There will be no Rapture!!!

[selahsays]

But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you. For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night. For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape. But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief. Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness. Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober.

- 1 Thessalonians 5:1-6 (KJV)

 

[Prodigal]

Chris

I just want to understand your own view though. I get it there is no rapture to you which is fine with me. But do you believe Jesus will come back and collect us? If so, when?


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Christ said He’s coming back for us, and He said it would be a surprise. 😊
There are only so many hours in the day. If I spend more time studying eschatology than I spend in prayer, I’m not using my time wisely. If all the biblical studies and spiritual duties or pursuits for one to be involved in, the study of future events is the least profitable, particularly for a new believer or a seeker. Everyone has an opinion on the end times, but prophecy is not understood until after it has been fulfilled. This was so at Christs first coming, and it will be so at His final coming. We should study to know Christ, to walk in His ways, to overcome the world, and to mortify the flesh. Beyond this we find ourselves in the realm of doubtful disputations which lead to division, divination, denomination, desperation etc.

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

I believe that we are living in the end times, as has every believer since Christ ascended to the right hand of the Father. I am a former dispensationalist, praise God, who now leans toward partial preterism. However, my most strongly held view on eschatology, is to do as Christ commanded, and be ready, for He cometh in an hour which I know not.

Ah okay, that's great! As long as you take God's command to heart to be prepared then I'm not worried. I do get worried for the pre-tribbers though because they're not preparing AT ALL to endure what's to come.


First of all, Jesus won't come back to collect us until after the great apostasy and antichrist are revealed:

2 Thessalonians 2:3 Don’t let anyone deceive you in any way, for that day will not come until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the man doomed to destruction.


I agree that the Bible does say that we won't know the day or the hour but we can recognize the season.

1 Thessalonians 5:4 But you, brothers and sisters, are not in darkness so that this day should surprise you like a thief. 5 You are all children of the light and children of the day. We do not belong to the night or to the darkness. 6 So then, let us not be like others, who are asleep, but let us be awake and sober.

and

Luke 21:25 “There will be signs in the sun, moon and stars. On the earth, nations will be in anguish and perplexity at the roaring and tossing of the sea. 26 People will faint from terror, apprehensive of what is coming on the world, for the heavenly bodies will be shaken. 27 At that time they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. 28 When these things begin to take place, stand up and lift up your heads, because your redemption is drawing near.”

29 He told them this parable: “Look at the fig tree and all the trees. 30 When they sprout leaves, you can see for yourselves and know that summer is near. 31 Even so, when you see these things happening, you know that the kingdom of God is near.


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[Prodigal]

Ah okay, that's great! As long as you take God's command to heart to be prepared then I'm not worried. I do get worried for the pre-tribbers though because they're not preparing AT ALL to endure what's to come.


First of all, Jesus won't come back to collect us until after the great apostasy and antichrist are revealed:

2 Thessalonians 2:3 Don’t let anyone deceive you in any way, for that day will not come until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the man doomed to destruction.


I agree that the Bible does say that we won't know the day or the hour but we can recognize the season.

1 Thessalonians 5:4 But you, brothers and sisters, are not in darkness so that this day should surprise you like a thief. 5 You are all children of the light and children of the day. We do not belong to the night or to the darkness. 6 So then, let us not be like others, who are asleep, but let us be awake and sober.

and

Luke 21:25 “There will be signs in the sun, moon and stars. On the earth, nations will be in anguish and perplexity at the roaring and tossing of the sea. 26 People will faint from terror, apprehensive of what is coming on the world, for the heavenly bodies will be shaken. 27 At that time they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. 28 When these things begin to take place, stand up and lift up your heads, because your redemption is drawing near.”

29 He told them this parable: “Look at the fig tree and all the trees. 30 When they sprout leaves, you can see for yourselves and know that summer is near. 31 Even so, when you see these things happening, you know that the kingdom of God is near.


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I’m not saying that I necessarily subscribe to this viewpoint, but have you ever considered the possibility that we are actually living in the Short Season post millennial reign period?

 

[HeIsHere]

I simply read the bible and take Jesus at His word.

Sir, the level of scripture twisting required to embrace dispensational theology, if such a damnable heresy is even worthy of being called theology, boggles my mind. I am however, sympathetic to your viewpoint. I was raised a Southern Baptist and schooled extensively in dispensational theology. In 1990 at the age of 23 when I met Christ personally and received His Holy Spirit, this was one of the very first things revealed to me, and it came as quite a shock. I’m not implying you do not have the Spirit of God. I am firmly stating however, that this heresy is as easily refuted as any other, but only if you are willing to lay down your dogmas and embrace the truth at whatever cost. Once you reach that point, about 15 minutes of investigation is all it takes to find the source of this satanic lie. Of course, unlearning your indoctrination will be a longer process, and humbling. God Speed

AMEN and AMEN and AMEN!!

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

I’m not saying that I necessarily subscribe to this viewpoint, but have you ever considered the possibility that we are actually living in the Short Season post millennial reign period?

No.

Too many things have not come to pass yet, so we've not come to that point.

But as long as you're prepared for anything - to endure to the end - then you should be fine for any outcome.


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[Prodigal]

No.

Too many things have not come to pass yet, so we've not come to that point.

But as long as you're prepared for anything - to endure to the end - then you should be fine for any outcome.


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“History is a set of lies agreed upon”
Napoleon

 

[HeIsHere]

You can’t be serious. Denying biblical truth is what every pre tribber since John Darby has been doing.

1827.
Someone has done their research,

I am glad you have done your research.

When I learn about anyone who is released from this false doctrine it brings me great, immeasurable joy.

 

[Prodigal]

I am glad you have done your research.

When I learn of anyone who is released from this false doctrine it brings me great immeasurable joy.

It certainly brought me a lot of joy.
Had I not been taught this garbage from childhood I might have came to Christ much sooner than I actually did. My best guess says I am not alone in that regard.

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

“History is a set of lies agreed upon”
Napoleon

*Shrug* He lost the empire and was exiled, OF COURSE he's going to say that!

Bible prophecy hasn't failed yet. It will prove itself true whether we believe it or not.


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[HeIsHere]

It certainly brought me a lot of joy.
Had I not been taught this garbage from childhood I might have came to Christ much sooner than I actually did. My best guess says I am not alone in that regard.

No you are not.

A little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing, when I really examined dispensationalism, I thought to myself was how did I ever believe this, it is such a twist and denial of what scripture plainly states.

 

[ZNP]

If you knew what you were talking about, you would know for a certainty that the snatching of the Bride MUST necessarily take place before the tribulation. This due to the rapture being the 8th step in the 12 step Jewish wedding ritual.

We are all appointed to tribulation, I prefer to use the term "before the 70th week" or at the end of the church age.

 

[cv5]

I simply read the bible and take Jesus at His word.

Sir, the level of scripture twisting required to embrace dispensational theology, if such a damnable heresy is even worthy of being called theology, boggles my mind. I am however, sympathetic to your viewpoint. I was raised a Southern Baptist and schooled extensively in dispensational theology. In 1990 at the age of 23 when I met Christ personally and received His Holy Spirit, this was one of the very first things revealed to me, and it came as quite a shock. I’m not implying you do not have the Spirit of God. I am firmly stating however, that this heresy is as easily refuted as any other, but only if you are willing to lay down your dogmas and embrace the truth at whatever cost. Once you reach that point, about 15 minutes of investigation is all it takes to find the source of this satanic lie. Of course, unlearning your indoctrination will be a longer process, and humbling. God Speed

I see nothing in your post that supports your position. Or any other post on CC. Ever.

If you do not yet understand the snatching of the Bride as it relates to the Church the virgin bride, the necessity of the redemption of the divorced wife of YHVH Israel, the time of Jacobs's trouble that precedes this and the full expanse of Biblical prophecy that confirms all of this, then you are holding an empty bag.

Nothing is more certain than the rapture. Its boilerplate Biblical doctrine.

Rev 3:10
Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

 

[Bingo]

“History is a set of lies agreed upon”
Napoleon

"Words of great soundness."

 

[DJT_47]

Amen, brother. The seals, trumpets, and bowls are God's Wrath and cover all 7 years. The unleashing of the Antichrist is itself a part of God's judgement and wrath. He is the First Horseman.

No such thing as the Rapture found in scripture. And, Revelation was addressed to the 7 churches of Asia 2000 yrs ago and the scripture says these things must shortly come to pass. What did it mean to THEM? What does it really mean to us??

 

[ZNP]

I see nothing in your post that supports your position. Or any other post on CC. Ever.

If you do not yet understand the snatching of the Bride as it relates to the Church the virgin bride, the necessity of the redemption of the divorced wife of YHVH Israel, the time of Jacobs's trouble that precedes this and the full expanse of Biblical prophecy that confirms all of this, then you are holding an empty bag.

Nothing is more certain than the rapture. Its boilerplate Biblical doctrine.

Rev 3:10
Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

It is essential that the apostate church take a very clear stand on this prior to the rapture because we have prophecies that the "Beast" will hate the whore and devour her flesh. The apostate church will be destroyed after the rapture.

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

I see nothing in your post that supports your position. Or any other post on CC. Ever.

If you do not yet understand the snatching of the Bride as it relates to the Church the virgin bride, the necessity of the redemption of the divorced wife of YHVH Israel, the time of Jacobs's trouble that precedes this and the full expanse of Biblical prophecy that confirms all of this, then you are holding an empty bag.

Nothing is more certain than the rapture. Its boilerplate Biblical doctrine.

Rev 3:10
Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

Well, there are so many beliefs about the end times obviously. The only thing we can know for sure is that one of them is true and will play out accordingly.

I think the safest strategy though is to prepare for the worst and build up our faith to endure to the end.


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[Musicmaster]

Some have argued that the pre-trib rapture will be on the basis of salvation, meaning that all who profess Christ will be taken up. I can't find that anywhere. What we DO find is that only half of the VIRGINS were allowed into that wedding supper...only those who had a vessel with oil along with their lamps. Jesus commanded that we watch and pray ALWAYS a prayer (Luke 21:36) that speaks to being watchful and ready by way of His provision rather than merely acknowledging His salvation. We have to ASK that we be accounted worthy to escape ALL these things that shall come to pass, and strangely very few sermons out there ever hammer this home.

Besides, the OP was done by a drive-by poster. When I administrated my own Christian forum years ago, I had an alternate account I would use to create drive-by postings to keep discussions flowing. This one worked nicely.

Also keep in mind that the Church is mentioned nowhere throughout the chapters in Revelation covering the tribulation period and events. The 24 elders are clearly shown to represent the Church in Heaven before Christ ever was handed the scroll with the seven seals.

This all is simple stuff that's so easily overlooked by so many. Modern Evangelicalism tends toward allegoricalization so that the scriptures can be made to say anything they want it to say, which is very much like evolutionary theory being injected into all the findings in order to force the narrative in the direction the researchers wants it to go.

MM

 

[Musicmaster]

The John Darby origins myth for the pre-trib rapture is such a comical set of nonsense.

MM

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

No such thing as the Rapture found in scripture. And, Revelation was addressed to the 7 churches of Asia 2000 yrs ago and the scripture says these things must shortly come to pass. What did it mean to THEM? What does it really mean to us??

There is such a thing as dual fulfillment where a prophecy is fulfilled in part close to the time it was announced and then fulfilled much later in full. So the things addressed in Revelation were fulfilled in part close to it's announcement and will be fulfilled again much later in full. We're close to that much later time.

You also have to read Daniel. Daniel was given all these prophecies that he didn't understand at all, but the angel said not to worry about them because they weren't meant to be understood by anyone until they were about to happen.

Daniel 12:8 I heard, but I did not understand. So I asked, “My lord, what will the outcome of all this be?”
9 He replied, “Go your way, Daniel, because the words are rolled up and sealed until the time of the end. 10 Many will be purified, made spotless and refined, but the wicked will continue to be wicked. None of the wicked will understand, but those who are wise will understand.

Furthermore, the book of Daniel tells us when we will start to understand them:

Daniel 12:4 But you, Daniel, roll up and seal the words of the scroll until the time of the end. Many will go here and there to increase knowledge.”

That means that the meaning of the prophecies will be unsealed at the time when travel is very accessible and information is very easy to acquire. If you look at the history of technology in regard to travel and information access, advancements in these two areas have been exponential.

So at this point, we are starting to understand the prophecies and many of us will likely live through those prophesied times.


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