The prodigal son?

[EmilyFoster]

I sometimes wonder by drawing a parallel to today's world. If kids go away from home and lose everything, there is a possibility they will go into further/deeper sin and illegal activities. They might not want to get back home to their family.

But this story is a great example that God is ready to accept us with open arms even in the worst of our conditions if we turn our hearts back to Him. Very thought provoking and encouraging.

 

[Loopyslament]

Atimely reminder of the unchanching principle of the God head Emily, often said it is the only time we see a Picture of God in a hurry

 

[Noblemen]

There are not two Covenant's, the old Covenant and new Covenant, but rather there is one Covenant: The original Covenant, and the renewed Covenant, what we call the New Covenant.

Question if I may? Do you not see a distinction between the Old Testament and the New Testiment, one with no Christ in you life, and one with the new Christ in you nature, curious.

 

[justpassinthrough]

Question if I may? Do you not see a distinction between the Old Testament and the New Testiment, one with no Christ in you life, and one with the new Christ in you nature, curious.

Who is it that you think Abraham was in covenant with?

the Lord appeared to Abram and said to him, “I am Almighty God; walk before Me and be blameless. And I will make My covenant between Me and you​

When Abram was ninety-nine years old, the Lord appeared to Abram and said to him, “I am Almighty God; walk before Me and be blameless. And I will make My covenant between Me and you, and will multiply you exceedingly.” Then Abram fell on his face, and God talked with him, saying: “As for Me, behold, My covenant is with you, and you shall be a father of many nations. No longer shall your name be called Abram, but your name shall be Abraham; for I have made you a father of many nations. I will make you exceedingly fruitful; and I will make nations of you, and kings shall come from you. And I will establish My covenant between Me and you and your descendants after you in their generations, for an everlasting covenant, to be God to you and your descendants after you. Also I give to you and your descendants after you the land in which you are a stranger, all the land of Canaan, as an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.” Genesis 17:1-8



again



And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel to Abraham beforehand, saying, “In you all the nations shall be blessed.” So then those who are of faith are blessed with believing Abraham. Galatians 3:8



again



And this I say, that the law, which was four hundred and thirty years later, cannot annul the covenant that was confirmed before by God in Christ, that it should make the promise of no effect. Galatians 3:17



The Spirit of Jesus Christ dwelled within Abraham, and empowered him to walk with Him in obedience.

• because Abraham obeyed My voice and kept My charge, My commandments, My statutes, and My laws.” Genesis 26:5

The same Spirit that we have in us if we have obeyed the Gospel.






JPT

 

[gb9]

Who is it that you think Abraham was in covenant with?

the Lord appeared to Abram and said to him, “I am Almighty God; walk before Me and be blameless. And I will make My covenant between Me and you​

When Abram was ninety-nine years old, the Lord appeared to Abram and said to him, “I am Almighty God; walk before Me and be blameless. And I will make My covenant between Me and you, and will multiply you exceedingly.” Then Abram fell on his face, and God talked with him, saying: “As for Me, behold, My covenant is with you, and you shall be a father of many nations. No longer shall your name be called Abram, but your name shall be Abraham; for I have made you a father of many nations. I will make you exceedingly fruitful; and I will make nations of you, and kings shall come from you. And I will establish My covenant between Me and you and your descendants after you in their generations, for an everlasting covenant, to be God to you and your descendants after you. Also I give to you and your descendants after you the land in which you are a stranger, all the land of Canaan, as an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.” Genesis 17:1-8



again



And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel to Abraham beforehand, saying, “In you all the nations shall be blessed.” So then those who are of faith are blessed with believing Abraham. Galatians 3:8



again



And this I say, that the law, which was four hundred and thirty years later, cannot annul the covenant that was confirmed before by God in Christ, that it should make the promise of no effect. Galatians 3:17



The Spirit of Jesus Christ dwelled within Abraham, and empowered him to walk with Him in obedience.

• because Abraham obeyed My voice and kept My charge, My commandments, My statutes, and My laws.” Genesis 26:5

The same Spirit that we have in us if we have obeyed the Gospel.






JPT

and what is the Gospel? believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved. that's it.

 

[Noblemen]

Who is it that you think Abraham was in covenant with?

the Lord appeared to Abram and said to him, “I am Almighty God; walk before Me and be blameless. And I will make My covenant between Me and you​

When Abram was ninety-nine years old, the Lord appeared to Abram and said to him, “I am Almighty God; walk before Me and be blameless. And I will make My covenant between Me and you, and will multiply you exceedingly.” Then Abram fell on his face, and God talked with him, saying: “As for Me, behold, My covenant is with you, and you shall be a father of many nations. No longer shall your name be called Abram, but your name shall be Abraham; for I have made you a father of many nations. I will make you exceedingly fruitful; and I will make nations of you, and kings shall come from you. And I will establish My covenant between Me and you and your descendants after you in their generations, for an everlasting covenant, to be God to you and your descendants after you. Also I give to you and your descendants after you the land in which you are a stranger, all the land of Canaan, as an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.” Genesis 17:1-8



again



And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel to Abraham beforehand, saying, “In you all the nations shall be blessed.” So then those who are of faith are blessed with believing Abraham. Galatians 3:8



again



And this I say, that the law, which was four hundred and thirty years later, cannot annul the covenant that was confirmed before by God in Christ, that it should make the promise of no effect. Galatians 3:17



The Spirit of Jesus Christ dwelled within Abraham, and empowered him to walk with Him in obedience.

• because Abraham obeyed My voice and kept My charge, My commandments, My statutes, and My laws.” Genesis 26:5

The same Spirit that we have in us if we have obeyed the Gospel.






JPT

Ok thanks, fair enough.

Who is it that you think Abraham was in covenant with?

the Lord appeared to Abram and said to him, “I am Almighty God; walk before Me and be blameless. And I will make My covenant between Me and you​

When Abram was ninety-nine years old, the Lord appeared to Abram and said to him, “I am Almighty God; walk before Me and be blameless. And I will make My covenant between Me and you, and will multiply you exceedingly.” Then Abram fell on his face, and God talked with him, saying: “As for Me, behold, My covenant is with you, and you shall be a father of many nations. No longer shall your name be called Abram, but your name shall be Abraham; for I have made you a father of many nations. I will make you exceedingly fruitful; and I will make nations of you, and kings shall come from you. And I will establish My covenant between Me and you and your descendants after you in their generations, for an everlasting covenant, to be God to you and your descendants after you. Also I give to you and your descendants after you the land in which you are a stranger, all the land of Canaan, as an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.” Genesis 17:1-8



again



And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel to Abraham beforehand, saying, “In you all the nations shall be blessed.” So then those who are of faith are blessed with believing Abraham. Galatians 3:8



again



And this I say, that the law, which was four hundred and thirty years later, cannot annul the covenant that was confirmed before by God in Christ, that it should make the promise of no effect. Galatians 3:17



The Spirit of Jesus Christ dwelled within Abraham, and empowered him to walk with Him in obedience.

• because Abraham obeyed My voice and kept My charge, My commandments, My statutes, and My laws.” Genesis 26:5

The same Spirit that we have in us if we have obeyed the Gospel.






JPT

Ok thanks, fair enough.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

So, what is the word of reconciliation that has been given to us, justpassinthrough?

The Gospel message.

Repent for the kingdom of God is at hand.

Those who are lost need to repent.

Do you believe the word of reconciliation revealed in 2 Cor 5:19-21 is as just true and crucial to us as what John Baptist, Jesus, and the apostles preached when they stated Repent ye: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand (Matt 3:3; Matt 4:17; Matt 10:7)?

Do you ever share the words in 2 Cor 5:18-21 with people with whom you come into contact?


2 Corinthians 5:

18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;

19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.

21 For he [God] hath made him [our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ] to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

I believe what JPt said ..that they FIRST have to BECOME children of God then..once SAVED . no..they won't be cast into the fires of hell if they haven't had a chance to repent but they WILL be judged and held accountable before God Almighty

justpassinthrough believes the born again believer will be cast into the lake of fire if they have not repented before they die.

Here is what justpassinthrough stated in response to my statement "It appears to me you believe that if a born again believer sins and then dies before he or she confesses his or her sin, that person is cast into the lake of fire."

From Post #1,614 in the OSAS= House Built on Sand thread.

"The general answer is yes, if a born again Christian dies in their sins they will go to hell."​

 

[reneweddaybyday]

The Spirit of Jesus Christ dwelled within Abraham, and empowered him to walk with Him in obedience.

• because Abraham obeyed My voice and kept My charge, My commandments, My statutes, and My laws.” Genesis 26:5

The same Spirit that we have in us if we have obeyed the Gospel.

In agreement that the Spirit is the same in NT as it was in OT as Ephesians 4:4 tells us.

However, there is a difference in what we have in our day and time and what was available in OT.

OT believers had Holy Spirit upon them.

From and after Day of Pentecost, the born again believer has the indwelling.

Please see below (bold / underline mine):

The second aspect of the Spirit’s work in the Old Testament is indwelling, or filling. Here is where the major difference between the Spirit’s roles in the Old and New Testaments is apparent. The New Testament teaches the permanent indwelling of the Holy Spirit in believers (1 Corinthians 3:16-17; 6:19-20). When we place our faith in Christ for salvation, the Holy Spirit comes to live within us. The Apostle Paul calls this permanent indwelling the “guarantee of our inheritance” (Ephesians 1:13-14). In contrast to this work in the New Testament, the indwelling in the Old Testament was selective and temporary. The Spirit “came upon” such Old Testament people as Joshua (Numbers 27:18), David (1 Samuel 16:12-13) and even Saul (1 Samuel 10:10). In the book of Judges, we see the Spirit “coming upon” the various judges whom God raised up to deliver Israel from their oppressors. The Holy Spirit came upon these individuals for specific tasks. The indwelling was a sign of God’s favor upon that individual (in the case of David), and if God’s favor left an individual, the Spirit would depart (e.g., in Saul’s case in 1 Samuel 16:14). Finally, the Spirit “coming upon” an individual doesn’t always indicate that person’s spiritual condition (e.g., Saul, Samson, and many of the judges). So, while in the New Testament the Spirit only indwells believers and that indwelling is permanent, the Spirit came upon certain Old Testament individuals for a specific task, irrespective of their spiritual condition. Once the task was completed, the Spirit presumably departed from that person.​

​

https://www.gotquestions.org/Spirit-Old-Testament.html​

In fact, 1 Peter 1:10-12 indicates that the OT prophets searched diligently to learn of what we have now in our day and time, and even the angels desire to look into what it is to be born again in our day and time:

1 Peter 1:

10 Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:

11 Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.

13 Unto whom it was revealed, that not unto themselves, but unto us they did minister the things, which are now reported unto you by them that have preached the gospel unto you with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven; which things the angels desire to look into.

 

[Noblemen]

A point should be made on one of our favorite quotes "God never changes or God does not change." True but the way he deals with people at different times does change.
Normally referred to as a dispensation, the way he handled Abram for instance is different than the way he would handles Moses. They had a message for their age and they proclaimed it. Adam and Eve had a message for their age, and so on, we have a message for our age. Our message is different from anyone else had in their age.
Not one of the other dispensations had a cross or a new birth or God as their father, none had a new Christ in you spirit-nature that we have. They can't be mixed, you know what a little leven will do to your message.
You loose your witness for Christ as life, and settle for a battle of doctrines. Never coming to understand Christ who is your only life, Gal. 2:20.
The HolySpirit will not make you nelieve anything, he will lead you he can comfort you as revelation begins to flow.
The believer that chooses not to yield to the HolySpirit can not understand their new birth in Christ. Standing firm in what I believe more than being taught of the HolySpirit.
There are things in God that believers miss out on because of what I believe. Christ as the life of the believer is everything we are looking for, granted it's in the fathers timing but it exsists in him who is our life, Gal. 4:1-2.

 

[justpassinthrough]

and what is the Gospel? believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved. that's it.

The Gospel of the Lord Jesus Christ.


From that time Jesus began to preach and to say, “Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.” Matthew 4:17

• Repent means to turn to God.

If you are called to turn to God, then by default you are called to turn from Satan as your lord.


This is believing the Lord Jesus, which means to obey and trust Him as Lord.


The way that your express this obedience of faith, concerning the Gospel is to confess Jesus as Lord.

This is what grants the believer/obeyer of the Gospel, the forgiveness of sins.

This is plainly what the Lord Jesus Christ taught to and commissioned Paul to do.

• The road to Damascus -

15 So I said, ‘Who are You, Lord?’ And He said, ‘I am Jesus, whom you are persecuting. 16 But rise and stand on your feet; for I have appeared to you for this purpose, to make you a minister and a witness both of the things which you have seen and of the things which I will yet reveal to you. 17 I will deliver you from the Jewish people, as well as from the Gentiles, to whom I now send you, 18 to open their eyes, in order to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who are sanctified by faith in Me.’ “Therefore, King Agrippa, I was not disobedient to the heavenly vision, but declared first to those in Damascus and in Jerusalem, and throughout all the region of Judea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent, turn to God, and do works befitting repentance. Acts 26:15-20

that they should repent, turn to God, and do works befitting repentance​

Repent is about being transferred from the kingdom of darkness to the kingdom of God.

• He has delivered us from the power of darkness and conveyed us into the kingdom of the Son of His love, Colossians 1:13

It's about changing who you serve, as your Lord.

• The Gospel of the kingdom is about changing the kingdom your are in, by changing the lord you serve.

 

[justpassinthrough]

Do you ever share the words in 2 Cor 5:18-21 with people with whom you come into contact?

When I’m teaching.


The ministry of reconstruction is reconciling people to God through the Gospel.



JPT

 

[justpassinthrough]

OT believers had Holy Spirit upon them.

• the Spirit of Christ who was in them

Of this salvation the prophets have inquired and searched carefully, who prophesied of the grace that would come to you, searching what, or what manner of time, the Spirit of Christ who was in them was indicating when He testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ and the glories that would follow.
1 Peter 1:10



JPT

 

[reneweddaybyday]

The ministry of reconstruction is reconciling people to God through the Gospel.

So when you teach 2 Cor 5:18-21, do you stick with what is written right there in the context?

Or do you conflate the message of the ministry of reconciliation shown in 2 Cor 5:18-21 with the parables of Luke 15?

 

[reneweddaybyday]

the Spirit of Christ who was in them

Please see below (bold / underline mine):

The second aspect of the Spirit’s work in the Old Testament is indwelling, or filling. Here is where the major difference between the Spirit’s roles in the Old and New Testaments is apparent. The New Testament teaches the permanent indwelling of the Holy Spirit in believers (1 Corinthians 3:16-17; 6:19-20). When we place our faith in Christ for salvation, the Holy Spirit comes to live within us. The Apostle Paul calls this permanent indwelling the “guarantee of our inheritance” (Ephesians 1:13-14). In contrast to this work in the New Testament, the indwelling in the Old Testament was selective and temporary. The Spirit “came upon” such Old Testament people as Joshua (Numbers 27:18), David (1 Samuel 16:12-13) and even Saul (1 Samuel 10:10). In the book of Judges, we see the Spirit “coming upon” the various judges whom God raised up to deliver Israel from their oppressors. The Holy Spirit came upon these individuals for specific tasks. The indwelling was a sign of God’s favor upon that individual (in the case of David), and if God’s favor left an individual, the Spirit would depart (e.g., in Saul’s case in 1 Samuel 16:14). Finally, the Spirit “coming upon” an individual doesn’t always indicate that person’s spiritual condition (e.g., Saul, Samson, and many of the judges). So, while in the New Testament the Spirit only indwells believers and that indwelling is permanent, the Spirit came upon certain Old Testament individuals for a specific task, irrespective of their spiritual condition. Once the task was completed, the Spirit presumably departed from that person.​

​

https://www.gotquestions.org/Spirit-Old-Testament.html​

 

[Lillywolf]

I read the parable as the simple proof of Father's eternal grace covenant for his children who are alive in him for eternity. In this world and the next. The son could leave the father. But the father never abandoned his son.

 

[justpassinthrough]

So when you teach 2 Cor 5:18-21, do you stick with what is written right there in the context?

Or do you conflate the message of the ministry of reconciliation shown in 2 Cor 5:18-21 with the parables of Luke 15?

Reconciliation with God is just that:
Being reconciled to God.


No matter where it is taught in the scriptures, the way to be reconciled to God is to obey Him and repent.


The only way a person is reconciled to God is to turn to Him or return to Him: Repent.


JPT

 

[justpassinthrough]

Please see below (bold / underline mine):

The second aspect of the Spirit’s work in the Old Testament is indwelling, or filling. Here is where the major difference between the Spirit’s roles in the Old and New Testaments is apparent. The New Testament teaches the permanent indwelling of the Holy Spirit in believers (1 Corinthians 3:16-17; 6:19-20). When we place our faith in Christ for salvation, the Holy Spirit comes to live within us. The Apostle Paul calls this permanent indwelling the “guarantee of our inheritance” (Ephesians 1:13-14). In contrast to this work in the New Testament, the indwelling in the Old Testament was selective and temporary. The Spirit “came upon” such Old Testament people as Joshua (Numbers 27:18), David (1 Samuel 16:12-13) and even Saul (1 Samuel 10:10). In the book of Judges, we see the Spirit “coming upon” the various judges whom God raised up to deliver Israel from their oppressors. The Holy Spirit came upon these individuals for specific tasks. The indwelling was a sign of God’s favor upon that individual (in the case of David), and if God’s favor left an individual, the Spirit would depart (e.g., in Saul’s case in 1 Samuel 16:14). Finally, the Spirit “coming upon” an individual doesn’t always indicate that person’s spiritual condition (e.g., Saul, Samson, and many of the judges). So, while in the New Testament the Spirit only indwells believers and that indwelling is permanent, the Spirit came upon certain Old Testament individuals for a specific task, irrespective of their spiritual condition. Once the task was completed, the Spirit presumably departed from that person.​

​

https://www.gotquestions.org/Spirit-Old-Testament.html​

Sorry but your commentary you posted will never change the truth of scripture.


Abraham was in covenant with Christ, and had His Spirit in him.


JPT

 

[reneweddaybyday]

Reconciliation with God is just that:
Being reconciled to God.

No matter where it is taught in the scriptures, the way to be reconciled to God is to obey Him and repent.

The only way a person is reconciled to God is to turn to Him or return to Him: Repent.

Here is the gospel:

1 Corinthians 15:

1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;

2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.

3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;

4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures



The Lord Jesus Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures;
The Lord Jesus Christ was buried, and He rose again the third day according to the Scriptures.


Romans 10:9-10 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.


You preaching "the only way a person is reconciled to God is to turn to Him ... : Repent"

without telling that person the gospel as written in Scripture does nothing to turn that person to God.

The way in which we turn to God is through the Lord Jesus Christ.

If all you do is tell a person is "turn to God ... repent of your sin" without showing them how to turn to God (i.e. confess with your mouth Jesus Christ is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead), you are not preaching the Gospel.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

Sorry but your commentary you posted will never change the truth of scripture.

The truth of Scripture is that in our day and time we have the Comforter which would not come unless Jesus departed:

John 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.




In our day and time, we are sealed with that holy Spirit of promise until the redemption of the purchase possession (still future):

Ephesians 1:

13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

14 Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.




In our day and time, what we have as an indwelling, present reality is something the prophets of old inquired of and searched diligently:

1 Peter 1:

10 Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:

11 Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.

12 Unto whom it was revealed, that not unto themselves, but unto us they did minister the things, which are now reported unto you by them that have preached the gospel unto you with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven; which things the angels desire to look into.


vs 12 unto whom [the prophets of old] it was revealed that not unto themselves, but unto us

The prophets of old saw something they never attained to.




Hebrews 11 explains it this way:

39 And these all, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise:

40 God having provided some better thing for us




Since it is the truth of Scripture that:

Jesus had to go away in order to send what we have in our day and time John 16:7);​

​

We are sealed with that holy Spirit of promise until the redemption of the purchase possession (still future) (Eph 1:13-14);​

​

What we have in our day and time was something the prophets of old had revealed to them that it was not unto themselves but unto us (1 Peter 1:12);​

​

Those who obtained a good report received not the promise: God having provided some better thing for us (Heb 11:39-40)​

surely you can acknowledge the truth of Scripture ...