Was Mary Sinless?

[Mem]

When you die nothing on earth is yours, it WAS yours, as in " WAS my( his) dog" as you stated. If you were still alive THEN he would still be your dog. The worm, who never dies, is still theirs, who are still there. If you have money, a house, car, etc., etc. when you die it is no longer yours. " And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, if any MAN worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand, The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of His indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb: and the smoke of THEIR torment ascendeth up FOR EVER AND EVER: and they have NO REST DAY NOR NIGHT, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name." Rev. 14: 3-11. If the torment stopped so would the smoke of it.

There was something I wanted to add to my post, something about the technicality of 'was my dog', but I was pressed for time. I was confident that you'd be sure to address that technicality in reply and give me opportunity and went ahead and sent and went.
If my cat survives me, he'll still my cat. If my son survives me, he's still my son. But those are special relationships.

And then there's the other angle, that the worm, and the smoke, are used as literary devices. Imagery, for example, isn't uncommon in scripture, especially if conveyed in visions. For example, you can't say the lamb with seven eyes is not a lamb with seven eyes but...

 

[Genez]

The point is he had to be born again in order to have a spirit otherwise he would have had no understanding of spiritual matters. You cannot spiritually discern something without the Holy Spirit's input and your own spirit making you alive to God.

1 Corinthians 2:14
But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

How do you think they could write scripture or speak of the things of God when they cannot receive things from the Spirit?

Some here must work for wall repairmen. They are trying to stir up business by getting others to knock their heads against the wall in frustration by trying to be reasonable with them... Reason with them while they have short-circuited their ability to reason with HONESTY.

I once tried to lead a demon to faith in Christ until I finally recognized what he is.
They really want to exhaust you...

 

[rewriter]

I once tried to lead a demon to faith in Christ until I finally recognized what he is.
They really want to exhaust you...

I hope you learned enough to recognize them faster now, they really do reveal themselves for what they are once you learn to tell the signs.

 

[Genez]

I hope you learned enough to recognize them faster now, they really do reveal themselves for what they are once you learn to tell the signs.

They are so subtle you must become aware of the nuances they use.
One of their favorite hiding places is by influencing immature Christians who see themselves as wise.

Like when Satan was using Peter.

 

[rewriter]

They are so subtle you must become aware of the nuances they use.
One of their favorite hiding places is by influencing immature Christians who see themselves as wise.

Like when Satan was using Peter.

They also deceive entire churches at times.

 

[Genez]

They also deceive entire churches at times.

At times...

Denomination = Demon Nation.

 

[rewriter]

At times...

Denomination = Demon Nation.

I will agree that the nastiest demon I have ever encountered was in a denominational church, it seems he had a specific task to perform there, but I most often encounter them, good old garden variety ones, in non-denominational churches

 

[bytheblood]

I guess question marks don't mean it's a question to you? I assumed nothing but took a guess and asked you to confirm or deny by means of the question mark. post#1355

Quote: Let me guess .. KJV Only?



Flesh gives birth to what again? Again, not a single verse to back up your claim that the material can produce the immaterial. It states clearly that the Spirit gives birth to spirit and that the spirit is given by God not by some other means. Yet, you constantly ignore this and insist biology is the means of acquiring a spirit.


Did you not read the scripture I gave you? If you are not born again, ie. still spiritually dead in your sins, you cannot know God or His ways yet you have these spiritually dead people writing scripture. You have them in a state where comprehension of the kingdom of God is impossible but being inspired by the Holy Spirit. What's more the 1Cor.2:14 scripture contrasts the natural man which would be one who, at the very least, walks by means of the flesh, to the spiritual man who, at the very least, is alive spiritually to God being able to do the exact same thing.


Then why tell Nicodemus before He died something that would make no sense to him but expect him to understand? No-one was expecting Jesus to die not even those He told repeatedly.

John 3:10
Jesus answered and said to him, “Are you the teacher of Israel, and do not know these things?


Might be better if you didn't. I don't think you understand what it means to be spiritual.

1) You don't have a single scripture stating that Moses, for instance, was "born again". Moses, as a few others, had a unique relationship with God by direct communication and the leading of Gods' chosen people, the Israelites, through whom the promised Seed of the woman would come. This promised Seed, is the Word, God, Jesus, who is the author of eternal salvation. The old testament righteous believed in Gods' promise, could see it afar off, but " And these all, having obtained a good report through faith , received not the promise" Heb. 11:39. These all died and were held in Abrahams' bosom (AKA Paradise), which was under the earth, until they could be redeemed by the blood of Jesus, who then led captivity captive, along with Paradise, for" without shedding of blood there is no remission " Heb. 9:22 UNTIL JESUS' SHEDDING OF HIS BLOOD NO ONE WAS SAVED, OR BORN AGAIN. Of your last sentence, " I don't think... " stood out as an honest assessment.

 

[bytheblood]

Fantasy-dogmatism has been your forte.

You really guess a lot.
Too much.

What, to you, does quicken mean biblically? To me it means to make alive ( something that was deadened) 0r REvive, in the context of a spiritual awakening or REnewal. I guess )

 

[bytheblood]

The point is he had to be born again in order to have a spirit otherwise he would have had no understanding of spiritual matters. You cannot spiritually discern something without the Holy Spirit's input and your own spirit making you alive to God.

1 Corinthians 2:14
But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

How do you think they could write scripture or speak of the things of God when they cannot receive things from the Spirit?

When you were a natural man, if you ever were, how did you receive the things of the Spirit, since you had no spirit? How did the Holy Spirit draw you? Did He draw your soul, which was natural? A donkey spoke of the things of God to Balaam, I guess it was born again also, huh? I'm not saying that those who, inspired, copied out the words that the Holy Spirit gave them, weren't righteous," Even as Abraham believed God and it was accounted to him for righteousness", Gal 3:6, they just weren't yet born again." ; and without shedding of blood is no remission." Heb 9:22. The blood of Jesus must be shed to receive salvation.

 

[bytheblood]

There was something I wanted to add to my post, something about the technicality of 'was my dog', but I was pressed for time. I was confident that you'd be sure to address that technicality in reply and give me opportunity and went ahead and sent and went.
If my cat survives me, he'll still my cat. If my son survives me, he's still my son. But those are special relationships.

And then there's the other angle, that the worm, and the smoke, are used as literary devices. Imagery, for example, isn't uncommon in scripture, especially if conveyed in visions. For example, you can't say the lamb with seven eyes is not a lamb with seven eyes but...

The son part I can see, but the cat no, that falls into the" was " category, you didn't sire the cat, you may have owned it but no longer, if it survived you. The worm and smoke MAY be used as a literary device or not, I take it as written, since I don't know for sure.

 

[Genez]

I will agree that the nastiest demon I have ever encountered was in a denominational church, it seems he had a specific task to perform there, but I most often encounter them, good old garden variety ones, in non-denominational churches

Non-denominational could mean they reject all authority but their own.
Denominational churches have a hierarchy that offers a sense of safety in numbers
of rejecting all authority but their own collective organization.

Either way… Non, or denominational... Both agree to disagree on points of sound doctrine to suite their own personal feelings on the matter.

 

[Genez]

1) You don't have a single scripture stating that Moses, for instance, was "born again".

"Born again" is not just for the Church age.

Don't you realize that when Jesus told Nicodemus that he needed to be born again?
That Jesus was speaking to a Jew?
And, that the Church with its salvation had not yet come to pass?
The Church was yet a mystery that was hidden from being known to them.

Jews who believed in the one they had come to know as the Lord God of Israel?
They were born again!

Nicodemus was a Jew. And, Jesus was telling that Jew that he needed to be born again...
Born again as a Jew!

Later on...
After the days of Moses and Israel had become a nation?
Then the Lord God of Israel took on flesh, and manifested Himself as Jesus Christ to the Jews.

OT believers were always born again!
For they were always given a human spirit to know the things of God with.

In the Church age we are to go beyond what any Jewish believer of the past could do.
Because we now have the Holy Spirit living in us!

By means of SOUND DOCTRINE we are to keep growing in knowledge of God's Word to become TRANSFORMED!
Transformed by the Spirit's power, not only to be obedient like the Jews were to do.

​

My dear children, for whom I am again in the pains of childbirth ​

until Christ is formed in you. Galatians 4:19​

​

​

And we all, who with unveiled faces contemplate the Lord’s glory, ​

are being transformed into his image with ever-increasing glory, ​

which comes from the Lord, who is the Spirit." 2 Corinthians 3:18​

We are not simply like saved OT born again believers!
We are a saved new creation in Christ! 2 Corinthians 5:17

If you are willing?
There is much to learn.

 

[sawdust]

1) You don't have a single scripture stating that Moses, for instance, was "born again". Moses, as a few others, had a unique relationship with God by direct communication and the leading of Gods' chosen people, the Israelites, through whom the promised Seed of the woman would come. This promised Seed, is the Word, God, Jesus, who is the author of eternal salvation. The old testament righteous believed in Gods' promise, could see it afar off, but " And these all, having obtained a good report through faith , received not the promise" Heb. 11:39. These all died and were held in Abrahams' bosom (AKA Paradise), which was under the earth, until they could be redeemed by the blood of Jesus, who then led captivity captive, along with Paradise, for" without shedding of blood there is no remission " Heb. 9:22 UNTIL JESUS' SHEDDING OF HIS BLOOD NO ONE WAS SAVED, OR BORN AGAIN. Of your last sentence, " I don't think... " stood out as an honest assessment.

You don't even know what it is to be born again so I'm not surprised you think all OT saints remained spiritually dead.

I have scriptures. I gave you one but you haven't bothered to challenge it.

John 3:3
Jesus answered and said to him, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.”
Amazing how all those OT saints were able to distinguish the kingdom of God from the kingdom of darkness and look forward to it.
John 3:8
The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear the sound of it, but cannot tell where it comes from and where it goes. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit.”
Who is born, not who will be born. It is in the present tense not some future tense.

1 Corinthians 2:14
But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

The "natural" man is the unbeliever still dead in their sin, not born again. The word translated "natural" is psychikos meaning "soulish". ie devoid of a spiritual life. We need to be born again so we have a spiritual life that enables us to discern spiritual matters otherwise it is all foolishness to us. It was not foolishness to Moses, or King David or any of the prophets etc.

Where's your scripture to back up your claims that no-one was saved or born again? All you have shown is the OT saints had to wait in Sheol (Paradise side) before they could enter the presence of God in heaven. Newsflash, they are still awaiting the Resurrection just like Peter, John, Paul and the rest of us.

You also forget that Christ is the Lamb that was slain from the foundation of the world. OT saints were saved on the basis of a "credit account".

Revelation 13:8
All who dwell on the earth will worship him, whose names have not been written in the Book of Life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

I think my last statement was quite accurate based on your inability to furnish any proof of your claims or even bother to address the scriptures provided.

 

[sawdust]

When you were a natural man, if you ever were, how did you receive the things of the Spirit, since you had no spirit? How did the Holy Spirit draw you? Did He draw your soul, which was natural? A donkey spoke of the things of God to Balaam, I guess it was born again also, huh? I'm not saying that those who, inspired, copied out the words that the Holy Spirit gave them, weren't righteous," Even as Abraham believed God and it was accounted to him for righteousness", Gal 3:6, they just weren't yet born again." ; and without shedding of blood is no remission." Heb 9:22. The blood of Jesus must be shed to receive salvation.

I didn't receive the things of the Spirit because I couldn't understand them. The Lord uses earthly things (ie.creation, morality, physical phenomenon like birth) to establish the drawing process.

John 3:12
If I have told you earthly things and you do not believe, how will you believe if I tell you heavenly things?

 

[Kroogz]

I hope you learned enough to recognize them faster now, they really do reveal themselves for what they are once you learn to tell the signs.

What is the difference between you and I acting in the sin nature and a demon?

Teach us these signs......Give us your wisdom.

 

[Genez]

You don't even know what it is to be born again so I'm not surprised you think all OT saints remained spiritually dead.

That remind me of when I was told a joke by a fellow student while attending Bible college.

I was asked this question...

Why is it when the Rapture happens the Catholic Church will be resurrected before anyone else? ​

I told him I did not know.

He told me...​

​

For, it says the dead in Christ shall rise first.​

 

[Kroogz]

That remind me of when I was told a joke by a fellow student while attending Bible college.

I was asked this question...

Why is it when the Rapture happens the Catholic Church will be resurrected before anyone else? ​

I told him I did not know.

He told me...​

​

For, it says the dead in Christ shall rise first.​

@Smiles@ One has to pay very special attention to what a Catholic truly believes. I have a father and mother in-law that are Catholic, but I do not doubt their salvation.......It's just going to Bible doctrine 101 for a thousand years when they hit the eternal state.

 

[Kroogz]

That remind me of when I was told a joke by a fellow student while attending Bible college.

I was asked this question...

Why is it when the Rapture happens the Catholic Church will be resurrected before anyone else? ​

I told him I did not know.

He told me...​

​

For, it says the dead in Christ shall rise first.​

This is why salvation is SIMPLY........Believe in the Lord Jesus Christ and you shall be saved.

We are mere mortals with EVERYTHING stacked against us........SIMPLY, believe on the Lord Jesus and you shall be saved.

Equal privilege and equal opportunity.....And it is simple. ACTS 16:31.

The deck is stacked against us all(Angelic/Kingdom conflict) God offers a very SIMPLE solution to the complex/unsolvable(by human standards) issue......John 3:16, Acts 16:31.

 

[Genez]

@Smiles@ One has to pay very special attention to what a Catholic truly believes. I have a father and mother in-law that are Catholic, but I do not doubt their salvation.......It's just going to Bible doctrine 101 for a thousand years when they hit the eternal state.

They are saved.

But, not saved from many evils in the world.
For that takes discerning truth to make them free.

False doctrine they too easily accept, because they passively want someone to be telling them what to think.
Rather than have someone to teach them the needed sound doctrine and the needed skills to know how to think with the Truth.

One can not be passive in spiritual warfare.
Those who fear correction wish to hide in being passive against the enemy.

grace and peace....