The Millennium literal or symbolic?

[Locutus]

Quote from PL move here from the rapture thread:

Let's not lose track of which realm (physical or spiritual) that these things are taking place. There is nothing in Rev 20:4-6 taking place in the physical (visible) realm. The beheaded saints are in the spiritual realm reigning with Christ. The "dead" are in the spiritual realm separated from God. There is no time in heaven, as I pointed out and Peter affirms. Since there is no sun in heaven, there is no time by scientific definition. Time is just a dimension.

Do the beheaded saints reigning with Christ stop reigning with Him after the so called thousand years? Do they cease being priests of God and of Christ? If so, then what do they do and what becomes of them?

Not losing track PL - this is the question I posed - where are you placing the resurrection?

The problem I see for you PL is that you have the "thousand" years with no end, whereas John states after the "thousand" years, so there is an end, and wherever you posit that end is where the resurrection is:

Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

On the one hand you say that Hades was emptied of the righteous and unrighteous in 70 AD, but you now have another resurrection after the "thousand" years.

​

 

[Lafftur]

[h=2]The Millennium literal or symbolic?[/h]And my answer is......

BOTH - literal AND symbolic.

Literal in that it is 1,000 years according to the Jewish calendar (currently on year 5778); and

Symbolic in that it is 1 day with the Lord - maybe our wedding day because after the millennium the Bride of Christ is no longer called the "Bride," but the New Jerusalem - the Lamb's Wife.

 

[lancaster]

The millennium is a literal span of time from the resurrection to 1000 AD. The 1st resurrection includes those that rose with Christ at His resurrection and went into the cities showing themselves alive. It also includes those that are partakers of salvation with Christ such as the thief on the cross who was crucified with Him. Paul in the 2nd chapter of Thessalonians spoke of the loosing of Satan and was looking 1000 yrs into the future. Satan infiltrated the church and undermined it; Paul calls this a great falling away of the church and the revelation of the man of sin that would deceive the entire world except the elect. Satan literally established his own church and by 1000 AD he had both political and ecclesiastical power to affect the entire world with all lying wonders; statues moved and pictures bled tears of blood. then we entered the dark ages. Jesus said, "work while it is day for the darkness cometh when no man can work." The one that came down from heaven was the messenger of the covenant, which was Christ and he confronted Satan in the temptation and bound him and spoiled his house; this is why the gates of hell will never prevail against the church. In revelations the first chapter Jesus proclaims that He is the one who possesses the keys to hell and to death. when Jesus Comes then he will resurrect all that are in the graves both the good and the bad and Judge them according to their works for many this will be the second death. At the end of this world He will send forth his angles and they will separate the good from the bad. Second Peter the 3rd chapter declares that He will destroy the world with unquenchable fire.

 

[garee]

Yeah the millenium is literal.

The Amil position seem to work the best for me at least today

Actually its signified the word thousand signifies an unknown amount to whatever is in view. (things seen,time "sun and moon", people, places, mountains, food etc ) The book of Revelation is no exception to the law or rule of faith . (the faith of God)

Rev 1:1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:


The word thousand along with multiples of ten are used in parables that way throughout the scriptures to give us the hidden manna as a understanding hid from those who have not the Spirit of Christ, the Holy Spirit of God. To them it is foolish and therefore they cannot understand and walk by faith. They stumble over the cross not abiding in Christ by faith.

2Corinthians 4:13 We having the same spirit of faith, according as it is written, I believed, and therefore have I spoken; we also believe, and therefore speak;

The key in that parable signifies the gospel .It unlocks the gates of hell as a bottomless pit a term used to signify a never ending justice where men will not be raised to new spirit life forever and ever. The key opens the gates and releases the prisoners who have been pardoned by Christ's three day labor of love or work of His faith.

Study the use of the word thousand and compare its spiritual meaning unseen, to the same unseen spirit of faith according as it is written . By it I can believe, with it we can all say amen.

We can I believe see that mutual faith of Christ working in all spiritual gifts as a two fold work affecting the ones feet that were moved according to the good pleasure of the will of God and give the other person the interpretation of God making it perfect as that which edifies God, never to edify man. .

Making request, if by any means now at length I might have a prosperous journey by the will of God to come unto you.For I long to see you, that I may impart unto you some spiritual gift, to the end ye may be established;

Not that the one sent might be established)

That is, that I may be comforted together with you by the mutual faith both of you and me.(Christs working in them)
Now I would not have you ignorant, brethren, that oftentimes I purposed to come unto you, (but was let hitherto,) that I might have some fruit among you also, even as among other Gentiles.I am debtor both to the Greeks, and to the Barbarians; both to the wise, and to the unwise.So, as much as in me is, I am ready to preach the gospel to you that are at Rome also.For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.Rom 1:17

That which is not of faith is the wrath of God it is of walking by sight of those who serve the temporal things of men seen, above the things of God the eternal .. not seen .

Rom 1:25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.


Interestingly he describes the power of the gospel as that which lives in us knowing it is not of us from the unseen spiritual understanding to the same .

His faith that works in us must increase as our non faith coming from the imagination of out own hearts it as long as we live in theses bodies of death will remain desperately wicked as in who can know ones own .

It is why along with our new spirit he gives us a new heart so that we can walk with him by faith in a hope of not carrying out the deeds of the flesh .

As always he must do the first works as his first love working in us. It is the work of God that we can believe him not seen.

Gotta love all the comforting personal pronouns ,they help to emphasize what he says... if he has begun the good work of salvation in us he will finish it to the end . He is our confidence as the anchor of our soul .

For I will take you from among the heathen, and gather you out of all countries, and will bring you into your own land.Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.And ye shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers; and ye shall be my people, and I will be your God.Eze 36:24

 

[Endoscopy]

[h=2]The Millennium literal or symbolic?[/h]And my answer is......

BOTH - literal AND symbolic.

Literal in that it is 1,000 years according to the Jewish calendar (currently on year 5778); and

Symbolic in that it is 1 day with the Lord - maybe our wedding day because after the millennium the Bride of Christ is no longer called the "Bride," but the New Jerusalem - the Lamb's Wife.

You stole my idea. ROFL

 

[miknik5]

The rest of the dead did not rise again until after the 1000 year reign

Those ruling in the millennium ate those who have a part in the first resurrection

(just as revelation 20 shows)

and the first fruits are still the Jews who come to faith in CHRIST at the last hour

just as the parable of the vineyard shows, the last will be first

 

[PlainWord]

Quote from PL move here from the rapture thread:



Not losing track PL - this is the question I posed - where are you placing the resurrection?

The problem I see for you PL is that you have the "thousand" years with no end, whereas John states after the "thousand" years, so there is an end, and wherever you posit that end is where the resurrection is:

Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

On the one hand you say that Hades was emptied of the righteous and unrighteous in 70 AD, but you now have another resurrection after the "thousand" years.

My point is that there is no time in heaven and the beheaded are reigning with Christ in heaven for a very long time (according to earth time).

As for Hades, only one side of the Gulf cleared out in 70 AD when Christ returned. The bad side is still there awaiting the resurrection of the damned.

 

[Locutus]

My point is that there is no time in heaven and the beheaded are reigning with Christ in heaven for a very long time (according to earth time).

As for Hades, only one side of the Gulf cleared out in 70 AD when Christ returned. The bad side is still there awaiting the resurrection of the damned.

The problem I see here PL is that Jesus did not mention a later resurrection of the "damned" - he said the righteous and unrighteous rise together - so how do you justify your position?


John 5:28 “Do not marvel at this; for an hour is coming, in which all who are in the tombs will hear His voice,

John 5:29 and will come forth; those who did the good deeds to a resurrection of life, those who committed the evil deeds to a resurrection of judgment.

What you are positing is two different hours, one past and one to come.

 

[Nehemiah6]

The problem I see here PL is that Jesus did not mention a later resurrection of the "damned" - he said the righteous and unrighteous rise together - so how do you justify your position?


John 5:28 “Do not marvel at this; for an hour is coming, in which all who are in the tombs will hear His voice,

John 5:29 and will come forth; those who did the good deeds to a resurrection of life, those who committed the evil deeds to a resurrection of judgment.

Just because Jesus summed up the two resurrections succinctly does not mean that we are to ignore everything else about the resurrections. Indeed He anticipated that His apostles would provide further light on His teachings, as well as fully explain the things He said very briefly. At the very least we know from Scripture that the first resurrection is separated from the second resurrection by AT LEAST one thousand years (Rev 20). So *the hour is coming* simply means *the time is coming*.

 

[PlainWord]

The problem I see here PL is that Jesus did not mention a later resurrection of the "damned" - he said the righteous and unrighteous rise together - so how do you justify your position?


John 5:28 “Do not marvel at this; for an hour is coming, in which all who are in the tombs will hear His voice,

John 5:29 and will come forth; those who did the good deeds to a resurrection of life, those who committed the evil deeds to a resurrection of judgment.

What you are positing is two different hours, one past and one to come.

I have a theory about this which I've never stated publicly. Will send you a PM.

 

[Endoscopy]

The Amil position seem to work the best for me at least today

Actually its signified the word thousand signifies an unknown amount to whatever is in view. (things seen,time "sun and moon", people, places, mountains, food etc ) The book of Revelation is no exception to the law or rule of faith . (the faith of God)

Rev 1:1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:


The word thousand along with multiples of ten are used in parables that way throughout the scriptures to give us the hidden manna as a understanding hid from those who have not the Spirit of Christ, the Holy Spirit of God. To them it is foolish and therefore they cannot understand and walk by faith. They stumble over the cross not abiding in Christ by faith.

2Corinthians 4:13 We having the same spirit of faith, according as it is written, I believed, and therefore have I spoken; we also believe, and therefore speak;

The key in that parable signifies the gospel .It unlocks the gates of hell as a bottomless pit a term used to signify a never ending justice where men will not be raised to new spirit life forever and ever. The key opens the gates and releases the prisoners who have been pardoned by Christ's three day labor of love or work of His faith.

Study the use of the word thousand and compare its spiritual meaning unseen, to the same unseen spirit of faith according as it is written . By it I can believe, with it we can all say amen.

We can I believe see that mutual faith of Christ working in all spiritual gifts as a two fold work affecting the ones feet that were moved according to the good pleasure of the will of God and give the other person the interpretation of God making it perfect as that which edifies God, never to edify man. .

Making request, if by any means now at length I might have a prosperous journey by the will of God to come unto you.For I long to see you, that I may impart unto you some spiritual gift, to the end ye may be established;

Not that the one sent might be established)

That is, that I may be comforted together with you by the mutual faith both of you and me.(Christs working in them)
Now I would not have you ignorant, brethren, that oftentimes I purposed to come unto you, (but was let hitherto,) that I might have some fruit among you also, even as among other Gentiles.I am debtor both to the Greeks, and to the Barbarians; both to the wise, and to the unwise.So, as much as in me is, I am ready to preach the gospel to you that are at Rome also.For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.Rom 1:17

That which is not of faith is the wrath of God it is of walking by sight of those who serve the temporal things of men seen, above the things of God the eternal .. not seen .

Rom 1:25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.


Interestingly he describes the power of the gospel as that which lives in us knowing it is not of us from the unseen spiritual understanding to the same .

His faith that works in us must increase as our non faith coming from the imagination of out own hearts it as long as we live in theses bodies of death will remain desperately wicked as in who can know ones own .

It is why along with our new spirit he gives us a new heart so that we can walk with him by faith in a hope of not carrying out the deeds of the flesh .

As always he must do the first works as his first love working in us. It is the work of God that we can believe him not seen.

Gotta love all the comforting personal pronouns ,they help to emphasize what he says... if he has begun the good work of salvation in us he will finish it to the end . He is our confidence as the anchor of our soul .

For I will take you from among the heathen, and gather you out of all countries, and will bring you into your own land.Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.And ye shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers; and ye shall be my people, and I will be your God.Eze 36:24

Another one who doesn't want their post to be read. The longer the post the fewer people will read it. Post a section of scripture and a brief statement about it. Do this several times and people will read them.

 

[MatthewG]

Post #292

Blessings brothers, and sisters in Christ Jesus.