Are you saved if you are not obedient?

Depleted · Dec 7, 2017

All always means all or it wouldn't be called "all." It would be a different word. BUT some words have more than one way of using them.

Using the word "can" in a sentence -- Can you can the can of peas? Used correctly each time, but understood by context.

Same principle behind all. Understand the context and you understand the word.

Yeah, so you don't like that God who used Pharaoh in startling ways. And you don't like the God that killed thousands of his own people in the wilderness or who told them to commit complete genocide to clear out the Promise Land. Question for you. If you don't like that God, what choice do you get? Because he is the only God, and what he did wasn't evil.

9/11 was under God's sovereignty. Sandy Hook was under God's sovereignty. The Trail of Tears was under God's sovereignty. The death of my mother was under God's sovereignty. Someone pulling me off an operating table and pinching a nerve in my back without ever knowing what caused pain under my ribs and to my waist for another 15 years was under God's sovereignty. Some doctor hired by Social Security and lying about my husband was under God's sovereignty. Dad's Alzheimer is under God's sovereignty. Cancer, Hepatitis C, and a heart attack for hubby were all under God's sovereignty. Being raped by five men was under God's sovereignty. The Holocaust was under God's sovereignty.

Everything, absolutely everything, is under God's sovereignty. No apologizing needed. God is exactly who he said he is. The only problem is us coming to terms with that is the one and only God we serve!

Anything less than that truly is false doctrine!

Snoozy · Dec 7, 2017

Depleted said:

thats quite a list there. maybe u put too much blame on God.
just because God did the things in the bible to pharaoh and so on doesnt mean God does ALL evil in the universe. what purpose does the devil play when u got God doing all the evil already? its like God should be mad at Himself and casting Himself out of heaven with the devil then? if He does the same???? dont make no sense. why would Jesus tell pharisees their father the devil came only to _ _ and _ fill in the blanks. if He does the same?

that aint right.

we live in a fallen world.

Ecc 9:11 I returned, and saw under the sun, that the race is not to the swift, nor the battle to the strong, neither yet bread to the wise, nor yet riches to men of understanding, nor yet favour to men of skill; but time and chance happeneth to them all.

eternally-gratefull · Dec 7, 2017

God does not cause evil. He may not stop it (he would have to remove all free will) but he is not the cause.

What is amazing about God is he can take the evil that men do, and make something good come out of it, for those who love God.

Magenta · Dec 7, 2017

eternally-gratefull said:

Amen. Of all the things I hear people teaching about God,
saying that God ordains evil has got to be one of the worst.

LittleGirl · Dec 7, 2017

Rokurac said:

There are many threads about salvation being not of works, and how salvation occurs.

The other threads deal with how salvation occurs and are a merrygoround of one side saying saving faith is never void of works and one is saying you are not saved if you dont have works.
Its a never ending circle, so I wanna make a new thread with the purpose of asking a simple yes or no question.

Is an individual saved who is not obedient to Christ?

For Scripture I would bring up:

Hebrews 5:9
And having been made perfect, He became to all those who obey Him the source of eternal salvation,

NO.

John 14:15
John 14:21
John 15:6

Jesus speaking.

eternally-gratefull · Dec 7, 2017

LittleGirl said:

Are they saved BECAUSE they are obedient. Or are they OBEDIENT because they are saved?

LittleGirl · Dec 7, 2017

Snoozy said:

You're right, of course.
God does not cause any evil at all.
God is all good and no evil can come from an "entity" that is all good.

As Eternally Grateful stated, God allows evil to happen or He'd have to remove all free will.

It's not easy to reconcile free will with God's sovereignty, so some prefer to "blame" God for everything - to put it your way.

My two cents...

LittleGirl · Dec 7, 2017

eternally-gratefull said:

They're obedient because they're saved.
An unsaved person could follow all the rules and still not be saved because they have no faith in Christ.

However, if you bring it down to a yes or no answer, the answer is that we do have to be obedient.

Hizikyah · Dec 7, 2017

LittleGirl said:

John 14:15, "“If you love Me, you shall guard My commands."

John 14:21, "“He who possesses My commands and guards them, it is he who loves Me. And he who loves Me shall be loved by My Father, and I shall love him and manifest Myself to him.”"

John 15:6, "“If anyone does not stay in Me, he is thrown away as a branch and dries up. And they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned."

eternally-gratefull said:

Abiding in Him is the only way to walk in His ways;

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]John/Yahanan 15:5-16, "I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, produces much fruit; but without Me, you can do nothing. If anyone does not abide in Me, he is thrown away like a branch, and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned. If you abide in Me, and letting My words; abide in you, you will ask what you will, and it will be done for you. In this is My Father glorified: when you produce much fruit; and in this way you become My disciples. Just as the Father has loved Me, so have I loved you; continue in My love. If you keep My Commands, you will abide in My love; just as I have kept My Father's Commands, and abide in His love. These things I have spoken to you, that My joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be complete. This is My Command: Love one another as I have loved you. Greater love has no one than this: that one would lay down his life on behalf of his brothers. You are My brothers, if you do whatever I command you."[/FONT]

Keeping His commands shows we are loving and by THIS WE KNOW:

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1 John 5:2-3, "By this we know that we love the children of Yah, when we love Yah and guard His commands. For this is the love for Yah, that we guard His commands, and His commands are not heavy."[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]

that is why it is written:

[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]2 Timothy 2:19, "However, the solid foundation of Yah stands firm, having this seal*, “ [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]knows those who are His, Let everyone who names the Name of Messiah turn away from unrighteousness.”

Strong's Concordance *"seal"is word #G4973 - sphragis: a seal, a signet, Original Word: σφραγίς, ῖδος, ἡ, Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine, Transliteration: sphragis, Phonetic Spelling: (sfrag-ece'), Short Definition: a signet-ring, impression of a seal, the proof, Definition: a seal, signet ring, the impression of a seal, that which the seal attests, the proof.

Same in the OT and the NT:

[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif][/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Exodus 13:9, “And it shall be as a *sign to you on your hand and as a reminder between your eyes, that the Torah (Instructions/Law) of [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]is to be in your mouth, for with a strong hand [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]has brought you out of Mitsrayim.”

The word *Sign is word #H226 – owth from Strong's Exhaustive Concordance, Hebrew Dictionary: meaning mark, token, sign, consent, flag, evidence of consent.[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif][/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif][/FONT]That is why it is written:

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1 Yahanan /John 2:3-7, “And by this we know that we know Him, if we guard His commands. The one who says, “I know Him,” and does not guard His commands, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. But whoever guards His Word, truly the love of Yah has been perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. The one who says he stays in Him ought himself also to walk, even as He walked. Beloved, I write no fresh command to you, but an old command which you have had from the beginning. The old command is the Word which you heard from the beginning.”

[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Genesis 1:1, “In the beginning Elohim created the heavens and the earth.”[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Deuteronomy 6:5, “And you shall love [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]your Strength with all your heart, and with all your being, and with all your might.”[/FONT][/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Leviticus 19:18, ‘Do not take vengeance or bear a grudge against the children of your people. And you shall love your neighbor as yourself. I am [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif].”[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Mat 22:37-40, "Yahshua said to him: You must love YHWH your Father with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your might. (Deut 6:5) This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. (Lev 19:18) On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets."[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Mat 4:4, “But He answering, said, “It has been written, ‘Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that comes from the mouth of [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif].” (Deut 8:3)[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]
[/FONT]

Hizikyah · Dec 7, 2017

LittleGirl said:

Revelation 14:12-13, “Here is the endurance of the set-apart ones, here are those guarding the Commands of יהוה and the Belief of יהושע. And I heard a voice out of the heaven saying to me, Write, Blessed are the dead who die in the Master from now on. Yes, says the Spirit, in order that they rest from their labors, and their works follow with them.”

guarding the Commands of יהוה :

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1 John 5:2-3, "By this we know that we love the children of Yah, when we love Yah and guard His commands. For this is the love for Yah, that we guard His commands, and His commands are not heavy."

Belief of יהושע:[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Mark 10:45, “For even the Son of Aḏam did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give His life a ransom for many.”[/FONT]

eternally-gratefull · Dec 7, 2017

LittleGirl said:

I agree, we are obedient because they are saved.

I would however change the last sentence though. If we say we HAVE to do something, we are depending on our own power. I Think john said it best when he said we do not sin because we have been born of God, Or another one who said he has perfected forever those he is in th process of sanctifying, or even paul where he said we are saved by grace through faith, but those saved are created for works. (It is their new nature)

eternally-gratefull · Dec 7, 2017

Hizikyah said:

John 14:15, "“If you love Me, you shall guard My commands."

John 14:21, "“He who possesses My commands and guards them, it is he who loves Me. And he who loves Me shall be loved by My Father, and I shall love him and manifest Myself to him.”"

John 15:6, "“If anyone does not stay in Me, he is thrown away as a branch and dries up. And they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned."

Abiding in Him is the only way to walk in His ways;

John/Yahanan 15:5-16, "I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, produces much fruit; but without Me, you can do nothing. If anyone does not abide in Me, he is thrown away like a branch, and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned. If you abide in Me, and letting My words; abide in you, you will ask what you will, and it will be done for you. In this is My Father glorified: when you produce much fruit; and in this way you become My disciples. Just as the Father has loved Me, so have I loved you; continue in My love. If you keep My Commands, you will abide in My love; just as I have kept My Father's Commands, and abide in His love. These things I have spoken to you, that My joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be complete. This is My Command: Love one another as I have loved you. Greater love has no one than this: that one would lay down his life on behalf of his brothers. You are My brothers, if you do whatever I command you."

Keeping His commands shows we are loving and by THIS WE KNOW:

1 John 5:2-3, "By this we know that we love the children of Yah, when we love Yah and guard His commands. For this is the love for Yah, that we guard His commands, and His commands are not heavy."

that is why it is written:

2 Timothy 2:19, "However, the solid foundation of Yah stands firm, having this seal*, “ יהוה knows those who are His, Let everyone who names the Name of Messiah turn away from unrighteousness.”

Strong's Concordance *"seal"is word #G4973 - sphragis: a seal, a signet, Original Word: σφραγίς, ῖδος, ἡ, Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine, Transliteration: sphragis, Phonetic Spelling: (sfrag-ece'), Short Definition: a signet-ring, impression of a seal, the proof, Definition: a seal, signet ring, the impression of a seal, that which the seal attests, the proof.

Same in the OT and the NT:

Exodus 13:9, “And it shall be as a *sign to you on your hand and as a reminder between your eyes, that the Torah (Instructions/Law) of יהוה is to be in your mouth, for with a strong hand יהוה has brought you out of Mitsrayim.”

The word *Sign is word #H226 – owth from Strong's Exhaustive Concordance, Hebrew Dictionary: meaning mark, token, sign, consent, flag, evidence of consent.

That is why it is written:

1 Yahanan /John 2:3-7, “And by this we know that we know Him, if we guard His commands. The one who says, “I know Him,” and does not guard His commands, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. But whoever guards His Word, truly the love of Yah has been perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. The one who says he stays in Him ought himself also to walk, even as He walked. Beloved, I write no fresh command to you, but an old command which you have had from the beginning. The old command is the Word which you heard from the beginning.”

Genesis 1:1, “In the beginning Elohim created the heavens and the earth.”

Deuteronomy 6:5, “And you shall love יהוה your Strength with all your heart, and with all your being, and with all your might.”

Leviticus 19:18, ‘Do not take vengeance or bear a grudge against the children of your people. And you shall love your neighbor as yourself. I am יהוה.”

Mat 22:37-40, "Yahshua said to him: You must love YHWH your Father with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your might. (Deut 6:5) This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. (Lev 19:18) On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets."

Mat 4:4, “But He answering, said, “It has been written, ‘Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that comes from the mouth of יהוה.” (Deut 8:3)

We must abide to produce fruit, if we are not producing fruit, he prunes us to help us make fruit, If that does not work, he lifts us up so we are not drowned out by the things of the world.

A man of God will work. There is no question about it, the question is HOW MANY WORKS will he produce.

A baby will not produce as much fruit as an adult.

Depleted · Dec 7, 2017

Snoozy said:

I give God "blame" because he deserved it. It's being "blamed" for a prefect record. Good to be "blamed" for that when true.

Are you simply ignoring The Book of Job? Job would not have lost his children, his herds, his fortune, and his health without God's divine approval. How do you deal with God gave his approval? And how do you gloss over what God told Job after God let him go through all of that?

This really is your problem, not God's problem or my problem. God is who God says he is. That's the God I love, and because of that, I have faced the fact/blame that some not-nice stuff happens because it works out for God's glory and my good. Can't really help that you ignored Job.

(BTW, Ecclesiastes? Written by the wisest man ever to be known on earth, and up there with one of the riches, and yet, even he at the end of his life was dealing with how much vanity happened in his life. ALSO good to get context! Wiping out tiny verses as prove-my-point isn't becoming of you. I know you aren't this most of the time. Why today?)

Depleted · Dec 7, 2017

eternally-gratefull said:

Kind of a dumb question since they weren't fully obedient any which way.

Hizikyah · Dec 7, 2017

eternally-gratefull said:

This is true, and I would say it's not about how nmany or more than this or that but about staying in His will, in thought and deed. Not always a smooth ride but staying in His will is the goal of the Command.

Depleted · Dec 7, 2017

LittleGirl said:

It's not good to add free will as a biblical principle either, since it's not one. I suspect you're relatively new in the Lord, and are being taught this "gospel" in your church. (Or, worse yet. You were raised into this, and never questioned what's being taught.) Might I make a suggestion? Do a word study on "free will" in the Bible.

I will give it will take you a lot of effort and quite a bit of time, but it will be worth it to you. It will make you dump all you're being taught until you see God's word for yourself, and then you will have a better understanding of when to question authority. More importantly, who has authority?

You're falling for propaganda tactics and simply because you're still stuck thinking older means smarter.

And, please notice, I'm not telling you what to believe. I'm asking you to look into it yourself. Because, on this site, lots of people think they know everything and want to plop their knowledge into the brains of anyone willing to listen.

Hizikyah · Dec 7, 2017

Depleted said:

Sister Depleated, I want to humby say I believe Free will is indeed true Scriptual principle:

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Free Will… Do we have free will and what are the consequences?

Psalm 11:4, "[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]is in His holy temple; [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]throne is in heaven; His eyes behold, His eyelids test the sons of men."[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Trial and being enticed/tempted are 2 different things, this experience is a trial, temptation is the desire to do evil, Yah guides none to evil, it is one's own desire that makes evil a desirable thing. James explains it better than I can;[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]James 1:12-18, “Blessed is the man who does endure trial, for when he has been proved, he shall receive the crown of life which the Master has promised to those who love Him. Let no one say when he is enticed, “I am enticed by Yah,” for Yah is not enticed by evil matters, and He entices no one. But each one is enticed when he is drawn away by his own desires and trapped. hen, when desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin. And sin, when it has been accomplished, brings forth death. Do not go astray, my beloved brothers. Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of light, with whom there is no change, nor shadow of turning. Having purposed it, He brought us forth by the Word of truth, for us to be a kind of first-fruits of His creatures.”

Joshua 24:15, “And if it seems evil in your eyes to serve [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif], choose for yourselves this day whom you are going to serve, whether the mighty ones which your fathers served that were beyond the River, or the mighty ones of the Amorites, in whose land you dwell. But I and my house, we serve [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif].”

John 7:17, “If anyone chooses to do His desire, he shall know concerning the teaching, whether it is from YHWH, or whether I speak from Myself.”

“chooses” is word #G2309 θέλω thelo (the'-lō) v., ἐθέλω ethelo (e-the'-lō) , 1. to determine, i.e. choose or prefer., 2. (by implication) to wish, i.e. be inclined to., 3. (sometimes adverbially) gladly., 4. (impersonally for the future tense) to be about to., 5. (by Hebraism) to delight in., {literally or figuratively; as an active option from subjective impulse; whereas G1014 properly denotes rather a passive acquiescence in objective considerations}, [apparently strengthened from the alternate form of G138], KJV: desire, be disposed (forward), intend, list, love, mean, please, have rather, (be) will (have, -ling, - ling(-ly)) , Root(s): G138, Compare: G140, G1014

1 Corinthians 10:13, "No trial has overtaken you except such as is common to man, and YHWH is trustworthy, who shall not allow you to be tried beyond what you are able, but with the trial shall also make the way of escape, enabling you to bear it."[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Genesis 2:16-17, “And [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Mighty commanded the man, saying, “Eat of every tree of the garden, but do not eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for in the day that you eat of it you shall certainly die.”[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Genesis 4:7, “If you do right, will it not be accepted? If you don’t do right, sin crouches at the door. Its desire is for you, but you are to rule over it.”

Deuteronomy 30:19-20, “I have called the heavens and the earth as witnesses today against you: I have set before you life and death, the blessing and the curse. Therefore you shall choose life, so that you live, both you and your seed, to love [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]your Strength, to obey His voice, and to cling to Him – for He is your life and the length of your days – to dwell in the land which [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]swore to your fathers, to Aḇraham, to Yitsḥaq, and to Ya‛aqoḇ, to give them.”[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]
Psalm 9:7-8, “But [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]abides forever, He is preparing His throne for judgment. And He judges the world in righteousness, He judges the peoples in straightness.”

Malachi 3:16-18, “Then those who reverenced [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]spoke often one to another, and [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]paid attention and heard them; and a Book of Remembrance was written in His presence of those who gave reverence to [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif], and who thought upon His Name; And they will be Mine! says [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]of hosts. In that day when I make up My jewels I will spare them, as a man spares his own son who serves him. Then you will return, and again discern between the righteous and the wicked, between him who serves[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif], and him who does not serve Him.”

This is a test to see who is fit for the Kingdom of Yah. For the Gospel is about how to enter the Kingdom of Yah.

Matthew 10:7, “And as you go, proclaim, saying, ‘The Kingdom of the heavens has drawn near.”

Mat 4:17, "From that time [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהושע [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]began to proclaim and to say, “Repent, for the Kingdom of the heavens has drawn near.”

He knows what we will do before we do it, but it is still our choice what we do day by day.
[/FONT]

peacefulbeliever · Dec 7, 2017

Depleted said:

Romans 3:5-8 . . .But if our unrighteousness demonstrates (highlights [HCSB]) the righteousness of God, what shall we say? The God who inflicts wrath is not unrighteous, is He? (I am speaking in human terms.) May it never be! For otherwise, how will God judge the world? But if through my lie the truth of God abounded to His glory, why am I also still being judged as a sinner? And why not say (as we are slanderously reported and as some claim that we say), “Let us do evil that good may come”? Their condemnation is just.People who say "Let us do evil so that good may come" will receive a righteous judgment - they shall be condemned. So - God who is JUST and delivers righteous judgement - does evil so that good may come? We are to be imitators of God - so we can do evil so that good may come???? . . . . Who is it that comes to steal, kill and destroy? God????

In the case of Pharaoh's "hardened heart", did God say that "he would harden Pharaoh's heart" because He already knew Pharaoh's character and knew that Pharaoh would harden his heart or did God actually do the hardening? God made Pharaoh harden his heart (sin) and then punished him for hardening his heart????? Is that righteous judgement? Were people killed in the OT? Yes . . . was their destruction due to disobedience? was their destruction due to idolatry? A consequence of their own sin? Wouldn't that be righteous judgement?

to the thread: Are we obedient 24/7? Do we one minute have Holy Spirit and then the next minute loose Holy Spirit? We are sealed until the day of redemption . . . when we sin - we are forgiven. So - I would say that if one is saved and they disobey - they are still saved.

shrume · Dec 7, 2017

Depleted said:

9/11 was under God's sovereignty. Sandy Hook was under God's sovereignty. The Trail of Tears was under God's sovereignty. The death of my mother was under God's sovereignty. Someone pulling me off an operating table and pinching a nerve in my back without ever knowing what caused pain under my ribs and to my waist for another 15 years was under God's sovereignty. Some doctor hired by Social Security and lying about my husband was under God's sovereignty. Dad's Alzheimer is under God's sovereignty. Cancer, Hepatitis C, and a heart attack for hubby were all under God's sovereignty. Being raped by five men was under God's sovereignty. The Holocaust was under God's sovereignty.

Please define what you mean by "under God's sovereignty".

If you think He had a hand in all those things, or that He condoned them, we serve different Gods.

Bladerunner · Dec 7, 2017

eternally-gratefull said:

I may be speaking out of turn here but all those times God use the enemy to defeat Israel and then He punished that enemy for attacking them was NOT, I say NOT because God went tot he dark side. He simply removed the restrain he had previous put on them. It was their evil intentions, Inherent in Man that caused them to attack Israel.

As a last point.....This is what the Millennium is all about. Man will not have NO influence from outside as Satan is locked up and out of the way. We Still see Man's evil abound. The point of the story is that Man does not need Satan to become or do evil. It was inherently brought on when Adam took a Bite of that Apple.

Rem, How you were told you are born into Sin. As a Child, you are unknowing thus innocent but evil is there waiting for just the right circumstances to come out.

Blade

Are you saved if you are not obedient?

Are you saved if you are not obedient to Christ?

Yes

No

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