The Church in Acts did not meet on the first day of the week...

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disciplemike: any reaction to apostolic fathers about sunday/sabbath? In their times there were no RCC and it was from the time of apostles or generation after them.
 
disciplemike said:
why you assign things to me that I did not say. Why would one have to bolster their case with falsehoods?
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this is a common thing that occurs when one party does not make clear what it is they believe, so that the other parties are left to try to comprehend their beliefs simply by inference.

it can easily be remedied by clearly stating what you do believe. those with
could you maybe give him a few specific examples of what you think he has assumed wrongly, and clarify that with a detailed explanation of what exactly is the doctrine you actually believe, explaining why what he inferred was wrong, and why the things you said that lead a person to such assumptions are actually justified by your actual position?

that would help cease any division & confusion.

as believers, shouldn't we be working to eradicate confusion & division amongst ourselves? i rather think that would be an holy purpose, for His glory.

thanks.
 
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TonyJay said:
That is not an answer, it is a diversion.
Let us clearly see what you believe ABOUT Genesis 1:1 to Revelation 22:21.
You have been arguing and disputing doctrine since your arrival on this forum.
So, post your doctrines clearly for all to see - that way there will be no misunderstanding.

It cannot be any clearer that that!
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I do it every day. I am not sure what you are looking for. The Bible is my mandate. It is good for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness. So, now can you explain your tactical use of falsehoods?
 
disciplemike said:
I have been doing that for days now. keep reading.
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And yet when we analyse what you are saying you respond by calling us liars and other insults.
So, I challenge you again - make plain what your beliefs are - or we will be forced to draw the conclusion that you are not honest and credible.

It is very plain that whatever you believe is not anywhere close to orthodox Christianity or even Christian at all.
Your approach has been highly confrontational and divisive.
It is also clear that you came here with a very clear strategy.
And this has been to ask seemingly innocent questions to lure people in and then tell them that they are wrong when they answer with information, usually based on orthodox beliefs.

From what I can see you want to divert people away from Christianity into some sort of Judaism ostensibly believing in Jesus Christ but denying all the key tenets that make Christianity Christian.

If I am wrong I invite you to formally lay out your doctrines one by one in a single post.
That way I can see that I was wrong and everyone else can see unequivocally what you believe.

As things stand I do not believe that your beliefs can equal anything that could be called Christian.
 
TonyJay said:
And yet when we analyse what you are saying you respond by calling us liars and other insults.
So, I challenge you again - make plain what your beliefs are - or we will be forced to draw the conclusion that you are not honest and credible.
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not honest? coming from you? please. you are the one using the falsehoods. you are angry because I called you on it. just deal with it and try to be fair to people.
 
disciplemike said:
not honest? coming from you? please. you are the one using the falsehoods. you are angry because I called you on it. just deal with it and try to be fair to people.
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No, I am not angry.
Post you doctrines and then all the misunderstanding can be cleared up - we will know unequivocally what you believe.
The ball is in your court.
 
disciplemike said:
My faith (for salvation) is in the promise that God made to Abraham, that through Abraham's Seed, we would be blessed. My salvation is by Yeshuah HaMashiach. His very name means "salvation". This fact in no way shape or form voids the 4th commandment that He gave us.
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Cling to the shadows and you risk missing the Real......

IMG_0572.jpg
 
disciplemike said:
Chinese people can count to 7 just like we can. It is just that simple.
The Messiah's redemptive work did save believers from the penalty for their sins, which is death. The redemptive work did not void the 4th commandment, not by a long shot. Why do people work so hard to avoid a day of rest?
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Do you know in Chinese culture people perceive the first day of the week as Monday?
 
TonyJay said:
And yet when we analyse what you are saying you respond by calling us liars and other insults.
So, I challenge you again - make plain what your beliefs are - or we will be forced to draw the conclusion that you are not honest and credible.

It is very plain that whatever you believe is not anywhere close to orthodox Christianity or even Christian at all.
Your approach has been highly confrontational and divisive.
It is also clear that you came here with a very clear strategy.
And this has been to ask seemingly innocent questions to lure people in and then tell them that they are wrong when they answer with information, usually based on orthodox beliefs.

From what I can see you want to divert people away from Christianity into some sort of Judaism ostensibly believing in Jesus Christ but denying all the key tenets that make Christianity Christian.

If I am wrong I invite you to formally lay out your doctrines one by one in a single post.
That way I can see that I was wrong and everyone else can see unequivocally what you believe.

As things stand I do not believe that your beliefs can equal anything that could be called Christian.
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THIS!

From day one he posted, my thoughts exactly!
 
disciplemike said:
some of them perceive cats as food, but that don't make it right.
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Indeed. What makes it right for Christians not to keep Sabbath are the words of the apostles and of the Holy Spirit.

"The apostles and elders...to the Gentile believers:

It seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us not to burden you with anything beyond the following requirements:
You are to abstain from food sacrificed to idols, from blood, from the meat of strangled animals and from sexual immorality."

Acts 15:28

So do not stand against apostles, elders and the Holy Spirit.
 
trofimus said:
Indeed. What makes it right for Christians not to keep Sabbath are the words of the apostles and of the Holy Spirit.

"The apostles and elders...to the Gentile believers:

It seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us not to burden you with anything beyond the following requirements:
You are to abstain from food sacrificed to idols, from blood, from the meat of strangled animals and from sexual immorality."

Acts 15:28

So do not stand against apostles, elders and the Holy Spirit.
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so it is okay to murder, commit adultery, steal?

I think you need to keep reading in Acts 15, where brother Yacov tells them that they can learn the rest in Synagogue, where Moses is read on every Sabbath.
 
disciplemike said:
so it is okay to murder, commit adultery, steal?
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I have already responded to this. No, it is not okay, because it is not only the part of the Law, it was valid before the Law and is valid after the Law, too.

I think you need to keep reading in Acts 15, where brother Yacov tells them that they can learn the rest in Synagogue, where Moses is read on every Sabbath.
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1. Wrong. James did not speak after this letter to Christians from Gentiles, but before it. So you have messed up what is a result and what is a discussion in this context. First James, then the result - this letter.

2. This letter do not say you cannot "learn OT", every Christian do that. It says you cannot burden us with its commands!
 
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disciplemike said:
so it is okay to murder, commit adultery, steal?

I think you need to keep reading in Acts 15, where brother Yacov tells them that they can learn the rest in Synagogue, where Moses is read on every Sabbath.
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well, I think you should read the Bible without Hebrew roots glasses on, and you would not try to turn Christianity into Judaism. which Paul said not to do, the whole letter of Galatians
 
gb9 said:
well, I think you should read the Bible without Hebrew roots glasses on, and you would not try to turn Christianity into Judaism. which Paul said not to do, the whole letter of Galatians
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do no murder? is that Judaism? wow.
 
disciplemike said:
do no murder? is that Judaism? wow.
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You do not need OT law to know you are not allow to murder anyone. Its in every culture´s law. Before OT, in it, after it.

So your argument "without law it is permitted to murder" is wrong. Its in NT and its in the US law.
 
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