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Did I miss something I never seen her mention Calvin, she did say that she posted in "Reformed vs Not-Reformed. She never said any thing about Calvin unless you consider posting Scriptures Calvin. Calvin wrote over 400 years ago there are many people that believe in a Biblical Doctrine of Predestination and Election that do not hold to Calvin's teachings. He simply rediscover what Augustus wrote who began to discover what Paul wrote, but neither one of them brought it to a full understanding. TULIP was not even around until after Calvin died and if it was it would not have been from Augustus, Luther or Calvin because they did not speak English. They believed in the Doctrines of Grace, the only deference between the two ideas is that one lifts up God in mans salvation and the other lifts up man in salvation. That's what the difference is. One God's grace is applied with-out anything being done by that person good or evil, not yet being born, because God by His foreknowledge choses people for salvation. If he looks down an see something being done by that person and that is the reason for Him electing that person. Than it's not foreknowledge, He acknowledges what the person will do in the future, but that's not what the Bible teaches. That would also be selection not election, because the choice was made a foreseen quality in that person, s foreseen faith. Which places man in charge of salvation not God and that is no longer grace, God's unmerited favor, that would be God's merited favor, don't know what that's call I just know it's not grace.
If you have faith before grace, again it's not grace, "For you are saved by grace through faith. Grace saves you, faith is the continues condition by which we are sanctified to receive our glorified bodies. Initial salvation by grace, continued salvation by faith. We are born again by grace, our eyes/ears are opened to the Gospel of truth, we respond in faith and repentance to receive our adoption or union with Christ by the life that the Spirit gave us granted by the Father. Our response of faith in repentance is when the Spirit seals us as the guarantee that we will receive our inheritance the blessed hope at His appearing or revelation. Calvin has nothing to do with that, it's our response to His loving us first.
I John 4:10 "In this is love, not that we have loved God but that he loved us and sent his Son to be the propitiation for our sins." We do not love God then He loves us, it's the other way around, God first, man response to God, God never response to man, if He did He could not be Lord. Notice how this and John 3:16 go together, “For God so loved the world,that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.”
Notice God loved the world in that He gave His Son, notice in I John 4:10 He sent His Son to be a propitiation for our sins, notice John 3:16 His death is to those that believe, in the Greek, believing/the believing ones/whoever is believing . That is why we love Him because he death for our sins, His death will cover all sin, but in the Father's foreknowledge and definite plan, He died for the believing or the elect and how do we know who the elect are they believe in Jesus or place their faith in His because by grace he died for us, for our sins.
If you have faith before grace, again it's not grace, "For you are saved by grace through faith. Grace saves you, faith is the continues condition by which we are sanctified to receive our glorified bodies. Initial salvation by grace, continued salvation by faith. We are born again by grace, our eyes/ears are opened to the Gospel of truth, we respond in faith and repentance to receive our adoption or union with Christ by the life that the Spirit gave us granted by the Father. Our response of faith in repentance is when the Spirit seals us as the guarantee that we will receive our inheritance the blessed hope at His appearing or revelation. Calvin has nothing to do with that, it's our response to His loving us first.
I John 4:10 "In this is love, not that we have loved God but that he loved us and sent his Son to be the propitiation for our sins." We do not love God then He loves us, it's the other way around, God first, man response to God, God never response to man, if He did He could not be Lord. Notice how this and John 3:16 go together, “For God so loved the world,that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.”
Notice God loved the world in that He gave His Son, notice in I John 4:10 He sent His Son to be a propitiation for our sins, notice John 3:16 His death is to those that believe, in the Greek, believing/the believing ones/whoever is believing . That is why we love Him because he death for our sins, His death will cover all sin, but in the Father's foreknowledge and definite plan, He died for the believing or the elect and how do we know who the elect are they believe in Jesus or place their faith in His because by grace he died for us, for our sins.
What does the bible say? We were chosen in Christ from before the creation of the world.[Ephesians 1:4]
In Romans 8 we have what is called the 'golden chain of redemption'...
And we know that in all things God works for the good of those who love him, who have been called according to his purpose.For those God foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstbornamong many brothers and sisters.And those he predestined, he also called; those he called, he also justified; those he justified, he also glorified.[vss 28-30]
Now, in verse 28 we see God predestined those He foreknew. Foreknew(foreknowledge) is not God simply looking through the portals of time and seeing those who He saw would have faith and electing them. That impugns His omniscience. God's foreknowledge is pre-arrangement. Look up the Greek word translated into foreknew(foreknowledge).
These He foreknew(pre-arranged) He predestined to be conformed to the image of the Christ. So God did not foreknow all in this manner, as many will die lost, not conformed to the Christ's image. Also, predestination is in regards to salvation and not reprobation.
These He predestined to be conformed to the image of the Christ, He also called. Again, this is talking about a particular ppl, and not everybody w/o exception. If He called everybody in this manner, everybody is saved. This is talking about the effectual call of the gospel, not the general call.
These He called, He also justified. Seeing we are justified by faith[Romans 5:1, Galatians 3:8], if God justified everybody, then all are saved. So again, this is talking about a particular ppl, and not everybody who ever lived.
And these ppl He justified, He also glorified. This is talking about the resurrection from the dead, when all the saints are given glorified bodies. Again, this is talking about a particular ppl, and not everybody whoever lived.
So, it is not I that is saying some are chosen to be saved and others not. The bible says this. I am just repeating what it avers. I rest in this, knowing my salvation was 100% God's work and 0% me.
In Romans 8 we have what is called the 'golden chain of redemption'...
And we know that in all things God works for the good of those who love him, who have been called according to his purpose.For those God foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstbornamong many brothers and sisters.And those he predestined, he also called; those he called, he also justified; those he justified, he also glorified.[vss 28-30]
Now, in verse 28 we see God predestined those He foreknew. Foreknew(foreknowledge) is not God simply looking through the portals of time and seeing those who He saw would have faith and electing them. That impugns His omniscience. God's foreknowledge is pre-arrangement. Look up the Greek word translated into foreknew(foreknowledge).
These He foreknew(pre-arranged) He predestined to be conformed to the image of the Christ. So God did not foreknow all in this manner, as many will die lost, not conformed to the Christ's image. Also, predestination is in regards to salvation and not reprobation.
These He predestined to be conformed to the image of the Christ, He also called. Again, this is talking about a particular ppl, and not everybody w/o exception. If He called everybody in this manner, everybody is saved. This is talking about the effectual call of the gospel, not the general call.
These He called, He also justified. Seeing we are justified by faith[Romans 5:1, Galatians 3:8], if God justified everybody, then all are saved. So again, this is talking about a particular ppl, and not everybody who ever lived.
And these ppl He justified, He also glorified. This is talking about the resurrection from the dead, when all the saints are given glorified bodies. Again, this is talking about a particular ppl, and not everybody whoever lived.
So, it is not I that is saying some are chosen to be saved and others not. The bible says this. I am just repeating what it avers. I rest in this, knowing my salvation was 100% God's work and 0% me.
D
Really? So you earn eternal life? You still didn't answer my question. Is eternal life just?
And you may ask yourself, "How do I work here?" And you may ask yourself, "Where is that large automobile?" (Name that tune. lol)
But many people ask many things, but absolutely no one asked "how does a person even be obedient to Faith If they are depraved," but you. No one was talking about that anymore than someone was talking about "How do I work here," so I see no relevance in your question but a poor job of skipping mine while responding to my post that did ask you something entirely different.
And you may ask yourself, "How do I work here?" And you may ask yourself, "Where is that large automobile?" (Name that tune. lol)
But many people ask many things, but absolutely no one asked "how does a person even be obedient to Faith If they are depraved," but you. No one was talking about that anymore than someone was talking about "How do I work here," so I see no relevance in your question but a poor job of skipping mine while responding to my post that did ask you something entirely different.
Me too. Got tired of the lies and the
Kind of like fly -- always buzzing around and contributing nothing but disease.
Kind of like fly -- always buzzing around and contributing nothing but disease.
Ppl are ticked off they have no say in their salvation. Like God needs, wants, expects, or asks their permission. Pffffft!!!!
Love the cop out from those who don't believe the testimony of Scripture; "So, are you saying...?"
No. You're being shown what Scripture says. Read it. It's right there. You're supposed to be Christians, His people. Again, read it. He said it. You claim He's your Father, and this is what He has said, and you act like you've never seen what is plainly there. Something is surely amiss then if you cannot see it while claiming Him as Father.
No. You're being shown what Scripture says. Read it. It's right there. You're supposed to be Christians, His people. Again, read it. He said it. You claim He's your Father, and this is what He has said, and you act like you've never seen what is plainly there. Something is surely amiss then if you cannot see it while claiming Him as Father.