Why do you believe the law is not binding on Christians?

[seed_time_harvest]

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To everyone, please look at post 107: This is amazing, john532 has said his first good thing, and seed_time_harvest has said his first bad thing. LOL I exaggerate, OF COURSE! The point I wish to make is: How could seed_time_harvest be sooo dumb headed? What in the world is he smoking? LOL, Please slow down and smell the roses, man. SORRY, I just could not resist. I just love these faces; but ,by the way, what, in the world does mean? , , I don't have a clue?! OF COURSE, God is happier, when we keep His commandments. Jesus loved the rich, young, good, moral, ruler who asked of eternal life. Do you think God is some kind of a fool? Disobedient children make fools of their stupid, ignorant parents. The wicked sinners of Rom. chs.1,2,3 Don't make God happy, they see God as some stupid fool. I really see tears in Jesus' eyes when He wept over Jerusalem, and at Lazarus grave. On the other hand, God is happy when the righteous rule and men are happy when they have plenty to eat and can sleep in peace. Please think, before you react. Love Hoffco

Calm down Hoffco.
If i said something wrong.I didn't mean to and GOD knows that my intentions were not bad.

 

[Daley]

Show me proof from the Bible why you believe the law is not binding on Christians.

Eph 2:15 KJV "Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace."

Here the Bible says the law of commandments was ABOLISHED. That means the Old Testament law the Jews lived by, given at Sinai, is obsolete. This doesn't mean Christians don't have laws, but we don't have THAT LAW. We have a NEW and DIFFERENT set of laws given by Jesus when he came, and elaborated on further by the disciples after his ascension.

 

[phil112]

Eph 2:15 KJV "Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace."

Here the Bible says the law of commandments was ABOLISHED. That means the Old Testament law the Jews lived by, given at Sinai, is obsolete. This doesn't mean Christians don't have laws, but we don't have THAT LAW. We have a NEW and DIFFERENT set of laws given by Jesus when he came, and elaborated on further by the disciples after his ascension.

I was nodding my head....right up 'til you said that. We have ZERO laws to abide by today. NONE. And you will find no such statements or directives in the new testament. Christ told us to keep HIS two commandments. That is all.

 

[Daley]

I was nodding my head....right up 'til you said that. We have ZERO laws to abide by today. NONE. And you will find no such statements or directives in the new testament. Christ told us to keep HIS two commandments. That is all.

"Flee fornication." (1 Cor 6:18) This is a law we have to obey.

"The law of faith." (Rom 3:27) This is another law we have to obey.

The command to preach, teach, make disciples, and baptize them in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit are all commands we must obey. (Matt 28:19-20)

We also have other laws in the Bible commanding us to pray, read the word, avoid lying, wrath, bitterness, and even positive commands to help the poor, care for widows and orphans, etc. So yes, we have laws, but our laws are not the same as the law of Moses. We don't keep these laws to be saved anymore than the Israelites could, because only by faith in Christ could anyone be saved under BOTH the law of Moses and the New Covenant.

By the way, as for the New Covenant, God says he will write his law in our hearts. See Hebrews 8. So this shows we do have laws, not on stone, but in our hearts; not those given through Moses, but those given through Jesus.

 

[resurrection33]

Show me proof from the Bible why you believe the law is not binding on Christians.

But this is the covenant which I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the LORD: I will put my law within them, and I will write it upon their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people. Jeremiah 31:33 RSV

I believe the law is a personal thing passed on from the Lord to each of us as we walk with him. Did the Lord intend for Christians to observe the jubilees? Obey the commandments.

 

[gamlet]

Both the Law and the Gospel teach a righteousness which is acceptable to God. When God gave His Law He said: Be holy because I, the Lord your God, am holy (Leviticus 19:2). He did not say, Keep My commandments as best you can. I will be satisfied with that. In His Law God demands perfection. Those who seek to be saved by keeping the Law, must keep God's Law perfectly. Every thought, word, and deed must be perfect. But can such perfection be attained? The Scriptures reveal that salvation through the Law is impossible. All who rely on observing the Law are under a curse, for it is written, Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything in the Book of the Law (Galatians 3:10). The bible describes our own righteousness as nothing but filthy rags. God directs us, therefore, to the perfect righteousness- the righteousness of Christ. Christ is the end of the Law so that there may be righteousness for everyone who believes (Romans 10:4). Christ, the Righteous One, kept God's Law perfectly for us and suffered and died in payment for our sins. NO LONGER ARE WE COMPELLED TO KEEP THE LAW FOR OUR SALVATION. Rather, we are invited to believe in Jesus Christ as the Savior from sin. Faith in Him makes us right with God. Such is the glorious message of the Gospel.

The Law produces sorrow; the Gospel brings joy. The Law makes men afraid of God, the righteous Judge; the Gospel causes sinners to love and trust their Lord.

The Pharisees knew the Law of Moses, and they attempted to keep it. They believed that they could make themselves righteous in the sight of God. They were so zealous that they added to God's Law hundreds of rules and traditions of their own. But all their attempts to keep the Law produced neither believers in God nor followers of Christ. Jesus called them hypocrites and pronounced God's judgement upon them.

We can teach the Law but that knowledge will not make us love the Lord nor move us to lead a life that pleases God. Why not? The Apostle writes: The letter kills, but the Spirit gives life (2 Cor 3:6). the letter is the Law; the Spirit comes through the Gospel. The Law does not give true spiritual life, but destroys it. The HS through the Gospel alone creates a saving faith in the sinner's heart.

Ask and it shall be given you....

"The Law produces sorrow" That's not how read the Psalms, friend. The Law is loved there, unless you want to delete that from Scripture.

Also the Law is so connected with love. Leviticus 19:18 which was quoted in James 2:8 and called the Royal Law. Love is the summary of the Law. In fact, the Law is the Manual of how to love. How do we love God? Have no other gods, keep away from idols, honor His name, keep the Sabbath...

How do we love others? Honor authorities, don't kill, murder, steal, lie, covet...

I don't keep the law for salvation. I am saved by grace. But as Israel was saved from bondage in Egypt then given the law to guide their behavior in the redeemed life, so has God used the Law to guide my own behavior so that my salvation experience may continue.

 

[gamlet]

For it is Written: Pay attention and learn:

Let’s start with an emphasis on continuity. A passage like Matthew 5:17-19 can be used to argue that all Old Testament laws are still in force. Jesus didn’t do away with any of God’s laws. Rather, he emphasized that we ought to obey God not only in our actions, but also in our hearts. We have to keep every Old Testament law in the spirit, in its attitude and purpose. God’s laws are written in our hearts and minds (Hebrews 8:10). They are internalized, so we should want to keep them. Hebrews 8:10 is a quote of Jeremiah 31:31-33, one could argue, and the laws that Jeremiah had in mind were the laws that were valid in his day: the old covenant laws. They were all given by God.

If this line of reasoning is correct, our love for God will motivate us to be circumcised, to keep the Jubilee year and sabbatical years. We will be diligent to avoid all forms of uncleanness, and we will wear phylacteries and only pure fabrics. We will offer sacrifices, not only for sin but also for fellowship offerings and thank offerings. When Jeremiah described the kingdom of God, old covenant customs were included.

These laws are still valid – but, as we know, they are applied in a spiritual way. The application of the law has been transformed by the coming of Jesus Christ. If our hearts are circumcised, it does not matter whether we have been circumcised in the flesh. If we are offering spiritual sacrifices, we do not need to offer animals.

If we are always forgiving debts and liberating people from bondage, we do not have to do anything different on sabbatical years. If we are treating our livestock and farmland properly, we do not have to do anything different on sabbatical years. If we live by the spirit, the letter of these laws is not required.

If we examine our hearts for corruption and are being cleansed by Jesus Christ, then we do not have destroy houses that have mildew. If our thoughts are pure, we don’t have to worry about our fabrics. If we are always thinking of God and his laws, we don’t have to wear phylacteries. The laws are valid, but the way in which we obey them has been transformed by the coming of Jesus Christ.

The Old Testament clearly commanded the Israelites to wear blue threads in tassels on their garments (Numbers 15:38-39). Was this law inspired by God, or not? Answer: It was. Is this law obsolete? Answer: It is. Who has the authority to declare a God-given law obsolete? Answer: Only God.

Does the New Testament specifically rescind this law? Answer: No. It says nothing about this specific law. Then how can we prove, with divine authority, that it is obsolete? Answer: Because the New Testament declares the entire old covenant obsolete (Hebrews 8:13). As a law code, as a source of laws, it is not valid.

That brings us to our second approach to Old Testament law: None of it is valid. Christians do not have to keep the law of Moses because those laws were a temporary package, designed to be in force only until the Messiah came. Now that he has come and given us a better covenant, the first is obsolete.

But, some say, we should keep both the letter and the spirit of this law. It is easy to make that claim, but there is no proof for it – and there is certainly no reason to condemn people on the basis of a different interpretation of how we should obey God. It is just as easy to make the claim that people truly abiding by the spirit of the tassels will also be wearing tassels. The flaw of such logic is exposed by the realization that the new covenant declares the old contract obsolete. We must focus on the spirit and purpose of the laws.

A Sabbatarian approach to the Sabbath emphasizes Matthew 5:17-19, and that usually leads to a distorted meaning for such verses as Colossians 2:16 and Romans 14:5.

However, after we recognize that the letter of some Old Testament laws is obsolete, then we realize that Matthew 5:17-19 has to be qualified or restricted in some way. So do Romans 3:20, 31; 7:12, 14 and other verses of continuity. These verses do not tell us which specific laws are still in force, and they do not prove the continued validity of any specific law. They are general, not specific.

Once we recognize that some Old Testament laws, although still valid in purpose, are obsolete in the letter, then we are free to accept the implications of what Paul wrote in Colossians 2:16. We should not let anyone judge us regarding Sabbath days, just as we shouldn’t let them judge us regarding new moons. Everyone should be convinced in their own mind, and they should not judge other Christians regarding such matters.

You have a very indiscriminate view of the Old Testament Law. You lump them all together into the Old Covenant anc conclude that they have been replaced by the New Covenant. If you would examine the context of Hebrews, you would see that the Old Covenant there refers to the Temple or Sanctuary ordinances which were shadows or symbols of Christ. They served to tell people before Christ's first coming about Him and His atoning sacrifice and ministry. Everything in the Sanctuary was a symbol of Christ: sacrificial lamb, blood, bread, light, priest. When the reality came, there was no need for the shadow anymore. So the veil in the Temple was torn at the moment of Jesus' death.

But there are laws in the Old Testament outside of the Sanctuary ordinances. There are laws which were specific for Israel which are not binding on us anymore although we can learn lessons from them. Then there are the moral laws (Ten Commandments and others) that were meant for all men. They were given even before Israel was founded as a nation.

So, not all Old Testament Laws have been taken away by the New Covenant. The moral laws that remain have nothing to do with gaining salvation. It is given for those who have been saved.

 

[gamlet]

what kind of law you talking about brother?

36 Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 This is the first and great commandment.
39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

All kind of law is base on love.

even secular law must base on love.for example traffic law.

Love mean doesn't like people hurt from accident. that way they make traffic law.

The real Love is come and dwelling on every believer and His Name is Jesus.

He is the real Sabbath.

So we are bound to the real law.

If Christ is the real Sabbath, does that mean we don't need to keep the seventh day Sabbath anymore?

 

[gamlet]

Romans 4:15 because the law brings wrath. And where there is no law there is no transgression.

Jesus has stand in our place for punishment in order to fulfill the Law; but now the laws were fulfilled and or you can say that the process has been completed. And now we can distinguish from what is good and what is evil. And now if we does someone wrong, and love it; God will see what your heart desires. Hoping for wrath on your enemies, in God's eyesight, He sees what you desires. But since we are all sinner (not living up to a Godly specifications) which we should all be like David, praying and fasting fervently on our face for mercy. But if you want o put a heavy burden (the laws that we all was unable to keep) on those that are weak as yourself is, then so be it. But I myself is going to clear my thoughts on those that sinned against me and focus on what I must do (because I'm endanger of Hell's fire as well) and let God be the Judge; and try my best not to put any Ideals in my head in how God should handle other. If I do have these thoughts, I'll be evil as well because I will be cursing.

Romans 4 talks about righteousness and promises. These are not gained by Law and those who depend on the law for salvation will experience wrath because the Law can not save them. It is by grace through faith that we are justified. But all this does not show that those who are saved do not keep the Law anymore as rules of life.

 

[gamlet]

The New Testament believer is under grace; Hebrews 7 says the law was changed, and we now have 'a better hope'.

I am under grace and have the better hope in Jesus. I don't keep the law to be saved but keep it as a rule of life.

 

[Jackson123]

If Christ is the real Sabbath, does that mean we don't need to keep the seventh day Sabbath anymore?

When we were kid, we play toy car. Now we are adult, we play real car.

adult should no longer play toy car. It is inapropriate

 

[gamlet]

One simple fact is all you need to know.

If the law is still binding. We are doomed. The curse of the law is death for everyone who does not obey EVERYTHING written in it.

The law can only condemn.

How good have you done this?

Galatians 3:10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them.”

Galatians 3:13 Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us (for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree”),

Galatians 3:19 What purpose then does the law serve? It was added because of transgressions, till the Seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was appointed through angels by the hand of a mediator.

Galatians 3:23 But before faith came, we were kept under guard by the law, kept for the faith which would afterward be revealed. 24 Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith. 25 But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.

So, is your Christianity lawless? I mean does it not say anything about murder, or stealing or lying or keeping the Sabbath?

 

[gamlet]

from Galatians chapter 5,

18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.

and

the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faith, 23 gentleness, and self-control.

i reach for the fruit of the Spirit... i try to keep the Spirit of the law, but not the letter... i believe this is what Jesus was talking about when he talked about clean foods and when he wrote in the sand...


2 Corinthians 3
For the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

blessings upon you all!

"Under the law" is a term used in the New Testament to refer to the Jews. Romans 2:17 says that they depended on the law as a means of righteousness.

I am not under the law. I am dead to the law. I don't depend on the law for righteousness but on Christ. But does that mean I don't keep the law anymore? Of course not. I'd go direct to jail if I murdered someone.

 

[gamlet]

Galatians 2:19 "For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God."

But you asked, so you know you are looking for a way to avoid clear scripture.

I just wish for these Scriptures to be understood properly. 'Dead to the law' is a metaphor used by Paul in the context of marriage. The Jews were married to the law. They depended on it for righteousness. You cannot marry another one unless your previous husband or wife dies, so you had to die to the law so that you can get married to Jesus.

In this context, it does not mean that Christians are not bound by the moral law anymore. Paul was dead to the law but he kept the law. So did all of the disciples. Antinomianism crept into the church at a very late date. Your interpretation must be verified by history.

 

[gamlet]

That's a lie. It is a task master. It is bondage. It's ONLY purpose was to lead us to Christ so that we may be free from the law.

You're using all these figures of speech without understanding them properly. It is bondage when it is depended upon for righteousness. The law as a taskmaster referred to the sanctuary ordinances that told people about Christ before He was born. They were shadows meant to be done away with when the reality came. Lastly, Christ died to set us free from sin not to set us free from the law.

 

[john832]

Again? You didn't listen the first hundred times, why would anyone want to go thru it again?

Trying to convince you sabbath keepers of grace thru Christ is an exercise in futility.

Show me how I am cursed for keeping the Sabbath. Show me how I am cursed for being faithful to my wife. Show me how I am cursed for telling the truth.

Better yet, show me how you are blessed for stealing, lying, cheating on your spouse, lusting, dishonoring your parents, serving other gods, bowing down to statues, breaking the Sabbath and taking God's holy name in vain.

 

[john832]

I was nodding my head....right up 'til you said that. We have ZERO laws to abide by today. NONE. And you will find no such statements or directives in the new testament. Christ told us to keep HIS two commandments. That is all.

So, uh, no laws? So if someone breaks into your home tonight, has his way with your spouse and then murders you and steals all your possessions they have done nothing wrong?

Rom 5:13 (For until the law sin was in the world, but sin is not imputed when there is no law.

According to you, they have not sinned and you wouldnot nave been wronged.

 

[phil112]

So, uh, no laws? So if someone breaks into your home tonight, has his way with your spouse and then murders you and steals all your possessions they have done nothing wrong?

Rom 5:13 (For until the law sin was in the world, but sin is not imputed when there is no law.

According to you, they have not sinned and you wouldnot nave been wronged.

Don't be a fool. If you keep acting like one, and talking like one, people will start calling you one. You really want that?
Follow Christ's two commandments. No one ever breaks into the house of someone they love like themself. People that love God with all their heart and mind don't rape. The law is made for the lawless.

By needing the law you are telling this board SO much about the state of your spirituality..........

 

[WomanLovesTX]

Don't be a fool. If you keep acting like one, and talking like one, people will start calling you one. You really want that?
Follow Christ's two commandments. No one ever breaks into the house of someone they love like themself. People that love God with all their heart and mind don't rape. The law is made for the lawless.

By needing the law you are telling this board SO much about the state of your spirituality..........

[h=3]Matthew 23:1-3[/h]King James Version (KJV)

23 Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples,
2 Saying The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat:
3 All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.

 

[WomanLovesTX]

Don't be a fool. If you keep acting like one, and talking like one, people will start calling you one. You really want that?
Follow Christ's two commandments. No one ever breaks into the house of someone they love like themself. People that love God with all their heart and mind don't rape. The law is made for the lawless.

By needing the law you are telling this board SO much about the state of your spirituality..........

Matthew 23:1-3

King James Version (KJV)

23 Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples,
2 Saying The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat:
3 All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.

Acts 15:20-22

King James Version (KJV)

20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.
21 For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.