily an accurate translation, and very likely not given the usage & context of this Hebrew word.

View attachment 246945

• first mention of this word is Genesis 14:24, referring to the warriors/servants who, with Abraham, defeated 5 kings & rescued Sodom. obviously not little children.
• comparing Genesis 41:1, 12 & 46, Joseph is no less than 28 and no more than 30 when he is referred to by the same word. obviously not a little child.
• the preceding context in 2 Kings 1:9,11,13 & 2 Kings 2:3,5,7 & 16 is 50 fighting servants of age to serve in the military --just like the first mention of this word in scripture in Genesis 14:24.
  • that's 6 witnesses in the immediate context. should i ignore all of them and be all 'oh but kjv is divine' and presume these are a two-busload-zize gang of unsupervised 7yr old children below the age of accountability who don't understand what they are doing?
  • or is this a gang of military-age young men in their 20's-30's?
  • how many are there in total; 50 or 42
• Elisha is between 25-30 years old at this time.
  • is he actually bald at 25 or does "go up you baldhead' mean something else?
  • are these 6yr old children or Elisha's peers who have come out of the city without their parents in a pack to threaten him?

Interesting 🤔
Were the sons of the prophets sending 50 men to search for Elijah, perhaps after Elisha told them he ascended? Do not send, he said. Yet they urged him until he was "ashamed" (disappointed, so long...) that he said go ahead and send them then... When they returned he said, told you so...😂 Then he heals the waters in the name of the Lord and the men mock him as he leaves town, perhaps out of jealousy. 🤷‍♂️

Little children: Strongs's H5288 (na`ar) shows 238 uses in the OT. 37 usages as man and 40 as men, 44 as child, 54 as servant/servants...
Wonder why they chose to use little children in the translation?

Go up: Strong's H5927 (`alah) shows over 700 usage. Go, ascend, depart, up, to name a few. 🤷‍♂️

Bald head: Strong's H7142 (qereach) 3 uses in the OT bald, head. From the word Strong's H7139 (qarach) to depilate, to shave, make oneself bald, perhaps in connection with mourning? Ezekiel 27:31 And they shall make themselves utterly bald for thee, and gird them with sackcloth, and they shall weep for thee with bitterness of heart and bitter wailing.

I have no idea but I love this kind of stuff! Please continue. 🍿

 

[posthuman]

Sounds like they were being stubborn and creating problems for Elijah. He got fed up with all of the mocking by a mob of 42 children and cursed them in the name of the Lord. Looks like the curse actually worked as well, as these two bears wasted no time immediately immerging from the forest/wooded area and going to work.

How is that a picture of Christ?
Where is Christ being mocked and told to go up?
((or to come down - see 2 Kings 2:1, **hint hint**))
Why doesn't God send bears immediately to kill everyone who ever mocks a prophet?
Why now?
Why is this written?

 

[oyster67]

has anyone ever thrown this passage at you and said "see? the Bible says God murders children!" ?

• well then you'd better sort out what this passage really means, so you have an answer for them.

God is going to do a lot more than that. If you are old enough to blaspheme and mock God and His servants, then you are old enough to be cast headlong into the Lake which burneth with fire and brimstone forever and ever.

 

[HealthAndHappiness]

Bears are large bulky mammals with big claws.

Children who mocked a man of God.

Because the Bible says there were 42.

Because the Bible says "bears".

Because the Bible says they were "she" bears.

You forgot to ask why the she bears came out of the wood and not out of the the lake.

The previous chapter God shows how He protects His prophet in more than remarkable ways.

Chapter 1

I'm glad chapter 2 is in the Bible.
I won't throw it away and replace it with a common tater. 😁

 

[HealthAndHappiness]

Bears are large bulky mammals with big claws.

Children who mocked a man of God.

Because the Bible says there were 42.

Because the Bible says "bears".

Because the Bible says they were "she" bears.

You forgot to ask why the she bears came out of the wood and not out of the the lake.

This is just speculation and have no authority or desire to consult the many Jewish commentaries that they look to as exceeding Biblical text.
I'm guessing that the children were possibly those of the prophets of Baal or at least influenced by those pagan false prophets.
Remember what Elijah did after he called out those deceivers? According to God's command, he rid the people of their influence. There were a lot of families who would have sided with them. Children often repeat what their parents say and reflect their attitudes.

 

[Nehemiah6]

why female bears?

The female is more deadly than the male (Rudyard Kipling). As to the rest of the story, there is nothing mystical. Divine judgment in those days was swift.

 

[HealthAndHappiness]

The female is more deadly than the male (Rudyard Kipling). As to the rest of the story, there is nothing mystical. Divine judgment in those days was swift.

Ask any park ranger and they will let you know to stay especially clear if you see a cub..

"Let a bear robbed of her whelps meet a man, rather than a fool in his folly."

Proverbs 17:12

 

[montana123]

It appears as if the children were telling Elisha to get out of here and mocking him so God allowed 2 bears to go against them because they disrespected the man of God.

 

[Lucy-Pevensie]

I don't care if anyone accuses God of being a murderer. It would be a false charge.
God is not a murderer, he is the creator. He gave life & he can take it. We are not God's judge, he can do with mankind what he will.

 

[HealthAndHappiness]

It appears as if the children were telling Elisha to get out of here and mocking him so God allowed 2 bears to go against them because they disrespected the man of God.

There were a lot of examples of God's judgement in the Old and New Testaments. He didn't do so every time there was a similar sin, but He demonstrated it up on nations, families and individuals periodically as examples.
Sodom and Gomorrah
Egypt
Those who challenged Moses authority
The 185,000 Assyrian soldiers, 2 Kings 19
Ananias and Sapphira , Acts 5

God still does miracles and brings judgement, but He made sure we have an example for all of history that God is just and sometimes brings swift judgement.
I've heard little criticism of the pagans burning their children alive as was a common practice by many of them. However, people have a tendency to look at God through their own view of morality and look at God as too harsh. They haven't seen anything until they read Revelation.
People have misjudged God for bringing the she bears against these young people who were mocking Elisha and telling him to go up!"... Perhaps that was mocking Elisha's message of how Elijah went up in the chariot of fire. Elisha took his place as a leader of God's prophets. His predecessor proved his message and authority against the 450 false prophets of Baal to convince the nation that the LORD is the true God. That was possibly emphasized here when they told Elisha to go up. That judgement may have been used to turn many others to the true Lord in faith. We don't know for sure, but we do know what is written for our admonition. God proved by these obvious judgements that He wasn't messing around with His people as they played the whore with devils for too long. He sent these Preachers to proclaim His message and the heathen kids aren't going to stop that from happening.