What 3 verses say that a lost man cannot believe the gospel?

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lenna said:
actually, while I understand what you are saying, I don't think we can quantify God's grace in a mathamatical formula because it does not 'add up'

the answer to our rebellion and sin would always be we need to be punished

God, gives an answer that does not make sense out of the sin equation.

the sum of rebellion and sin equals death.

God offers life instead
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math is full of proofs that there are things which cannot be measured. try dividing something by zero. if that makes it a useless pursuit, then pursuing knowledge of God is equally useless, because God is beyond searching out :)
this is why He created mathematics this way. it teaches truth, as Romans 1 -- His glory is clearly seen by what He has made

it is just a language -- and if it is true, then we can show through this language that His grace defies measure. i don't have time tonight but i have no doubt we can express it as well or better in the language of algebraic topology as we can with English. ;)
 
posthuman said:
math is full of proofs that there are things which cannot be measured. try dividing something by zero. if that makes it a useless pursuit, then pursuing knowledge of God is equally useless, because God is beyond searching out :)
this is why He created mathematics this way. it teaches truth, as Romans 1 -- His glory is clearly seen by what He has made

it is just a language -- and if it is true, then we can show through this language that His grace defies measure. i don't have time tonight but i have no doubt we can express it as well or better in the language of algebraic topology as we can with English. ;)
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if that makes it a useless pursuit, then pursuing knowledge of God is equally useless, because God is beyond searching out :)
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sounds a tad beyond all of our scopes ;)

you said yourself that you may be alone in your mathematical pursuits of God but I do appreciate all that is beyond our mathematical understanding and I have no doubt God fully integrates your mathematical understandings in His revealing of Himself to you

by that same measure, as Paul states, we cannot comprehend all that God has prepared for those who love Him

I believe He would say to you to go in peace and trust you are His
 
eternally-gratefull said:
Yet 4 posts and you have not proven a thing just made accusations,

I see your sister who loves to mock is liking your posts, I guess your two peas in a pod. And I see she has earned the right to remain in my prayer bin

i don’t play games my friend, you want to act that way find someone else.
good day
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Good day to you. You've proven my point. You wrote the posts wherein you reworded the scripture pertaining to the tax collector and pharisee. Now you think I have to prove you reworded the scripture in your own postings that refer to the tax collector and pharisee?

You are playing the game here. You avoided the responsibility for that from the first time I addressed the matter and dodged the responsibility for it as you are again now.

Further, don't implicate a sister in this. That is a cowards move to be quite blunt. You have a cheek to pray for her when you refuse to acknowledge what you do wrong here. You play games! In fact, this game that has gone this far with you refusing to acknowledge what you've written about the tax collector and pharisee in your own words, opposite of God's makes me wonder if the reason you don't accept the responsibility is because these few pages after doing that you feign you have no idea what I'm talking about. And that makes me wonder if it is you that wrote those posts that altered the scripture pertaining to the tax collector and pharisee.

That would be a game indeed. Sharing an account here. That would explain how you don't recall what you wrote but want others to remind you. And then you turn dark when they refuse.
I think you may be surprised at how many here have you on their prayer list.

Bins? Are for dust. Not prayer!
 
eternally-gratefull said:
Not really, even in their view if Jesus did not die no one could be saved,

so the kitten is mistaken, at least in that comment

we should stop trying to destroy them so much we say and think things that are not close to being true, we hurt our own cause when we do this
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WOW! Not only do you add your own words to scripture, i.e. the pharisee and tax collector verse, but you also add your own maligning thoughts to others postings, in this case per your reference to my observations earlier about Tulip, my post.

I'll be really really direct here so that there is no equivocation even from someone who disrespects members and the scripture by corrupting what exists with your own bad fiction.
What you're saying I said about Jesus is a DAMNED FROM THE PIT OF HELL LIE!

The one seeking to destroy is you! Even Satan comes clad as an angel of light. And why not? He was the light bringer Lucifer before his fall!
Maybe that is why your last name is spelled wrong. Maybe what you're telling us by that is you're here to eternally grate on the nerves of Christians fully.
Because Grateful is the true spelling. You can't even respect the dictionary's entry for the actual writing of Grateful?
There's a pattern to your posting. A bad one from the start of your name.

Yes, this is mean. You're right. That's because I rebuke those who lie about what I say about Jesus my Savior!
And I make no apologies. God tells us to do this. In love? When God opened Hell to receive humans after creating it for Satan and his fallen, maybe God's telling us that love is subjective. In this case, maybe love is telling you that your fruits are glaring! And ROTTEN!


But you're still breathing.
That means you can repent.

I won't be reading you anymore. Quite simply, it isn't worth it.
 
soggykitten said:
the antithesis of grace
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I misread your statement as
"The Atheists of grace" and i like it.

The Church is full of such corruption and is far from what God intended.
Time to clean out the inside of your cup people cause the bridegroom is almost here.

Tulip has the same foreign evil root as:
OSAS - Rejecting the sovereignty of God to cut your unbelieving posterior off like he said he would.
Wretched man syndrome - who's Unrighteous is there Righteousness.
The Unholy powerless - who's god is nothing more then a tradition you belong to.
while on the other side of the same error we have:
Blab it and grab its - Genie in a bottle God
The modern Judaizers - The magic word song and dance crowd with the modern version of just a little off the top.
The modern Pharisees - Who god is their intellect and the only holy seal they acknowledge comes on a doctorate degree.

While the narrow path remains as it always has with those who have the fear of God before there eyes and who are careful to not neglect the very purpose of the Gospel.

Therefore, beloved, since we have these promises, let us cleanse ourselves from everything that defiles body and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God. - 2 Cor 7:1

Make every effort to live in peace with everyone and to be
holy; without holiness no one will see the Lord - Heb 12:14

And there will be a highway called the Way of Holiness. The unclean will not travel it, only those who walk in that Way— and fools will not stray onto it. - Isa 35:8

The only way, the only true path is our ceasing from sin and beginning to live the rest of our lives in holiness. This is our true worship and this is what gives God glory and opens the door to the working of the Spirit of Holiness in the power of God through our lives.

Every other path man has made for himself is in order to cling to his favorite sins and justify himself as he is.
They are all a maligning of the true name and character of God and the Lord Jesus and that should make you angry.
Angry enough to call on God to do whatever it takes to bring you the end of yourself and the end of your sin and make you holy, to put on his splendor in the worship of Him. By doing so you put all those who say they know him to open shame and God name and way are shown to his glory.

Ascribe to the LORD the glory due his name; worship the LORD in the splendor of his holiness. - Ps 29:2
 
lenna said:
well

that equals our infinitesimally small reaching out to the only God who has created all things :geek:
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Funny how everyone gets the mustard seed wrong.
it is not faith the size of the mustard seed.
But the faith of the tiny mustard seed.
It is not small faith it is a very great faith in a very small package or capacity.
Being the smallest of seeds it grows into one of the tallest of plants in the garden.
 
eternally
Lion222 said:
I misread your statement as
"The Atheists of grace" and i like it.

The Church is full of such corruption and is far from what God intended.
Time to clean out the inside of your cup people cause the bridegroom is almost here.

Tulip has the same foreign evil root as:
OSAS - Rejecting the sovereignty of God to cut your unbelieving posterior off like he said he would.
Wretched man syndrome - who's Unrighteous is there Righteousness.
The Unholy powerless - who's god is nothing more then a tradition you belong to.
while on the other side of the same error we have:
Blab it and grab its - Genie in a bottle God
The modern Judaizers - The magic word song and dance crowd with the modern version of just a little off the top.
The modern Pharisees - Who god is their intellect and the only holy seal they acknowledge comes on a doctorate degree.

While the narrow path remains as it always has with those who have the fear of God before there eyes and who are careful to not neglect the very purpose of the Gospel.

Therefore, beloved, since we have these promises, let us cleanse ourselves from everything that defiles body and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God. - 2 Cor 7:1

Make every effort to live in peace with everyone and to be
holy; without holiness no one will see the Lord - Heb 12:14

And there will be a highway called the Way of Holiness. The unclean will not travel it, only those who walk in that Way— and fools will not stray onto it. - Isa 35:8

The only way, the only true path is our ceasing from sin and beginning to live the rest of our lives in holiness. This is our true worship and this is what gives God glory and opens the door to the working of the Spirit of Holiness in the power of God through our lives.

Every other path man has made for himself is in order to cling to his favorite sins and justify himself as he is.
They are all a maligning of the true name and character of God and the Lord Jesus and that should make you angry.
Angry enough to call on God to do whatever it takes to bring you the end of yourself and the end of your sin and make you holy, to put on his splendor in the worship of Him. By doing so you put all those who say they know him to open shame and God name and way are shown to his glory.

Ascribe to the LORD the glory due his name; worship the LORD in the splendor of his holiness. - Ps 29:2
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I misread your statement as
"The Atheists of grace" and i like it. :LOL:(y):D
I actually ascribe to OSAS because it is scripture. The rest of what you said is pretty interesting reading. Thank you.
 
Lion222 said:
Funny how everyone gets the mustard seed wrong.
it is not faith the size of the mustard seed.
But the faith of the tiny mustard seed.
It is not small faith it is a very great faith.
Being the smallest of seeds it grows into one of the tallest of plants in the garden.
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One of the smallest seeds. The smallest seed on earth belongs in the Orchid family.
 
If you want to argue for your convictions fine if you want to point out what you believe is someones error fine.
But if you are ready to throw stones at someones character directly...
Well you best be someone without any sin.
 
jackrosie said:
I hear you....I just don’t understand how a true believer who has been saved by Christ ,can live a life of despair,knowing in their heart that he saved them.

How can anyone take away from a believer,what God gave them.

I truly don’t understand it.....

Dusky,how can being pounded with negativity,take your faith away?
If it came from God?
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Jackrosle, with all due respect, I believe that the scriptures teach that after we have been born again, we still retain our fleshly nature and struggle within ourselves with a battle of our fleshly desires against our spiritual nature. Paul explains this in Romans 7:14-25.

The natural man, before he has been regenerated, does not have this warfare within himself. He does not have spiritual faith, which comes with the indwelling of the Holy Spirit as a fruit of the Holy Spirit. His faith is the faith of man and his accomplishments.
 
soggykitten said:
eternally

I misread your statement as
"The Atheists of grace" and i like it. :LOL:(y):D
I actually ascribe to OSAS because it is scripture. The rest of what you said is pretty interesting reading. Thank you.
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Do you reject this?
Romans 20-22
That is correct: They were broken off because of unbelief, but you stand by faith. Do not be arrogant, but be afraid. For if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you either. Take notice, therefore, of the kindness and severity of God: severity to those who fell, but kindness to you, if you continue in His kindness. Otherwise you also will be cut off.
 
soggykitten said:
Which would be impossible if they were to begin as that which is created to represent the T, totally depraved, and the rest of the petals as pertains to Tulip.

Do you think so too?
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Agree, total depravity/total inability is the foundation for the rest of the system, reaches beyond man's sinfulness to his complete inability, a completely constrained will and unable to respond to the Gospel and believe.

From their web site........

The religion of "free will" pictures salvation as a possibility for all men if they are willing to cooperate with God by believing. The religion of free grace presents salvation as a certainty for all of the elect of God because God gives faith as a gift.
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Source
 
All who have this hope in him purify themselves, just as he is pure. - 1 John 3:3

These are those who have believe and walk in faith, these are the Children of God.
If this is not you, if you are not perusing holiness in God.
Well see Romans 20-11
 
lenna said:
sounds a tad beyond all of our scopes ;)

you said yourself that you may be alone in your mathematical pursuits of God but I do appreciate all that is beyond our mathematical understanding and I have no doubt God fully integrates your mathematical understandings in His revealing of Himself to you

by that same measure, as Paul states, we cannot comprehend all that God has prepared for those who love Him

I believe He would say to you to go in peace and trust you are His
Click to expand...

It's still my secret plan to turn all y'all sisters and brothers into mathematicians... :geek:


 
EleventhHour said:
This to me is someone reaching out :unsure:
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Reaching out because their heart is convicted of sin and of the hope of the mercy of God, it seems. Who convicts?

I'm not sure belief and regeneration are seperable in time. :unsure:
When does an egg become a chicken? o_O

I really have little time today will get back later. Not as tho I expect we'll settle a thousand years old puzzle in a few days ha - both sides have their cases, and both are made for respect of God. It's a dim glass we see through, we gotta remember, and not become bitter towards each other
 
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