What does this downgrade mean for you??

[TDWP22]

Our downgrade, by S&P, from a AAA rating to a AA+ means higher interest rates on credit cards, mortgages, loans...etc
Investors may decide to sop investing. Companies may decide to lay off personal due to the increases in interest rates.

Why are we in this mess?? simple we cannot afford Social security, medicare and medicaid. Our government cannot take care of us anymore. Besides these insurance programs were not suppose to be a long term solution. If serious cuts to these programs, as well as abolition Obama care, these country may go into another depression.

Someone has to have to the guts to tell the American people that we cannot take care of them anymore. We have been giving Americans fish, instead of teaching them how to catch fish so they are able to feed themselves. Our people are accustomed this situation, and yes, America will become a hell hole.

 

[TDWP22]

PS: for those who believe the rich need to pay there "fair share;" that will never happen. Laws aren't perfect, there are loop holes to every law (and the rich have the means to finding them). Besides the rich control and hold this country afloat, and the Constitution was created to protect them.

 

[zeroturbulence]

I believe it won't have much effect on the economy. The countries which hold US debt can't afford to do anything that might slow down the US economy further because we are by far the biggest comsumers of products and services around the globe. If they raise interest rates on US debt, it can hurt the US economy and cause us to buy less of their products. There will certainly be a lot of verbal reprimanding from the other countries though, just like what China did today.

Now on the other hand, if Moody's decides to downgrade too, then the other countries might be pressured into raising interest rates, but with only the S&P downgrade, there isn't much pressure on them to do that. Lets hope Moody's doesn't do that.

 

[dmdave17]

PS: for those who believe the rich need to pay there "fair share;" that will never happen. Laws aren't perfect, there are loop holes to every law (and the rich have the means to finding them). Besides the rich control and hold this country afloat, and the Constitution was created to protect them.

While I don't really see the significance of this discussion to a Christian web site, except as one more example of our rejection of the founding principles of this nation (which were Christian by the way), I feel compelled to offer a little lesson in Economics '101', "job creation".

Most people get "rich" by being in business. Whether it's the "mom & pop" grocery, the medium-sized contractor, or the massive conglomerate, wealth is created through the sale of a product or the providing of a service. Businesses generate revenue, which eventually goes into the pockets of the business owners. Out of that revenue, they pay expenses; equipment, supplies, wages and, yes, taxes. What is left over, they get to keep.

Imagine that a small a/c repair company with five technicians is bringing in about $ 450,00 a year. Expenses amount to $ 50,000 a year, wages $ 250,000 ($ 50,000/employee), and taxes $ 50,000. That leaves $100,000 left for the business owner; not exactly millionaire status.

Now imagine that the taxes on this business are doubled; from $ 50,000 to $ 100,000. Where will the money come from? Well, expenses are pretty constant; can't really do much there. And we can't really expect the business owner to cut his income in half; after all, he is the brains (and often brawn) behind the business. What does that leave? Oh, oh, he has to cut an employee.

So the net effect on the economy is $ 50,000 less in circulation; not to mention the loss of whatever taxes that employee was paying. The economy slows, less taxes are raised, and the $ 50,000 in additional taxes paid by the business are ultimately offset by loss of tax revenue in other areas.

No matter what the size of the business, it always works this way. The first casualty of increased taxes is decreased jobs. And that creates a greater demand for government handouts such as unemployment, welfare, etc.. Therefore, government is asked to pay out more with less revenue.

You are absolutely right that government entitlement programs are to blame for the mess this country is in. This is why I fervently believe that we must rid ourselves of the Obama administration and all its vestiges in November, 2012. But raising taxes is never the solution. As the current administration is finding out.

God bless us all.

 

[TDWP22]

While I don't really see the significance of this discussion to a Christian web site, except as one more example of our rejection of the founding principles of this nation (which were Christian by the way), I feel compelled to offer a little lesson in Economics '101', "job creation".

Most people get "rich" by being in business. Whether it's the "mom & pop" grocery, the medium-sized contractor, or the massive conglomerate, wealth is created through the sale of a product or the providing of a service. Businesses generate revenue, which eventually goes into the pockets of the business owners. Out of that revenue, they pay expenses; equipment, supplies, wages and, yes, taxes. What is left over, they get to keep.

Imagine that a small a/c repair company with five technicians is bringing in about $ 450,00 a year. Expenses amount to $ 50,000 a year, wages $ 250,000 ($ 50,000/employee), and taxes $ 50,000. That leaves $100,000 left for the business owner; not exactly millionaire status.

Now imagine that the taxes on this business are doubled; from $ 50,000 to $ 100,000. Where will the money come from? Well, expenses are pretty constant; can't really do much there. And we can't really expect the business owner to cut his income in half; after all, he is the brains (and often brawn) behind the business. What does that leave? Oh, oh, he has to cut an employee.

So the net effect on the economy is $ 50,000 less in circulation; not to mention the loss of whatever taxes that employee was paying. The economy slows, less taxes are raised, and the $ 50,000 in additional taxes paid by the business are ultimately offset by loss of tax revenue in other areas.

No matter what the size of the business, it always works this way. The first casualty of increased taxes is decreased jobs. And that creates a greater demand for government handouts such as unemployment, welfare, etc.. Therefore, government is asked to pay out more with less revenue.

You are absolutely right that government entitlement programs are to blame for the mess this country is in. This is why I fervently believe that we must rid ourselves of the Obama administration and all its vestiges in November, 2012. But raising taxes is never the solution. As the current administration is finding out.

God bless us all.

well, most people here have no idea whats going on, im just giving updates...
here's one more thing i forgot to say: it isn't that there aren't any jobs out there, in fact there are millions of them, but people just aren't prepared for them. The government can create as many jobs at it wants, the fact will not change. besides millions of "L brain" related jobs are going to be outsourced in the next few years. so there has to be an Educational reform

 

[zeroturbulence]

Well, today (the Monday after the downgrade) it looks like the world's investors believe that the downgrade is reason to pull a lot of their money out of the stock market. Thats something I didn't expect, but it makes a little sense, if you are heavily invested you don't want to risk what this unprecedented downgrade might mean for the future so you take a bunch of your money off the table, at least until there is some reassurance that countries won't increase their interest rates on US debt and cause a world economic slowdown like i mentioned in my first post.

On the positive side, this caused oil to go down, so gas prices will be coming down in about 2 to 3 weeks.

 

[zeroturbulence]

Oh well, I had no idea Obama made a speech this morning. He mentioned raising taxes on the rich and investors know that would hurt the economy.

 

[DiscipleWilliam]

PS: for those who believe the rich need to pay there "fair share;" that will never happen. Laws aren't perfect, there are loop holes to every law (and the rich have the means to finding them). Besides the rich control and hold this country afloat, and the Constitution was created to protect them.

Your postings sound ironically similar to what is spewed out of the mouths of mainstream media conglomerates. This is completely inaccurate and sounds more like a ranting tirade instead of something that properly recognizes and diagnoses the heart of the problem. The rich don't hold this country afloat anymore than anyone else does. You fail to take into account the value of human labor. Humans, and human labor is what keeps this country afloat. I would argue that crime and prisoners would have a better chance of keeping this country afloat than the "rich."

The "rich," predominately speaking do not exert large amounts of human labor, but more often then not act as leaches upon the work generated by the lower classes. Furthermore, this country is financed by the the sheer equity of the American people and the value of their birth certificates (securities) that the corporate U.S. uses as collateral to borrow money. Don't mistake it, we are all debtors, and debtors cannot win no matter how much money -which is just FRN paper or circulating tax-anticipation coupons- you possess.

Creditors possess money, and have the power to control it. Consequently, creditors have the power (not necessarily the authority) to enslave debtors (and do). This is not a problem involving the rich and the poor because no one uses gold and silver (true money) anyway, it's all units or digits in a computer; but the conflict is with creditors and the debtors and a deliberate and persistent breach of constitutional law. Understand this, the notion of a "rich," and "poor" is in your mind if you think like this you are still in the Matrix. If you understand true value you would quickly realize that Christians are the ONLY possessors of true wealth. Happy trails brother.

 

[Sooner28]

While I don't really see the significance of this discussion to a Christian web site, except as one more example of our rejection of the founding principles of this nation (which were Christian by the way), I feel compelled to offer a little lesson in Economics '101', "job creation".

Most people get "rich" by being in business. Whether it's the "mom & pop" grocery, the medium-sized contractor, or the massive conglomerate, wealth is created through the sale of a product or the providing of a service. Businesses generate revenue, which eventually goes into the pockets of the business owners. Out of that revenue, they pay expenses; equipment, supplies, wages and, yes, taxes. What is left over, they get to keep.

Imagine that a small a/c repair company with five technicians is bringing in about $ 450,00 a year. Expenses amount to $ 50,000 a year, wages $ 250,000 ($ 50,000/employee), and taxes $ 50,000. That leaves $100,000 left for the business owner; not exactly millionaire status.

Now imagine that the taxes on this business are doubled; from $ 50,000 to $ 100,000. Where will the money come from? Well, expenses are pretty constant; can't really do much there. And we can't really expect the business owner to cut his income in half; after all, he is the brains (and often brawn) behind the business. What does that leave? Oh, oh, he has to cut an employee.

So the net effect on the economy is $ 50,000 less in circulation; not to mention the loss of whatever taxes that employee was paying. The economy slows, less taxes are raised, and the $ 50,000 in additional taxes paid by the business are ultimately offset by loss of tax revenue in other areas.

No matter what the size of the business, it always works this way. The first casualty of increased taxes is decreased jobs. And that creates a greater demand for government handouts such as unemployment, welfare, etc.. Therefore, government is asked to pay out more with less revenue.

You are absolutely right that government entitlement programs are to blame for the mess this country is in. This is why I fervently believe that we must rid ourselves of the Obama administration and all its vestiges in November, 2012. But raising taxes is never the solution. As the current administration is finding out.

God bless us all.

So countries like Norway, who has the fifth largest economy in the world and has high taxes and strong unions, how do they fit int your ideology? Taxes are just one factor in determining business. There are other expenses, as well as a demand for products. If your business has a high demand, it's going to be profitable. If what you said is true, countries like Norway would be on the bottom of the totem poll, but they are near the top. Can't square that circle.

 

[zeroturbulence]

So countries like Norway, who has the fifth largest economy in the world and has high taxes and strong unions, how do they fit int your ideology? Taxes are just one factor in determining business. There are other expenses, as well as a demand for products. If your business has a high demand, it's going to be profitable. If what you said is true, countries like Norway would be on the bottom of the totem poll, but they are near the top. Can't square that circle.

First of all, Norway is an oil producing country and a big exporter of oil. That right there means they already have plenty of money to begin with. Second, the Norwegian govt. owns a large stake in every company in the country. This means that they take an active role in making sure those companies thrive, unlike here in the US where the govt. couldn't care less about businesses and their owners and don't even think twice about passing legislation that will drive them either out of business or out of the country. You're comparing apples to oranges.

 

[christian_chick50109]

Have you ever thought about some of the retired people who cannot work? They need the social security, medicare and medicaid. I know for sure my grandparents would be on the streets without it. I think they need to make reforms to it, but getting rid of it is stupid.

 

[Sooner28]

First of all, Norway is an oil producing country and a big exporter of oil. That right there means they already have plenty of money to begin with. Second, the Norwegian govt. owns a large stake in every company in the country. This means that they take an active role in making sure those companies thrive, unlike here in the US where the govt. couldn't care less about businesses and their owners and don't even think twice about passing legislation that will drive them either out of business or out of the country. You're comparing apples to oranges.

The government takes an active role in make sure those companies thrive? So more government involvement is the answer? Perhaps the government should get involved in management decisions then? I don't know exactly what you are advocating. You seem to be saying the government should play a much bigger role than it does. So I need you to be more specific was to what you mean.

Norway isn't the only country either. Germany has higher taxes, Britian has higher taxes, Sweden has higher taxes, and Australia. These countries are not economic wastelands. And all have AAA ratings, unlike us.

 

[Sooner28]

Have you ever thought about some of the retired people who cannot work? They need the social security, medicare and medicaid. I know for sure my grandparents would be on the streets without it. I think they need to make reforms to it, but getting rid of it is stupid.

This is what I try to tell people. I completely agree with you. I have an uncle who has a failing heart, failing kidneys, and has one leg. His only income is Social Security and he is on Medicare. So people should actually think about these programs they want to indiscriminately cut...

 

[zeroturbulence]

The government takes an active role in make sure those companies thrive? So more government involvement is the answer? Perhaps the government should get involved in management decisions then? I don't know exactly what you are advocating. You seem to be saying the government should play a much bigger role than it does. So I need you to be more specific was to what you mean.

I mean... you can't compare Norway to the US because in Norway the government actually CARES about the success of the country's businesses.

 

[zeroturbulence]

Norway isn't the only country either. Germany has higher taxes, Britian has higher taxes, Sweden has higher taxes, and Australia. These countries are not economic wastelands. And all have AAA ratings, unlike us.

Have you taken a good look at what they are going through right now? Those countries are on the edge of bankruptcy.

Higher taxes only works when THE GOVERNMENT ACTUALLY CARES about the people. The US government is a giant bureaucracy that only cares about special interests and large corporations.

 

[Sooner28]

Have you taken a good look at what they are going through right now? Those countries are on the edge of bankruptcy.

Higher taxes only works when THE GOVERNMENT ACTUALLY CARES about the people. The US government is a giant bureaucracy that only cares about special interests and large corporations.

Maybe we agree more than I thought! . Those countries generally take a harder stance on the public good. They don't destroy individuals along the way, but it is more community based. Contrasted with the United states, we are an extremely individualistic culture that loves liberty, with threads of community mixed in (with programs like public education, social security, medicare, and medicaid).

 

[zeroturbulence]

Yes, all that is true. Glad we can agree. I was a bit worried there for a minute