Tongues and Fruit of the Spirit...

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I draw your attention to the episode in Acts 16:16-18. where a girl was following Paul proclaiming, 'These men are servants of the Most High God, who proclaim to us the way of salvation'.
On the surface, this sounds very sound and orthodox. The reality however was, she was 'possessed with a spirit of divination'.
This demonstrates that messages can be spoken out that sound correct, are scriptural, but come from a demonic source.
The contention that because it sounds OK, then it must be from God is false. I contend that much that passes as 'tongues' today is demonic in origin.
Ever hear of blasphemy against the Holy Spirit (the Enabler), just as Jesus framed it? Your attempt to bridge her fortune telling with tongues is undetectable.
 
Ever hear of blasphemy against the Holy Spirit (the Enabler), just as Jesus framed it? Your attempt to bridge her fortune telling with tongues is undetectable.
That there have been incidences of demonic tongues is well documented. If you think the devil can't mimic tongues, then you are very misled.
 
Tongues, Prophecy, word of knowledge/wisdom were all 'revelation gifts'. God used these gifts, along with Apostles & Prophets to teach the young Church new truths, not yet revealed eg. salvation, body of Christ, Kingdom of God etc. The finished canon of the New Testament was God final revelation to the Church, thus making the 'revelation gifts' redundant.
The gifts/ministries of Apostle and Prophet were 'foundational' ministries, Eph 2:20. Once the Church was built, they also became redundant too.
Is that why for many, if not most, Protestant churches the canon of scripture is not officially closed? The only church that I know of with certainty that has closed the canon is the RCC.

You have also not cited any scripture to support your claim that the gifts were just to reach the young church. And I might note that Paul revealed salvation the body of Christ and the kingdom of God while still acknowledging the gifts of tongues and prophesy. Additionally, are you likewise claiming that the other gifts mentioned with tongues and prophecy, healing, discernment, wisdom and knowledge, etc., have also ceased since the apostolic age? Many of these gifts are still claimed to exist today you know. And if these other gifts still continue, why were they not distinguished from tongues and prophecy in Paul's writings?
 
The requirements for the eyewitnesses are that they are available to be questioned by anyone, and if you accept the HS as inspiring scripture, it is the HS who set the requirement of 2 or 3 eyewitnesses. Thus, are you claiming that the HS contradicts himself and that anyone, including nonbelievers, may be allowed to directly question him?
I'm talking about myself in Him. He only is my witness .I don't know you as judge witness
He knows me and I know Him! Look at Saul ,the others rrecognized he was witnessed of The Jesus himself and accepted him a brother Paul.
 
Is that why for many, if not most, Protestant churches the canon of scripture is not officially closed? The only church that I know of with certainty that has closed the canon is the RCC.

You have also not cited any scripture to support your claim that the gifts were just to reach the young church. And I might note that Paul revealed salvation the body of Christ and the kingdom of God while still acknowledging the gifts of tongues and prophesy. Additionally, are you likewise claiming that the other gifts mentioned with tongues and prophecy, healing, discernment, wisdom and knowledge, etc., have also ceased since the apostolic age? Many of these gifts are still claimed to exist today you know. And if these other gifts still continue, why were they not distinguished from tongues and prophecy in Paul's writings?
I believe I have argued the Cessationist case, on the gifts of the Spirit as best I can. We seem to be going in circles over the same issues. I shall leave at that.
Peace.
 
I believe I have argued the Cessationist case, on the gifts of the Spirit as best I can. We seem to be going in circles over the same issues. I shall leave at that.
Peace.
Here know this All
characteristics of the Holy Spirit that rested upon Jesus Christ.
  • The Spirit of the Lord
  • Wisdom
  • Understanding
  • Counsel
  • Might
  • Knowledge
  • Fear of the Lord
  • All above has to be First!
The 9 Gifts of the Spirit (1 Corinthians 12:8–10)
These are supernatural abilities given to believers for ministry and building up the church.
  • Word of wisdom
  • Word of knowledge
  • Faith
  • Gifts of healings
  • Working of miracles
  • Prophecy
  • Discerning of spirits
  • Kinds of tongues
  • Interpretation of tongues These are the Gifts of The Spirit Above

  • Below Are The 9 Fruits of the Spirit (Galatians 5:22–23)
These are Christ-like character traits produced internally over time by the Holy Spirit's presence.
  • Love
  • Joy
  • Peace
  • Patience (or longsuffering)
  • Kindness (or gentleness)
  • Goodness
  • Faithfulness
  • Gentleness (or meekness)
  • Self-control (or temperance)
 
Faith. is a whole other level! man don't Know Faith!. Just hearing does that really make faith ? This does
rhema, which means the spoken, living word or a specific utterance of God. That is The know Faith Touching Him ,taking of Him His Virtue! That Faith Jesus Lord &Christ He will Stop whatever he's doing.
know faith!
 
I believe I have argued the Cessationist case, on the gifts of the Spirit the best I can.
No such mention of cessation is remotely evident "until we all may come to the unity of the faith". Till then, the same remains, "He led captive captivity, and gave gifts to men." (Eph 4:13,8) But even that incorrectly shows us a "shadow of turning".
 
Faith. is a whole other level! man don't Know Faith!. Just hearing does that really make faith ? This does
rhema, which means the spoken, living word or a specific utterance of God. That is The know Faith Touching Him ,taking of Him His Virtue! That Faith Jesus Lord &Christ He will Stop whatever he's doing.
know faith!
megalē pistis (\(\mu\epsilon\gamma\acute{\alpha}\lambda\eta\,\pi\acute{\iota}\sigma\tau\iota\varsigma\)). This is the direct root of the modern prefix "mega-," meaning massive, vast, or of immense magnitude.
Omy two times record in orig Gospel As a living Everlasting gospel What He does in Use I'm sure is written also
 
megalē pistis (\(\mu\epsilon\gamma\acute{\alpha}\lambda\eta\,\pi\acute{\iota}\sigma\tau\iota\varsigma\)). This is the direct root of the modern prefix "mega-," meaning massive, vast, or of immense magnitude.
Omy two times record in orig Gospel As a living Everlasting gospel What He does in Use I'm sure is written also
Did Jesus son of man lie ? He said "I have not found so great faith, no, Not in Israel.".


The 2 gentiles marveled Jesus mega Faith
 
Thank God, they waited in Jerusalem for "power from on high"! Pentecost Sunday and the gifts was initiated by Him and by Him "they will cease", and not those who never wanted anything to do with it in the first place!
 
Hi Rewriter.
One of the problems with your view of speaking in tongues is that the New Testament 'tongues' were known languages (Acts 2). The 'tongues' on display today are not known languages but rather what linguists have called, 'free vocalization'.
Now I see this as a problem as to the authenticity of modern day speaking in tongues.
How can one claim to have the same gift as Acts 2, when what you have is not known languages?
It is only through rightly dividing the Word and accepting all that is written regarding a topic that truth is revealed:

1 Cor 14:2
For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries.

Many fail to understand what's actually happening when a person initially speaks in tongues. When the Holy Spirit of God enters a believer, it opens up a whole new world! The manifestation of speaking in tongues is the result of God's Spirit reviving man's spirit that was dead in sin due to Adam and Eve's actions in the garden. The believer’s renewed spirit begins communicating directly with the Spirit of God. (1 Cor. 14:2 (“speaks not unto men, but unto God”), Acts 2, 10, and 19, and Romans 8:26)

So what happens when you pray in tongues after you have already received the Holy Ghost?

"𝐍𝐔𝐌𝐁𝐄𝐑 𝟏
𝐘𝐎𝐔 𝐀𝐑𝐄 𝐁𝐔𝐈𝐋𝐃𝐈𝐍𝐆 𝐘𝐎𝐔𝐑𝐒𝐄𝐋𝐅 𝐒𝐏𝐈𝐑𝐈𝐓𝐔𝐀𝐋𝐋𝐘
1 Corinthians 14:4 He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself.
The word edifieth means to build up, strengthen, and spiritually reinforce.
Just as your physical body needs nourishment to remain strong, your spirit also requires spiritual strengthening.

Praying in tongues builds your inner man.
It strengthens your faith.
It reinforces your spiritual sensitivity.
It deepens your awareness of God’s presence.

Jude 1:20 But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost.
Notice what scripture says. Praying in the Holy Ghost builds your faith.
And when joined with singing in the Spirit, that edification becomes both prayer and worship flowing together in beautiful fellowship with God.
This is one of the reasons born again believers should pray and sing in the Spirit regularly.
It is spiritual strengthening.
It is heaven’s way of fortifying your inner man.

𝐍𝐔𝐌𝐁𝐄𝐑 𝟐
𝐈𝐓 𝐀𝐋𝐋𝐎𝐖𝐒 𝐘𝐎𝐔𝐑 𝐒𝐏𝐈𝐑𝐈𝐓 𝐓𝐎 𝐂𝐎𝐌𝐌𝐔𝐍𝐈𝐂𝐀𝐓𝐄 𝐃𝐈𝐑𝐄𝐂𝐓𝐋𝐘 𝐖𝐈𝐓𝐇 𝐆𝐎𝐃
1 Corinthians 14:2 For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries.

This is profound. When you pray in tongues, you are not speaking to people.
You are speaking directly to God.
Your spirit is communicating with Him beyond the limitations of natural language.
There are burdens your natural mind cannot fully express.
There are places of intercession deeper than vocabulary can reach.
There are moments when your spirit knows what your mind cannot articulate.
That is why praying in tongues is so powerful.
It allows the Spirit within you to pray beyond the limitations of human understanding.
And when that same Spirit moves you into song, your worship rises beyond the limits of earthly expression.

𝐍𝐔𝐌𝐁𝐄𝐑 𝟑
𝐈𝐓 𝐀𝐋𝐋𝐎𝐖𝐒 𝐓𝐇𝐄 𝐒𝐏𝐈𝐑𝐈𝐓 𝐓𝐎 𝐏𝐑𝐀𝐘 𝐓𝐇𝐄 𝐏𝐄𝐑𝐅𝐄𝐂𝐓 𝐖𝐈𝐋𝐋 𝐎𝐅 𝐆𝐎𝐃
Romans 8:26 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought.

There are times when we simply do not know how to pray.
We do not know what to ask.
We do not know what is needed.
We do not know what God is accomplishing behind the scenes.
But the Spirit knows.

When you yield yourself in prayer, the Spirit intercedes through you according to God’s perfect knowledge and purpose.
This is one of the greatest blessings of praying in tongues.
You may not understand every word being spoken, but God understands perfectly.
And the Spirit is praying through you according to divine wisdom.

𝐍𝐔𝐌𝐁𝐄𝐑 𝟒
𝐈𝐓 𝐊𝐄𝐄𝐏𝐒 𝐘𝐎𝐔 𝐒𝐏𝐈𝐑𝐈𝐓𝐔𝐀𝐋𝐋𝐘 𝐒𝐄𝐍𝐒𝐈𝐓𝐈𝐕𝐄
The world constantly pulls at your attention.
Life can cloud your spiritual awareness. Distractions can dull your sensitivity to the voice of God.
But praying in tongues sharpens your spirit. Singing in the Spirit lifts your heart into worship.
Together they quiet the noise of the flesh and tune your soul toward heaven.

Romans 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
A believer who regularly prays and sings in the Spirit becomes increasingly sensitive to divine direction.
You begin to recognize His promptings more clearly.
You discern His voice more readily.
You become more aware of His peace, correction, and guidance.

𝐍𝐔𝐌𝐁𝐄𝐑 𝟓
𝐈𝐓 𝐑𝐄𝐅𝐑𝐄𝐒𝐇𝐄𝐒 𝐀𝐍𝐃 𝐒𝐓𝐑𝐄𝐍𝐆𝐓𝐇𝐄𝐍𝐒 𝐘𝐎𝐔𝐑 𝐒𝐎𝐔𝐋

Isaiah prophesied of this.
Isaiah 28:11-12 For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people… This is the rest wherewith ye may cause the weary to rest; and this is the refreshing.

There is spiritual refreshing in praying in tongues. And there is deep spiritual joy in singing in the Spirit.
When your soul is weary, when your heart is burdened, when your mind is overwhelmed, praying and singing in the Spirit bring divine refreshing.
It brings rest.
It brings renewal.
It brings peace.

So when should a born again believer pray and sing in the Spirit?
Daily.
Not as ritual.
Not as empty repetition.
But as ongoing fellowship with God.

Paul said:
1 Corinthians 14:18 I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all. Paul understood its value. He practiced it regularly.
He recognized it as an essential part of spiritual life.

Pray in tongues when you worship.
Sing in the Spirit when praise rises within you.
Pray in tongues when you do not know what to pray.
Pray in tongues when you are burdened.
Pray in tongues when you need strength.
Sing in the Spirit when your soul needs refreshing.
Pray and sing in the Spirit when seeking direction.
Pray in tongues when interceding for others.
Pray in tongues when building yourself in faith.
Pray and sing in the Spirit simply because you desire communion with God.
This is not strange.
This is not emotionalism.
This is not unnecessary.
This is part of New Covenant life.
It is one of the beautiful privileges of having the Spirit of God dwelling within you.

𝐒𝐩𝐞𝐚𝐤𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐢𝐧 𝐭𝐨𝐧𝐠𝐮𝐞𝐬 was never meant to be a forgotten moment in your salvation testimony.
It was given to become a living part of your daily walk with God.
It is the language of spiritual edification.
It is the language of communion.
It is the language of surrender.
It is the language of intercession.
It is the language of worship.
It is the language of spiritual strengthening.

When you pray and sing in the Spirit, you are yielding your tongue to the Spirit of God.
And when your tongue is yielded, your heart follows.
Your mind quiets.
Your spirit aligns.
Your faith is strengthened.
Your relationship with God deepens.
This is why praying and singing in the Spirit matter after the new birth. It is not merely proof that you received the Holy Ghost.
It is one of God’s greatest gifts to help you walk faithfully after receiving Him.

So pray in the Spirit.
Sing in the Spirit.
Build yourself up.
Strengthen your inner man.
Yield yourself fully to His presence.
And allow the Holy Ghost within you to continually shape, strengthen, refresh, and lead you as you walk in covenant with God.

Just so you know. The Initial sign of speaking in tongues and daily prayer language is NOT the same as the Gift of Speaking in tongues that Pauls talked about in 1 Cor 12 and taught on in verse 14. Tongues operate as a public gift in the congregation when accompanied by interpretation. See 1 Cor 12-14
This is different from the initial sign of receiving the Holy Ghost and different from private prayer.
This is a ministry operation for the edification of the church.)

𝐅𝐎𝐑𝐁𝐈𝐃 𝐍𝐎𝐓 𝐒𝐏𝐄𝐀𝐊𝐈𝐍𝐆 𝐈𝐍 𝐓𝐎𝐍𝐆𝐔𝐄𝐒
1 Corinthians 14:39 Wherefore, brethren, covet to prophesy, and forbid not to speak with tongues."
𝐃𝐨𝐮𝐠 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐃𝐚𝐫𝐥𝐞𝐧𝐞 𝐘𝐨𝐫𝐤.
 
Thank God, they waited in Jerusalem for "power from on high"! Pentecost Sunday and the gifts was initiated by Him and by Him "they will cease", and not those who never wanted anything to do with it in the first place!
 
Can someone explain to me what this verse means about the gift of tongues:

Tongues, then, are a sign, not for believers but for unbelievers; prophecy, however, is not for unbelievers but for believers. 1 Cor 14.22
The believer is prepared to speak in tongues upon receiving the Holy Spirit. Whereas tongues is a sign for the unbeliever. Tongues draws attention to the fact that God has indeed taken up residence in a person. (Acts 2:1-4, 8:12-18, 10:43-48, 19:1-7)

At times people are used to speak a message from God in a language they do not know for an unbeliever in their language. At other times a message spoken in unknown tongues is revealed by a person through the spiritual gift of interpretation. (1 Cor. 12-14)
 
2 Cor. 13:1 records the biblical principle for confirming truth: “In the mouth of two or three witnesses shall every word be established.” This teaches that God’s principles are not founded upon isolated statements, but are confirmed through consistent witness and agreement throughout Scripture.

Scripture repeatedly reveals that speaking in tongues occurred immediately when individuals were filled with the Holy Spirit. This pattern is clearly witnessed in Acts 2:4, Acts 10:44–46, and Acts 19:6. Together, these passages establish a consistent biblical testimony concerning the initial evidence of receiving the Holy Spirit. Jesus Himself declared that tongues would accompany believers (Mk. 16:17), and Isaiah prophetically spoke of God speaking “with stammering lips and another tongue” (Isa. 28:11).

Speaking in tongues and the fruit of the Spirit should not be confused. Speaking in tongues provides the initial evidence of receiving the infilling of the Holy Spirit, whereas spiritual fruit provides the enduring evidence that a person is truly indwelt by the Holy Spirit.

Fruit does not automatically appear the moment the Holy Spirit comes to dwell within a believer, but is progressively produced as a born again person matures in Christ. Jesus taught that a tree is known by its fruit (Matt. 7:16–20), and Paul described the fruit of the Spirit as love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, meekness, and temperance (Gal. 5:22–23). Jesus also taught that abiding in Him results in spiritual fruitfulness (John 15:4–5).

Over time, fruit becomes evident throughout the believer’s lifelong journey with the Lord. Paul’s prayer in Phil. 1:9–11 reflects ongoing spiritual growth, and Peter teaches that believers are to continually add spiritual virtues to their faith so they may become fruitful and mature in Christ. (2 Peter 1:5-8)

The initial evidence and the enduring evidence serve different purposes. One confirms the reception of the Holy Spirit, while the other reveals the continuing work of the Spirit within the life of the believer.
interesting . The issue with your two points of the work of the Holy Spirit and what is the new nature of the believer as they mature in Christ. The fruit of the Spirit are listed are they not in the word of God?

The gifts of the Holy Spirit for church are to produce some things that confirm they are valid. They Must:

edify, comfort, exhort. Correct , and line up with the word of GOD. They do not replace the word of God. No are the gifts of the Holy Spirit to be elevated over the word of God.
 
Is that descriptive or prescriptive?


Confirms to who: the one who receives the Holy Spirt or onlookers?
Prescriptive.

Tongues is confirmation for all parties. (Acts 2:1-4, 33; 10:43-48, 19:1-7)

Note: The Samaritan account in Acts 8:12-18 reveals the individuals believed Philip's message and submitted to water baptism in the name of Jesus yet did not receive the Holy Ghost. They received the Holy Ghost days later when Peter and John arrived to assist. Although the account does not specifically state tongues was the evidence that proved the experience. One can be confident that speaking in tongues did indeed confirm the experience since tongues was the consistent evidence in the detailed conversion accounts listed above.
 
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interesting . The issue with your two points of the work of the Holy Spirit and what is the new nature of the believer as they mature in Christ. The fruit of the Spirit are listed are they not in the word of God?

The gifts of the Holy Spirit for church are to produce some things that confirm they are valid. They Must:

edify, comfort, exhort. Correct , and line up with the word of GOD. They do not replace the word of God. No are the gifts of the Holy Spirit to be elevated over the word of God.
You misunderstand the point being made, which is there's initial evidence upon receiving the Holy Ghost into one's body, and enduring evidence that follows the initial experience.

Speaking in tongues is the initial sign that a person has received the Holy Ghost. The manifestation differs from spiritual gift of tongues that relies upon the spiritual gift of interpretation to reveal God's message for a congregation.


Note the different purposes:

1. Tongues served as a sign of the outpouring of the Holy Ghost/Spirit.

Acts 2:4 "And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak with other tongues as the Spirit gave the utterance."
Mark 16:17 also says that "And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;"

When the Holy Ghost/Spirit was received, tongues appeared as the outward sign/evidence that the Spirit had been given. (Acts 2:4, 10:43-48, 19:1-7)



2. Tongues as a form of prayer directed toward God.
"He that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God." 1 Cor. 14:2

Manifests for the edification of oneself. The person is communicating directly with God through a prayer language given by the Holy Spirit.

Paul said, "If I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful. What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also." 1 Cor. 14:14-15

"Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered." (Rom. 8:26)

"But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost." Jude 1:20



3. Speaking in tongues manifests along with interpretation of tongues to edify the body of Christ as spiritual gifts. (1 Cor. 12:10)
 
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You misunderstand the point being made, which is there's initial evidence upon receiving the Holy Ghost into one's body, and enduring evidence that follows the initial experience.

Speaking in tongues is the initial sign that a person has received the Holy Ghost. The manifestation differs from spiritual gift of tongues that relies upon the spiritual gift of interpretation to reveal God's message for a congregation.


Note the different purposes:

1. Tongues served as a sign of the outpouring of the Holy Ghost/Spirit.

Acts 2:4 "And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak with other tongues as the Spirit gave the utterance."
Mark 16:17 also says that "And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;"

When the Holy Ghost/Spirit was received, tongues appeared as the outward sign/evidence that the Spirit had been given. (Acts 2:4, 10:43-48, 19:1-7)



2. Tongues as a form of prayer directed toward God.
"He that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God." 1 Cor. 14:2

Manifests for the edification of oneself. The person is communicating directly with God through a prayer language given by the Holy Spirit.

Paul said, "If I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful. What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also." 1 Cor. 14:14-15

"Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered." (Rom. 8:26)

"But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost." Jude 1:20



3. Speaking in tongues manifests along with interpretation of tongues to edify the body of Christ as spiritual gifts. (1 Cor. 12:10)
so is prophesying
 
That there have been incidences of demonic tongues is well documented. If you think the devil can't mimic tongues, then you are very misled.

The Devil does not mimic tongues.
The Devil can only induce gibberish.
We do not get tongues like they were spoken in the earlier days of the church.

Then how is it that each of us hears them in our native language? Acts 2:8

.
 
The Devil does not mimic tongues.
The Devil can only induce gibberish.
We do not get tongues like they were spoken in the earlier days of the church.

Then how is it that each of us hears them in our native language? Acts 2:8

.
Funny I seen and heard The Devil and Heard Hell too ..anyway The Devil was trying to speak in Tongues Nastiest Sounds I ever heard .