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good grief
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Dread_Zeppelin
Guest
Actually friend, I was hoping you would respond with a little more passion by providing evidence that might actually support your claim, but now I think you've satisfied what really helps to expose deceptions such as these, more rhetoric. My efforts are, in actuality, toward the readers of these posts. Normally, if there isn't significant resistance to false teachings, there may be a few who actually become somewhat persuaded, but I am now satisfied that you have provided sufficient rhetoric to show the readers exactly what your theories, (in this post), are comprised of.
I enjoyed your post in another thread pertaining to ' the separation of Church and State'. You certainly did a little research in that one. I do often underestimate the discerning abilities of the readers of these posts when I consider just how individuals measure the 'thread content' with the truth of the bible, but I'm certain there are some who are not quickly moved by every new wind and wave of doctrine.
You have my word that, 'in this thread', I've said everything that needs to be said and you may carry on freely with your theory. Backing off now
.[/quote]Hows this for discernment? As a reader of this post I find this response to be extremely pretentious and mean. The smiley face just adds to the self satisfying spirit of it all. Moviefan has gone through a very trying experience and you tell others that they are decieved by his witness? How is that not a slap in the face? Actually, "friend" I find that Christians who attack other people personally based on their views to be so far into their own ego that they can't rationally discuss the issue at hand without hurting the other party. Even if Moviefan is wrong there is no need to tear him down (and others who believe in him) in such a way that sucks all the love of Christ out of the discussion. God bless you and hopfully take you down a notch.
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]If you really are interested in learning about genuine evidence for the Bible, I'd suggest "The Case for Christ" by Lee Strobel. It goes down many roads, explaining in detail why the New Testament makes sense from a historical basis.
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There's enough DNA in one single human cell that if you lined up every genetic code like a string, it'd go to the moon and back, 500 times! That's quite a bit of difference.
]If you really are interested in learning about genuine evidence for the Bible, I'd suggest "The Case for Christ" by Lee Strobel. It goes down many roads, explaining in detail why the New Testament makes sense from a historical basis.
-----------edited quoted conent---------
There's enough DNA in one single human cell that if you lined up every genetic code like a string, it'd go to the moon and back, 500 times! That's quite a bit of difference.
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Out of curiosity, what sort of "evidence" would suit you? I've already shown that neither the practice of masturbation nor the condemnation of it are inherently mentioned by Scripture. You blanket them under the definition of "perverseness", and yet you haven't given you're own reasons for this belief. The fact of the matter is that if the Bible doesn't say it, then it creates a "puzzle" of sorts. If a person is going to call something a sin when God didn't do so Himself, then they have an inherent burden to show why He wouldn't have mentioned it. Many people feel all kinds of guilt over masturbation, but that can be born out of many different things. Some of it can be righteous conviction from God, but the attitudes of man can also bring a flase sense of shame, and so can the enemy. Lust is clearly forbidden more than once in the Bible...but you won't find a single verse which says that lust and masturbation are inherently dependent. It's not in there.
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Dread_Zeppelin
Guest
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snowangel
Guest
Might review the original question here ------------------------>>>>
Graybeard's question is how would you go about undoing the seed that has been planted in these young minds?
------------------------>>>>Graybeard's question is how would you go about undoing the seed that has been planted in these young minds?
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Well, answering that question, by definition, means believing that masturbation is inherently sinful, which is something I don't agree with. I think it should be the job of parents to instruct their kids on sexual matters, instead of the schools...but if, for whatever reason, the parents aren't providing answers, the kids will go to the next person in line. I was raised by a single mother, and also my aunt and uncle...none of them ever discussed sex with me at all. My mother caught me masturbating when I was 16, and practically crucified me herself; looking back, I don't blame her, because she was going through a lot of confusing doctrines and such.Might review the original question here
Graybeard's question is how would you go about undoing the seed that has been planted in these young minds?
I think the church in general really focuses way too much on the "prohibition" aspects of sex, and then they leave it at that. They assume that because masturbation is a sexual act, it must be lustful, and therefore sin...even though the Bible says no such thing. Religious leaders over the years have used fear to keep people in dogmatic chains, and this entire issue is just one example. When sex is treated like a "forbidden subject" in the home, kids grow up thinking their own sexual desires are bad, and no one bothers to tell them any different. This only causes two results: either the kids internalize their desires (like I did), or they openly rebel in frustration and promiscuity...neither are good things in the slightest.
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you know what they say masturbate a day keeps the doctor away ..... i think. anyway are u sure the teacher didnt say something like instead of letting ur urges go and have sex with ur gf cos ur both underage u should try to contol ur urges with self pleasure plus masturbation is a natural thing
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Graybeard
Guest
I am unsubscribing from my own thread due to it being hijacked by persons who bully their own worldly views to justify their actions. The Bible speaks for itself, it is quite clear on the subject...period. Some of you do not WANT to hear what the Lord says. This thread was not at all about masturbation being right or wrong, I even revived a thread just on the subject of masturbation for all who so wish to argue the matter, but some insist on being downright rude and invasive. This thread was deleted before and I regret asking for it to be brought back.
Most here do not even have kids who push their views....
so all who wish to continue debating and arguing..........KNOCK YOURSELF OUT....I'M DONE HERE!
Most here do not even have kids who push their views....
so all who wish to continue debating and arguing..........KNOCK YOURSELF OUT....I'M DONE HERE!
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greatkraw
Guest
yeah teamjinx was a troll
a youth has to decide for himself what he considers to be a sin
all you can do is give him your perspective and scripture to back it up
I said all this before Graybeard
I may be fat, Graybeard but I am worth listening to
and what do you think of people who send personal insults anonymously through the rep button?
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songster
Guest
Quote from Dread_Zeppelin
Hows this for discernment? As a reader of this post I find this response to be extremely pretentious and mean. The smiley face just adds to the self satisfying spirit of it all. Moviefan has gone through a very trying experience and you tell others that they are decieved by his witness? How is that not a slap in the face? Actually, "friend" I find that Christians who attack other people personally based on their views to be so far into their own ego that they can't rationally discuss the issue at hand without hurting the other party. Even if Moviefan is wrong there is no need to tear him down (and others who believe in him) in such a way that sucks all the love of Christ out of the discussion. God bless you and hopfully take you down a notch.[/quote]
I"ve said nothing disrespectful, nor have I attacked in any way. Moviefan has told everyone who has not shared his experience, to 'Shut Up', and yet it is interesting that you made no comment on how 'mean' that seemed to be. This was said before I responded. Comments such as that are not only unnecessary, but provocative and antagonistic.
Moviefan has made his new philosophy public by posting it on this thread. Anyone who does so, knowingly subjects their philosophies to criticism. I do realize dread_zeppelin, that you are an advocate of masturbation and perhaps one who subscribes to Moviefans philosophy, however when philosophies such as yours and Moviefans are presented without supporting evidence, it becomes somewhat difficult to simply accept it as fact.
Moviefan has admittedly exchanged a porn addiction for a masturbation habit. I applaud the fact that he has rid his life of pornography, however this is rare and does not line up with evidence which clearly shows that masturbation is not only addictive, but that, like any other addiction, it can lead to more satisfying avenues of pleasure, and an eventual need for viewing material, especially in men. The idea that everyone is capable of consistently masturbating without lusting is ludicrous, especially when the one making the claim cannot do it himself.
I am not contending with You or Moviefan, your philosophies are simply what they are, 'philosophies', and both of you are entitled to them. However Moviefan's philosophy is based solely on the assumption that because the word masturbation, or some reasonably equivalent scenario, does not appear in the bible, it has somehow become an outlet provided by God. The following scripture has been re-interpreted to suit this theory.
1 Corinthians 10:13
No temptation has seized you except what is common to man. And God is faithful; he will not let you be tempted beyond what you can bear. But when you are tempted, he will also provide a way out so that you can stand up under it.
Most would concede that this scripture is giving believers an assurance that God will provide Grace and power in times of temptation. Moviefan has said that what God may actually be saying in this scripture is, that 'masturbation is your way of escape' .
Frankly I think I've maintained great restraint considering the heretical undertones of his philosophy.
Hows this for discernment? As a reader of this post I find this response to be extremely pretentious and mean. The smiley face just adds to the self satisfying spirit of it all. Moviefan has gone through a very trying experience and you tell others that they are decieved by his witness? How is that not a slap in the face? Actually, "friend" I find that Christians who attack other people personally based on their views to be so far into their own ego that they can't rationally discuss the issue at hand without hurting the other party. Even if Moviefan is wrong there is no need to tear him down (and others who believe in him) in such a way that sucks all the love of Christ out of the discussion. God bless you and hopfully take you down a notch.[/quote]
I"ve said nothing disrespectful, nor have I attacked in any way. Moviefan has told everyone who has not shared his experience, to 'Shut Up', and yet it is interesting that you made no comment on how 'mean' that seemed to be. This was said before I responded. Comments such as that are not only unnecessary, but provocative and antagonistic.
Moviefan has made his new philosophy public by posting it on this thread. Anyone who does so, knowingly subjects their philosophies to criticism. I do realize dread_zeppelin, that you are an advocate of masturbation and perhaps one who subscribes to Moviefans philosophy, however when philosophies such as yours and Moviefans are presented without supporting evidence, it becomes somewhat difficult to simply accept it as fact.
Moviefan has admittedly exchanged a porn addiction for a masturbation habit. I applaud the fact that he has rid his life of pornography, however this is rare and does not line up with evidence which clearly shows that masturbation is not only addictive, but that, like any other addiction, it can lead to more satisfying avenues of pleasure, and an eventual need for viewing material, especially in men. The idea that everyone is capable of consistently masturbating without lusting is ludicrous, especially when the one making the claim cannot do it himself.
I am not contending with You or Moviefan, your philosophies are simply what they are, 'philosophies', and both of you are entitled to them. However Moviefan's philosophy is based solely on the assumption that because the word masturbation, or some reasonably equivalent scenario, does not appear in the bible, it has somehow become an outlet provided by God. The following scripture has been re-interpreted to suit this theory.
1 Corinthians 10:13
No temptation has seized you except what is common to man. And God is faithful; he will not let you be tempted beyond what you can bear. But when you are tempted, he will also provide a way out so that you can stand up under it.
Most would concede that this scripture is giving believers an assurance that God will provide Grace and power in times of temptation. Moviefan has said that what God may actually be saying in this scripture is, that 'masturbation is your way of escape' .
Frankly I think I've maintained great restraint considering the heretical undertones of his philosophy.
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SeekinHIM
Guest
Dear Graybeard,
Do you pray with your son? If so, when you are preparing to pray, explain to him the concepts in Scripture that clearly define such behavior..........."inordinate affection" --- "sins against your own body". Then YOU openly forgive his teacher, and lead him to do the same, lead him to repent for the behavior, and ask the LORD for cleansing for him. (You may want to ask the LORD about dealing with the Teacher through the proper channels, ie: Pricipal, Vice Principal, etc.)
After this the enemy has been "de-clawed" as is spoken of in the Scripture, "he roams about seeking somone to devour".........Once the "LEGAL" issue, that the enemy will try to use against your son is removed, he will "flee".........
Remind him very compassionately, THERE IS THEREFORE NOW NO CONDEMNATION FOR THOSE WHO ARE IN CHRIST JESUS.................Rom. 8:1
Blessings...........
SeekinHIM
Do you pray with your son? If so, when you are preparing to pray, explain to him the concepts in Scripture that clearly define such behavior..........."inordinate affection" --- "sins against your own body". Then YOU openly forgive his teacher, and lead him to do the same, lead him to repent for the behavior, and ask the LORD for cleansing for him. (You may want to ask the LORD about dealing with the Teacher through the proper channels, ie: Pricipal, Vice Principal, etc.)
After this the enemy has been "de-clawed" as is spoken of in the Scripture, "he roams about seeking somone to devour".........Once the "LEGAL" issue, that the enemy will try to use against your son is removed, he will "flee".........
Remind him very compassionately, THERE IS THEREFORE NOW NO CONDEMNATION FOR THOSE WHO ARE IN CHRIST JESUS.................Rom. 8:1
Blessings...........
SeekinHIM
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Demeter
Guest
WHAT? are you sure you shouldn't be lecturing your child on homosexuality?? assuming his friend is male of course. Two males masturbating together is sure to escalate to homosexual intercourse. Trust me i know.
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greatkraw
Guest
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