We deserve Wrath

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gloryfied

Guest
#1
#1
In my small group, we were discussing what we deserve from God. The question was asked this way, What do we deserve from God when we get up in the morning? After very little discussion we determined the only thing we deserve from God as soon as we get up is Wrath. What we are grateful for and what we hope for and want is God's grace. Blessed be to Him that gives us His grace even while we are sinners.
 
p_rehbein

p_rehbein

Senior Member
#2
Sep 4, 2013
30,932
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#2
gloryfied said:
In my small group, we were discussing what we deserve from God. The question was asked this way, What do we deserve from God when we get up in the morning? After very little discussion we determined the only thing we deserve from God as soon as we get up is Wrath. What we are grateful for and what we hope for and want is God's grace. Blessed be to Him that gives us His grace even while we are sinners.
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Could not disagree more................your "little group" has much to learn of God, Jesus Christ, and His Gospel
 
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paulsfam4

Guest
#3
#3
I tend to wake up thanking Jesus because being that I am saved I don't worry about the wrath ! I totally worry about making a mistake and disappointing my God, I live one day at a time and walk with my lord, Now as a country! it needs Gods wrath !!
 
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gloryfied

Guest
#4
#4
Our little group felt that wrath is what we deserve but not what we get or hope for. We are very thankful for the Grace of God. Understanding the question as what we deserve, but be thankful as His grace is what we get even though we do not deserve it. This is a statement to make us all look harder at ourselves and to help us understand how amazing God is.
 
p_rehbein

p_rehbein

Senior Member
#5
Sep 4, 2013
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#5
gloryfied said:
Our little group felt that wrath is what we deserve but not what we get or hope for. We are very thankful for the Grace of God. Understanding the question as what we deserve, but be thankful as His grace is what we get even though we do not deserve it. This is a statement to make us all look harder at ourselves and to help us understand how amazing God is.
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this idea is all well and good for the unsaved, those not under Grace.......however, it is not accurate for the Church......jus saying.......but, hey, if you feel you only deserve wrath, well it's your choice.
 
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gloryfied

Guest
#6
#6
I am sorry p I think you missed the point, we know that God gives us His love and grace, but what we really deserve and what we will never have to endure if we remain faithful is Gods wrath. I hope this helps you to understand that our little group does know alot about God and Jesus and the Gospel. It was merely a conversation starter and something more to be thankful for.
 
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Saint_Cecilia

Guest
#8
#8
gloryfied said:
Blessed be to Him that gives us His grace even while we are sinners.
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"The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand. He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him."

- John 3:35-36

✝
 
SweetShelly35

SweetShelly35

Senior Member
#9
Feb 21, 2012
289
3
18
#9
Hi gloryfield!!

I notice that your small group was really focused on the word deserve. We don't deserve anything, but Jesus Christ hung on the cross so that we could be forgiven and made us white as snow. Many people are grateful for many different things, some call it hope, and others call it blind faith that God will give us grace and fill us with the holy spirit. I noticed you are fairly new here on CC. If you ever want to chat, please feel free to drop me a line!

Shelly ((hugs))
 
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djness

Guest
#10
#10
I have always had trouble with this thinking that we deserve wrath.
Did you deserve wrath before you were born or after?
Maybe it's a pride issue with me cause I don't want to deserve wrath but this is difficult for me.
I'm certainly willing to be wrong if I am.
 
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gb9

Senior Member
#11
Jan 18, 2011
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#11
the thing about it is this: a holy and righteous God cannot tolerate sin of any kind. this is why he was so careful to keep himself away from Israel in the O.T., with Moses on Mt. Sinai in particular. so it does not matter what we did, how bad it was, or how long ago it was. we broke God's perfect commands and deserve punishment. but he sent his Son to take that in our place!! that is the best news ever!!
 
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3in1

Guest
#12
#12
Amen! Glory be to God
 
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jmary1392

Guest
#13
#13
3in1 said:
Amen! Glory be to God
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Psalm 119 verse 50 'This is my comfort in my affliction, that Your word has revived me.'

- As believers we have the Word of God and it is a powerful tool.
- It is a peculiar source of strength.
- God's word is living and powerful.
- His word can overcome the greatest hurdle.

PRAYER: Lord, thank You that no matter what affliction I may be facing at this point in time, it is Your word that can bring me comfort and direction. Amen.

ENJOY....!!!
 
posthuman

posthuman

Senior Member
#14
Jul 31, 2013
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#14
As for you, you were dead in your transgressions and sins, in which you used to live when you followed the ways of this world and of the ruler of the kingdom of the air, the spirit who is now at work in those who are disobedient. All of us also lived among them at one time, gratifying the cravings of our flesh and following its desires and thoughts. Like the rest, we were by nature deserving of wrath.
(Ephesians 2:1-3)

now in the past, all of us woke up every morning deserving nothing but wrath. that ought to be clear to everyone.

But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved. And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus, in order that in the coming ages he might show the incomparable riches of his grace, expressed in his kindness to us in Christ Jesus. For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God — not by works, so that no one can boast. For we are God’s handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.
(Ephesians 2:4-10)

why don't we get the wrath we deserve? what's changed?

it's God's mercy and grace. nothing else.

it's not because we deserve anything other than wrath that we don't wake up condemned every morning. it's because of God's great mercy. it's because Christ has sacrificed Himself on our behalf. we didn't deserve that, and no matter what we do, we still won't deserve it.

i agree with the conclusion your group came to 100% -- praise GOD! we aren't given the wrath we deserve, but a sonship we certainly don't!
 
p_rehbein

p_rehbein

Senior Member
#15
Sep 4, 2013
30,932
7,012
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#15
I disagree.........................but if you guys seek to deserve "wrath," well that is certainly your right...... :)

[h=1]Romans
8[/h]
1 .) There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
2 .) For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
3 .) For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
4 .) That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
5 .) For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
6 .) For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
7 .) Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
8 .) So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
9 .) But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
10 .) And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
11 .) But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
12 .) Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh.
13 .) For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
14 .) For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
15 .) For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.
16 .) The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
17 .) And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.
18 .) For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us.
19 .) For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God.
20 .) For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope,
21 .) Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.
 
posthuman

posthuman

Senior Member
#16
Jul 31, 2013
38,939
13,916
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#16
p_rehbein said:
I disagree.........................but if you guys seek to deserve "wrath," well that is certainly your right...... :)
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no you don't :)

you just misunderstand.

For there is no distinction: for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus, whom God put forward as a propitiation by his blood, to be received by faith.
This was to show God’s righteousness, because in his divine forbearance he had passed over former sins. It was to show his righteousness at the present time, so that he might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus.
Then what becomes of our boasting? It is excluded.
(Romans 3:22-27)

grace is a gift. it's not something we deserve at all; it's not 'earned'
anything we do that's worthy of being called "righteous" isn't of ourselves, but of God - all glory belongs to Him.

you don't disagree with that, do you?
saying we "deserve" wrath isn't the same as saying we're "condemned" or that we want to be. all we're saying is that salvation is by grace, through faith, and not by works. it's a heart toward walking humbly and loving mercy.
 
p_rehbein

p_rehbein

Senior Member
#17
Sep 4, 2013
30,932
7,012
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#17
posthuman said:
no you don't :)

you just misunderstand.

For there is no distinction: for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus, whom God put forward as a propitiation by his blood, to be received by faith.
This was to show God’s righteousness, because in his divine forbearance he had passed over former sins. It was to show his righteousness at the present time, so that he might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus.
Then what becomes of our boasting? It is excluded.
(Romans 3:22-27)

grace is a gift. it's not something we deserve at all; it's not 'earned'
anything we do that's worthy of being called "righteous" isn't of ourselves, but of God - all glory belongs to Him.

you don't disagree with that, do you?
saying we "deserve" wrath isn't the same as saying we're "condemned" or that we want to be. all we're saying is that salvation is by grace, through faith, and not by works. it's a heart toward walking humbly and loving mercy.
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...........snap...........(please look to the left of my comment.......especially paying attention to my avatar........ :) )

Why, pray tell, is it ALWAYS ME that does NOT UNDERSTAND? Actually, I DO understand, and if folks will read my #5 comment they will see that I distinguished between a "sinner" and a "believer."

When we were yet in our sin, we CERTAINLY deserved the Wrath of God........however, ONCE we are saved by Grace, and that through Faith............and become blood bought, born again children of God AND HEIRS to the Promise...........we PASS BEYOND deserving Wrath, and ARE NOW HEIRS TO THE PROMISE AND WORTHY TO BE CALLED THE SONS OF GOD.

Do you believe the sons of God deserve wrath? I don't............

God bless............. :)
 
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