Undeniably overwhelming and resounding proof of the truth of WOF, NICI, and BIGI.

[Brother_Don]

i don't use the term name it and claim it, but i do believe what we say is what we get.

 

[shotgunner]

There is nothing wrong with asking God for something by faith. The difference between that, and the name-it-and-claim-it crowd, is they teach you can "speak" your will into existence, and God is obligated to do what you ask.

To anyone who believes they have the power to speak something true by faith, then go raise some of your loved ones from the dead. Speak the end to poverty and world hunger. Speak the cure for all disease.

What's the matter? Faith not strong enough?

It's all a scam by the same people who steal money from the gullible with their "seed-faith" nonsense. Give money to them, and God will give you more than you pledged in return.

Looks like the truly poor, who can't afford to give any money, are out of luck.

Honestly if what I've seen in WOF was as you describe, I would be just as against it as anyone here! That is not what I have been taught from WOF, and I've listened to many WOF teachers in the last 20 years.


It is honestly just about agreeing with a promise God gave in his word and holding onto that promise by faith ,no matter what the circumstance looks like.

 

[shotgunner]

i don't use the term name it and claim it, but i do believe what we say is what we get.

I agree with you sir but let me rephrase that for clarity because it seems many take that truth the wrong way.

We get what we believe, and we say what we believe.

 

[Yet]

Honestly if what I've seen in WOF was as you describe, I would be just as against it as anyone here! That is not what I have been taught from WOF, and I've listened to many WOF teachers in the last 20 years.


It is honestly just about agreeing with a promise God gave in his word and holding onto that promise by faith ,no matter what the circumstance looks like.

Google it shotgun. The wolve's tactics are common knowledge to all, for the past 40 some years. And you missed it? Check the batteries on your hearing aide. Something Is Amiss!

I submit that God does answer our prayers. Steadfast faith is essential. Holiness is essential. But if u r believing for a million dollar mansion and a new limo once a year, your heart is a thousand light years away from God.

When we got saved, all desires for 'things' died. All we wanted was to serve the Master and save souls. We couldn't figure why so many others were spending all their faith, so called, on worldly materialism and not on soul winning. We felt out of place, something wrong wit us. So we went to the streets winning souls....by ourselves.
Well, most of these other Christians that lusted for 'things' have backslid or living in an ice house, (state of their heart) deader than dirt along with the rest of the church.
What does that tell you?

 

[Goodness11]

Google it shotgun. The wolve's tactics are common knowledge to all, for the past 40 some years. And you missed it? Check the batteries on your hearing aide. Something Is Amiss!

I submit that God does answer our prayers. Steadfast faith is essential. Holiness is essential. But if u r believing for a million dollar mansion and a new limo once a year, your heart is a thousand light years away from God.

When we got saved, all desires for 'things' died. All we wanted was to serve the Master and save souls. We couldn't figure why so many others were spending all their faith, so called, on worldly materialism and not on soul winning. We felt out of place, something wrong wit us. So we went to the streets winning souls....by ourselves.
Well, most of these other Christians that lusted for 'things' have backslid or living in an ice house, (state of their heart) deader than dirt along with the rest of the church.
What does that tell you?

Yet, this is such a lovely line!!
"When we got saved, all desires for 'things' died. All we wanted was to serve the Master and save souls."

This is so true!! All I obsess about is how I can help others; which is why I'm going back to college to work in geriatrics. Money is scarce in our house-hold; but we trust God to provide for our needs and they always are! We might not get to vacation or buy new clothes or even eat steak; but we all are supremely happy!!

When we were at Church (I know you don't like that word, lol! Sorry...) yesterday, and dancing with our kids holding them up during worship music; I had a moment and started crying thanking God for the little hands!! Those little hands on my back!! Just precious...life is just so very precious...

 

[Stephen63]

And Hagen? A third degree mason?

Makes one wonder how many of these are, since these guys seem to be untouchable by the govt.

 

[popeye]

Gee, did you ever stop & think that a true believer would only desire what God does? Jesus is saying this to true believers..... those who would never desire the things of the flesh.

WOF folks believe they can claim anything from God, such as healings before God's timing & plans, miracles to people who won't serve Him, & things like saving sinners who have constantly rejected the grace of God, as if God will force that sinner's hand at their request. Imagine, such people who believe this doctrine playing God against God's own plans for man..... like He's gonna allow that.....riiiiight.

Jesus is our example that we should follow His steps. So what did He do? Only what He saw the Father do. Even in the garden, Jesus submitted to the Father by saying, "not my will, but thine be done."

If Jesus submitted to the Father's will, then we should submit to the will of Christ, & do as the Holy Spirit leads, & not as we want.

.......such as healings before God's timing & plans, miracles to people who won't serve Him, & things like saving sinners who have constantly rejected the grace of God,.........

You just described Jesus' earthly ministry

 

[Stephen63]

You just described Jesus' earthly ministry

Uuuuummmm...... no I didn't. Did you just DARE to say Jesus went AGAINST the Father's will?

 

[shotgunner]

Gee, did you ever stop & think that a true believer would only desire what God does? Jesus is saying this to true believers..... those who would never desire the things of the flesh.

WOF folks believe they can claim anything from God, such as healings before God's timing & plans, miracles to people who won't serve Him, & things like saving sinners who have constantly rejected the grace of God, as if God will force that sinner's hand at their request. Imagine, such people who believe this doctrine playing God against God's own plans for man..... like He's gonna allow that.....riiiiight.

Jesus is our example that we should follow His steps. So what did He do? Only what He saw the Father do. Even in the garden, Jesus submitted to the Father by saying, "not my will, but thine be done."

If Jesus submitted to the Father's will, then we should submit to the will of Christ, & do as the Holy Spirit leads, & not as we want.

No, you don't know a thing about WOF. All you just stated is what you think you know. No one in WOF desires to go against God or do anything apart from God. They just have the audacity to believe what God says in his word instead of lacing every prayer with the doubt of "if it be your will." If God already said he would do it in his word, then it is his will, and it's just doubt to ask "if it be your will."

 

[know1]

Haha, sadly that's true...
I remember not long after I started walking with the Lord I was watching 'christian' TV at a friends house waiting for him to get ready. And some preacher came on and he was saying, I'll never forget it. "I feel the Holy Spirit tell me there are 10 1000 dollar offerings blah blah blah, if this is you, and you feel to give, and you do it, the Lord will bless you but if you dont, the Lord is gonna cut and divide, He will cut and divide! Oh my Lord I'm so excited!" Then it cut to a shot of his wife and she looked man, evil. I couldn't believe I just heard, so I turned it off. That'll never leave me lol

Sadly, one of those ministries did something similar to my wife and I. Telling us that if we didn't give that they not only wouldn't pray for us but God would curse us. They said something else that was worse, but I won't say what that was.
Yup, they actually sent that garbage to us.
So we gave the trash can their letter, and cut them off, never to give to their ministry again.
Like all of you, I am not for that either. That is not faith, that is, at the very least, fear of losing their ministry.

 

[know1]

i don't use the term name it and claim it, but i do believe what we say is what we get.

Well, you just joined the WOF club, because it's the same thing.
They just put a name and label to it.

 

[know1]

Honestly if what I've seen in WOF was as you describe, I would be just as against it as anyone here! That is not what I have been taught from WOF, and I've listened to many WOF teachers in the last 20 years.


It is honestly just about agreeing with a promise God gave in his word and holding onto that promise by faith ,no matter what the circumstance looks like.

This is true, but most don't look at what the word says, they go by experience and believe that. And because they had a bad experience, they have utterly rejected the who doctrine. The preachers don't help either.

 

[shotgunner]

Sadly, one of those ministries did something similar to my wife and I. Telling us that if we didn't give that they not only wouldn't pray for us but God would curse us. They said something else that was worse, but I won't say what that was.
Yup, they actually sent that garbage to us.
So we gave the trash can their letter, and cut them off, never to give to their ministry again.
Like all of you, I am not for that either. That is not faith, that is, at the very least, fear of losing their ministry.

That's not something I believe nor anyone I know that others might call WOF. That's why I hate to put a label on things. labels mean different things to different people, and there can even be a vast difference in people who refer to themselves by the same label.

 

[know1]

Honestly I don't know how to deal with that, it's definitely something I want to look into. It can't mean that I can receive anything I desire because Paul asked God to remove the thorn from his flesh three times but God wouldn't do it because His grace was sufficient. Notice God didn't remove it because God's grace is sufficient, not because Paul didn't name and claim it.

Two things. Yes, God means exactly what He said, or He lied. And you misunderstood what God said to Paul. He didn't tell him to grin and bare it, but gave him the answer for deliverance.
If you are having a hard time with that, then try this one.
Joh 15:7 If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.
Notice the condition to the promise.
Again, whose will is the determining factor here?
Where is God's will in this verse?
It's there. It's just too good for most to believe it.
Is it too hard to believe that God loves us so much that He wants to give us the good things we want or desire? The same thing we do for our children, because we love them.
It is all through the bible. God wants to bless His children with good things.
How 'bout this one?
Mat 7:7 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you:
Mat 7:8 For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.
Mat 7:9 Or what man is there of you, whom if his son ask bread, will he give him a stone?
Mat 7:10 Or if he ask a fish, will he give him a serpent?
Mat 7:11 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children, how much more shall your Father which is in heaven give good things to them that ask him?
You can reject the written truths of the gospel if you wish, you can make them say what you want, but you will be turning the light of the gospel in you into darkness.
Luk 11:34 The light of the body is the eye: therefore when thine eye is single, thy whole body also is full of light; but when thine eye is evil, thy body also is full of darkness.
Luk 11:35 Take heed therefore that the light which is in thee be not [turned to] darkness.
It is better to believe what is written.

 

[Magenta]

How about these from James?

You do not have because you do not ask God. When you ask, you do not receive, because you ask with wrong motives, that you may spend what you get on your pleasures.

 

[know1]

No, you don't know a thing about WOF. All you just stated is what you think you know. No one in WOF desires to go against God or do anything apart from God. They just have the audacity to believe what God says in his word instead of lacing every prayer with the doubt of "if it be your will." If God already said he would do it in his word, then it is his will, and it's just doubt to ask "if it be your will."

I didn't want to touch that post. It was too messed up.
One things is clear though. The man know nothing about the subject.

 

[know1]

How about these from James?

You do not have because you do not ask God. When you ask, you do not receive, because you ask with wrong motives, that you may spend what you get on your pleasures.

Thank you.
Finally, someone who actually use scripture for her argument.
This could be one reason why most of you don't get a thing from God and why those who use God's word, do.
Heb 3:12 Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God.
This could be another reason.
Would you please look at the scripture verses in the post right before yours ma'am and tell me what they are saying?
What does God consider to be good things?

 

[Magenta]

I didn't want to touch that post. It was too messed up.
One things is clear though. The man know nothing about the subject.

That is what the Caths often say about the Prots

 

[know1]

That's not something I believe nor anyone I know that others might call WOF. That's why I hate to put a label on things. labels mean different things to different people, and there can even be a vast difference in people who refer to themselves by the same label.

That was from a TV ministry.

 

[know1]

Okay, I have given many many scripture verses on the subject for WOF. Not in just one area of the subject, but many. And no one has refuted the verses I used to explain them away.
We have about two verses from the opposition. One pertaining to the will of God and the other pertaining to the condition of ones heart. Both good points, and true, but it doesn't effect WOF but agrees with it.
Again, no one can refute the doctrine with scripture, so why do you continue to try to disprove it with logic, reasoning, past experiences, and what others have done with it?
You believe in salvation because it is written, but you don't believe in WOF even though it too is written, over and over again.
Which is worse, and I'm not advocating either.
Lusting for the things of the world, as you say about those who believe in WOF, or calling God a liar, refusing knowledge, rejecting God's word, and having an evil heart of unbelief? I could could go on with the second part.