Who Justifieth the Ungodly

[riverhooks]

God Justifeth the Ungodly !
Therefore being justified by faith ( got it wrong bubba) God commands you to repent. 2 Thessalonians 2:13 / But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth: Whereunto he called you by our gospel to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. The false doctrine of non-imputation using wrested scripture for example. God needs to impute righteousness to you. He will not justify the wicked . You the ungodly were justified when you believed and not before. Then you became entrenched in the error of salvation by election, limited atonement, and other non-sense . You make God into the Image of John Calvins fantasy. Oh that you would hearken to The Lord and use the scripture for correction and reproof and instruction in righteousness Then you could know Him . Let Go of your library . Hold on to Jesus He is your salvation. He is a God of Glory, and He likes faith . A lot. But He will not believe for you . Repent and Believe the Gospel . “Can you hear me now ? "

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riverhooks
Disciple
Nov 23, 20212365028




Yesterday at 10:45 AM
#334
All humankind must accept the subtitute who payed penalty for them and satisfied the law and His righteousness. He was raised again for their justification. Not because they don’t have to do a thing now or cannot as Calvin asserts. But because by faith the heart believes to righteousness and with the mouth confession is made to salvation. God draws many by his Spirit no man can come to Him otherwise, but at a certain point unless that soul is prayed for God gives him over to his free will. Personally I always used my freewill to resist the gospel but my time came when I was reading I am The Vine you are the Branches. That is when the Holy Spirit Opened my eyes to a life lived without God. He is seated at the right hand of the Father. Look unto Him and be saved all the ends of the earth. Sort of thing. Calvinism will cost you. 52 . "I will not Justify the Wicked “ The Lord. “All humankind is justified before God” Brightfame 52 . Step by Step you can free yourself from this entanglement . It is serious . Remember Paul speaking of the simplicity of the gospel ? So a child could believe it . My Savior is not the tyrant and respecter of persons or needing some Theologian to give Him glory by proclaiming Salvation is non conditional for his chosen. He enables some , condemns some, I plead with you. Hearken. Cast your care upon Him and allow the Spirit of God to lead you out of this .

Rom 4:5

5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

This is True, but not of all who are ungodly, but only for those ungodly ones Christ died for the Elect.

Rom 5:6

6 For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.

And this is True of the Ungodly that Christ died for, that they were Justified while being Ungodly, because they were Justified by Christ's Blood Rom 5:9

9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

Yes by nature the Elect they are just like other men, ungodly law breakers, guilty sinners,but they are made just solely by the obedience / blood of Christ Rom 5:19b

19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.127

So basically Rom 5:9 and Vs 19b teach the same thing, Justification / made Righteous solely by the obedience / blood of Christ !

By His Death alone, those He died for, have been cleared of all charges, acquitted of all accusations the Law could charge them with, hence free from all Divine Condemnation Rom 8:33-34, and all this while being Ungodly, sinners, and enemies !

 

[brightfame52]

it is written

Romans 3:

26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.

...

28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith ...


READ YOUR BIBLE!!!

Yet Justification of the ungodly takes place before they have faith and is the reason why they are given faith to believe it.

 

[brightfame52]

no one is justified "prior to their believing the gospel".

Romans 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.


The means of the justification for all mankind was established in eternity past ... however, what you fail to acknowledge is that the Lord Jesus Christ died for all mankind ... that all mankind has faith to believe ... that some place their faith (believe) in lies rather than the One True God.





Yes ... and the whole of Hebrews is devoted to explaining the excellency of the Lord Jesus Christ.

Now read the first verse of chapter 2:

Hebrews 2:1 Therefore we ought to give the more earnest heed to the things which we have heard, lest at any time we should let them slip.

Those who do not give the more earnest heed to the things which [they] heard are the ones who let them slip.

When they let them slip, they reap the consequence of not giving the more earnest heed to the things which [they] heard.

It's not like they didn't hear ... God did not withhold anything ... they did hear and let slip the things which they heard.





nope ... read Ephesians 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, to the saints which are at Ephesus, and to the faithful in Christ Jesus

written to the faithful in Christ Jesus. The only way to be in Christ Jesus is to believe in Him:

Ephesians 1:13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise

you trusted after you heard
you believed after you trusted
you were sealed after you believed





read the whole verse, brightfame52:

John 8:24 I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.

You keep dodging the faith factor.


READ YOUR BIBLE!!!

They are justified before God before they believe because Christ has already purged away their sins by His death or blood Heb 1:3

3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:

 

[brightfame52]

The Lord Jesus Christ died for all mankind ...

John 3:

16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.

18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned ...





The verse does not state "that they were Justified" ... the verse states that Christ died for the ungodly.

Go back to Romans 5:1 to see how/when mankind is justified:

Romans 5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ


Why do you keep rejecting the truth of God's Word???

Read Romans 4:1-5 ... Faith is not works (as you keep insisting). We have gone over those verses before, brightfame52.

Romans 4:16 - 25 ... it [righteousness] shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead

Read Romans 5:1 ... Therefore being justified by faith

Now read Romans 5:6, 5:9, 5:19 and don't forget what you learn from Romans 4 (faith is not works) and Romans 4:16-5:1 (justified by faith).

God expects us to remember what we've read ... not rip Romans 5:6, 5:9, 5:19 as standalone verses without the foundational truth He provided in previous verses.

You believe a lie ... you have been taught that faith is works ... God's Word tells us faith is not works. Who are you going to believe? God? or the teaching of whatever dogma you hold to?

Christ died only for the elect and it is them that He Justified Rom 8:33-34

33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died[for Gods elect], yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

 

[Mofastus]

I think the "he" is referring back to God, and is referring to the Son.

it is

 

[posthuman]

Christ died only for the elect and it is them that He Justified Rom 8:33-34

33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died[for Gods elect], yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

if we take out the words you inserted into Romans 8:34, it doesn't say Christ only died for the elect.

it is your presumed additions to scripture in Romans 8:34 that contradict 1 John 2:2 -- the Bible isn't broken

we went over this in great detail at least a year ago, dude
why are you still pushing heresy? Christ died for all. not all believe.

the presence of food on a table does not fill one's belly.
for hunger to be satisfied, you have to actually eat!

 

[posthuman]

Christ died only for the elect

but anyway ok; i'm no different than you; i also fail and forget things i have learned.
so let's do this math again:

He Himself is the propitiation for our sins,​

and not for ours only but also for the whole world.​

(1 John 2:2)​

​

• who is "our" referring to?
  • the elect
• who is "the whole world" referring to?
  • not the elect
• what does it mean that Christ died not for our sins only but also for the whole world?
  • Christ did not only die for the elect

☐ ​

​

​

 

[OIC1965]

Romans 5:5 And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.

Faith which works by love. galatians 5:6

 

[Rivers_of_Mercy]

He Himself is the propitiation for our sins,and not for ours only but also for the whole world.(1 John 2:2)

• who is "our" referring to?
  • the elect
• who is "the whole world" referring to?
  • not the elect
• what does it mean that Christ died not for our sins only but also for the whole world?
  • Christ did not only die for the elect

Maybe flow charts would help.... LOL I was just talking to someone about propitiation being one of my favorite words.
Sorry... I could not resist. LOL

 

[OIC1965]

No its True doctrine and Im testifying with scripture why the elect are justified before they believe. You dont receive the testimony.

Justification is the imputation of righteousness to a sinner, right? Romans 4 and other places say that righteousness is imputed to those who believe. So belief precedes justification.

Though there definitely is the fact that God initiates salvation, not us, for foreknowing, predestination, and calling precedes all of it.

 

[OIC1965]

It is not Faith itself that Justifies the Elect, but God Himself Rom 8:33

33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

It is He that Imputes Righteousness unto them on behalf of Christ's Work for them, and that is what Faith has at it's view when God reveals this Righteousness Imputed by the Preaching of the Gospel to them Rom 1:16-17, so it is each child of Abraham will as Abraham did, have the Gospel Preached individually to them Gal 3:8

8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.

By the Spirit's application of it to their minds and hearts, and God given Faith will embrace it and embrace Him that did Justify, God or God through Christ Isa 53:11

11 He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.

God justifies the Elect through faith.

 

[posthuman]

Maybe flow charts would help.... LOL I was just talking to someone about propitiation being one of my favorite words.
Sorry... I could not resist. LOL

good idea!





"His blood be upon us" has very different meanings depending on whether it's believers or unbelievers saying it

 

[brightfame52]

Justification by Grace Alone !

Titus 3:7

7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

Its this Truth, not Justification by Faith alone, but Justification by Grace alone that is the foundation of the Gospel Preaching. Rom 3:24

24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

That word freely means undeservedly, and not until this Truth is testified to faithfully, no Gospel of God's Grace has been preached and believed.7

Yes being freely Justified by His Election of Grace Rom 11:5-7, apart from anything done by the sinner, not his faith, repentance, accepting a gift, nothing done or determined by man !

 

[brightfame52]

if we take out the words you inserted into Romans 8:34, it doesn't say Christ only died for the elect.

it is your presumed additions to scripture in Romans 8:34 that contradict 1 John 2:2 -- the Bible isn't broken

we went over this in great detail at least a year ago, dude
why are you still pushing heresy? Christ died for all. not all believe.

the presence of food on a table does not fill one's belly.
for hunger to be satisfied, you have to actually eat!

Its only the elect that God Justifies Rom 8:33

33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

 

[brightfame52]

but anyway ok; i'm no different than you; i also fail and forget things i have learned.
so let's do this math again:

He Himself is the propitiation for our sins,​

and not for ours only but also for the whole world.​

(1 John 2:2)​

​

• who is "our" referring to?
  • the elect
• who is "the whole world" referring to?
  • not the elect
• what does it mean that Christ died not for our sins only but also for the whole world?
  • Christ did not only die for the elect

☐ ​

​

​

1 Jn 2:2 applies to the elect, out from the jews and the gentiles. Its just that simple. Rom 8:33

33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

 

[brightfame52]

Justification is the imputation of righteousness to a sinner, right? Romans 4 and other places say that righteousness is imputed to those who believe. So belief precedes justification.

Though there definitely is the fact that God initiates salvation, not us, for foreknowing, predestination, and calling precedes all of it.

Nowhere does it say belief precedes Justification, but thats who has been Justified, them who believe. Everyone who has been Justified by Christs death, shall be given Faith to believe.

 

[brightfame52]

God justifies the Elect through faith.

Thats false. God Justified the elect by Christs death for them. Rom 8:33-34
33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

 

[OIC1965]

Nowhere does it say belief precedes Justification, but thats who has been Justified, them who believe. Everyone who has been Justified by Christs death, shall be given Faith to believe.

The Call precedes justification. Romans 8:28-30. Foreknown, predestined, called, justified, glorified. The call produces Faith and faith, (which is a gift of God), results in justification (as a secondary, not primary cause or instrument).

 

[posthuman]

1 Jn 2:2 applies to the elect, out from the jews and the gentiles.

• not only ours
  ((in context clearly: the elect, out from the Jews and the Gentiles also - John isn't writing only to Jews but to a mixed Gentile church))
• but also the whole world
  ((that's everyone outside of the church))

you're contradicting scripture. i'm not.
the matter is settled - Christ died for everyone; not everyone believes; not all are saved

 

[reneweddaybyday]

Yet Justification of the ungodly takes place before they have faith and is the reason why they are given faith to believe it.

All of mankind has faith, brightfame52.

The question is not “does someone have faith”.

The question is “in what (Who, more specifically) do we place our faith”.

The more someone places their faith in (believes) a lie, the worse it is for them.

The atheist places his/her faith in the fact that there is no God. He/she remains weak in faith ... even to the point where God strengthens that unbelief (hardens their heart).

The believer places his/her faith in the Truth that God is the Creator of the heavens and the earth and all that is therein. The believer's faith is strengthened as he/she believes more and more of the Truth of God's Word.