Why can't some folk take responsibility for themselves?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
I

imfinallyfree

Banned
Dec 17, 2013
822
7
0
Why do some folk look to others to answer for their indiscretions?

Like people waiting for saints to take them to Heaven when it is the individuals responsibility to get there by proving themselves to God?

I heard this one guy say that we can do whatever we want because Jesus bled on the cross.

Well if that's the excuse when someone is being judged by God for themselves and how they lived,that excuse seems a bit flimsy.

I don't think that it will stand up to scrutiny by God.

I mean if He asks why were you lustful,hateful,greedy whatever the case may be can you really say "well because Jesus bled on the cross".

That really gonna work? That don't seem right to me.
 
Like people waiting for saints to take them to Heaven when it is the individuals responsibility to get there by proving themselves to God?

Neither saints nor you yourself can get you to heaven
 
Your reasoning might be sound if you truly understood that a person living for God has only in mind to do what God chooses to do through them... NOT some rules they looked up in a book to follow.... nor to go hog wild, attempting to be as rebellious as possible.

That old junk of, "Do it the way I know it is supposed to be done, or else you are in the wrong.", is not exactly what Jesus taught.
 
imfinallyfree said:
Why do some folk look to others to answer for their indiscretions?

Like people waiting for saints to take them to Heaven when it is the individuals responsibility to get there by proving themselves to God?

I heard this one guy say that we can do whatever we want because Jesus bled on the cross.

Well if that's the excuse when someone is being judged by God for themselves and how they lived,that excuse seems a bit flimsy.

I don't think that it will stand up to scrutiny by God.

I mean if He asks why were you lustful,hateful,greedy whatever the case may be can you really say "well because Jesus bled on the cross".

That really gonna work? That don't seem right to me.
Click to expand...
Yes, I agree that the Lord does expect us to obey his commandments. It's not always easy, and the Lord understands that, and he forgives the repentant sinner. However, those who are unwilling to repent aren't going to find the gate.
 
I was just thinking of this short along the lines of what you post. God's grace violates our sense of justice. We think that a good person should go to Heaven by virtue of being good, but that is not the way it works. No amount of goodness is good enough to cancel out even one sin. For ALL have sinned and come short of the glory of God.

It's like this: you take a perfectly clean bandage- spotless, it looks pristine to us and you decide to place it on a wound. We might think "this is good, it will cover a wound and heal it." But supposing there is even one tiny MRSA bacteria on it, and it is slapped on the wound, the person will be infected and may die. For the most part, the bandage IS clean and good, but a little badness makes the whole thing bad. It doesn't matter if you put a dirty, used bandage on the wound or a bandage with one tiny bacteria, the person is still infected.

A person like Jeffrey Dahmer can be saved and go to Heaven, while a sweet little grandmother who gave to charity and never did anything wrong except a little gossip can go to Hell.

The difference is WHO you are trusting to get you to Heaven. You will either trust Christ, or you will trust yourself.

I read a novel called The Private Memoirs and Confessions of a Justified Sinner by James Hogg (1824). In the novel, he satirizes the idea that a saved person can go to Heaven no matter what they do. The protagonist in the novel basically says, "Whoop, whoop! I'm saved- I can do whatever I want, alright!" He goes on a bender of epic proportions. He rapes, steals, kills people. And he says, "I'm saved, so what."

In a way, this is true. In Christ, we have liberty. The penalty of Hell has been taken away. BUT, a person who is genuinely saved, the new creature doesn't want to commit all these sins. The old fleshly nature, is still sinful and desires to do whatever it wants. Because God has loved us so much, we want to love Him and seek to please Him. The Holy Spirit within us convicts us of sins. The most miserable people on this Earth are people who are saved, but not living in a way pleasing to God. It is not the person who is unsaved and good, or unsaved and bad.

God does not work on a justice system, but a mercy system. The mercy is available to everyone. Anyway, once you are saved, your Spirit doesn't want you to go and commit all sorts of sins. We're free to, but we don't now want to in our spirits (although the flesh may want to still commit sins). This is a paradox, and it is mentioned in Romans 7:15-25 better.

[video=youtube;XrLzYw6ULYw]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XrLzYw6ULYw[/video]
 
Thanks all I was just feeling bad because some people that are super religious were looking down on me and I was just thinking about them.
 
Galatea said:
I was just thinking of this short along the lines of what you post. God's grace violates our sense of justice. We think that a good person should go to Heaven by virtue of being good, but that is not the way it works. No amount of goodness is good enough to cancel out even one sin. For ALL have sinned and come short of the glory of God.

It's like this: you take a perfectly clean bandage- spotless, it looks pristine to us and you decide to place it on a wound. We might think "this is good, it will cover a wound and heal it." But supposing there is even one tiny MRSA bacteria on it, and it is slapped on the wound, the person will be infected and may die. For the most part, the bandage IS clean and good, but a little badness makes the whole thing bad. It doesn't matter if you put a dirty, used bandage on the wound or a bandage with one tiny bacteria, the person is still infected.

A person like Jeffrey Dahmer can be saved and go to Heaven, while a sweet little grandmother who gave to charity and never did anything wrong except a little gossip can go to Hell.

The difference is WHO you are trusting to get you to Heaven. You will either trust Christ, or you will trust yourself.

I read a novel called The Private Memoirs and Confessions of a Justified Sinner by James Hogg (1824). In the novel, he satirizes the idea that a saved person can go to Heaven no matter what they do. The protagonist in the novel basically says, "Whoop, whoop! I'm saved- I can do whatever I want, alright!" He goes on a bender of epic proportions. He rapes, steals, kills people. And he says, "I'm saved, so what."

In a way, this is true. In Christ, we have liberty. The penalty of Hell has been taken away. BUT, a person who is genuinely saved, the new creature doesn't want to commit all these sins. The old fleshly nature, is still sinful and desires to do whatever it wants. Because God has loved us so much, we want to love Him and seek to please Him. The Holy Spirit within us convicts us of sins. The most miserable people on this Earth are people who are saved, but not living in a way pleasing to God. It is not the person who is unsaved and good, or unsaved and bad.

God does not work on a justice system, but a mercy system. The mercy is available to everyone. Anyway, once you are saved, your Spirit doesn't want you to go and commit all sorts of sins. We're free to, but we don't now want to in our spirits (although the flesh may want to still commit sins). This is a paradox, and it is mentioned in Romans 7:15-25 better.

[video=youtube;XrLzYw6ULYw]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XrLzYw6ULYw[/video]
Click to expand...

I loved this, It really makes you think :)
 
imfinallyfree said:
Thanks all I was just feeling bad because some people that are super religious were looking down on me and I was just thinking about them.
Click to expand...


Understand that religion is a man made thing. I'm not saying it's wrong or anything but God doesn't look down on anyone. You have a relationship with him and that's what matters. These super religious folks have to live with the choices they make. You can't worry about them, pray that God opens their eyes to see that we aren't supposed to look down on others.
 
Why can't some folk take responsibility for themselves?
Click to expand...

Cause they are followers of that calvin guy, tippy toe thru the tulips
m0139.gif
 
Well I could answer but I do believe Galatea,answered your question pretty accurately and thoroughly so I'll leave it at that,great job,though as usual we are to all give God the Glory,on to the next question!
 
We can never be of the mindset to prove ourselves to God. This is both working for His approval (which is works) which He has already given us, nor can we become legalistic.

But God doesn't leave us hanging there...He gives us His rightful premise thru righteousness (which is the non-perverted version): That if we love Him, after first accepting His love for us, and wallow in His love to a point relationally that you love Him back because He simply gives us freedom and liberty; something will come of it - fruit > we will obey His commandments because of our love for Him. Now, this is how we are to prove ourselves to Him, by accepting His Love absolutely and graciously and act faithfully in our acceptance as Himself being our disposition of our New Life.

He wants us to willfully love Him back, and the only way to do that is to obey His commands, for He is love; and we therefore can love Him back faithfully and willfully. We are to be bondservants to righteousness which simply means live according to the spirit and not the flesh, and to thereby kill the things of the flesh, as we relationally live in Christ.

We seem to celebrate the fact Jesus gets on that video scale for us. And we should all AMEN that about 100 times +. But what does Him getting on the scale for us mean exactly? Are we not also on that scale as well as the Christ-like New creature? Why does it say,".. if we remain in Him and His words remain in us....", after regeneration?

Well, certainly, by now I hope, many of us we get that we cannot earn salvation thru works, it is only thru God sending His Son to pay the price of our sins for us on the Cross that we are made innocent and free full of liberty; recognizing we, too, were crucified with Him in the old self as we believe and receive Him. But what of His Judgements? Where does that leave us with His Judgements? Has God's judgement fallen off the face of our experiences? Is the middle walk of sometimes sinning and mostly not ok? Is luke-warm ok? NO, of course not!

We are known as His Children by His judgements. Both God and we are revealed by His judgments. His character is revealed by what He proclaims to be right and our characters are revealed by our inability to measure up. His judgment puts an end to sin. Christ’s work on the cross fulfilled God’s judgment.

If you allow yourself to be judged today, you will not be judged later. To be disciplined by the Lord is not the same as to be condemned by Him - for He is love. It is only when we refuse to accept the judgment of the cross that we are destroyed by God’s judgment.

The closer one is to God, the more severe His discipline will be. By undergoing the continual judgment of God, we are saved from His eternal judgment. Judgment reveals the mind of God. If we would do His will, we must abide by His judgments. As long as God restrains judgement, we cannot judge another. But once God has enlightened our hearts by His judgment, we may utter a word of rebuke to a brother in reconciling him in love respectfully and gently.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top Bottom
Back