What are the ordinances and traditions?

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Mar 4, 2020
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#1
What are the ordinances and/or traditions taught or delivered by speech and/or letter?

1 Corinthians 11:2
2Now I praise you, brethren, that ye remember me in all things, and keep the ordinances, as I delivered them to you.

2 Thessalonians 2:15
15Therefore, brothers, stand firm and cling to the traditions we taught you, whether by speech or by letter.
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
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#2
All “traditions,” including any that Paul “taught, whether by WORD, or our epistle” (vs. 15) had to line up with revealed Scripture
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
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#3
28For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things;
29That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.
30¶So when they were dismissed, they came to Antioch: and when they had gathered the multitude together, they delivered the epistle:
31Which when they had read, they rejoiced for the consolation.
Acts 15
 

Kolistus

Well-known member
Feb 3, 2020
538
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#4
What are the ordinances and/or traditions taught or delivered by speech and/or letter?

1 Corinthians 11:2
2Now I praise you, brethren, that ye remember me in all things, and keep the ordinances, as I delivered them to you.

2 Thessalonians 2:15
15Therefore, brothers, stand firm and cling to the traditions we taught you, whether by speech or by letter.
Well, honest answer, I do not know, as I wasn't there listening back then.

Some orthodox and catholic churches CLAIM to know but I doubt they do.
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
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#5
The best conclusion is that Acts 15:28–31 is part of the “ordinances” that Paul delivered, along with two “ceremonies”: the Lord’s Supper and Baptism. Since the gospel dealt with BURIAL and RESURRECTION as well as death, only TWO ordinances would show that, and it would take TWO, not ONE. The Supper would set forth His death, and Baptism would set forth His burial and resurrection. THAT IS PAUL’S “GOSPEL OF THE GRACE OF GOD” ACCORDING TO 1 CORINTHIANS 15:1–4.
 
Mar 4, 2020
8,614
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#6
The best conclusion is that Acts 15:28–31 is part of the “ordinances” that Paul delivered, along with two “ceremonies”: the Lord’s Supper and Baptism. Since the gospel dealt with BURIAL and RESURRECTION as well as death, only TWO ordinances would show that, and it would take TWO, not ONE. The Supper would set forth His death, and Baptism would set forth His burial and resurrection. THAT IS PAUL’S “GOSPEL OF THE GRACE OF GOD” ACCORDING TO 1 CORINTHIANS 15:1–4.
Possibly 1 Corinthians 7?

There's some bits where Paul emphasizes "But to the rest speak I, not the Lord" or "And so ordain I in all churches." And again "I have no commandment of the Lord: yet I give my judgment"
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
7,685
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#7
Possibly 1 Corinthians 7?

There's some bits where Paul emphasizes "But to the rest speak I, not the Lord" or "And so ordain I in all churches." And again "I have no commandment of the Lord: yet I give my judgment"
A ordinance is simply a rule/law, as in 1 Cor 11, a womans behavior in the church follows, giving a rule/law

As 2 Timothy states below, all scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for (Doctrine)

As for 2 Thessalonians 2:15, the word of God in 2 Timothy below also applies, in that the canon of scripture is sufficient for the man of God, no need to "wonder" on Paul's unwritten "traditions", simple

2 Timothy 3:16-17KJV
16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
17 That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
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#8
Possibly 1 Corinthians 7?

There's some bits where Paul emphasizes "But to the rest speak I, not the Lord" or "And so ordain I in all churches." And again "I have no commandment of the Lord: yet I give my judgment"
Something Jesus didn't say ,but pauls saying it now ..as inspired ,still authoritative ?
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,167
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#9
Something Jesus didn't say ,but pauls saying it now ..as inspired ,still authoritative ?
Paul was speaking as the Holy Spirit gave him utterance. And Peter placed all of Paul's epistles alongside the existing Scriptures. Since we find ordinances mentioned at the beginning of 1 Corinthians 11, the woman's head covering during worship would also be an ordinance, along with the Lord's Supper and baptism by immersion.
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
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#10
Paul was speaking as the Holy Spirit gave him utterance. And Peter placed all of Paul's epistles alongside the existing Scriptures. Since we find ordinances mentioned at the beginning of 1 Corinthians 11, the woman's head covering during worship would also be an ordinance, along with the Lord's Supper and baptism by immersion.
1 cor 11 ( 16 But if any man seem to be contentious, we have no such custom, neither the churches of God.) “Ordinances” refers to “ceremonies” in modern language. The only CEREMONY in the chapter is the Lord’s Supper. The only two ceremonies mentioned in Scriptures are the Lord’s Supper and Baptism (Luke 22:19–20; Matt. 28:19).
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,167
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#11
“Ordinances” refers to “ceremonies” in modern language.
No. Ordinances are not ceremonies according to a proper interpretation of the Greek word paradosis. Not what any modern interpretation suggests.

Strong's Concordance
paradosis: a handing down or over, a tradition
Original Word: παράδοσις, εως, ἡ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: paradosis
Phonetic Spelling: (par-ad'-os-is)
Definition: a handing down or over, a tradition

Usage: an instruction, tradition.

In the context in which it is used by Paul, Christ HANDED DOWN to the apostles many teachings after His resurrection and before His ascension (and then directly to Paul). Then the apostles HANDED DOWN those teachings to the churches. But since they would not be on earth indefinitely, they also taught faith men to teach other faithful men the traditions or handed down teachings of Christ (and expected that this would continue). The woman's head covering and the Lord's Supper were included in 1 Corinthians 11. Water baptism is found throughout the book of Acts.
 
4

4ChristAlone

Guest
#12
All “traditions,” including any that Paul “taught, whether by WORD, or our epistle” (vs. 15) had to line up with revealed Scripture
Here he begins saying

2Thes 2:15 Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and *hold the traditions which ye *have been* taught,
whether by word, or our epistle.

But up further he tells you what they told them when they were with them (in word) which they are not (since he is writing to them in this epistle)

2 Thes 3:10 For even when **we were** with you, **this** we commanded you,
that if any would not work, neither should he eat.

So the tradition is after a manner of life and behavior (as shown by him in 2 Thes 3:7)

And then further down he could just say,

2Thes 3:14 And if any man obey not our word by this epistle,
note that man, and have no company with him, that he may be ashamed
 
4

4ChristAlone

Guest
#13
Here he begins saying

2Thes 2:15 Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and *hold the traditions which ye *have been* taught,
whether by word, or our epistle.

But up further he tells you what they told them when they were with them (in word) which they are not (since he is writing to them in this epistle)

2 Thes 3:10 For even when **we were** with you, **this** we commanded you,
that if any would not work, neither should he eat.

So the tradition is after a manner of life and behavior (as shown by him in 2 Thes 3:7)

And then further down he could just say,

2Thes 3:14 And if any man obey not our word by this epistle,
note that man, and have no company with him, that he may be ashamed

Let me add to the above, I hate this one it can be lengthy but its hard to catch

The above is a tradition

This is part of that "walking disorderly"
and not after the tradition received of them was about.

Even as Paul shows it a few verses earlier...
When he says this

2Thes 3:6 we command *you* (now, in this epistle), brethren,
in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ,
that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother
that walketh disorderly,
and
not after the tradition
which he *received of* us (or received already when we were with you)

They had received it from them already
Which was to follow their manner of "behavior"

As Paul conttinues,

2Thes 3:7 For yourselves know how ye ought to follow us:
for we behaved not ourselves disorderly (even when they were among you )

Whereas he also says,

2Thes 3:8 Neither did we eat any man's bread for nought;
but wrought with labour and travail night and day,
that we might not be chargeable to any of you:

And to "make ourselves examples" (unto them) to follow

As he also states saying,

2Thes 3:9 Not because we have not power,
but to make ourselves an ensample unto you
to follow us. (in that way)

So again...

2Thes 3:10 For even when we **were with** you THIS we commanded you,
that if any would not work,
neither should he eat.

So he just told them what was commanded them by word (when he saw them previously in person) when they (the apostles) were with them and now he is writing it (in this same in that epistle)

And because the apostles (now being away from them) are now "hearing" this...

As he writes,

2Thes 3:11 For **we hear** (being no more with them but now away)
that there are some (but not all) which walk among you disorderly,

(howso disorderly?
and not after what tradition?)

Paul continues,

working not *at all*
,
but *are* busybodies.

So Paul names them

Which is exactly this earlier

2Thes 3:6...that which walketh disorderly,
and not after the tradition which he received (already) of us

And he continues "to these" in particular saying

2Thes 3:12 Now *them* that **are such**
we command
and exhort by our Lord Jesus Christ,
that with quietness they **work**,
and eat their *own bread*

Don't be a leech" tradition

And so now what they had (previously commanded them in word) and what they received already when the apostles were with them is now in writing (in that same epistle) and so Paul ends it saying...

2Thes 3:14 And if any man obey not our word by *this* epistle, note that man
(ie the man who does not do what he just commanded) which was *that* which they received of them in person and now likewise in writing as well

Thats how I am catching it
 
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4ChristAlone

Guest
#14
Also, even earlier in the context of 2 Thes 2:15 he says it the same way there also (concerning what he said about the things he was writing in the same epistle) saying,

2 Thes 2:5 Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you ( in person ), I told you ( even then) these things (which I am writing to you about in this same epistle)?

Like in both places he touches down on what was said in person and in that epistle (wheres in 2 Thes 2 was of a particular insight and the other was on not being a freeloader for the most part.
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,424
113
#15
28For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things;
29That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.
30¶So when they were dismissed, they came to Antioch: and when they had gathered the multitude together, they delivered the epistle:
31Which when they had read, they rejoiced for the consolation.
Acts 15
The ordinances and traditions spoken of in Corinthians and Thessalonians have to do with scripture. The traditions in Acts has to do with what the Pharisees viewed as scripture but was not scripture. They taught that if you cut foreskin you were circumcised, and taught that you must obey not working on the Sabbath ahead of loving your neighbor. Luke is telling, in Acts, about what is scripture to be followed.