The Atonement: What did it REALLY Accomplish?
- Thread starter brightfame52
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
The redeemed of the Lord shall return !
Isa 51:11
11 Therefore the redeemed of the Lord shall return, and come with singing unto Zion; and everlasting joy shall be upon their head: they shall obtain gladness and joy; and sorrow and mourning shall flee away.
Many in man made religion dont understand nor believe the effects that Christ's redeeming death had on all for whom He died, It returns them back to God from whom they went astray, apostatized from in Adam, yet His redeeming death shall cause them to return, as it is written, the redeemed of the Lord shall [predestined] return.
To give an idea of this blessed return, look at the prodigal son Lk 15:11-21
Now notice vs 17-20 , thats the action of being returned to the Lord, thats what is effected in each of the redeemed of the Lord, those Christ died for, in other words, Christ's redeeming death receives all the credit for the actions of the returning son in Vs 17-20 !
Now this very same Illustration is stated in Peters writings 1 Pet 1:18-20
Peter writing to the redeemed, those redeemed by the precious blood of the Lamb, notice what he writes:
They were redeemed out of a vain conversation or manner of Life Vs 18
The word from preposition ek means:
I.out of, from, by, away from
See how Peter is crediting the Blood of Christ as the means by which they were brought out of, away from a vain manner of life ! Peter does not say it was due to their wise decision making, or their freewill, that they are changed, but again, because of the precious blood of the Lamb !
Yet even more to the point is what he writes later here 1 Pet 2:24-25
Notice the word returned in Vs 25, that applies to the redeemed back up in 1 Pet 1:18-20 !
So you see, that's what Isa 51:11 means, the redeemed of the Lord shall return or be returned.
The word returned in 1 Pet 2:25 is the greek word epistrephō:
I.transitively
A.to turn to
i.to the worship of the true God
B.to cause to return, to bring back
i.to the love and obedience of God
Here in the text its in the passive voice :
The passive effects the middle and causes the subject to act, so the word also means:
A.to turn to one's self
B.to turn one's self about, turn back
C.to return, turn back, come back
Because what's being effected here is conversion !
Lets look back once again at the prodigal Lk 15:17-18
17 And when he came to himself, he said, How many hired servants of my father's have bread enough and to spare, and I perish with hunger!
18 I will arise and go to my father, and will say unto him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and before thee,
The son being acted upon as in being the hit ball, he corresponds in like action, though he begins to act and cooperate, he is not the author of it, the redeeming blood of Christ is ! So again we see come to past what is promised in the prophecy Isa 51:11
11 Therefore the redeemed of the Lord shall return, and come with singing unto Zion; and everlasting joy shall be upon their head: they shall obtain gladness and joy; and sorrow and mourning shall flee away.
Fulfilled in Christ, the Redeemed 1 Pet 1:18 and the being returned 1 Pet 2:25 ! 36
Isa 51:11
11 Therefore the redeemed of the Lord shall return, and come with singing unto Zion; and everlasting joy shall be upon their head: they shall obtain gladness and joy; and sorrow and mourning shall flee away.
Many in man made religion dont understand nor believe the effects that Christ's redeeming death had on all for whom He died, It returns them back to God from whom they went astray, apostatized from in Adam, yet His redeeming death shall cause them to return, as it is written, the redeemed of the Lord shall [predestined] return.
To give an idea of this blessed return, look at the prodigal son Lk 15:11-21
11 And he said, A certain man had two sons:
12 And the younger of them said to his father, Father, give me the portion of goods that falleth to me. And he divided unto them his living.
13 And not many days after the younger son gathered all together, and took his journey into a far country, and there wasted his substance with riotous living.
14 And when he had spent all, there arose a mighty famine in that land; and he began to be in want.
15 And he went and joined himself to a citizen of that country; and he sent him into his fields to feed swine.
16 And he would fain have filled his belly with the husks that the swine did eat: and no man gave unto him.
17 And when he came to himself, he said, How many hired servants of my father's have bread enough and to spare, and I perish with hunger!
18 I will arise and go to my father, and will say unto him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and before thee,
19 And am no more worthy to be called thy son: make me as one of thy hired servants.
20 And he arose, and came to his father. But when he was yet a great way off, his father saw him, and had compassion, and ran, and fell on his neck, and kissed him.
21 And the son said unto him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and in thy sight, and am no more worthy to be called thy son.
12 And the younger of them said to his father, Father, give me the portion of goods that falleth to me. And he divided unto them his living.
13 And not many days after the younger son gathered all together, and took his journey into a far country, and there wasted his substance with riotous living.
14 And when he had spent all, there arose a mighty famine in that land; and he began to be in want.
15 And he went and joined himself to a citizen of that country; and he sent him into his fields to feed swine.
16 And he would fain have filled his belly with the husks that the swine did eat: and no man gave unto him.
17 And when he came to himself, he said, How many hired servants of my father's have bread enough and to spare, and I perish with hunger!
18 I will arise and go to my father, and will say unto him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and before thee,
19 And am no more worthy to be called thy son: make me as one of thy hired servants.
20 And he arose, and came to his father. But when he was yet a great way off, his father saw him, and had compassion, and ran, and fell on his neck, and kissed him.
21 And the son said unto him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and in thy sight, and am no more worthy to be called thy son.
Now notice vs 17-20 , thats the action of being returned to the Lord, thats what is effected in each of the redeemed of the Lord, those Christ died for, in other words, Christ's redeeming death receives all the credit for the actions of the returning son in Vs 17-20 !
Now this very same Illustration is stated in Peters writings 1 Pet 1:18-20
18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;
19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:
20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,
19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:
20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,
Peter writing to the redeemed, those redeemed by the precious blood of the Lamb, notice what he writes:
They were redeemed out of a vain conversation or manner of Life Vs 18
The word from preposition ek means:
I.out of, from, by, away from
See how Peter is crediting the Blood of Christ as the means by which they were brought out of, away from a vain manner of life ! Peter does not say it was due to their wise decision making, or their freewill, that they are changed, but again, because of the precious blood of the Lamb !
Yet even more to the point is what he writes later here 1 Pet 2:24-25
24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.
25 For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now returned unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls.
25 For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now returned unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls.
Notice the word returned in Vs 25, that applies to the redeemed back up in 1 Pet 1:18-20 !
So you see, that's what Isa 51:11 means, the redeemed of the Lord shall return or be returned.
The word returned in 1 Pet 2:25 is the greek word epistrephō:
I.transitively
A.to turn to
i.to the worship of the true God
B.to cause to return, to bring back
i.to the love and obedience of God
Here in the text its in the passive voice :
The passive voice represents the subject as being the recipient of the action. E.g., in the sentence, "The boy was hit by the ball," the boy receives the action.
The passive effects the middle and causes the subject to act, so the word also means:
A.to turn to one's self
B.to turn one's self about, turn back
C.to return, turn back, come back
Because what's being effected here is conversion !
Lets look back once again at the prodigal Lk 15:17-18
17 And when he came to himself, he said, How many hired servants of my father's have bread enough and to spare, and I perish with hunger!
18 I will arise and go to my father, and will say unto him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and before thee,
The son being acted upon as in being the hit ball, he corresponds in like action, though he begins to act and cooperate, he is not the author of it, the redeeming blood of Christ is ! So again we see come to past what is promised in the prophecy Isa 51:11
11 Therefore the redeemed of the Lord shall return, and come with singing unto Zion; and everlasting joy shall be upon their head: they shall obtain gladness and joy; and sorrow and mourning shall flee away.
Fulfilled in Christ, the Redeemed 1 Pet 1:18 and the being returned 1 Pet 2:25 ! 36
The redeemed of the Lord shall return ! 2
Redemption brings back those who went astray in Adam the son of God Lk 3:38 Isa 53:6
38 Which was the son of Enos, which was the son of Seth, which was the son of Adam, which was the son of God.
6 All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the Lord hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.
The sons of God in their natural federal head Adam, turned everyone his own way, but yet through the Redemption that is in Christ Jesus, they [The Sheep who went astray] shall be returned to God, 1 Pet 2:24-25
24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.
25 For ye were as sheep going astray[Isa 53:6]; but are now returned unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls.
The Healing of the Stripes effects the return to God ! See also 1 Pet 3:18
18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us[The Sheep] to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:
That He might bring us [the Sheep] back to God denotes the stated Purpose for Christ suffering for sins, the Just for the unjust ! The word that :
hína (a subordinating conjunction) – for the purpose that (in order that), looking to the aim (intended result) of the verbal idea. 2443 /hína ("for the purpose that")
The Purpose and intended result for For Christ dying for our sins, was that it would bring us to God !
And Remember 1 Pet 3:18 relates back to 1 Pet 1:18-20
18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;
19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:
20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,
I hope this is clear, Redemption by the Precious Blood of Christ brings the Lost Sheep back to God, that was the Purpose of His "hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust"
Listen folks, If Christ's Redemptive Death does not effect a returning or coming back to God or Conversion, then it failed the Divine Purpose and Intention, but yet that is what all religionists are willing to state if they indeed teach that Christ died for some that shall never be converted back to God Acts 3:19, they teach a failed Christ !
But Glory to God, True Believers believe all for whom He died, of God's Sheep, shall be converted back to God, 100 % of the Sheepfold !
Redemption brings back those who went astray in Adam the son of God Lk 3:38 Isa 53:6
38 Which was the son of Enos, which was the son of Seth, which was the son of Adam, which was the son of God.
6 All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the Lord hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.
The sons of God in their natural federal head Adam, turned everyone his own way, but yet through the Redemption that is in Christ Jesus, they [The Sheep who went astray] shall be returned to God, 1 Pet 2:24-25
24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.
25 For ye were as sheep going astray[Isa 53:6]; but are now returned unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls.
The Healing of the Stripes effects the return to God ! See also 1 Pet 3:18
18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us[The Sheep] to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:
That He might bring us [the Sheep] back to God denotes the stated Purpose for Christ suffering for sins, the Just for the unjust ! The word that :
hína (a subordinating conjunction) – for the purpose that (in order that), looking to the aim (intended result) of the verbal idea. 2443 /hína ("for the purpose that")
The Purpose and intended result for For Christ dying for our sins, was that it would bring us to God !
And Remember 1 Pet 3:18 relates back to 1 Pet 1:18-20
18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;
19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:
20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,
I hope this is clear, Redemption by the Precious Blood of Christ brings the Lost Sheep back to God, that was the Purpose of His "hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust"
Listen folks, If Christ's Redemptive Death does not effect a returning or coming back to God or Conversion, then it failed the Divine Purpose and Intention, but yet that is what all religionists are willing to state if they indeed teach that Christ died for some that shall never be converted back to God Acts 3:19, they teach a failed Christ !
But Glory to God, True Believers believe all for whom He died, of God's Sheep, shall be converted back to God, 100 % of the Sheepfold !
The Lord Jesus Christ died for all mankind ... all descendants of Adam:
John 1:29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.
John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
2 Corinthians 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
... you miss the whole point of the parable because you ignore the context within which the Author of Scripture placed the parable ... to whom is the Lord Jesus Christ speaking ??? ... He is speaking to the Pharisees and scribes who murmured because the Lord Jesus Christ receiveth sinners, and eateth with them (Luke 15:2).
Both sons of the Father sinned ... the younger left and wasted his heritage in riotous living (Luke 15:13) ... the elder was enraged that the Father loved his younger brother and threw a party for him (Luke 15:28) ... the love of the Father for both sons is evident in the parable.
The younger son represents the whosoever believeth of the whole world for whom the Lord Jesus Christ died (John 3:16-17).
The elder son represents the pharisees and scribes ... those who considered themselves as "elect" and who murmured, saying, This man receiveth sinners, and eateth with them.
1 Peter 1:18 does not state "they were brought out of, away from a vain manner of life !"
1 Peter 1:18 is that we were bought with the precious blood of Jesus (1 Peter 1:19) ... and because of your ongoing habitual practice of ripping verses from the context within which the Author of Scripture has placed the verse, you miss the point.
Because the precious blood of the Lord Jesus Christ is of inestimable value ... His blood can take away the sin of the world – John 1:29; 1 John 2:2 ... the born again one is to:
1 Peter 1:13 – gird up the loins of your mind, be sober, and hope to the end
1 Peter 1:14 – as obedient children, not fashioning yourselves according to the former lusts in your ignorance
1 Peter 1:15-16 – as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation; Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy.
1 Peter 1:17 – pass the time of your sojourning here in fear
The born again one is to consider the cost ... the precious blood of Jesus ... and live his or her life in light of having been purchased by that blood. The born again believer now belongs to Jesus, for He is the One Who paid the price.
... Peter does, in fact, state that a person must believe ... that it is faith in the Lord Jesus Christ which causes the believer to rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory even when faced with the trial of your faith ... though it be tried with fire:
1 Peter 1:
7 That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:
8 Whom [the Lord Jesus Christ] having not seen, ye love; in whom, though now ye see him not, yet believing, ye rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory:
9 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.
... and you would know this truth if you would quit ripping verses from the context within which the Author of Scripture has placed the verse.
... again you miss the whole point of the parable because you ignore the context within which the Author of Scripture placed the parable ... to whom is the Lord Jesus Christ speaking ??? ... He is speaking to the Pharisees and scribes who murmured because the Lord Jesus Christ receiveth sinners, and eateth with them (Luke 15:2).
Here is what Spurgeon wrote concerning the parable (bold mine):
To find the response of the pharisees and scribes to whom the Lord Jesus Christ was speaking when He told them the parables (plural), you have to read to Luke 16:14 ... they derided Him.
So there goes your erroneous statement that those to whom Christ spoke "corresponds in like action, though he begins to act and cooperate, he is not the author of it, the redeeming blood of Christ is" because those to whom He spoke did not begin "to act and cooperate" ... according to Luke 16:14 they derided Him ... which means they sneered at Him in their scornful rejection of His teaching.
Quit trying to align Scripture to your erroneous dogma ... read God's Word just as written ... ask God to reveal to you what it is that He wants you to know.
Your surmisings are nothing but the corruptible things God speaks of in 1 Peter 1:18.
READ YOUR BIBLE!!!
.
John 1:29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.
John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
2 Corinthians 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
... you miss the whole point of the parable because you ignore the context within which the Author of Scripture placed the parable ... to whom is the Lord Jesus Christ speaking ??? ... He is speaking to the Pharisees and scribes who murmured because the Lord Jesus Christ receiveth sinners, and eateth with them (Luke 15:2).Both sons of the Father sinned ... the younger left and wasted his heritage in riotous living (Luke 15:13) ... the elder was enraged that the Father loved his younger brother and threw a party for him (Luke 15:28) ... the love of the Father for both sons is evident in the parable.
The younger son represents the whosoever believeth of the whole world for whom the Lord Jesus Christ died (John 3:16-17).
The elder son represents the pharisees and scribes ... those who considered themselves as "elect" and who murmured, saying, This man receiveth sinners, and eateth with them.
1 Peter 1:18 does not state "they were brought out of, away from a vain manner of life !"
1 Peter 1:18 is that we were bought with the precious blood of Jesus (1 Peter 1:19) ... and because of your ongoing habitual practice of ripping verses from the context within which the Author of Scripture has placed the verse, you miss the point.
Because the precious blood of the Lord Jesus Christ is of inestimable value ... His blood can take away the sin of the world – John 1:29; 1 John 2:2 ... the born again one is to:
1 Peter 1:13 – gird up the loins of your mind, be sober, and hope to the end
1 Peter 1:14 – as obedient children, not fashioning yourselves according to the former lusts in your ignorance
1 Peter 1:15-16 – as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation; Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy.
1 Peter 1:17 – pass the time of your sojourning here in fear
The born again one is to consider the cost ... the precious blood of Jesus ... and live his or her life in light of having been purchased by that blood. The born again believer now belongs to Jesus, for He is the One Who paid the price.
... Peter does, in fact, state that a person must believe ... that it is faith in the Lord Jesus Christ which causes the believer to rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory even when faced with the trial of your faith ... though it be tried with fire: 1 Peter 1:
7 That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:
8 Whom [the Lord Jesus Christ] having not seen, ye love; in whom, though now ye see him not, yet believing, ye rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory:
9 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.
... and you would know this truth if you would quit ripping verses from the context within which the Author of Scripture has placed the verse.
... again you miss the whole point of the parable because you ignore the context within which the Author of Scripture placed the parable ... to whom is the Lord Jesus Christ speaking ??? ... He is speaking to the Pharisees and scribes who murmured because the Lord Jesus Christ receiveth sinners, and eateth with them (Luke 15:2).Here is what Spurgeon wrote concerning the parable (bold mine):
The truth here taught is just this: that mercy stretches forth her hand to misery, that grace receives men as sinners, that it deals with demerit, unworthiness and worthlessness; that those who think themselves righteous are not the objects of divine compassion, but the unrighteous, the guilty and the undeserving, are the proper subjects for the infinite mercy of God; in a word, that salvation is not of merit but of grace.
To find the response of the pharisees and scribes to whom the Lord Jesus Christ was speaking when He told them the parables (plural), you have to read to Luke 16:14 ... they derided Him.
So there goes your erroneous statement that those to whom Christ spoke "corresponds in like action, though he begins to act and cooperate, he is not the author of it, the redeeming blood of Christ is" because those to whom He spoke did not begin "to act and cooperate" ... according to Luke 16:14 they derided Him ... which means they sneered at Him in their scornful rejection of His teaching.
Quit trying to align Scripture to your erroneous dogma ... read God's Word just as written ... ask God to reveal to you what it is that He wants you to know.
Your surmisings are nothing but the corruptible things God speaks of in 1 Peter 1:18.
READ YOUR BIBLE!!!
.
newsflash for you, brightfame52 ... all mankind "turned everyone his own way". A person is not considered to be a child of God until God imputes His righteousness to him or her ... and according to Scripture, God imputes righteousness when a person believes.
The Lord Jesus Christ died for all mankind ... all descendants of Adam:
John 1:29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.
John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
2 Corinthians 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
According to 1 Peter 2, God allows mankind to reject Him:
1 Peter 2:7 Unto you therefore which believe he is precious: but unto them which be disobedient, the stone which the builders disallowed, the same is made the head of the corner
... you add words to Scripture in your futile attempt to align Scripture to your erroneous dogma.
In 1 Peter 3:18 you add the words " [the Sheep] " and " back ".
Why can you not read Scripture just as written? Why must you continuously add words and terms to Scripture which are not included in Scripture which is the Word of God? ... the God you claim you believe, yet there is no evidence of faith in you because you do not believe His Word just as He wrote it.
... absolutely not true. Do not blame God for the actions of mankind. God's Word tells us exactly what occurs when a person does not come to faith in the gospel of Christ:
Romans 1:
16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it [the gospel of Christ] is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.
17 For therein [the gospel of Christ] is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.
from faith to faith – not from works to faith or from faith to works ... from faith to faith. The life of the born again one begins in faith and the born again one is to continue to live by faith alone.
Romans 1:
18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold [Greek katecho] the truth in unrighteousness;
19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse
Rom 1:18-20 tells us that God makes plain His eternal power and Godhead ... however, this truth is suppressed. The words "who hold" in vs 18 are translated from the Greek word katechō which means to suppress; hold back; restrain. When the Word of God is spoken, the hearer restrains the truth from reaching his/her heart.
It is clear from vs 19 that God reveals His eternal power and Godhead and it is clear from vs 18 that it is the person who rejects God.
The ones who do not come to repentance reject that which God reveals to them. It's not that they can't believe ... it's that they reject that which is to be believed, even though what is to be believed has been revealed to them.
The fact that some reject God has no effect on the veracity of God's Word ... nor the efficacy of the sacrifice of the Lord Jesus Christ ... just as you rejecting what is written in Romans 1 has no effect on the truth stated therein.
READ YOUR BIBLE!!!
.
The Lord Jesus Christ died for all mankind ... all descendants of Adam:
John 1:29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.
John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
2 Corinthians 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
According to 1 Peter 2, God allows mankind to reject Him:
1 Peter 2:7 Unto you therefore which believe he is precious: but unto them which be disobedient, the stone which the builders disallowed, the same is made the head of the corner
... you add words to Scripture in your futile attempt to align Scripture to your erroneous dogma.In 1 Peter 3:18 you add the words " [the Sheep] " and " back ".
Why can you not read Scripture just as written? Why must you continuously add words and terms to Scripture which are not included in Scripture which is the Word of God? ... the God you claim you believe, yet there is no evidence of faith in you because you do not believe His Word just as He wrote it.
... absolutely not true. Do not blame God for the actions of mankind. God's Word tells us exactly what occurs when a person does not come to faith in the gospel of Christ:Romans 1:
16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it [the gospel of Christ] is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.
17 For therein [the gospel of Christ] is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.
from faith to faith – not from works to faith or from faith to works ... from faith to faith. The life of the born again one begins in faith and the born again one is to continue to live by faith alone.
Romans 1:
18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold [Greek katecho] the truth in unrighteousness;
19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse
Rom 1:18-20 tells us that God makes plain His eternal power and Godhead ... however, this truth is suppressed. The words "who hold" in vs 18 are translated from the Greek word katechō which means to suppress; hold back; restrain. When the Word of God is spoken, the hearer restrains the truth from reaching his/her heart.
It is clear from vs 19 that God reveals His eternal power and Godhead and it is clear from vs 18 that it is the person who rejects God.
The ones who do not come to repentance reject that which God reveals to them. It's not that they can't believe ... it's that they reject that which is to be believed, even though what is to be believed has been revealed to them.
The fact that some reject God has no effect on the veracity of God's Word ... nor the efficacy of the sacrifice of the Lord Jesus Christ ... just as you rejecting what is written in Romans 1 has no effect on the truth stated therein.
READ YOUR BIBLE!!!
.
That was from just the last few pages, too! So redundant... .
-
1
- Show all
The Lord Jesus Christ died for all mankind ... all descendants of Adam:
John 1:29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.
John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
2 Corinthians 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
... you miss the whole point of the parable because you ignore the context within which the Author of Scripture placed the parable ... to whom is the Lord Jesus Christ speaking ??? ... He is speaking to the Pharisees and scribes who murmured because the Lord Jesus Christ receiveth sinners, and eateth with them (Luke 15:2).
Both sons of the Father sinned ... the younger left and wasted his heritage in riotous living (Luke 15:13) ... the elder was enraged that the Father loved his younger brother and threw a party for him (Luke 15:28) ... the love of the Father for both sons is evident in the parable.
The younger son represents the whosoever believeth of the whole world for whom the Lord Jesus Christ died (John 3:16-17).
The elder son represents the pharisees and scribes ... those who considered themselves as "elect" and who murmured, saying, This man receiveth sinners, and eateth with them.
1 Peter 1:18 does not state "they were brought out of, away from a vain manner of life !"
1 Peter 1:18 is that we were bought with the precious blood of Jesus (1 Peter 1:19) ... and because of your ongoing habitual practice of ripping verses from the context within which the Author of Scripture has placed the verse, you miss the point.
Because the precious blood of the Lord Jesus Christ is of inestimable value ... His blood can take away the sin of the world – John 1:29; 1 John 2:2 ... the born again one is to:
1 Peter 1:13 – gird up the loins of your mind, be sober, and hope to the end
1 Peter 1:14 – as obedient children, not fashioning yourselves according to the former lusts in your ignorance
1 Peter 1:15-16 – as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation; Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy.
1 Peter 1:17 – pass the time of your sojourning here in fear
The born again one is to consider the cost ... the precious blood of Jesus ... and live his or her life in light of having been purchased by that blood. The born again believer now belongs to Jesus, for He is the One Who paid the price.
... Peter does, in fact, state that a person must believe ... that it is faith in the Lord Jesus Christ which causes the believer to rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory even when faced with the trial of your faith ... though it be tried with fire:
1 Peter 1:
7 That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:
8 Whom [the Lord Jesus Christ] having not seen, ye love; in whom, though now ye see him not, yet believing, ye rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory:
9 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.
... and you would know this truth if you would quit ripping verses from the context within which the Author of Scripture has placed the verse.
... again you miss the whole point of the parable because you ignore the context within which the Author of Scripture placed the parable ... to whom is the Lord Jesus Christ speaking ??? ... He is speaking to the Pharisees and scribes who murmured because the Lord Jesus Christ receiveth sinners, and eateth with them (Luke 15:2).
Here is what Spurgeon wrote concerning the parable (bold mine):
To find the response of the pharisees and scribes to whom the Lord Jesus Christ was speaking when He told them the parables (plural), you have to read to Luke 16:14 ... they derided Him.
So there goes your erroneous statement that those to whom Christ spoke "corresponds in like action, though he begins to act and cooperate, he is not the author of it, the redeeming blood of Christ is" because those to whom He spoke did not begin "to act and cooperate" ... according to Luke 16:14 they derided Him ... which means they sneered at Him in their scornful rejection of His teaching.
Quit trying to align Scripture to your erroneous dogma ... read God's Word just as written ... ask God to reveal to you what it is that He wants you to know.
Your surmisings are nothing but the corruptible things God speaks of in 1 Peter 1:18.
READ YOUR BIBLE!!!
.
John 1:29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.
John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
2 Corinthians 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
... you miss the whole point of the parable because you ignore the context within which the Author of Scripture placed the parable ... to whom is the Lord Jesus Christ speaking ??? ... He is speaking to the Pharisees and scribes who murmured because the Lord Jesus Christ receiveth sinners, and eateth with them (Luke 15:2).Both sons of the Father sinned ... the younger left and wasted his heritage in riotous living (Luke 15:13) ... the elder was enraged that the Father loved his younger brother and threw a party for him (Luke 15:28) ... the love of the Father for both sons is evident in the parable.
The younger son represents the whosoever believeth of the whole world for whom the Lord Jesus Christ died (John 3:16-17).
The elder son represents the pharisees and scribes ... those who considered themselves as "elect" and who murmured, saying, This man receiveth sinners, and eateth with them.
1 Peter 1:18 does not state "they were brought out of, away from a vain manner of life !"
1 Peter 1:18 is that we were bought with the precious blood of Jesus (1 Peter 1:19) ... and because of your ongoing habitual practice of ripping verses from the context within which the Author of Scripture has placed the verse, you miss the point.
Because the precious blood of the Lord Jesus Christ is of inestimable value ... His blood can take away the sin of the world – John 1:29; 1 John 2:2 ... the born again one is to:
1 Peter 1:13 – gird up the loins of your mind, be sober, and hope to the end
1 Peter 1:14 – as obedient children, not fashioning yourselves according to the former lusts in your ignorance
1 Peter 1:15-16 – as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation; Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy.
1 Peter 1:17 – pass the time of your sojourning here in fear
The born again one is to consider the cost ... the precious blood of Jesus ... and live his or her life in light of having been purchased by that blood. The born again believer now belongs to Jesus, for He is the One Who paid the price.
... Peter does, in fact, state that a person must believe ... that it is faith in the Lord Jesus Christ which causes the believer to rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory even when faced with the trial of your faith ... though it be tried with fire: 1 Peter 1:
7 That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:
8 Whom [the Lord Jesus Christ] having not seen, ye love; in whom, though now ye see him not, yet believing, ye rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory:
9 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.
... and you would know this truth if you would quit ripping verses from the context within which the Author of Scripture has placed the verse.
... again you miss the whole point of the parable because you ignore the context within which the Author of Scripture placed the parable ... to whom is the Lord Jesus Christ speaking ??? ... He is speaking to the Pharisees and scribes who murmured because the Lord Jesus Christ receiveth sinners, and eateth with them (Luke 15:2).Here is what Spurgeon wrote concerning the parable (bold mine):
The truth here taught is just this: that mercy stretches forth her hand to misery, that grace receives men as sinners, that it deals with demerit, unworthiness and worthlessness; that those who think themselves righteous are not the objects of divine compassion, but the unrighteous, the guilty and the undeserving, are the proper subjects for the infinite mercy of God; in a word, that salvation is not of merit but of grace.
To find the response of the pharisees and scribes to whom the Lord Jesus Christ was speaking when He told them the parables (plural), you have to read to Luke 16:14 ... they derided Him.
So there goes your erroneous statement that those to whom Christ spoke "corresponds in like action, though he begins to act and cooperate, he is not the author of it, the redeeming blood of Christ is" because those to whom He spoke did not begin "to act and cooperate" ... according to Luke 16:14 they derided Him ... which means they sneered at Him in their scornful rejection of His teaching.
Quit trying to align Scripture to your erroneous dogma ... read God's Word just as written ... ask God to reveal to you what it is that He wants you to know.
Your surmisings are nothing but the corruptible things God speaks of in 1 Peter 1:18.
READ YOUR BIBLE!!!
.
18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:
You dont believe it, thats unbelief !
newsflash for you, brightfame52 ... all mankind "turned everyone his own way". A person is not considered to be a child of God until God imputes His righteousness to him or her ... and according to Scripture, God imputes righteousness when a person believes.
The Lord Jesus Christ died for all mankind ... all descendants of Adam:
John 1:29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.
John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
2 Corinthians 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
According to 1 Peter 2, God allows mankind to reject Him:
1 Peter 2:7 Unto you therefore which believe he is precious: but unto them which be disobedient, the stone which the builders disallowed, the same is made the head of the corner
... you add words to Scripture in your futile attempt to align Scripture to your erroneous dogma.
In 1 Peter 3:18 you add the words " [the Sheep] " and " back ".
Why can you not read Scripture just as written? Why must you continuously add words and terms to Scripture which are not included in Scripture which is the Word of God? ... the God you claim you believe, yet there is no evidence of faith in you because you do not believe His Word just as He wrote it.
... absolutely not true. Do not blame God for the actions of mankind. God's Word tells us exactly what occurs when a person does not come to faith in the gospel of Christ:
Romans 1:
16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it [the gospel of Christ] is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.
17 For therein [the gospel of Christ] is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.
from faith to faith – not from works to faith or from faith to works ... from faith to faith. The life of the born again one begins in faith and the born again one is to continue to live by faith alone.
Romans 1:
18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold [Greek katecho] the truth in unrighteousness;
19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse
Rom 1:18-20 tells us that God makes plain His eternal power and Godhead ... however, this truth is suppressed. The words "who hold" in vs 18 are translated from the Greek word katechō which means to suppress; hold back; restrain. When the Word of God is spoken, the hearer restrains the truth from reaching his/her heart.
It is clear from vs 19 that God reveals His eternal power and Godhead and it is clear from vs 18 that it is the person who rejects God.
The ones who do not come to repentance reject that which God reveals to them. It's not that they can't believe ... it's that they reject that which is to be believed, even though what is to be believed has been revealed to them.
The fact that some reject God has no effect on the veracity of God's Word ... nor the efficacy of the sacrifice of the Lord Jesus Christ ... just as you rejecting what is written in Romans 1 has no effect on the truth stated therein.
READ YOUR BIBLE!!!
.
The Lord Jesus Christ died for all mankind ... all descendants of Adam:
John 1:29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.
John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
2 Corinthians 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
According to 1 Peter 2, God allows mankind to reject Him:
1 Peter 2:7 Unto you therefore which believe he is precious: but unto them which be disobedient, the stone which the builders disallowed, the same is made the head of the corner
... you add words to Scripture in your futile attempt to align Scripture to your erroneous dogma.In 1 Peter 3:18 you add the words " [the Sheep] " and " back ".
Why can you not read Scripture just as written? Why must you continuously add words and terms to Scripture which are not included in Scripture which is the Word of God? ... the God you claim you believe, yet there is no evidence of faith in you because you do not believe His Word just as He wrote it.
... absolutely not true. Do not blame God for the actions of mankind. God's Word tells us exactly what occurs when a person does not come to faith in the gospel of Christ:Romans 1:
16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it [the gospel of Christ] is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.
17 For therein [the gospel of Christ] is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.
from faith to faith – not from works to faith or from faith to works ... from faith to faith. The life of the born again one begins in faith and the born again one is to continue to live by faith alone.
Romans 1:
18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold [Greek katecho] the truth in unrighteousness;
19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse
Rom 1:18-20 tells us that God makes plain His eternal power and Godhead ... however, this truth is suppressed. The words "who hold" in vs 18 are translated from the Greek word katechō which means to suppress; hold back; restrain. When the Word of God is spoken, the hearer restrains the truth from reaching his/her heart.
It is clear from vs 19 that God reveals His eternal power and Godhead and it is clear from vs 18 that it is the person who rejects God.
The ones who do not come to repentance reject that which God reveals to them. It's not that they can't believe ... it's that they reject that which is to be believed, even though what is to be believed has been revealed to them.
The fact that some reject God has no effect on the veracity of God's Word ... nor the efficacy of the sacrifice of the Lord Jesus Christ ... just as you rejecting what is written in Romans 1 has no effect on the truth stated therein.
READ YOUR BIBLE!!!
.
I believe the verse as written in the context within which the Author of Scripture has placed it ... ,,, and I have explained the verse and its context to you many times ...
Post 1648
Post 1676
Post 1726
that your only reply to my many posts explaining to you the truth of Scripture is what is stated in Post 1746 submitted by @Magenta reveals the complete and utter inability of your erroneous dogma to withstand the scrutiny of Scripture.
I have now explained your error in your interpretation of Luke 15:11-32 which you also completely ignore ...
Your erroneous dogma fails under the light of Scripture ... so it is you who "dont believe it, thats unbelief !"
nope ... truth of Scripture which refutes your erroneous dogma.
.
Post 1648
Post 1676
Post 1726
that your only reply to my many posts explaining to you the truth of Scripture is what is stated in Post 1746 submitted by @Magenta reveals the complete and utter inability of your erroneous dogma to withstand the scrutiny of Scripture.
I have now explained your error in your interpretation of Luke 15:11-32 which you also completely ignore ...
Your erroneous dogma fails under the light of Scripture ... so it is you who "dont believe it, thats unbelief !"
nope ... truth of Scripture which refutes your erroneous dogma.
.
-
1
- Show all
That was from just the last few pages, too! So redundant... .
the erroneous dogma of brightfame52 cannot refute the truth of Scripture ... that's why the only response of brightfame52 is "unbelief !" (or words to that effect) whenever a brother or a sister in Christ tries to straighten out his erroneous dogma.
Psalm 12:6 The words of the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times.
Psalm 138:2 I will worship toward thy holy temple, and praise thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name.
.
-
2
- Show all
You're the one in denial as to what is written in Scripture.
I have provided Scripture which states the Lord Jesus Christ died for the whole world, all descendants of Adam:
John 1:29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.
John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
2 Corinthians 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
I have provided Scripture which tells us when God imputes righteousness:
Romans 4:
20 He [Abraham] staggered not at the promise of God through unbelief; but was strong in faith, giving glory to God;
21 And being fully persuaded that, what he [God] had promised, he [God] was able also to perform.
22 And therefore it was imputed to him [Abraham] for righteousness.
23 Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it [righteousness]was imputed to him;
24 But for us also, to whom it [righteousness] shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead;
25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.
5:1 Therefore, being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ
I have provided Scripture which tells of the power of God concerning salvation:
Romans 1:
16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it [the gospel of Christ] is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.
17 For therein [the gospel of Christ] is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.
... the one who is in "unbelief" is the one who does not believe Scripture just as written by the Author of Scripture ...
READ YOUR BIBLE!!!
.
I have provided Scripture which states the Lord Jesus Christ died for the whole world, all descendants of Adam:
John 1:29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.
John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
2 Corinthians 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
I have provided Scripture which tells us when God imputes righteousness:
Romans 4:
20 He [Abraham] staggered not at the promise of God through unbelief; but was strong in faith, giving glory to God;
21 And being fully persuaded that, what he [God] had promised, he [God] was able also to perform.
22 And therefore it was imputed to him [Abraham] for righteousness.
23 Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it [righteousness]was imputed to him;
24 But for us also, to whom it [righteousness] shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead;
25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.
5:1 Therefore, being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ
I have provided Scripture which tells of the power of God concerning salvation:
Romans 1:
16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it [the gospel of Christ] is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.
17 For therein [the gospel of Christ] is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.
... the one who is in "unbelief" is the one who does not believe Scripture just as written by the Author of Scripture ...READ YOUR BIBLE!!!
.