Why Must Saul Suffer?
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Hello Off123123123, God does not delight in suffering itself, whether it is His Son's or ours, rather, He is pleased with the results of it (the good that comes from suffering, that is), be it His Son's or ours.
For instance,
May He bless you as you seek to find Him!!
~Deuteronomy (David)
"We know that God causes all things to work together
for good to those who love God, to those who
are called according to His purpose"
Romans 8:28.
For instance,
Hebrews 12
4 You have not yet resisted to the point of shedding blood in your striving against sin;
5 and you have forgotten the exhortation which is addressed to you as sons,
“MY SON, DO NOT REGARD LIGHTLY THE DISCIPLINE OF THE LORD,
NOR FAINT WHEN YOU ARE REPROVED BY HIM;
6 FOR THOSE WHOM THE LORD LOVES HE DISCIPLINES,
AND HE SCOURGES EVERY SON WHOM HE RECEIVES.”
7 It is for discipline that you endure; God deals with you as with sons; for what son is there whom his father does not discipline?
8 But if you are without discipline, of which all have become partakers, then you are illegitimate children and not sons.
9 Furthermore, we had earthly fathers to discipline us, and we respected them; shall we not much rather be subject to the Father of spirits, and live?
10 For they disciplined us for a short time as seemed best to them, but He disciplines us ~for our good~, so that we may ~share His holiness~.
11 All discipline for the moment seems not to be joyful, but sorrowful; yet to those who have been trained by it, afterwards it yields the ~peaceful fruit of righteousness~.
The Father's principal attribute, the one by which He relates most closely to us, that is, is love. If He took some sort of sadistic pleasure in seeing anyone suffer, even the reprobate, then He would a monster, not what He is/has proven Himself to be, our loving, heavenly Father/Abba.May He bless you as you seek to find Him!!
~Deuteronomy (David)
"We know that God causes all things to work together
for good to those who love God, to those who
are called according to His purpose"
Romans 8:28
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Scripture literally says he does as he pleases. Psalms 115:3, 135:6
He sends out people as sheep to be slaughtered, he grants it to people to suffer.
God only does what pleases him.
Psalm 115:4 Our God is in the heavens; he does all that he pleases.
Psalm 135:6 Whatever the Lord pleases, he does, in heaven and on earth, in the seas and all deeps.
Phil 1:29 29 For it has been granted to you that for the sake of Christ you should not only believe in him but also suffer for his sake,
1 Peter 3 . 17 For it is better to suffer for doing good, if that should be God's will, than for doing evil.
Romans 8:36 As it is written, “For your sake we are being killed all the day long; we are regarded as sheep to be slaughtered.”
Is 53: 10 Yet it was the will of the Lord to crush him;
he has put him to grief;
He sends out people as sheep to be slaughtered, he grants it to people to suffer.
God only does what pleases him.
Psalm 115:4 Our God is in the heavens; he does all that he pleases.
Psalm 135:6 Whatever the Lord pleases, he does, in heaven and on earth, in the seas and all deeps.
Phil 1:29 29 For it has been granted to you that for the sake of Christ you should not only believe in him but also suffer for his sake,
1 Peter 3 . 17 For it is better to suffer for doing good, if that should be God's will, than for doing evil.
Romans 8:36 As it is written, “For your sake we are being killed all the day long; we are regarded as sheep to be slaughtered.”
Is 53: 10 Yet it was the will of the Lord to crush him;
he has put him to grief;
Everyone, think on this:
Jeremiah 12:5 “If you have raced with men on foot and they have worn you out, how can you compete with horses? If you stumble in safe country, how will you manage in the thickets by the Jordan?"
So when God puts us through our paces, and we face trials and persecutions, it really so that we become stronger and be more than conquerors and to get a lot good done for God. It really doesn't help anyone to whine and complain - it just makes that person look bad (not to mention useless)!
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Jeremiah 12:5 “If you have raced with men on foot and they have worn you out, how can you compete with horses? If you stumble in safe country, how will you manage in the thickets by the Jordan?"
So when God puts us through our paces, and we face trials and persecutions, it really so that we become stronger and be more than conquerors and to get a lot good done for God. It really doesn't help anyone to whine and complain - it just makes that person look bad (not to mention useless)!
🍹
You don't understand the meaning of the phrase...what He pleases. It's a phrase that means God is sovereign. He doesn't answer to anyone. There is no one who can restrict the activity of God.. He does as He pleases.
You and I do answer to some authorities. We can't always do as we might want. We are limited and restricted.
You and I do answer to some authorities. We can't always do as we might want. We are limited and restricted.
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Scripture says what he does pleases God.
Ephesians 1:5
5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,]
Isaiah 53 10 Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the Lord shall prosper in his hand.
Is 46
10 Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:
Rev 18:20
20 Rejoice over her, O heaven, and you saints and apostles and prophets, for cGod has given judgment for you against her!”
Ez 5:13 13 “Thus shall my anger spend itself, and I will vent my fury upon them and satisfy myself. And they shall know that I am the Lord—that I have spoken in my jealousy—when I spend my fury upon them.
You can’t split that hair between his sovereign pleasure, and the pleasure he derives from his actions. It’s like heads and tails on a coin, they come together.
Ephesians 1:5
5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,]
Isaiah 53 10 Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the Lord shall prosper in his hand.
Is 46
10 Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:
Rev 18:20
20 Rejoice over her, O heaven, and you saints and apostles and prophets, for cGod has given judgment for you against her!”
Ez 5:13 13 “Thus shall my anger spend itself, and I will vent my fury upon them and satisfy myself. And they shall know that I am the Lord—that I have spoken in my jealousy—when I spend my fury upon them.
You can’t split that hair between his sovereign pleasure, and the pleasure he derives from his actions. It’s like heads and tails on a coin, they come together.
Yes exactly! You just agreed with me. He’s taking pleasure in their ruin, suffering, etc.
Everything God does, pleases him. It’s not just about his ability to will what he wants. If it was just about his ability to will what he wants, then those verses in Psalms would have said something along those lines, not something also involving his actual pleasure. The pleasure he derives from doing his will is all throughout scripture. You can’t separate the two.
Everything God does, pleases him. It’s not just about his ability to will what he wants. If it was just about his ability to will what he wants, then those verses in Psalms would have said something along those lines, not something also involving his actual pleasure. The pleasure he derives from doing his will is all throughout scripture. You can’t separate the two.
There is a reason the book of Psalms uses the word pleasure twice regarding this topic. If it was just about his ability to will what he wants, they would have used another term. It’s not just about his ability to will, it’s the pleasure he has in doing it. As referenced in various verses i showed where God was pleased with what he willed, whether it was things we’d consider good and happy, or things we usually consider less than pleasanT to go through.
In Rev God said to REJOICE at the destruction of the wicked.
Rev 18:20
20 Rejoice over her, O heaven, and you saints and apostles and prophets, for cGod has given judgment for you against her!”
It pleased God to bruise Jesus.
and So on and so forth.
So when he grants people to suffer, just like everything else he wills, it brings him pleasure.
In Rev God said to REJOICE at the destruction of the wicked.
Rev 18:20
20 Rejoice over her, O heaven, and you saints and apostles and prophets, for cGod has given judgment for you against her!”
It pleased God to bruise Jesus.
and So on and so forth.
So when he grants people to suffer, just like everything else he wills, it brings him pleasure.
Hello again Off, as I said in my last post, the Father allows suffering and has a purpose in it (FAR greater than the suffering itself), such as His Son coming here to die that horrible death on the Cross on our behalf, NOT because He was pleased BY the suffering itself, but because He was pleased with what RESULTED from it, from His Son's suffering and death, for us (e.g. the gracious atonement for and forgiveness of our sins, and eternal life).
John 3
16 God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.
Again, may He bless you as you seek to find Him and know Him!!
~Deuteronomy (David)
John 3
16 God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.
~Deuteronomy (David)