What was abolished?

[john832]

Is that what I said?

Please explain what you mean by no curse attached to Christ's Law. What happens if one breaks Christ's Law?

 

[john832]

By the deeds of the law no flesh shall be justified in his sight.

Saying the Law is still valid and that one must obey says that one is justified by it how?

 

[john832]

if we walk in the spirit we will not transgress the law but full fill it but the irit will break the yolk as I have experienced it because of my own I could not have any breakthrough but by His spirit His whole spirit meaning His holy ghost power and Word which is also spirit a full balanced gospel only by His power is it possible to obey God

So you NEVER transgress?

You, my friend, have a credibility problem...

1Jn 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
1Jn 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
1Jn 1:10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

 

[Word_Swordsman]

=Hizikyah;1866188]You prove my prior point.

"as touching the law, a Pharisee;"

dung

He counted being a Pharisee not an honor, but a shame, of no value compared to High Priest Jesus, and his own position in the Kingdom from Heaven.

You also isolate to error for he also says:

Romans 3:28, "For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the Law."

Romans 3:31, "Are we then doing away with the Law through the faith? By no means! Rather, we establish the Law!"

Let's look at that error. It's a matter of taking verses out of context to create an unsupported doctrine. Here's enough to get started, with an asterisk at the ones you plucked out of context:

Romans 3:23-31 (KJV)
[SUP]23 [/SUP] For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;
[SUP]24 [/SUP] Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
[SUP]25 [/SUP] Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;
[SUP]26 [/SUP] To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.
[SUP]27 [/SUP] Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith.
[SUP]28 [/SUP] Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.
[SUP]*29 [/SUP] Is he the God of the Jews only? is he not also of the Gentiles? Yes, of the Gentiles also:
[SUP]30 [/SUP] Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith.
[SUP]*31 [/SUP] Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.
Romans 6:1-2, "What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin that grace may abound? By no means!How can we who died to sin still live in it?"

Christians are justified freely (made to be righteous) through the redemption (deliverance) that came "in Christ", by believing on Jesus. The basis of that deliverance is not based upon obedience to the law of Moses, but upon the blood of Christ.

God justified us by faith, not our works, not by deeds of the law.

Under the old law a sinner could count of having his past sins covered up, then go on sinning another year. The sinner then continually sinned, living in sin except that one day a year at the Temple.

God our Justifier is the only One that can justify Jew and Gentile alike, without the old law, and break the cycle of abiding in sin continually.

Do we make the law useless, of no value, no effect? No. Sinners, the lost, the unbelievers live under the law if they abide in it. Paul explains elsewhere that the law was our schoolmaster unto going on to a higher level, Christ. I remember rehearsing the add/subtract, multiply flash cards, and appreciate that gradeschool training. But I went on to college and a career, and have had no further use for those flash cards, which I have packed with memorabilia from my childhood. It's still there. All of it was quite useful back then.

It is best explained here: Ephesians 2:14-16 (KJV)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;
[SUP]15 [/SUP] Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
[SUP]16 [/SUP] And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:

Today there is no partition separating Jew and Gentile, no earthly priesthood, no sacrifices, no altar, no Ark, no animal blood being sprinkled, no dogmatic commands peculiar to Jews. He reconciled us by the cross, not by mixing law and grace. At the very least Christ has abolished, done away with the law contained in ordinances, (however many they are) to make the new body of Christ.

The word translated abolished is also used "done away". It's like my favorite leather coat with wool lining, and some precious membership patches, and signatures of friends when I retired. It's "full of memories" and history to me. It began to rot, super-glued scratches becoming tears, becaming too troublesome to keep using it, offending my wife. She bought a new one for me. I won't wear the old one again, but I had it 51 years and don't wish to send it to the landfill for annihilation. It is packed with the memorabilia. That similar to the concept of "abolishment" or "doing away with" something precious, but replaced by something much better.

So all that Christ did at the cross and afterwards "establishes" (stands) the law by fulfilling it's purpose. It made it appropriate for Jesus to die bearing the sins of the world. That law was cited by the priesthood to convict him in his innocense. Insteadd of God punishing those in authority, Jesus ratified the New Covenant of grace through faith in his own blood to make propitiation for us. That is, Jesus satisfied the heavenly Mercy Seat such that God could by his grace and love for us have mercy on sinners who believe and repent.

That is what the law could not do once and for all. The New Covenant is better, a new one like a new coat, not an old patched, stitched up one. Romans 3 doesn't stop there, but the lesson continues into chapter 4 without a break, continuing the context of the subject.

Now I hope some who have followed this thread can see how vital it is to stay in context with the passage, the chapter, not ending doctrines at the end of a chapter (chapter divisions were not in the original manuscriptes), and the book, and the testament the book is in. Then it is safe to refer to the other testament if not causing a contradiction of doctrines. God is not divided. His word is to be handled correctly (rightly divided).

I'll leave the rest of the out-of-context doctrinal points for later, or for someone else to easily use scripture to explain their meanings. Or maybe Mr. Hizikyah would clear it up to show himself a workman that needeth not be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. I'll wait to see your reply to this much before going on.

......
........
..........

These are all terribly out of context, cherry picked, meanings distorted to create a new doctrine. All must be fixed.

1 Corinthians 7:19, "For neither circumcision counts for anything nor uncircumcision, but keeping the commandments of God?"

Romans 6:1-2, "What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin that grace may abound? By no means! How can we who died to sin still live in it?"

Romans 7:7, Shall we therefore say that the Law is sin? No! By no means! But to the contrary, I did not know sin; transgression of the Law, except through the Law, for I did not know lust, unless the Law had said: Do not covet."

Acts 24:14, "But I confess this to you, that after the way which they call heresy--so I worship the Father of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the Law and in the Prophets."

Romans 7:25, "Thanks be to Yahweh, I have deliverance through Yahshua Messiah our King! So then, with this same mind, I myself serve the Law of Yahweh, while in the flesh that is yet subject to the law of sin."

Acts 21:24, "Take them, and be purified with them, and pay their expenses so that they may shave their heads. Then everyone will know that those things they were informed about you (forsaking the Law), were lies, and that you, yourself, walk orderly, and keep the Law."

Romans 7:12, "Therefore the Law is holy, and the commandments are holy, and just, and righteous."

Ephesians 6:2-3, "Honor your father and mother; which is the first commandment with a promise: That it may be well with you, and you may live long on the earth."


Galatians 3:13,(KJV) "Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the Law, being made a curse for us, for it is written, Cursed is everyone who hangeth on a tree."

2 peter 3:15-17, "And count the patience of our Lord as salvation, just as our beloved brother Paul also wrote to you according to the wisdom given him, as he does in all his letters when he speaks in them of these matters. There are some things in them that are hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other Scriptures. You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, take care that you are not carried away with the error of lawless people and lose your own stability."

 

[Hizikyah]

[/FONT][/SIZE][/COLOR]

He counted being a Pharisee not an honor, but a shame, of no value compared to High Priest Jesus, and his own position in the Kingdom from Heaven.

I agree that's why I said;

You prove my prior point.

"as touching the law, a Pharisee;"

dung

Let's look at that error. It's a matter of taking verses out of context to create an unsupported doctrine. Here's enough to get started, with an asterisk at the ones you plucked out of context:

Romans 3:23-31 (KJV)
[SUP]23 [/SUP] For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;
[SUP]24 [/SUP] Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
[SUP]25 [/SUP] Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;
[SUP]26 [/SUP] To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.
[SUP]27 [/SUP] Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith.
[SUP]28 [/SUP] Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.
[SUP]*29 [/SUP] Is he the God of the Jews only? is he not also of the Gentiles? Yes, of the Gentiles also:
[SUP]30 [/SUP] Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith.
[SUP]*31 [/SUP] Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.
Romans 6:1-2, "What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin that grace may abound? By no means!How can we who died to sin still live in it?"

Christians are justified freely (made to be righteous) through the redemption (deliverance) that came "in Christ", by believing on Jesus. The basis of that deliverance is not based upon obedience to the law of Moses, but upon the blood of Christ.

God justified us by faith, not our works, not by deeds of the law.

Under the old law a sinner could count of having his past sins covered up, then go on sinning another year. The sinner then continually sinned, living in sin except that one day a year at the Temple.

God our Justifier is the only One that can justify Jew and Gentile alike, without the old law, and break the cycle of abiding in sin continually.

And these verses were talken out of context how? You quoted basically the same thing but highlighted, "[SUP]27 [/SUP] Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith. " Where is my "boasting" doesnt exist, I don't boast about anything my faith or my woks, the only thing I can boast about is Him... If you can find a single time/post where I have ever bosted about ANYTHING of mine, I will repent. But I d not blieve that is possible because I do not boast, aslo, saying we should obey is not boasting, the day when someone says, "hey lets be obedient" and other believers are says, "Boasting!" "Justified by wiroks" is an odd day....

Let's look at that error. It's a matter of taking verses out of context to create an unsupported doctrine. Here's enough to get started, with an asterisk at the ones you plucked out of context:

[SUP]*29 [/SUP] Is he the God of the Jews only? is he not also of the Gentiles? Yes, of the Gentiles also:
[SUP]30 [/SUP] Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith.
[SUP]*31 [/SUP] Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

So out of context how?

So you think only hebrews should listen and gentiles get to play with satan? Or what are you trying to say? (BTW im a grafted in ex-gentile)

Romans 3:28, "For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the Law."

Romans 3:31, "Are we then doing away with the Law through the faith? By no means! Rather, we establish the Law!"

Romans 6:1-2, "What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin that grace may abound? By no means!How can we who died to sin still live in it?"

Do we make the law useless, of no value, no effect? No. Sinners, the lost, the unbelievers live under the law if they abide in it. Paul explains elsewhere that the law was our schoolmaster unto going on to a higher level, Christ. I remember rehearsing the add/subtract, multiply flash cards, and appreciate that gradeschool training. But I went on to college and a career, and have had no further use for those flash cards, which I have packed with memorabilia from my childhood. It's still there. All of it was quite useful back then.

It is best explained here:

Ephesians 2:14-16 (KJV)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;
[SUP]15 [/SUP] Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
[SUP]16 [/SUP] And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:

Today there is no partition separating Jew and Gentile, no earthly priesthood, no sacrifices, no altar, no Ark, no animal blood being sprinkled, no dogmatic commands peculiar to Jews. He reconciled us by the cross, not by mixing law and grace. At the very least Christ has abolished, done away with the law contained in ordinances, (however many they are) to make the new body of Christ.

The word translated abolished is also used "done away". It's like my favorite leather coat with wool lining, and some precious membership patches, and signatures of friends when I retired. It's "full of memories" and history to me. It began to rot, super-glued scratches becoming tears, becaming too troublesome to keep using it, offending my wife. She bought a new one for me. I won't wear the old one again, but I had it 51 years and don't wish to send it to the landfill for annihilation. It is packed with the memorabilia. That similar to the concept of "abolishment" or "doing away with" something precious, but replaced by something much better.

So all that Christ did at the cross and afterwards "establishes" (stands) the law by fulfilling it's purpose. It made it appropriate for Jesus to die bearing the sins of the world. That law was cited by the priesthood to convict him in his innocense. Insteadd of God punishing those in authority, Jesus ratified the New Covenant of grace through faith in his own blood to make propitiation for us. That is, Jesus satisfied the heavenly Mercy Seat such that God could by his grace and love for us have mercy on sinners who believe and repent.

That is what the law could not do once and for all. The New Covenant is better, a new one like a new coat, not an old patched, stitched up one. Romans 3 doesn't stop there, but the lesson continues into chapter 4 without a break, continuing the context of the subject.

Now I hope some who have followed this thread can see how vital it is to stay in context with the passage, the chapter, not ending doctrines at the end of a chapter (chapter divisions were not in the original manuscriptes), and the book, and the testament the book is in. Then it is safe to refer to the other testament if not causing a contradiction of doctrines. God is not divided. His word is to be handled correctly (rightly divided).

I'll leave the rest of the out-of-context doctrinal points for later, or for someone else to easily use scripture to explain their meanings. Or maybe Mr. Hizikyah would clear it up to show himself a workman that needeth not be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. I'll wait to see your reply to this much before going on.

......
........
..........

These are all terribly out of context, cherry picked, meanings distorted to create a new doctrine. All must be fixed.

Heaping a whole bunce of personal accusations without illustrating how is emply in my eyes, others may read this and buy your it, but if you can't illustrate with my quotes where I did what you accuse me of, to me it's nothing but "hot air."

Do we make the law useless, of no value, no effect? No. Sinners, the lost, the unbelievers live under the law if they abide in it.

For the Law was laid down for the righteous not the sinner... Who's not a sinner here? If none sinned there would be no need for a Law, guess what people do, thats why it is there to tell us what is wrong, I have yet to meet someone who has never read the book yet knows what is in it....

Paul explains elsewhere that the law was our schoolmaster unto going on to a higher level, Christ.

Then listen to the Messiah; and please show me one single time He says not to follow the Law or that the Law is gone...

Matthew 5:17-19English Standard Version (ESV)

[SUP]17 [/SUP]“Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. [SUP]18 [/SUP]For truly, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished. [SUP]19 [/SUP]Therefore whoever relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever does them and teaches them will be called great in the kingdom of heaven.


Revelation 21:1-2English Standard Version (ESV)

21 Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and the sea was no more. [SUP]2 [/SUP]And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.

1 Corinthians 7:19, "For neither circumcision counts for anything nor uncircumcision, but keeping the commandments of God?"

Romans 6:1-2, "What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin that grace may abound? By no means! How can we who died to sin still live in it?"

Romans 7:7, Shall we therefore say that the Law is sin? No! By no means! But to the contrary, I did not know sin; transgression of the Law, except through the Law, for I did not know lust, unless the Law had said: Do not covet."

Acts 24:14, "But I confess this to you, that after the way which they call heresy--so I worship the Father of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the Law and in the Prophets."

Romans 7:25, "Thanks be to Yahweh, I have deliverance through Yahshua Messiah our King! So then, with this same mind, I myself serve the Law of Yahweh, while in the flesh that is yet subject to the law of sin."

Acts 21:24, "Take them, and be purified with them, and pay their expenses so that they may shave their heads. Then everyone will know that those things they were informed about you (forsaking the Law), were lies, and that you, yourself, walk orderly, and keep the Law."

Romans 7:12, "Therefore the Law is holy, and the commandments are holy, and just, and righteous."

Ephesians 6:2-3, "Honor your father and mother; which is the first commandment with a promise: That it may be well with you, and you may live long on the earth."


Galatians 3:13,(KJV) "Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the Law, being made a curse for us, for it is written, Cursed is everyone who hangeth on a tree."

2 peter 3:15-17, "And count the patience of our Lord as salvation, just as our beloved brother Paul also wrote to you according to the wisdom given him, as he does in all his letters when he speaks in them of these matters. There are some things in them that are hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other Scriptures. You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, take care that you are not carried away with the error of lawless people and lose your own stability."

 

[Elin]

Please explain what you mean by
no curse attached to Christ's Law. What happens if one breaks Christ's Law?

The "curse of the law" (Dt 27:26; Gal 3:10, 13) is God's wrath (Ro 4:15) on those
who do not keep it perfectly, hence "all who rely on observing the law are under a curse (Gal 3:10),
from which Christ redeemed those who believe in him (Gal 3:13).

In the NT, there is no curse (condemnation) for failure to keep Christ's law (Mt 22:37-39) perfectly.
In the NT, there is only one sin that condemns--unbelief (Jn 3:36).
Unbelief leaves one in the sin of Adam in which he was born (God's wrath remains on him--Jn 3:36).

So the unbeliever is condemned, whether he breaks Christ's law or not.
While the believer is forgiven of his sin when he confesses and repents of it.

 

[Hizikyah]

"all who rely on observing the law are under a curse (Gal 3:10),
from which Christ redeemed those who believe in him (Gal 3:13).

Galatians 3:10
Parallel Verses
New International Version
For all who rely on the works of the law are under a curse, as it is written: "Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law."

New Living Translation
But those who depend on the law to make them right with God are under his curse, for the Scriptures say, "Cursed is everyone who does not observe and obey all the commands that are written in God's Book of the Law."

English Standard Version
For all who rely on works of the law are under a curse; for it is written, “Cursed be everyone who does not abide by all things written in the Book of the Law, and do them.”


Galatians 3:13
Parallel Verses
New International Version
Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us, for it is written: "Cursed is everyone who is hung on a pole."

New Living Translation
But Christ has rescued us from the curse pronounced by the law. When he was hung on the cross, he took upon himself the curse for our wrongdoing. For it is written in the Scriptures, "Cursed is everyone who is hung on a tree."

English Standard Version
Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us—for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who is hanged on a tree”—

New American Standard Bible
Christ redeemed us from the curse of the Law, having become a curse for us-- for it is written, "CURSED IS EVERYONE WHO HANGS ON A TREE "--

King James Bible
Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

Those who depend on the Law to make them righteous are in error not those who take His Instruction as their life guide....

Mattithyah 22:37-40, "Yahshua said to him: You must love Yahweh your Father with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your might. This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets."

Romans 13:9-14, "For the commandments: You shall not commit adultery, You shall not murder, You shall not steal, You shall not bring false testimony, You shall not covet, and all other commandments are summed up in these Laws; namely: You must love your neighbor as yourself. Love does no wrong to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfilling of the Law. Put On Yahshua Messiah And do this, understanding the present time. The hour has come for you to wake up from your slumber, because our salvation is nearer now than when we first believed. The night is nearly over; the day is almost here. So let us throw off the works of darkness, and put on the armor of light. Let us walk properly, as in the daytime; not in revelry and drunkenness, not in sexual impurity and debauchery, not in strife and envy. Rather, humble yourself to our Ruler, Yahshua Messiah, and put a stop to providing for the lusts of the flesh."

1 Yahchanan (John) 3:4, "Whosoever commits sin transgresses also the Law: for sin is the transgression of the Law."

1 Yahchanan (John) 5:2-3, "By this we know that we love the children of Yahweh: When we love Yahweh by keeping His Laws. For this is the love of Yahweh: That we keep His Law, and His Law is not grievous."

1 John 5:2-3 (ESV), By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and obey his commandments. For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments. And his commandments are not burdensome. "

Who could call "do not kill" "do not steal" "honor you mother and father" "no idols" "do not take the name of YHWH in vain" a burden?

 

[Hizikyah]

So the unbeliever is condemned, whether he breaks Christ's law or not.
While the believer is forgiven of his sin when he confesses and repents of it.

I agree here 100%


1 John 3:4, "Whosoever commits sin transgresses also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law."

1 John 1:8-10, "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us."

Rom 7:7, What? Can anyone therefore say that the Law is sin? No! By no means! But to the contrary, I did not know sin; transgression of the Law, except through the Law, for I did not know lust, unless the Law had said: Do not covet. 12, Therefore the Law is holy, and the commandments are holy, and just, and righteous.13 Did that which is righteous, then, become death to me? By no means! But in order that sin might be recognized as sin, it produced death in me through that which was righteous, so that through the commandments, sin might become utterly sinful."

1 John 3:4, "Whosoever commits sin transgresses also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law."

James 1:22-25, " But prove yourselves doers of the word, and not merely hearers who delude themselves. For if anyone is a hearer of the word and not a doer, he is like a man who looks at his natural face in a mirror; for once he has looked at himself and gone away, he has immediately forgotten what kind of person he was. But one who looks intently at the perfect law, the law of liberty, and abides by it, not having become a forgetful hearer but an effectual doer, this man will be blessed in what he does."

1 Yahchanan 2:1-2, "My little children, I write these things to you, so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father: Yahshua Messiah, the Righteous; and He is the sacrifice of atonement for our sins, and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world."

Yahdah 1:4, "For there are certain men who have secretly crept in, who were before of old ordained for this condemnation, unholy men, who turn the undeserved pardon of our One Supreme Savior Yahweh into licentiousness, and deny Yahshua our Messiah."

Acts 26:20 English Standard Version
"but declared first to those in Damascus, then in Jerusalem and throughout all the region of Judea, and also to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God (YHWH), performing deeds in keeping with their repentance."

Acts 26:20 King James Bible
"But shewed first unto them of Damascus, and at Jerusalem, and throughout all the coasts of Judaea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God (YHWH), and do works meet for repentance."

Acts 3:19 Parallel Verses
"Repent therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out; that times ofrefreshing may come from the presence of Yahweh."

New International Version
Repent, then, and turn to God, so that your sins may be wiped out, that times of refreshing may come from the Lord,

New Living Translation
Now repent of your sins and turn to God, so that your sins may be wiped away.

English Standard Version
Repent therefore, and turn back, that your sins may be blotted out,

New American Standard Bible
"Therefore repent and return, so that your sins may be wiped away, in order that times of refreshing may come from the presence of the Lord;

King James Bible
Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;

Ezekiel 14:6, "Therefore, say to the house of Israyl; This is what Father Yahweh says: Repent, and turn from your idols! Turn your faces away from all your abominations!"

Ezekiel 18:30, "Therefore, I will judge you, O house of Israyl, everyone according to his own ways, says Father Yahweh. Repent, and turn from all your transgressions, so iniquity will not be your ruin."

John (NLT) 5:28-30, "Don’t be so surprised! Indeed, the time is coming when all the dead in their graves will hear the voice of God’s Son, and they will rise again. Those who have done good will rise to experience eternal life, and those who have continued in evil will rise to experience judgment. I can do nothing on my own. I judge as God tells me. Therefore, my judgment is just, because I carry out the will of the one who sent me, not my own will."

Ezekiel 33:11, "Say to them; As surely as I live, says Father Yahweh: I take no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but rather that the wicked turn from his way, and live! Turn, turn from your evil ways! For why will you die, O house of Israyl?"

Matthew 12:41, "The men of Nineveh shall rise in judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it: because they repented at the preaching of Jonas; and, behold, a greater than Jonas is here."

Jonah 3:5-10, "So the people of Nineveh believed God, and proclaimed a fast, and put on sackcloth, from the greatest of them even to the least of them. For word came unto the king of Nineveh, and he arose from his throne, and he laid his robe from him, and covered him with sackcloth, and sat in ashes. And he caused it to be proclaimed and published through Nineveh by the decree of the king and his nobles, saying, Let neither man nor beast, herd nor flock, taste any thing: let them not feed, nor drink water: But let man and beast be covered with sackcloth, and cry mightily unto God: yea, let them turn every one from his evil way, and from the violence that is in their hands. Who can tell if God will turn and repent, and turn away from his fierce anger, that we perish not? And God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way; and God repented of the evil, that he had said that he would do unto them; and he did it not."

1 Corinthians 6:9-11, "Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God. And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God."

It is Scripture.

 

[Elin]

So the unbeliever is condemned, whether he breaks Christ's law or not.

While the believer is forgiven of his sin when he confesses and repents of it.

I agree here 100%

That's good to hear!

 

[seed_time_harvest]

John (Yahchanan 15:4-6, "Abide in Me, and I in you. Just as the branch cannot produce fruit by itself, unless it abides in the vine, neither can you, unless you abide in Me. I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, produces much fruit; but without Me, you can do nothing. If anyone does not abide in Me, he is thrown away like a branch, and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned."


Psalm 89:26-37, "...My covenant will stand fast with Him...My covenant I will not break, nor will I change what that has gone out of My lips. Once for all, I have vowed by My holiness--I cannot lie..."

I know its the common accusation that any who say we should obey Him are "justified by works", yet my sig says the reality of my belief.

Can a sheep be of the flock if he does not follow the Shepard?


John 12:48, "He who rejects Me, and does not follow My words has One Who judges him. The word that I have spoken, the same will be used to judge him in the last day."

1 Yahchanan 2:1-2, "My little children, I write these things to you, so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father: Yahshua Messiah, the Righteous; and He is the sacrifice of atonement for our sins, and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world."

Jude 1:4, "For there are certain men who have secretly crept in, who were before of old ordained for this condemnation, unholy men, who turn the undeserved pardon of our One Supreme Savior Yahweh into licentiousness, and deny Yahshua our Messiah"

1 Yahchanan 5:2-3, "By this we know that we love the children of Yahweh: When we love Yahweh by keeping His Laws. For this is the love of Yahweh: That we keep His Law, and His Law is not grievous."

entole = Commandment/Law

1 John 1:8-10, "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us."

2 Timothy 4:3-4, “For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but after their own lusts they will heap to themselves teachers, who will tickle their ears, and they will turn away their ears from the truth, and be turned to fables.”

By the deeds of the law no flesh shall be justified in his sight.

I agree with that, but how did any of those verse or anything I said warrant that?





my sig;

Mt 5:18, "For truly I say to you; Unless heaven and earth passes away, one yodh--the smallest of the letters--will in no way pass from the Law, until all things are perfected."

Rev 21:1-2, "And I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away."

Rom3:28, "For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the Law."

31"Are we then doing away with the Law through the faith? By no means! Rather, we establish the Law!",

​

Hello Hizikyah

I was really trying to say that the law could only be fulfilled by JESUS and without faith in JESUS who is the only one who could fulfill the law then we would not have hope(no man)All those scriptures seem to be talking about JESUS right?
are you talking about the two laws or ten? because if you are talking about the ten then you would get no help

 

[Apostol2013]

So you NEVER transgress?

You, my friend, have a credibility problem...

1Jn 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
1Jn 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
1Jn 1:10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

If you read later on in that book chapter three it states that the sons of God do not sin and those who sin is of the devil and in this are they manifest what john says if we live in the spirit we have no sin but in the growth process we are covered unless one chooses to openly rebel aggaist God in this world the devil will cause you to rebel against God only to purposely bring His wrath upon the eath

 

[Hizikyah]

Hello Hizikyah

I was really trying to say that the law could only be fulfilled by JESUS and without faith in JESUS who is the only one who could fulfill the law then we would not have hope(no man)All those scriptures seem to be talking about JESUS right?
are you talking about the two laws or ten? because if you are talking about the ten then you would get no help

hello Mr. Word Swordsman

I have to restate;

Romans 3:28, "For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the Law."

Romans 3:31, "Are we then doing away with the Law through the faith? By no means! Rather, we establish the Law!"

Romans 6:1-2, "What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin that grace may abound? By no means!How can we who died to sin still live in it?"

Got a Scripture for this part

are you talking about the two laws or ten? because if you are talking about the ten then you would get no help

Or did you completely make that up? Because to me it seems to go directly against Scripture;

Ezekiyl 36:26-28, "A new heart; mind, will I also give you, and a new spirit will I put within you; and I will take away the heart of stone out of your flesh, and will give you a heart of flesh. I will put My Spirit within you, and cause you to walk in My statutes, and you will keep My judgments, and do them. And you will dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers; and you will be My people, and I will be your Father."

Yeremyah 31:33, "For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israyl: After those days, says Yahweh: I will put My Law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts, and I will be their Strength, and they will be My people."

"Law" is word #H8451 - Torah: direction, instruction, law Original Word: תּוֹרָה Part of Speech: Noun Feminine Transliteration: torah

Hebrews 10:16, "This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, says Yahweh: I will put My Law into their hearts, and in their minds I will write them."

 

[Messenger_of_Fire]

To love your neighbor as yourself is the fulfillment of all of whatever "law" may be.

Can a "Christian" love a "Muslim" as himself? Yes. Law fulfilled.

 

[Hizikyah]

To love your neighbor as yourself is the fulfillment of all of whatever "law" may be.

Can a "Christian" love a "Muslim" as himself? Yes. Law fulfilled.

What is love though, how do we love?

DO I just say, "I love you" and that is? Im perfect?

Not implying you are saying this rather I seriously say, how do we love according to what He calls love?

 

[Ukorin]

The Law is good and is useful, like all the Scriptures.
The sacrificial system is abolished, and the government is exiled, but the Spirit of it all remains, and it's instructions are never something to have contempt for.

The Bible does not distinguish between ceremonial laws and moral laws,
however, the Spirit gives us understanding of the commands.

Full rejection is disbelief. Making excuses is living in the flesh.
When we discuss the Word, we should not be doing either of these.

We should also not be physically minded when reading the Word, which is where the literal hermeneutic nessesitates God changing His ways, in order to rationalize the OT commands.

Therefore, we do not fulfill the requirements of the Letter in order to follow the Spirit, but follow the Spirit in order to fulfill the requirements of the Letter.

Remember that salvation was always by faith, which was always counted as righteousness.

 

[Hizikyah]

The Law is good and is useful, like all the Scriptures.
The sacrificial system is abolished, and the government is exiled, but the Spirit of it all remains, and it's instructions are never something to have contempt for.

The Bible does not distinguish between ceremonial laws and moral laws,
however, the Spirit gives us understanding of the commands.

Full rejection is disbelief. Making excuses is living in the flesh.
When we discuss the Word, we should not be doing either of these.

We should also not be physically minded when reading the Word, which is where the literal hermeneutic nessesitates God changing His ways, in order to rationalize the OT commands.

Therefore, we do not fulfill the requirements of the Letter in order to follow the Spirit, but follow the Spirit in order to fulfill the requirements of the Letter.

Remember that salvation was always by faith, which was always counted as righteousness.

"the truth will set you free"

John 8:31-38, "So Yahshua/Jesus said to the Jews who had believed him, “If you abide in my word, you are truly my disciples, and you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.” They answered him, “We are offspring of Abraham and have never been enslaved to anyone. How is it that you say, ‘You will become free’?” Yahshua/Jesus answered them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, everyone who practices sin is a slave to sin. The slave does not remain in the house forever; the son remains forever. So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed. I know that you are offspring of Abraham; yet you seek to kill me because my word finds no place in you. I speak of what I have seen with my Father, and you do what you have heard from your father.”

Romans 9:6-8, "However, it is not as though Yahweh's plan had failed. For it is not everyone who is a descendant of Israyl who belongs to Israyl. Nor, just because they are his descendants, are they all Abraham's children; but: In Isaac will your seed be called. That is, it is not those who are the children of the flesh who are Yahweh's children; but it is the children of the promise who are regarded as Abraham's seed."

Psalm 105:6-9, "O seed of Abraham His servant, You children of Yaaqob, His chosen ones! He is Yahweh our Father! His judgments are in all the earth. He has remembered His covenant forever, the Law He commanded for a thousand generations; Which He made; ratified, established, with Abraham, and vowed by His oath to Isaac. He confirmed it; let it stand, to Yaaqob for a Law, and to Israyl for an everlasting covenant."

 

[Ukorin]

To love your neighbor as yourself is the fulfillment of all of whatever "law" may be.

Can a "Christian" love a "Muslim" as himself? Yes. Law fulfilled.

No. You must ALSO love the Lord your God.
Loving others is the 2nd commandment.
All the Law and Prophets hang upon these two commands.

If you love the Lord, you will keep His commandments.

And here is the circle: what are the commandments we must keep?

Love the Lord your God, and love your neighbor as yourself.

 

[Ukorin]

"the truth will set you free"

John 8:31-38, "So Yahshua/Jesus said to the Jews who had believed him, “If you abide in my word, you are truly my disciples, and you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.” They answered him, “We are offspring of Abraham and have never been enslaved to anyone. How is it that you say, ‘You will become free’?” Yahshua/Jesus answered them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, everyone who practices sin is a slave to sin. The slave does not remain in the house forever; the son remains forever. So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed. I know that you are offspring of Abraham; yet you seek to kill me because my word finds no place in you. I speak of what I have seen with my Father, and you do what you have heard from your father.”

Romans 9:6-8, "However, it is not as though Yahweh's plan had failed. For it is not everyone who is a descendant of Israyl who belongs to Israyl. Nor, just because they are his descendants, are they all Abraham's children; but: In Isaac will your seed be called. That is, it is not those who are the children of the flesh who are Yahweh's children; but it is the children of the promise who are regarded as Abraham's seed."

Psalm 105:6-9, "O seed of Abraham His servant, You children of Yaaqob, His chosen ones! He is Yahweh our Father! His judgments are in all the earth. He has remembered His covenant forever, the Law He commanded for a thousand generations; Which He made; ratified, established, with Abraham, and vowed by His oath to Isaac. He confirmed it; let it stand, to Yaaqob for a Law, and to Israyl for an everlasting covenant."

Amen! The New Covenant is not simply a revised version of the Old, or a Covenant to cancel out the Old,
but a revealing of what was already in place!

 

[Messenger_of_Fire]

What is love though, how do we love?

DO I just say, "I love you" and that is? Im perfect?

Not implying you are saying this rather I seriously say, how do we love according to what He calls love?

Are you "married" my brother? You define love the same way you would love your spouse, or your child. Even YOURSELF. Do you make mistakes? If so, do you see God not forgiving you? See that in the man you consider even your enemy. It's ok to disagree. Even Paul said that tongues will cease and prophecies will fail. What is important is what we learn, even from our mistakes.

If you were in the midst of a massive heart attack, would you care if the man saving your life is a "Muslim" or any other name we call men?

"If you love me, keep my commandments." His commandments are to love one another as He loved us! Jesus died by loving us while we were still sinners! We MUST do the same.

 

[Hizikyah]

What is love though, how do we love?

DO I just say, "I love you" and that is? Im perfect?

Not implying you are saying this rather I seriously say, how do we love according to what He calls love?

Amen! The New Covenant is not simply a revised version of the Old, or a Covenant to cancel out the Old,
but a revealing of what was already in place!

"the truth will set you free"

SO few people understand this, I am proud to call you brother!

Hebrews 7:11-12, "Now if perfection had been attainable through the Levitical priesthood (for under it the people received the law), what further need would there have been for another priest to arise after the order of Melchizedek, rather than one named after the order of Aaron? For the priesthood being changed(transformation), there is made of necessity a change(transformation) also of the law."

3331 - metathesis - transformation

Psalm 89:26-37, "He will call out to Me; You are my Father, O Yahweh! You are the Rock of my salvation! And I will make Him My firstborn, higher than the kings of the earth. My mercy I will keep for Him forever and My covenant will stand fast with Him. And I will establish his Seed forever, and his throne will be as the days of heaven. Should his children forsake My Law, and refuse to walk in My judgments; Should they profane My statutes, and fail to keep My commandments; Then I will punish their transgression with the rod, and their iniquity with lashes from the whip. Nevertheless, My lovingkindness I will not utterly withdraw from him, nor will I ever betray My faithfulness. My covenant I will not break, nor will I change what that has gone out of My lips. Once for all, I have vowed by My holiness--I cannot lie, and I say to David: His Seed will endure forever, and his throne will endure before Me like the sun. His throne will be established forever like the moon: the faithful witness in the sky."

Isayah 59:15-21, "Yes, truth is suppressed; and he who departs from evil is accounted as mad. Yahweh saw this, and it displeased Him that there was no justice. But He saw no man, and wondered that there was no intercessor. Therefore His own arm brought salvation for Him, and His own righteousness, it sustained Him. For He put on righteousness as a breastplate, with a helmet of salvation on His head; He put on the garments of vengeance for clothing, and He wrapped Himself with zeal like a tallit. According to their deeds, accordingly He will repay--fury to His adversaries, recompense to His enemies; to the islands; nations, He will repay recompense. So they will reverence the Name of Yahweh from the west and His glory from the rising of the sun; when our enemies will come in like a flood, the Spirit of Yahweh will lift up a standard against them; The Redeemer will depart from Zion for those of Yaaqob who repent of their sins! declares Yahweh. As for Me, this is My covenant with them, says Yahweh: My Spirit which is upon you, namely My Words which I have put in your mouth; they will not depart from your mouth, nor from the mouth of your seed, nor from the mouth of your seed's seed, says Yahweh: from this time and forevermore."

"wondered that there was no intercessor"

Hebrews 7:11-12, "Now if perfection had been attainable through the Levitical priesthood (for under it the people received the law), what further need would there have been for another priest to arise after the order of Melchizedek, rather than one named after the order of Aaron? For the priesthood being changed(transformation), there is made of necessity a change(transformation) also of the law."

3331 - metathesis - transformation

"wondered that there was no intercessor"

1 Timothy 2:5, "For One is Yahweh; and One Mediator between Yahweh and men: the Man, Yahshua Messiah."

1 Timothy 2:5, "For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man[a] Christ Jesus."

Therefore His own arm brought salvation for Him, and His own righteousness"

1 John (Yahchanan) 4:10. "In this is love: Not that we loved Yahweh, but that He loved us, and sent His Son to be the sacrifice of atonement for our sins."

"He wrapped Himself with zeal like a tallit. According to their deeds, accordingly He will repay--fury to His adversaries, recompense to His enemies; to the islands; nations, He will repay recompense"

Revelation 19:13-15:, "And He was wrapped in a tallit dipped in blood, and the Name of Him is called: Yahshua--The Salvation of Yahweh. And the armies in heaven clothed in fine linen, white and clean, followed Him upon white horses, And out of His mouth goes a sharp, two-edged sword, that with it He should strike the nations; and He will rule over them with a rod of iron; and He treads the wine press of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty Yahweh."

Revelation 21:1-2, "And I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no more sea. And I, Yahchanan, saw the holy city, Yahweh Shammah, coming down from Yahweh out of heaven, prepared as brides adorned for their husbands. And I heard a great voice out of heaven, saying: Behold, the tabernacle of Yahweh is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they will be His people, and Yahweh Himself will be with them, and be their Father.