What is the point in being a prophet?

[Genez]

@jonchristian.... why did you want to make little of the fact of what they passage reveals?
It actually is an answer for those who are misleading Christians...

Greet Priscilla and Aquila and the household of Onesiphorus. Erastus stayed in Corinth,​

and I left Trophimus sick in Miletus. Do your best to get here before winter. Eubulus​

greets you, and so do Pudens, Linus, Claudia and all the brothers and sisters." 2 Timothy 4:19-21​

The gift was removed from Paul!

The time had come for that gift to end.

 

[Aaron56]

The work 'perfect' appears in the neuter gender!
The body of Christ would have been in the feminine gender! The Bride of Christ.

The collective group of believers may he referred to as the church, the Body, and the Bride depending upon usage.

But I’m fairly certain you’re not hearing what I’m saying anyway…

 

[Aaron56]

​

Greet Priscilla and Aquila and the household of Onesiphorus. Erastus stayed in Corinth,​

and I left Trophimus sick in Miletus. Do your best to get here before winter. Eubulus​

greets you, and so do Pudens, Linus, Claudia and all the brothers and sisters." 2 Timothy 4:19-21​

​

The gift was removed!​

There you go. Distorting while you act like you know what you are talking about.
Its a well known technique of those who promote false teachings...

Paul did not say the water was bad.
If it were? Paul should have recommended the same thing for many others.

What happened to Trophimus? You skipped that one.... Paul had to leave him behind sick. Trophimus almost died.

“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom ​

of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in ​

heaven. ​

​

On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in ​

your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty ​

works in your name?’ And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew ​

you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’ Matthew 7:21-23​

LOOK!

They called Him, Lord, Lord!
They did miracles and works IN HIS NAME!

But? They were never saved.

They walked in a demonic counterfeit of power and were deceived to think it was the Holy Spirit.....
And, they rejected the corrections from Scripture when they came. No excuse will be accepted.

You need a real healing.[/QUOTE

No. They were liars: from the beginning and with the Lord.

 

[jonchristian]

@jonchristian.... why did you want to make little of the fact of what they passage reveals?

What are you referencing? When did I do this?

 

[jonchristian]

So... ..........You're going to miss the Rapture?

Or, is Kamala going to get in?

What are you trying to say?

Matthew 24:21 For then there will be a great tribulation, such as has not occurred since the beginning of the world until now, nor ever will again. 22 And if those days had not been cut short, no life would have been saved; but for the sake of the elect those days will be cut short.

Rev 6:9 When the Lamb broke the fifth seal, I saw underneath the altar the souls of those who had been killed because of the word of God, and because of the testimony which they had maintained...

Rev 13:7 7 It was also given to him to make war with the saints and to overcome them, and authority was given to him over every tribe, people, language, and nation.

Rev 20:4 ...And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony of Jesus and because of the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or his image and had not received the mark on their foreheads and on their hands; and they came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.

Rev 13:16 And he causes all, the small and the great, the rich and the poor, and the free and the slaves, to be given a mark on their right hands or on their foreheads, 17 and he decrees that no one will be able to buy or to sell, except the one who has the mark, either the name of the beast or the number of his name.

Etc, etc, etc.

 

[Genez]

Matthew 24:21 For then there will be a great tribulation, such as has not occurred since the beginning of the world until now, nor ever will again. 22 And if those days had not been cut short, no life would have been saved; but for the sake of the elect those days will be cut short.

Rev 6:9 When the Lamb broke the fifth seal, I saw underneath the altar the souls of those who had been killed because of the word of God, and because of the testimony which they had maintained...

Rev 13:7 7 It was also given to him to make war with the saints and to overcome them, and authority was given to him over every tribe, people, language, and nation.

Rev 20:4 ...And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony of Jesus and because of the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or his image and had not received the mark on their foreheads and on their hands; and they came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.

Rev 13:16 And he causes all, the small and the great, the rich and the poor, and the free and the slaves, to be given a mark on their right hands or on their foreheads, 17 and he decrees that no one will be able to buy or to sell, except the one who has the mark, either the name of the beast or the number of his name.

Etc, etc, etc.

So... it looks like you think the Tribulation can take place while the church remains on the earth.

If you have already been taught about the Rapture? And want to believe the Church is going to go through all the passages you listed?
If so? Then I will just leave you be.

 

[jonchristian]

So... it looks like you think the Tribulation can take place while the church remains on the earth.

If you have already been taught about the Rapture? And want to believe the Church is going to go through all the passages you listed?
If so? Then I will just leave you be.

Pretty sure that's what Jesus is telling us here. I hope He plans to come three times, and the second time is to "rapture" us up. I won't complain and be like, "But, Jesus, you said we would be killed and martyred and go through Great Tribulation." I'll be like, "Thank you!"

 

[Genez]

Pretty sure that's what Jesus is telling us here. I hope He plans to come three times, and the second time is to "rapture" us up. I won't complain and be like, "But, Jesus, you said we would be killed and martyred and go through Great Tribulation." I'll be like, "Thank you!"

Who did Jesus say that to?
Was it the Church?
Or, was it to Jews?

His disciples were Jews.
Jesus taught as a beautifully wise rabbi.

The Church did not begin until later at Pentecost.
Jesus taught was as a rabbi teaching to Jews.
It was Paul who later revealed the mystery (Romans 16:24-26) that had been yet hidden, even while Jesus was still alive.

This is where rightly dividing the Word of God requires developing skill.
It takes time and learning more and more Bible doctrine.
That is why false doctrine should never be tolerated.
False doctrine wants to rob and steal and kill our spiritual life.

grace and peace ...................

 

[ResidentAlien]

It's interesting that in Ephesians, Paul describes the unity of the faith in terms of maturity and not falling for every wind of doctrine that comes along:

"And He Himself gave some to be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, and some pastors and teachers, for the equipping of the saints for the work of ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ, till we all come to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a perfect man, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ; that we should no longer be children, tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the trickery of men, in the cunning craftiness of deceitful plotting, but, speaking the truth in love, may grow up in all things into Him who is the head—Christ." Ephesians 4:11-15​

And it's also interesting that Paul, in 1 Corinthians 13, equates the sign gifts with immaturity:

"When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child; but when I became a man, I put away childish things." 1 Corinthians 13:11​

​

I'm not saying the "perfect" in v. 10 is the completed canon; it's surely not. However, the one way we can be sure of sound doctrine is our Bible. If we rely on prophecies and supernatural knowledge we're asking for trouble. Whose prophecies and whose knowledge are we supposed to believe when you have 1000 prophets all saying something different?

 

[CS1]

It's interesting that in Ephesians, Paul describes the unity of the faith in terms of maturity and not falling for every wind of doctrine that comes along:

"And He Himself gave some to be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, and some pastors and teachers, for the equipping of the saints for the work of ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ, till we all come to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a perfect man, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ; that we should no longer be children, tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the trickery of men, in the cunning craftiness of deceitful plotting, but, speaking the truth in love, may grow up in all things into Him who is the head—Christ." Ephesians 4:11-15​

And it's also interesting that Paul, in 1 Corinthians 13, equates the sign gifts with immaturity:

"When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child; but when I became a man, I put away childish things." 1 Corinthians 13:11​

​

I'm not saying the "perfect" in v. 10 is the completed canon; it's surely not. However, the one way we can be sure of sound doctrine is our Bible. If we rely on prophecies and supernatural knowledge we're asking for trouble. Whose prophecies and whose knowledge are we supposed to believe when you have 1000 prophets all saying something different?

I agree completely. The context of the Gifts of the Holy Spirit seen in 1 Corinthians 12 through 14 doesn't replace the word of God but confirms it.

That is why the prophets are subject to the Prophets 1cor 14:32, which means Judge by the word of God, all that has been said.

That, too, is an error if one thinks Prophesying replaces the word of GOD or is equal to it. it must be confirmed. The maturity of the believer is one who lives the word of GOD and studies it. This was the error of Bill Johnson of Bethel Church.

They were teaching Prophesying replaced or was as authoritative as the Word of God. As a Pentacostel Minister for more than 30 years, that is unbiblical and error.

The gifts of the Holy Spirit must do the following: MUST!:

• line up with the word of GOD
• comfort, edify, or exhort
• must bring glory to God, not man
• prophesying must be confirmed not to replace the word of GOD
• done in order and discipline

When this is done, the gifts of the Holy Spirit are practical. An overzealous believer must be corrected when operating recklessly. FYI, that is what discipleship is for. The idea we abandon the bible ( not that you said that) id foolishness and error.

 

[jonchristian]

You guys really bring the joy of the Lord.

Y'all remind me of the Pharisees and Sadducees denying the Messiah when He was standing right in front of them. They knew the scriptures very well. They lived by them. But their hearts had become so hard, that when Messiah showed up, He wasn't what THEY were expecting, so they denied Him. I expect my rebuke of your attitudes and hardness of heart to go over your heads. Instead of examining yourself, you'll insist that you're right in all your ways. And you're not. I can tell you by having listened to you. When Jesus healed on the Sabbath, they always found it as occasion to call Him a sinner. By your words, I can tell you would have too. He wasn't good enough for them.

Now, attack me just like they did Him. Rage and seethe. Stop your ears from listening so you can be just like they were.

 

[Genez]

The gifts of the Holy Spirit must do the following: MUST!:

• line up with the word of GOD
• comfort, edify, or exhort
• must bring glory to God, not man
• prophesying must be confirmed not to replace the word of GOD
• done in order and discipline

When this is done, the gifts of the Holy Spirit are practical. An overzealous believer must be corrected when operating recklessly. FYI, that is what discipleship is for. The idea we abandon the bible ( not that you said that) id foolishness and error.

We have enough problems today because very few have a clear understanding of God's Word due to poor exegesis and pastors lacking in such discipline. Then along comes an alleged prophet and REINFORCES another false teaching.....

​

​

Do not despise prophecies, but test everything; hold fast what is good. ​

Abstain from every form of evil.​

​

Now may the God of peace himself sanctify you completely, and may your ​

whole spirit and soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our ​

Lord Jesus Christ. 1 Thessalonians 5:20-23​

No... Prophesy was not for simply edification and exhortation. It was to expose what needed to be dealt with so God could work in their hearts to become sanctified and purified.

Do not despise prophecies, but test everything; hold fast what is good. ​

Abstain from every form of evil.​

It was to slap you on the nose and make exposed arrogance wince and hurt.
And, if need be... It was to scare you, to show you how stupid you can be while you were being sure you were right.
Because of that, it caused a resentment in resistant believers, a resentment that made them bond with like-minded souls,
forming into factions, and sometimes to wander off to form into their own denomination where they would be comfortable
within their own skin.

​

​

For first of all, when you come together as a church, I hear that there are divisions among you, ​

and in part I believe it. No doubt there have to be factions among you to show which of you ​

have God’s approval. 1 Corinthians 11:18-19​

Today, that's a good pastor's job… And maybe even a good evangelist visiting an area where ongoing contentions need to be addressed.

Happens here in the forum all the time when someone is sticking with a false concept, and gets needed rebukes.
But, others resenting the rebukes keep giving the one refusing to be corrected thumbs up. Therefore .......

​

For first of all, when you come together as a church, I hear that there are divisions among you, ​

and in part I believe it. No doubt there have to be factions among you to show which of you ​

have God’s approval. 1 Corinthians 11:18-19​

Do not despise prophecies, but test everything; hold fast what is good. ​

Abstain from every form of evil.​

​

​

Then Jesus said to his disciples, “Whoever wants to be my disciple must deny themselves ​

and take up their cross and follow me.​

Those sucked into tongues today are refusing to deny themselves. They will make one excuse after another!

So be it.

Was I just acting like a prophet?

We will all stand alone before the Lord and given a perfect evaluation. Now's the time to clean up your actions.

...... selah

 

[Eli1]

You guys really bring the joy of the Lord.

Y'all remind me of the Pharisees and Sadducees denying the Messiah when He was standing right in front of them. They knew the scriptures very well. They lived by them. But their hearts had become so hard, that when Messiah showed up, He wasn't what THEY were expecting, so they denied Him. I expect my rebuke of your attitudes and hardness of heart to go over your heads. Instead of examining yourself, you'll insist that you're right in all your ways. And you're not. I can tell you by having listened to you. When Jesus healed on the Sabbath, they always found it as occasion to call Him a sinner. By your words, I can tell you would have too. He wasn't good enough for them.

Now, attack me just like they did Him. Rage and seethe. Stop your ears from listening so you can be just like they were.

I'm actually happy that you're actually out there traveling from state to state trying to spread the word. This is what a few missionaries on our church do.
As far as your approach and who you are as a person, i can't say much because i can't pretend to know people over text. Even in person you need at least a week to get to know someone reasonably well.
But based on what you posted here about your traveling and your experience .. God bless you and give you more strength and energy to keep going.

 

[Genez]

The collective group of believers may he referred to as the church, the Body, and the Bride depending upon usage.

But I’m fairly certain you’re not hearing what I’m saying anyway…

If you whisper half of it, and turn your head away, that will become inevitable.

 

[sawdust]

The work 'perfect' appears in the neuter gender!
The body of Christ would have been in the feminine gender! The Bride of Christ.

Do you believe all the gifts have ceased or just some like the "word" gifts? (tongues, knowledge, wisdom, prophecy)

 

[Cameron143]

Do you believe all the gifts have ceased or just some like the "word" gifts? (tongues, knowledge, wisdom, prophecy)

The cessation of wisdom would explain alot here on the site.

 

[sawdust]

The cessation of wisdom would explain alot here on the site.

The gift of wisdom and the wisdom that comes from knowing Christ (who is the Word) are two different things but I'm guessing you were talking a little tongue in cheek, yes?

 

[Genez]

Do you believe all the gifts have ceased or just some like the "word" gifts? (tongues, knowledge, wisdom, prophecy)

If all gifts disappeared? Not good!
No one could be posting anything here!

Which ones were to cease?
The ones likened to:
A spiritual baby bottle, diapers.
And, rattles and toys needed to keep them entertaining themselves while not knowing how to live.

The gifts that ceased were only the ones required for the pioneering days of the church.
They were provided by God to compensate and offer stability for what had not yet been made known to the Church.

The temporary gifts ceased after apostles and prophets like Paul and others, supplied in writing what was needed to
explain to those ignorant of what seemed like the spiritually exotic way.
The way that would release some from living under the law.
Supplying things that held up those who could not yet understand what was going on.

Supplied with what God would later require of the Church to learn, and make a part of their very own lives.

To certain belligerent Jews who opposed the Church (like Paul had), God displayed in power to the unbelieving Jews
the counter of tongues speaking in foreign languages. Languages they understood as a second language, to stun and baffle them.

Brothers, do not be children in your thinking. ​

Be infants in evil, but in your thinking be mature. ​

​

In the Law it is written, ​

​

“By people of strange tongues and by the lips of foreigners will I speak ​

to this people (the Jews), and even then they will not listen to me, says ​

the Lord.” Thus tongues are a sign not for believers but for unbelievers.​

1 Corinthians 14:20-22a​

Tongues was a sign to unbelievers, like the plagues of Egypt were a sign to Pharaoh,
whom God knew would not believe.

For those hold the banner high for tongues, the stimulation that alleged tongues provides
for them emotionally highly addictive.
These people are ruled by their emotions.....

Sorry to say.
That is my report to home base.

 

[Genez]

The cessation of wisdom would explain alot here on the site.

There is a difference between gaining knowledge today, as we are supposed to, and what was called the gift of knowledge.
The gift of knowledge imparted knowledge that had not yet been taught.

Back then the gift of knowledge would have appeared like what we now call being psychic, but the source
would have come from the Spirit.

 

[Cameron143]

There is a difference between gaining knowledge today, as we are supposed to, and what was called the gift of knowledge.
The gift of knowledge imparted knowledge that had not yet been taught.

Back then the gift of knowledge would have appeared like what we now call being psychic, but the source
would have come from the Spirit.

Sometimes a joke is just a joke.