A very critical difference between the old and new covenants

[kennethcadwell]

This just proves you are unwilling to bend to the truth of what the words actually say.....good luck with your rejection of truth and denial of words and rebellious attitude toward the inspired word......!

You mean bend to what you consider truth, as I have read and looked at many study references on the subject and not one of them says this is speaking of hatred, anger, or jealousy as you have stated. Once again if you are an adversary to God you are not going to get eternal life.
Even Paul says over and over again that sins can not control your life as a believer, and even gave more than once lists of sins that can not even be part of our life.....And he states that if those things are in your life, then the truth is not.

 

[dcontroversal]

You mean bend to what you consider truth, as I have read and looked at many study references on the subject and not one of them says this is speaking of hatred, anger, or jealousy as you have stated. Once again if you are an adversary to God you are not going to get eternal life.
Even Paul says over and over again that sins can not control your life as a believer, and even gave more than once lists of sins that can not even be part of our life.....And he states that if those things are in your life, then the truth is not.

The Greek word Zelos is what it is....I don't care what commentaries teach...especially by men who are ignorant of truth and or unwilling to admit what words are actually used...like I said....reject the word and be wrong...just par for the course with you anyway.....!

 

[kennethcadwell]

The Greek word Zelos is what it is....I don't care what commentaries teach...especially by men who are ignorant of truth and or unwilling to admit what words are actually used...like I said....reject the word and be wrong...just par for the course with you anyway.....!

Well you should care about commentaries in study bibles and other reference sources on learning the bible, because these people have just as much man hours if not more then you on the subject and what is being said. The arrogance is believing that you are always 100% right, and anybody else that does not agree with you is wrong. I know many of main stream biblical scholars who have 1,000's of hours and over 20 years in leaning in the original Greek and Hebrew, and they do not twist that scripture just to mean hatred, anger, or jealousy.

And a cross reference to use with this scripture is where Paul says in Romans 6:16;
Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

If you are given over to live your life in willful sins, instead of walking in the righteousness ways of the Lord. Those sins are your master that will lead you to judgment and spiritual death, instead of doing the righteousness spiritual works that He said you would do leading to eternal life.
Then you have in Hebrews 10:31 that opens this all up for you, because here it says it is a fearful thing to find yourself in the hands of God. Reason being is because if you find yourself standing before God and the great white judgment, instead of in front of Jesus and the mercy seat. Then you know that your judgment will be sent to the lake of fire, and not eternal life.

Hebrews 10:31
It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

 

[kennethcadwell]

Hebrews 10:27 N-NNS
GRK: καὶ πυρὸς ζῆλος ἐσθίειν μέλλοντος
NAS: of judgment and THE FURY OF A FIRE
KJV: fiery indignation, which shall
INT: and of fire fury to devour about

 

[dcontroversal]

Well you should care about commentaries in study bibles and other reference sources on learning the bible, because these people have just as much man hours if not more then you on the subject and what is being said. The arrogance is believing that you are always 100% right, and anybody else that does not agree with you is wrong. I know many of main stream biblical scholars who have 1,000's of hours and over 20 years in leaning in the original Greek and Hebrew, and they do not twist that scripture just to mean hatred, anger, or jealousy.

And a cross reference to use with this scripture is where Paul says in Romans 6:16;
Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

If you are given over to live your life in willful sins, instead of walking in the righteousness ways of the Lord. Those sins are your master that will lead you to judgment and spiritual death, instead of doing the righteousness spiritual works that He said you would do leading to eternal life.
Then you have in Hebrews 10:31 that opens this all up for you, because here it says it is a fearful thing to find yourself in the hands of God. Reason being is because if you find yourself standing before God and the great white judgment, instead of in front of Jesus and the mercy seat. Then you know that your judgment will be sent to the lake of fire, and not eternal life.

Hebrews 10:31
It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

More fluff balls and a rejection of truth while misapplying the word......

Zelos=zeal or jealousy
Orge-wrath

Keep rejecting truth Kenneth....like I said..it is what you do best...especially when it contradicts your erroneous view.....!

EVERY WORD of GOD IS INSPIRED and to reject WORDS in CONTEXT leads to errors......so...believe the MEN who you follow..as for me I will believe the INSPIRED WORD THAT GOD gave--->ZELOS

 

[AtonedFor]

One's outer actions do have to show that their belief in Him is true.
If you continue walking in sins, hatred, unforgiveness, and no mercy toward others
the bible says the Truth is not in you.

Yes, but worse than that, and more condemning than that ...

IF these sins against the Lord are NOT sincerely repented of before death,
the guilty one will NOT be allowed in ... to Heaven. Guaranteed.

 

[kennethcadwell]

More fluff balls and a rejection of truth while misapplying the word......

Zelos=zeal or jealousy
Orge-wrath

Keep rejecting truth Kenneth....like I said..it is what you do best...especially when it contradicts your erroneous view.....!

EVERY WORD of GOD IS INSPIRED and to reject WORDS in CONTEXT leads to errors......so...believe the MEN who you follow..as for me I will believe the INSPIRED WORD THAT GOD gave--->ZELOS

Really, in post #224 shows you how the Greek word zelos was used in this scripture of Hebrews 10:27. And it doesn't change the meaning as have been stated by me and many others.

 

[AtonedFor]

Paul says over and over again that sins can not control your life as a believer,
and even gave more than once lists of sins that can not even be part of our life.....
And he states that if those things are in your life, then the truth is not.

Worse than that, and even more condemning than that ...

IF anyone is habitually involved w/o repentance
in any of the sins in these several SIN LISTS,
they will NOT inherit the kingdom of God/Heaven,
which is analogous to Heaven itself! Guaranteed.

But, perhaps the point is: PROBABLY ...
all true believers (the elect) will be persuaded by the precious Holy Spirit
to NOT be guilty of this rejection of God and His demands!

Even though true believers do have the free will to be fatally disobedient.

And, perhaps the point is: PROBABLY ...
all true believers (the elect) will be persuaded by the dire warnings in the NT
to NOT be guilty of this rejection of God and His demands!

 

[AtonedFor]

And a cross reference to use with this scripture is where Paul says in Romans 6:16;
Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey,
his servants ye are to whom ye obey;
whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

I haz found that precious few see what Paul is warning about in Romans 6.

They mucho prefer to believe his edifications about:
-- we are slaves to God
-- we are slaves of obedience leading to righteousness and holiness

REALLY!

GEE, THANKS FOR TELLIN' US ... 'CAUSE WE DIDN'T KNOW THAT.
OH, WELL, WE LEARN SOMETHIN' NEW EVERY DAY.

 

[kennethcadwell]

I haz found that precious few see what Paul is warning about in Romans 6.

They mucho prefer to believe his edifications about:
-- we are slaves to God
-- we are slaves of obedience leading to righteousness and holiness

REALLY!

GEE, THANKS FOR TELLIN' US ... 'CAUSE WE DIDN'T KNOW THAT.
OH, WELL, WE LEARN SOMETHIN' NEW EVERY DAY.

The thing that saddens me is the taking of one word, just one word, out of a scripture and trying to make it change the full the context of the entire scripture or passage. Or the other thing is to take only a handful of scriptures that they like, and not wanting to even pay attention or twist the others they don't like. And when the rest of us bring them up, we are considered teaching falsely. Sorry but the bible has those scriptures, not us, so their debate is really with God....

 

[dcontroversal]

The thing that saddens me is the taking of one word, just one word, out of a scripture and trying to make it change the full the context of the entire scripture or passage. Or the other thing is to take only a handful of scriptures that they like, and not wanting to even pay attention or twist the others they don't like. And when the rest of us bring them up, we are considered teaching falsely. Sorry but the bible has those scriptures, not us, so their debate is really with God....

It is obvious that you are blind to the fact that ONE word makes of breaks the context and turns the word of God into a LIE....so your point aimed at me above is invalid......I suggest you go back to Genesis and see how ONE word change everything and how it led to the fall of the human race and turned the truth into a lie and come on line with the fact that the GREEK word used in Hebrews 10 is the word for ZEAL and not WRATH!

 

[kennethcadwell]

It is obvious that you are blind to the fact that ONE word makes of breaks the context and turns the word of God into a LIE....so your point aimed at me above is invalid......I suggest you go back to Genesis and see how ONE word change everything and how it led to the fall of the human race and turned the truth into a lie and come on line with the fact that the GREEK word used in Hebrews 10 is the word for ZEAL and not WRATH!

It does only if that person is not educated in the word and have been falsely taught to go by what another has told them, and do not look into other translations. Those who want to pick and choose will always be lead falsely away from the truth, but those who actually have open minds and seek out the truth will find it. As the case goes with Hebrews 10:27 the Greek word zelos does not change the whole context, unless you try and force it to do so.........

Hebrews 10:27 N-NNS
GRK: καὶ πυρὸς ζῆλος ἐσθίειν μέλλοντος
NAS: of judgment and THE FURY OF A FIRE
KJV: fiery indignation, which shall
INT: and of fire fury to devour about

This is how zelos is applied here in Hebrews 10:27, and it still ends with the context of finding oneself in the fury, indignation, or judgment of cast into the lake of fire. Nobody is saved after judgment, as you are either saved into eternal life at the mercy seat, or you are cast into the lake of fire at the great white judgment of God. As verse 31 states that it will be fearful for you if you find yourself in front of God at judgment instead of the Lord at the mercy seat.

 

[dcontroversal]

It does only if that person is not educated in the word and have been falsely taught to go by what another has told them, and do not look into other translations. Those who want to pick and choose will always be lead falsely away from the truth, but those who actually have open minds and seek out the truth will find it. As the case goes with Hebrews 10:27 the Greek word zelos does not change the whole context, unless you try and force it to do so.........

Hebrews 10:27 N-NNS
GRK: καὶ πυρὸς ζῆλος ἐσθίειν μέλλοντος
NAS: of judgment and THE FURY OF A FIRE
KJV: fiery indignation, which shall
INT: and of fire fury to devour about

This is how zelos is applied here in Hebrews 10:27, and it still ends with the context of finding oneself in the fury, indignation, or judgment of cast into the lake of fire. Nobody is saved after judgment, as you are either saved into eternal life at the mercy seat, or you are cast into the lake of fire at the great white judgment of God. As verse 31 states that it will be fearful for you if you find yourself in front of God at judgment instead of the Lord at the mercy seat.

You should read the bolded above and take your own advice Kenneth as that is where you find yourself...choking on what some commentator has told you while refusing to be open to the truth....

Keep following men instead of the words of God and the perimeters set by the word and the definition of the words and you will find out for sure...albeit too late!

a literal GREEK translation...

fearful, but some expectation of judgment and of fire ZEAL to consume being about the adversaries.....

Par for the course with you...like I have said numerous times.....!

 

[kennethcadwell]

You should read the bolded above and take your own advice Kenneth as that is where you find yourself...choking on what some commentator has told you while refusing to be open to the truth....

Keep following men instead of the words of God and the perimeters set by the word and the definition of the words and you will find out for sure...albeit too late!

a literal GREEK translation...

fearful, but some expectation of judgment and of fire ZEAL to consume being about the adversaries.....

Par for the course with you...like I have said numerous times.....!

Sorry, but I do not pick and choose what scriptures to go by so this does not apply to me.
I go by the whole word of God, and not by what I was taught by another. As I just use other references as a cross reference, but if it does not compute with the bible I cancel it out and not pay attention to it.
You are now even reversing the words in the scripture which shows your study is not of the word, but what you have been told. As zelos comes before fire and not after as you have just reversed it. I showed you twice now how it was applied in this scripture from the Greek lexicon in post #224 and #232. I guess you keep over looking how I did that, and what I see from you is just your opinion of rewriting of the scripture.

 

[dcontroversal]

Sorry, but I do not pick and choose what scriptures to go by so this does not apply to me.
I go by the whole word of God, and not by what I was taught by another. As I just use other references as a cross reference, but if it does not compute with the bible I cancel it out and not pay attention to it.
You are now even reversing the words in the scripture which shows your study is not of the word, but what you have been told. As zelos comes before fire and not after as you have just reversed it. I showed you twice now how it was applied in this scripture from the Greek lexicon in post #224 and #232. I guess you keep over looking how I did that, and what I see from you is just your opinion of rewriting of the scripture.

another proof of your blindness Kenneth...I copied VERBATIM the GREEK TEXT that IS USED in translation of the NAS that you quote.......just goes to show that you have NO CLUE what you believe and or understand!

WHAT A FARCE!

 

[kennethcadwell]

another proof of your blindness Kenneth...I copied VERBATIM the GREEK TEXT that IS USED in translation of the NAS that you quote.......just goes to show that you have NO CLUE what you believe and or understand!

WHAT A FARCE!

Really, it sure doesn't show that as there is no cross reference or anything from where you got it from. As it looks just like you just typed it up from your own hand. As I gave you the exact usage from this passage from the Greek lexicon in two previous posts, and each time it does not change the word order, or the meaning of the context. Forcing a change in context will always make a wrong contextual meaning, that and plus not using other scriptures to interpret each other. Scripture to interpret scripture !!!!

Because once again there is nobody saved after judgment, and this passage being discussed is what happens at judgment when you stand before God. Not what happens while still walking in the flesh, as it is showing the outcome if you continue to walk in darkness (willful sins) instead of walking in light (Spirit unto righteousness leading to eternal life).....

 

[dcontroversal]

Really, it sure doesn't show that as there is no cross reference or anything from where you got it from. As it looks just like you just typed it up from your own hand. As I gave you the exact usage from this passage from the Greek lexicon in two previous posts, and each time it does not change the word order, or the meaning of the context. Forcing a change in context will always make a wrong contextual meaning, that and plus not using other scriptures to interpret each other. Scripture to interpret scripture !!!!

Because once again there is nobody saved after judgment, and this passage being discussed is what happens at judgment when you stand before God. Not what happens while still walking in the flesh, as it is showing the outcome if you continue to walk in darkness (willful sins) instead of walking in light (Spirit unto righteousness leading to eternal life).....

This view also reeks of ignorance.....what do you suppose is meant by Paul when he talks of cutting someone loose for the destruction of the FLESH that the spirit may be saved in the day of Judgment? You are blind to the fact that sometimes GOD kills people in the FLESH and yet they remain a saved child of God.....

and NOW you accused me of LYING and making up a verse of scripture that supports what I am saying of the which rejects and contradicts your erroneous view....

I COPIED IT VERBATIM from the NASB/NIV Parallel New TESTAMENT in GREEK and ENGLISH so.....Satan rejected words as well and then accuses the brethren....!

Good luck with your rejection of truth and words dude....!

 

[kennethcadwell]

This view also reeks of ignorance.....what do you suppose is meant by Paul when he talks of cutting someone loose for the destruction of the FLESH that the spirit may be saved in the day of Judgment? You are blind to the fact that sometimes GOD kills people in the FLESH and yet they remain a saved child of God.....

and NOW you accused me of LYING and making up a verse of scripture that supports what I am saying of the which rejects and contradicts your erroneous view....

I COPIED IT VERBATIM from the NASB/NIV Parallel New TESTAMENT in GREEK and ENGLISH so.....Satan rejected words as well and then accuses the brethren....!

Good luck with your rejection of truth and words dude....!

Turning somebody over to satan in 1 Corinthians 5:5 does not have anything to do with allowing a person to live in willful sins, and still be saved at the end. It is talking about purging them out of the church, as their way of walking in darkness will corrupt other members. So you are to cast them out of the church, and not keep company with them. And by being shunned it would hopefully make them take a look at themselves and come back in repentance. Turning away from the wrong way they are walking, and saving their spirit at the time of judgment. However if that person never repents then they will remain lost, and not headed toward eternal life but the second death in the lake of fire...

 

[dcontroversal]

Turning somebody over to satan in 1 Corinthians 5:5 does not have anything to do with allowing a person to live in willful sins, and still be saved at the end. It is talking about purging them out of the church, as their way of walking in darkness will corrupt other members. So you are to cast them out of the church, and not keep company with them. And by being shunned it would hopefully make them take a look at themselves and come back in repentance. Turning away from the wrong way they are walking, and saving their spirit at the time of judgment. However if that person never repents then they will remain lost, and not headed toward eternal life but the second death in the lake of fire...

Whatever dude....keep following your commentaries and man made theologies.....good luck! You are beyond the ability to learn a thing as to reject the very words inspired of God places you in a position that is not open to learning and instruction...so...good luck!

 

[damombomb]

hand this man over to Satan for the DESTRUCTION of the flesh, SO THAT THE SPIRIT MIGHT BE SAVED on the day of the Lord.


1corinthians 5:5
Means he was handed over to satan, example horrible sickness or something, so he would repent and call upon the Lord.…46where THEIR WORM DOES NOT DIE, AND THE FIRE IS NOT QUENCHED. 47"If your eye causes you to stumble, throw it out; it is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye, than, having two eyes, to be cast into hell, 48where THEIR WORM DOES NOT DIE, AND THE FIRE IS NOT QUENCHED.…