What Does It Mean That God Desires All People To Be Saved?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
T

Ted01

Well-known member
#301
May 14, 2022
1,055
448
83
#301
Everlasting-Grace said:
Jesus told the theif on the cross he would be with him in paradise that evening? How is that any different? I looked it up. It appears they believe Mary was given her heavenly body already. Do they understand that no one has been resurrected yet? Not even Mary, Who is in Paradise awaiting the return of her savior?
Click to expand...
Well, it's all rather confusing in my mind and I don't want to pretend to be an expert on such things. Also, there's a lot of differing opinions even among those who are in the same Faith.

Anyway, some see Mary as Divine.... she had to be, they reason because something un-pure couldn't conceive Jesus, the Holy One. (cf. The Immaculate Conception and The Council of Ephesus).

Therefore, she also could not die.
 
E

Everlasting-Grace

Well-known member
#302
Dec 18, 2021
5,012
1,540
113
#302
Ted01 said:
Well, it's all rather confusing in my mind and I don't want to pretend to be an expert on such things. Also, there's a lot of differing opinions even among those who are in the same Faith.

Anyway, some see Mary as Divine.... she had to be, they reason because something un-pure couldn't conceive Jesus, the Holy One. (cf. The Immaculate Conception and The Council of Ephesus).

Therefore, she also could not die.
Click to expand...
She birthed the human body of Jesus, Jesus entered the body after the birth when God breathed life into the baby. She did not birth God. Jesus as God, as Jesus said himself, was before Abraham. Mary was not even conceived herself yet by sinful parents.

Mary could not be devine. She also could not be sinless. The term full of grace proves this. A perfect being would not need grace. they would EARN their righteous standing with God.

One needs grace because they are a sinner..

Even Mary called Jesus her savior. Its odd that she understood what many others do not..
 
Simona1988

Simona1988

Active member
#303
Mar 15, 2021
196
138
43
#303
PennEd said:
Hmmm.

Can you point to where it says in Scripture that we should worship, or even pray to Mary?
Click to expand...
Sure. But only after you show me where did Jesus ask his disciples to write a book about Him.

PennEd said:
Also, Here is a good explanation of just what it means for Mary to be the mother of God. Hope you are not confused. Mary was a sinner, just like you and me, that needed her Son's Sacrifice to pay her sin debt.
Click to expand...
She was a sinner, but she wasn't like you and me... she was chosen by God the Father to bear His Son.

PennEd said:
We should distinguish the term Theotokos from mother of God, because there is a subtle yet important difference. The term mother of God could be taken wrongly as implying that Mary was the source or originator of God, similar to how Juno was the mother of Vulcan in Roman mythology. Of course, Christianity teaches that God is eternal and that Jesus Christ has a pre-existent, divine nature. The idea that Mary is the mother of God in the sense that she was the source of God or somehow predated God or is herself part of the Godhead is patently unbiblical, and heretical.
Click to expand...
We call her mother of God, in order to accentuate and confess the nature of Jesus Christ, who is both God and man. So that people who don't believe He is both God and man (most heresies revolved around Jesus's nature) get red-headed. ;)
 
E

Everlasting-Grace

Well-known member
#304
Dec 18, 2021
5,012
1,540
113
#304
Simona1988 said:
Sure. But only after you show me where did Jesus ask his disciples to write a book about Him.
Click to expand...
The whole bible is about him, thats why he is called the word (john 1) so its confusing why you would ask such a question


She was a sinner, but she wasn't like you and me... she was chosen by God the Father to bear His Son.
Click to expand...
That would make her just like us, the penalty of sin is death. Jesus had to die for her also.

But she was shown grace that she could even bore the human body that would be given the spirit of Christ at birth


We call her mother of God, in order to accentuate and confess the nature of Jesus Christ, who is both God and man. So that people who don't believe He is both God and man (most heresies revolved around Jesus's nature) get red-headed. ;)
Click to expand...
She is not the mother of God. that is a pagan term.

She is the mother of Jesus Fleshy body. God has no mother.

Jesus was God long before he entered the body bore by Mary
 
PennEd

PennEd

Senior Member
#305
Apr 22, 2013
12,955
8,670
113
#305
Simona1988 said:
Sure. But only after you show me where did Jesus ask his disciples to write a book about Him.
Click to expand...
Where in Scripture? Are you talking about some Catholic or Eastern Orthodox Book that ISN'T Scripture?

Simona1988 said:
She was a sinner, but she wasn't like you and me... she was chosen by God the Father to bear His Son.
Click to expand...
Yes she was. Not sure what that proves.

Simona1988 said:
We call her mother of God, in order to accentuate and confess the nature of Jesus Christ, who is both God and man. So that people who don't believe He is both God and man (most heresies revolved around Jesus's nature) get red-headed.
Click to expand...
He is God and man. No argument there.

So we're back to why you think it's ok to pray and Worship Mary?
 
Magenta

Magenta

Senior Member
#306
Jul 3, 2015
56,000
26,134
113
#306
NightTwister said:
I never denied that, and I can't figure out why you think I did.
Click to expand...
Weird, since our conversation started with you denying that Calvinists by large believe the U of T.U.L.I.P.

Your claim was that only 1% (a statistic you made up) believe that God predetermines who will be saved.

NightTwister said:
That is such a small subset that it hardly warrants mention.
Click to expand...
 
NightTwister

NightTwister

Well-known member
#307
Jul 5, 2023
1,352
455
83
64
Colorado, USA
#307
Magenta said:
Weird, since our conversation started with you denying that Calvinists by large believe the U of T.U.L.I.P.

Your claim was that only 1% (a statistic you made up) believe that God predetermines who will be saved.
Click to expand...
Yet, that's not what the 1% is referring to. So, are you interested in an actual conversation, or would you prefer to just continue with your misconceptions?
 
Magenta

Magenta

Senior Member
#309
Jul 3, 2015
56,000
26,134
113
#309
NightTwister said:
Yet, that's not what the 1% is referring to. So, are you interested in an actual conversation, or would you prefer to just continue with your misconceptions?
Click to expand...
If you were interested in actual discussion, would you be fabricating statistics
out of the thin air of your imagination to prop up what you believe to be true?

Putting yourself forward as an authority about something you do not believe while acting
as if others could have no knowledge or understanding of things they do not believe???
 
T

Ted01

Well-known member
#310
May 14, 2022
1,055
448
83
#310
Magenta said:
If you were interested in actual discussion, would you be fabricating statistics
out of the thin air of your imagination to prop up what you believe to be true?
Click to expand...
Some people tend to speak in hyperbole... almost always. But then they get upset when people misunderstand them?
And they don't even seem to realize... and would never admit to it.
 
NightTwister

NightTwister

Well-known member
#311
Jul 5, 2023
1,352
455
83
64
Colorado, USA
#311
Ted01 said:
Some people tend to speak in hyperbole... almost always. But then they get upset when people misunderstand them?
And they don't even seem to realize... and would never admit to it.
Click to expand...
I wasn't speaking in hyperbole. Sometimes people tend to bear false witness against their neighbor, but don't realize, and rarely admit it. Then they get upset when called out on it.
 
T

Ted01

Well-known member
#312
May 14, 2022
1,055
448
83
#312
NightTwister said:
I wasn't speaking in hyperbole. Sometimes people tend to bear false witness against their neighbor, but don't realize, and rarely admit it. Then they get upset when called out on it.
Click to expand...
Well, I'd be happy to admit it, if that's the case.
But what of your "1%"... is that factual? Have you run a statistical analysis of the entire population of Earth?
 
NightTwister

NightTwister

Well-known member
#313
Jul 5, 2023
1,352
455
83
64
Colorado, USA
#313
Ted01 said:
Well, I'd be happy to admit it, if that's the case.
But what of your "1%"... is that factual? Have you run a statistical analysis of the entire population of Earth?
Click to expand...
Less than 1% of Calvinists believe in Double (Symmetrical) Predestination. In other words, almost none believe that God predestined them to damnation and actively works to prevent them from coming to salvation. A request for clarification or more details probably would've helped, but some would just prefer to make accusations and use ad hominem arguments instead.
 
Magenta

Magenta

Senior Member
#314
Jul 3, 2015
56,000
26,134
113
#314
NightTwister said:
A request for clarification or more details probably would've helped, but some would just prefer to make accusations and use ad hominem arguments instead.
Click to expand...
Ted01 said:
And they don't even seem to realize... and would never admit to it.
Click to expand...
Yes, case in point underway as we speak!

No doubt NT sees himself as faultless in the convo.
 
T

Ted01

Well-known member
#315
May 14, 2022
1,055
448
83
#315
NightTwister said:
Less than 1% of Calvinists believe in Double (Symmetrical) Predestination. In other words, almost none believe that God predestined them to damnation and actively works to prevent them from coming to salvation. A request for clarification or more details probably would've helped, but some would just prefer to make accusations and use ad hominem arguments instead.
Click to expand...
Okay... that's what you believe.
But we were talk about hyperbole vs. factual ideas... where are your facts that support this "1%"? Or are you just saying 1% in hyperbolic language?
 
T

Ted01

Well-known member
#316
May 14, 2022
1,055
448
83
#316
Hey @NightTwister are you still there!?

So, your 1%... is that fact, or hyperbole?

Still waiting...
 
TabinRivCA

TabinRivCA

Well-known member
#318
Oct 23, 2018
12,381
10,061
113
#318
In fact, God's Word tells us specifically to avoid arguments; “Don't have anything to do with foolish and stupid arguments, because you know they produce quarrels. And the Lord's servant must not be quarrelsome but must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful” (2 Timothy 2:23-24).
This Scripture came to mind, and so I'm putting it out there, have a blest Wednesday everyone💕
 
NightTwister

NightTwister

Well-known member
#319
Jul 5, 2023
1,352
455
83
64
Colorado, USA
#319
TabinRivCA said:
In fact, God's Word tells us specifically to avoid arguments; “Don't have anything to do with foolish and stupid arguments, because you know they produce quarrels. And the Lord's servant must not be quarrelsome but must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful” (2 Timothy 2:23-24).
Click to expand...
Arguing against those who misrepresent the beliefs of a significant number of Christians isn't a "foolish or stupid" argument.
 
T

Ted01

Well-known member
#320
May 14, 2022
1,055
448
83
#320
NightTwister said:
It's a fact, but one you don't like. Moving on...
Click to expand...
Haha... not so quick.
Can you please post your source of information? Or was I correct when I said that people who tend to use hyperbole a lot, don't like to admit it?

A little proof please, just so that we can see that it is indeed a fact and just not your opinion.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.