Let's Take a Deeper Look at this Hyper Stuff

[Grace777x70]

People that speak of the glorious grace of Christ and what He has done use the scriptures to prove what they believe.

God does not "show people" that believing in the finished work of Christ is wrong and not Biblical despite the fact that it may "conflict" with what they believe from their different church backgrounds.

The maligning of the so-called hyper grace gospel of the Lord Jesus Christ is what is not Biblical. It "conflicts" with some church traditions and thus it has been mis-represented in so many ways. Things that are said get "twisted" to make it "appear" to be something else and then they attack the "twisted" version.

Here is an example:

Someone says " The sky is so blue...isn't it beautiful?"

Another hears this person speak and says " What?...you are a false teacher...the sky is not green...everyone knows it is blue."


We are allowed to have different views without people maligning others and at the very least they need to say what is really being spoken accurately so that things can be discussed in an honest manner. They are allowed to disagree as well. No one is asking for people to agree with everything anyone says - just be honest in what is really being said and represent it accurately.


People use the bible as if it is God. The scriptures themselves are not God. They are to lead us to Christ. Jesus Himself said that very fact.

John 5:39-40 (NASB)
[SUP]39 [/SUP] "You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; it is these that testify about Me;

[SUP]40 [/SUP] and you are unwilling to come to Me so that you may have life.

We can have our heads full of Bible knowledge but not really know what they are saying unless the scriptures are illuminated by the Holy Spirit to reveal Christ to us.

The scribes in Jesus' day knew the scriptures but they did not know what they meant or that they were referring to Christ. We can memorize the scriptures, be able to quote 1/2 the NT, read it fluently in Greek, Hebrew, Aramaic, pray 5 hours a day, go to every church service - and still not know the meaning of the scriptures and how they reveal Christ to us.

What it all boils down to is this: people have different interpretations of some scriptures. We are all a product of what we have studied or learned from our religious upbringing. Even people that go to seminary or bible school will come out with what that denomination teaches of the school they went to.

If that place where we study from doesn't believe in the gifts of the Spirit are for today - that student will come out of that school believing the same thing. If they do go to a place that believes the gifts of the Spirit are in operation today - then they will come out believing the same thing as they were taught. The interesting thing is that both groups will use the "Greek and Hebrew" to back up their beliefs.

Never allow anyone to try to "lord it over you in your faith toward the Lord Jesus Christ" with what they have studied and thus their "interpretation" of the scriptures is the right one so you have to listen to what "they" say it means. This is part of the doctrine of the Nicolaitans which Jesus hates.

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We should always listen to everyone as the Holy Spirit is in all of us and He is the One that reveals all of Jesus and the things that God has done for us. Personally I love to look at the Greek as it has many shades of meaning but we can read "Greek and Hebrew" through the eyes of our natural mind too so we are still dependent on the Holy Spirit to reveal Jesus in them.

I firmly believe that we are just as dependent on the Holy Spirit to reveal Jesus in the scriptures ( No matter what language you read it in ) to us, as Mary was dependent on the Holy spirit to conceive Jesus in her womb.

So, I encourage all of us to listen to everyone and pray to discern what is of God and what is not. We can trust the Holy Spirit in us to reveal Jesus. He will be faithful to us.

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

GM G777! I came to forum to share what God showed me this morning. I thought it would help us some more.

He had me in 1 Peter 2-5. Bear with me - it is relevant to our struggles here.

"...His Spirit has made you holy. As a result, you have obeyed Him [the obedience of faith] and been cleansed by the blood...may He give you more and more grace...it is by His great mercy that we have been born again...and through your faith, God is protecting you by His power..."

You know me by now, so you could guess quite easily that I take "has made you holy" to mean - has set me apart for Himself,"
because I think I have grown in holiness and by more and more of His grace, will continue to do so, but don't believe I am holy but am growing more holy. (Maybe one day I will need to listen to you speak about holy and sanctified and what it is that you see differently. I'm sure you have something there that I don't, but even if so, if my understanding results in less trust in me and more trust in Him, I don't believe I am harmed by seeing it how I do for now.

So, whether one believes they are holy or believes they grow more holy, it doesn't matter because it saysit's His SPIRIT that has made us holy. So my point is that this is not any cause for any boasting (unless you want to boast about how kind He has been to you.) No boasting because of the words "it is HIS SPIRIT that made me holy."

Next, "As a result, you have obeyed Him"
This is saying that I have obeyed Him AS A RESULT of what Peter said directly before.
I have obeyed Him as a result of receiving this Spirit that "made me holy."
So my point is, no boasting - because of those words that say my obedience of faith is a result of having received this Spirit.

Next. "It is by His great mercy that we have been born again."
So, once again, no boasting. Because of those words "it is by His mercy."
No boasting that I made a good choice and other men refuse to make a good choice because "it is by His mercy..."

Next he says "through your faith, God is protecting you."

All of this shows clearly that there is never cause for any boast because "His Spirit made me holy" and the result was my obedience of faith.

Some seem to us to boast in the mercies and graces of God as if they do a good thing by their obedience of faith, but Peter shows that none of this and its results came by me but solely through the marvelous grace of God. (Even my trust in Him (faith) was not something that came by me, as it says elsewhere in the bible also.)

But then we seem to others as if we speak evil when we say we had nothing to do with it - it was all by Gods' grace.

So this that Peter says makes us all the more sure that we know Gods' mind in this matter and that we can never now be swayed again to ever think that we speak evilly about Gods' grace.

So I hope I wasn't too convoluted for my point (or should I say Peters point) to be seen and you can see how relevant this is to our struggles here.

 

[FreeNChrist]

Christians working to diminish the significance of God's grace? Saying it should not be overemphasized? And appealing to the OT for justification of that? It is nothing more than a rejection of Christ Himself. The Apostle Paul, the apostle of grace, would be very surprised and disappointed to say the least.

Folks don't seem to understand that for Paul grace isn't the imparting of just some "thing" from God, but of God Himself. That in Jesus Christ the Gift and the Giver are as Tozer says, "organically one and inseparable". That, "always the two are found together. The Apostle Paul…never disassociates God's grace from God's crucified Son."

“If you take away the grace of God from the gospel you have extracted from it its very life-blood, and there is nothing left worth preaching, worth believing, or worth contending for. Grace is the soul of the gospel: without it the gospel is dead. Grace is the music of the gospel: without it the gospel is silent as to all comfort.” - Charles Spurgeon

 

[LaurenTM]

I understand when I explain Biblical grace people might think I'm teaching something I'm not.

As I've written other places my idea of sin is probably much stricter than most people.

Paul ran into the same issue.

If I say we should no longer be dominated by sin, I am accused of preaching perfectionism.
If I say grace empowers us to no longer desire sin, I am accused of preaching perverted grace.

Yet both view points are incomplete without the other.

I don't have a problem with the term hyper-grace because I actually want grace to abound, but not so we can sin, but so that we no longer desire to. So that we walk in the fullness of who we are in Christ.

Some preach less grace thinking it safer, I preach more grace knowing it stronger.

The issue I HAVE is that people don't have a right understanding of grace.

So let's start there...

Is Grace given?

1 Co 3:10 By the grace God has given me, I laid a foundation as a wise builder, and someone else is building on it. But each one should build with care.

Romans 12:3 For by the grace given me I say to every one of you: Do not think of yourself more highly than you ought, but think of yourself with sober judgment, according to the measure of faith God has given you.

Is grace given, linked to walking out who we are in Christ?

1 Co 15:10 But by the grace of God I am what I am, and His grace to me was not in vain. No, I worked harder than all of them--yet not I but the grace of God that was with me.

And here's Peter continually praying that we would have MORE grace...

2 Peter 1:2 May grace and peace be multiplied to you in the knowledge of God and of Jesus our Lord.

2 Peter 3:8 But grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To Him be the glory both now and to the day of eternity. Amen.

What about sin's connection to grace?

Romans 6:4 For sin will have no dominion over you, since you are not under law but under grace.

It is through humility we receive more grace...

James 4:6 But he gives more grace. Therefore it says, “God opposes the proud, but gives grace to the humble.”

And here's John...

John 1:16 And from his fullness we have all received, grace upon grace.

And here's Paul to Timothy his beloved spiritual son...

2 Tim 2:1 You then, my child, be strengthened by the grace that is in Christ Jesus

2 4:22 Tim The Lord be with your spirit. Grace be with you.

I am not afraid that people will take me wrong. That's on them.

Titus 1:15 To the pure, all things are pure, but to the defiled and unbelieving, nothing is pure; but both their minds and their consciences are defiled.

I will continue to preach the message of grace, until we see every form of sin bow.

I actually believe grace allows us to walk away from the dominion of sin as Paul declared.

And not just the "outward forms" but also the "inward forms".

And it doesn't happen by telling people what they can and can't do. It happens by them understanding the love and power of God. It happens through receiving and understanding grace.

And we can only give what we ourselves have received.
Talk doesn't transform, but His power does.

1 Co 4:20 For the kingdom of God does not consist in talk but in power.

And in regards to it being is His power that transforms us.

Here is my prayer:

Thank you Holy Spirit that you alone teach us, guide us, and give us grace to grow in Christ. It is your power that transforms us and I pray that people will embrace grace. In it's purest truest form. And then go and share with others. And just like John, Peter, and Paul they would pray for them to receive grace as well. So that we can get beyond this contention about "can we sin" and instead walk into "how can we truly love". So that we can reveal You to the world.

that, is what I understand about you Cee

and that issue is mine also

 

[LaurenTM]

I have not been able to get on a forum in months, so I have not seen any of them. If you suspect me of having "ulterior-motives" you are wrong, I am sincere. I did not come here seeking to trick anyone and go "aha!" like a pharisee. I despise what the Pharisees represented and hold honesty in higher regard from that. It's hard not to be insulted by your insinuation, but you don't know me so I have to try to be understanding. I guess have a good day, but know that I came here sincerely trying to learn. I will do so on my own then. God bless.

please do not put words in my mouth

 

[LaurenTM]

I personally think one of the things that make this discussion of grace difficult to understand is the fact that other things needed to understand are being left out. To truly study grace you must also look at other subjects; sin, repentance, justification, salvation, sanctification, forgiveness ect ect. It is like studying any other subject concerning God. You cannot study one subject without looking at others also.

It is like creating an "image" of God to represent God. It is completely impossible to create an image of God that reflects who God is. You cannot create an image of God that reflects every attribute of God. You can show some things like strength and power but where does love and kindness fit. Then you have the incommunicable attributes. How do you show immutability, omniscience, omnipresense ect. Impossible.

To study one part of something given us by God you must incule a study of others also. Without sin there is no need for grace. Without grace there is no sanctification. Without sactificstion there is no righteousness. One "part" of God includes all "parts" of God. Thus a study of Gods grace has to also include others that lead to and stem from Gods grace.

Here it seems we are trying to "define" grace by using "grace". Grace begins with God and ends with God but in the middle there is so much more. You cannot define the building of a house by looking at a finished house and saying "that is how you build a house".

that, is what I see also

I totally agree

and thank you

I have studied all those things and I am struggling to convey what you have just said rather eloquently

ps...I am by no means 'done' studying

 

[LaurenTM]

James is telling us, true religion is loving people who can't take care of themselves. Widows and orphans.

Staying unstained from the world has a lot to with bridling our tongues. Encouraging one another. Remember Jesus said our love for one another is how the world would know we are His disciples. But this is a moot point, because loving people is how we don't sin. So instead of focusing on not sinning, how about we say what He actually commanded. That we love each other. And in love we fulfill the law.

The issue I have with this, He keeps us from sinning stuff, is that while it is true, it is HALF the story, it doesn't release the power to actually love people. It is straining at gnats, but swallowing a camel.

Freedom releases the power to love one another!!!

Gal 5:13 For you were called to freedom, brothers. Only do not use your freedom as an opportunity for the flesh, but through love serve one another.

A perfect example is your comment, many people think being "unstained from the world" is about us doing something to be holy, the context shows us it's actually pointing to our conduct with other people.

Not sinning is self-focused, loving people is Christ-focused.

Here's what that Scripture is actually referring to:

19Know this, my beloved brothers: let every person be quick to hear, slow to speak, slow to anger; 20for the anger of man does not produce the righteousness of God. 21Therefore put away all filthiness and rampant wickedness and receive with meekness the implanted word, which is able to save your souls.

v21 is the conclusion point of v19 and v20.

25But the one who looks into the perfect law, the law of liberty, and perseveres, being no hearer who forgets but a doer who acts, he will be blessed in his doing.

v25: It's the law of liberty that actually leads us into functioning out of pure religion that you quoted. It's not the religion that means to bind, James is declaring TRUE religion which means there is a FALSE religion.

27Religion that is pure and undefiled before God, the Father, is this: to visit orphans and widows in their affliction, and to keep oneself unstained from the world.

v21 tells us that filthiness is not loving people.
v27 enforces this idea by saying to be unstained we must love one another.

But without an understanding of sin being empty of love the point is completely missed.

It doesn't at all mean what some people think it does. Missing the forest for the trees.

It's not about self-righteousness, it's about loving one another. As is most of the Bible.

People have replaced not sinning with self-righteousness. Instead of replacing not sinning with loving one another.

In my opinion...

There can be no complete Scriptural conversation about not sinning this side of the covenant that doesn't include the idea we are commanded to love one another. And that connection is drastically needed in the Body of Christ today.

you have really come through Cee

thank you so much!

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

Christians working to diminish the significance of God's grace? Saying it should not be overemphasized? And appealing to the OT for justification of that? It is nothing more than a rejection of Christ Himself. The Apostle Paul, the apostle of grace, would be very surprised and disappointed to say the least.

Folks don't seem to understand that for Paul grace isn't the imparting of just some "thing" from God, but of God Himself. That in Jesus Christ the Gift and the Giver are as Tozer says, "organically one and inseparable". That, "always the two are found together. The Apostle Paul…never disassociates God's grace from God's crucified Son."

“If you take away the grace of God from the gospel you have extracted from it its very life-blood, and there is nothing left worth preaching, worth believing, or worth contending for. Grace is the soul of the gospel: without it the gospel is dead. Grace is the music of the gospel: without it the gospel is silent as to all comfort.” - Charles Spurgeon

Oh my goodness! The second time I have been floored by a Spurgeon quote. Of all the old, dusty works I have found and collected and been helped so much by, I am puzzled how I never ran across Spurgeon! I will have to search on my kindle I guess. Oh wait...maybe he is not dead and that's why I haven't found him in any of the thrift stores...?

Sometimes I feel bad that I comb the thrift stores often, because when I find a treasure trove, I can tell it is because someones parent died and they donated their books. I profit so much by their old books. And marvel that they gave them away, not knowing what a treasure their parents left them in the books!

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

uhhh...it's probably not good that more of my friends are dead men than alive men...

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

Oh well, I can't help it. They are my friends.

 

[Grace777x70]

uhhh...it's probably not good that more of my friends are dead men than alive men...

LOL..they are all still alive...just not on this planet. You will see them when we go to be with the Lord....

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

LOL..they are all still alive...just not on this planet. You will see them when we go to be with the Lord....

HAHA!! I just came back because I was going to say: oh but wait...they AREN'T dead...! HAHA!

 

[LaurenTM]

So your obviously have not read the Major or Minor prophets lately. Why did they pull out their hair?

"And half of their children spoke the language of Ashdod, and they could not speak the language of Judah, but only the language of each people.25 And I confronted them and cursed them and beat some of them and pulled out their hair. And I made them take an oath in the name of God, saying, “You shall not give your daughters to their sons, or take their daughters for your sons or for yourselves.26 Did not Solomon king of Israel sin on account of such women? Among the many nations there was no king like him, and he was beloved by his God, and God made him king over all Israel. Nevertheless, foreign women made even him to sin.27 Shall we then listen to you and do all this great evil and act treacherously against our God by marrying foreign women?” Neh. 13:24-27.

Oh, right! It was sin! This was actually the only example of a prophet pulling out hair. And it wasn't his own, but rather the women who had intermarried with the remaining Judeans against God's express wishes.

As for rending their garments instead, more a sign of mourning or grief.

"The tearing of one’s clothes is an ancient tradition among the Jews, and it is associated with mourning, grief, and loss. The first mention of someone tearing his garments is in Genesis. “When Reuben returned to the cistern and saw that Joseph was not there, he tore his clothes” (Genesis 37:29). A short time later, “Jacob tore his clothes, put on sackcloth and mourned for his son many days” (Genesis 37:34) when he thought that Joseph had been killed."

There were times when people should have torn their garments but did not. The prophet Jeremiah received the Word of God concerning a soon-coming judgment on Judah. Jeremiah faithfully wrote the prophecy in a scroll and delivered it to King Jehoiakim. The king listened to the first part of the prophecy, but then he took a knife, cut the scroll in pieces, and burned it in a brazier (Jeremiah 36:23). This impious act was met with chilling stoicism from his aides: “The king and all his attendants who heard all these words showed no fear, nor did they tear their clothes” (verse 24). If ever there was a time to tear one’s clothes, this was it; but these men had no fear of God, no remorse, no conviction of sin.

http://www.gotquestions.org/tear-clothes-Bible.html


Hmm! No conviction of sin! That is certainly what my yearly read-through- the -Bible tells me. I thought you were more fluent in the Scriptures, Lauren, when you were last here. Or did you get swept away in this hypergrace nonsense, which reinterprets the Bible, and the entire purpose and meaning of why Jesus came to save us? From our sins, right?


Then there is this beautiful call to repentance in the book of Joel, Just before he prophesies that on the Day of Pentecost, the Hoily Spirit will descend.

"Yet even now,” declares the Lord,
“return to me with all your heart,
with fasting, with weeping, and with mourning;
13 and rend your hearts and not your garments.”
Return to the Lord your God,
for he is gracious and merciful,
slow to anger, and abounding in steadfast love;
and he relents over disaster.
14 Who knows whether he will not turn and relent,
and leave a blessing behind him,
a grain offering and a drink offering
for the Lord your God?" Joel 2:13

As far as your insults to me, you can veil it by not putting my name, as above, but you are still insulting me and holding grudges against me. I wonder what the living God thinks about that? Had you stayed a bit longer, you would have read my letter of apology. Well, that is water under the bridge.

At least I am honest! I directly quote the people who have posted things that are not Biblical and show them how and why I disagree. Because after 8 months of putting up with this lie, even getting taken in myself, despite my "pile of books and a Greek NT," I am tired of being pushed over by people who have an agenda. God graciously showed me where this hypergrace gospel was wrong and from the mouths of the people who were in fact pushing this take over of the BDF, why they were wrong. God is so good that when we go astray he brings us back. I pray that will happen to the people here who have been deceived by this false gospel. Even if I have to refute it point by point, using, yes - the Bible! And always the Greek NT. And of course, the Hebrew from time to time, although I am not as fluent in it as I once was.

I just had no idea that using the Bible and relying on it with the Holy Spirit leading is legalism or a lack of grace. Sad that sects of modern Christianity have come to this! (Speaking generally, of course, as you seem to think everything is "all about you.")

good grief

it was a figure of speech

why are some in this thread so ready to jump on anything they personally think indicates that someone is missing a part of their theology?

honestly Angela, I don't think you have a clue what some of us trying to say here

one person says I am comparing myself to an OT prophet and you decide I have not read the minor prophets lately

do you read your Bible from cover to cover every single day?

[FONT=&quot]I just had no idea that using the Bible and relying on it with the Holy Spirit leading is legalism or a lack of grace. Sad that sects of modern Christianity have come to this! (Speaking generally, of course, as you seem to think everything is "all about you.")[/FONT]

where do you get this from?

is all you have in your heart poison darts?

I'm not responding to you anymore. I honestly do not think you are 100% responsible for what you are posting at this time

whatever is going on with you, no one here caused it

God bless you. My last response to you.

 

[God4me]

GM G777! I came to forum to share what God showed me this morning. I thought it would help us some more.

He had me in 1 Peter 2-5. Bear with me - it is relevant to our struggles here.

"...His Spirit has made you holy. As a result, you have obeyed Him [the obedience of faith] and been cleansed by the blood...may He give you more and more grace...it is by His great mercy that we have been born again...and through your faith, God is protecting you by His power..."

You know me by now, so you could guess quite easily that I take "has made you holy" to mean - has set me apart for Himself,"
because I think I have grown in holiness and by more and more of His grace, will continue to do so, but don't believe I am holy but am growing more holy. (Maybe one day I will need to listen to you speak about holy and sanctified and what it is that you see differently. I'm sure you have something there that I don't, but even if so, if my understanding results in less trust in me and more trust in Him, I don't believe I am harmed by seeing it how I do for now.

So, whether one believes they are holy or believes they grow more holy, it doesn't matter because it saysit's His SPIRIT that has made us holy. So my point is that this is not any cause for any boasting (unless you want to boast about how kind He has been to you.) No boasting because of the words "it is HIS SPIRIT that made me holy."

Next, "As a result, you have obeyed Him"
This is saying that I have obeyed Him AS A RESULT of what Peter said directly before.
I have obeyed Him as a result of receiving this Spirit that "made me holy."
So my point is, no boasting - because of those words that say my obedience of faith is a result of having received this Spirit.

Next. "It is by His great mercy that we have been born again."
So, once again, no boasting. Because of those words "it is by His mercy."
No boasting that I made a good choice and other men refuse to make a good choice because "it is by His mercy..."

Next he says "through your faith, God is protecting you."

All of this shows clearly that there is never cause for any boast because "His Spirit made me holy" and the result was my obedience of faith.

Some seem to us to boast in the mercies and graces of God as if they do a good thing by their obedience of faith, but Peter shows that none of this and its results came by me but solely through the marvelous grace of God. (Even my trust in Him (faith) was not something that came by me, as it says elsewhere in the bible also.)

But then we seem to others as if we speak evil when we say we had nothing to do with it - it was all by Gods' grace.

So this that Peter says makes us all the more sure that we know Gods' mind in this matter and that we can never now be swayed again to ever think that we speak evilly about Gods' grace.

So I hope I wasn't too convoluted for my point (or should I say Peters point) to be seen and you can see how relevant this is to our struggles here.

You have overlooked 1 Pet 1: 15--16,
1 Pet : 2: 11--12. 1 Pet 3: 10--15.
1 Pet 4: 1--2.

So ask yourself, who gave you that revelation? ?

As God doesn't give half truths.

 

[Vigil]

please do not put words in my mouth

I did not, but you heavily implied as such by saying that "I had an idea of what I was going to say before coming into this thread." which is completely false. I did not. I came into this thread objectively.

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

You have overlooked 1 Pet 1: 15--16,
1 Pet : 2: 11--12. 1 Pet 3: 10--15.
1 Pet 4: 1--2.

So ask yourself, who gave you that revelation? ?

As God doesn't give half truths.

But now you must be holy in everything you do. That's the first one you gave. But it is the Holy Spirit who makes us holy, as he said just before. The temple surely can't be holy without the Spirit that MAKES it holy. So should the temple boast that it has, or is, making itself holy by the obedience of faith that was not of itself, but was the "Result" as Peter says, of the Spirit in it.

The next one, I must be holy because God is holy. The temple can strive all it wants to be as holy as God, but it will just be caught up in ridiculousness, as it is only the Spirit of God that can, or does, make it holy, as Peter said before. The axe can't boast to the hand that it has hewn a log by it's own effort. The axe is a tool.

Maybe it would not benefit anyone for me to go further. If the first two verses I addressed make one want to reject Peters entire opening, I don't see what good could come of addressing the rest of the vss you give...

 

[God4me]

But now you must be holy in everything you do. That's the first one you gave. But it is the Holy Spirit who makes us holy, as he said just before. The temple surely can't be holy without the Spirit that MAKES it holy. So should the temple boast that it has, or is, making itself holy by the obedience of faith that was not of itself, but was the "Result" as Peter says, of the Spirit in it.

The next one, I must be holy because God is holy. The temple can strive all it wants to be as holy as God, but it will just be caught up in ridiculousness, as it is only the Spirit of God that can, or does, make it holy, as Peter said before. The axe can't boast to the hand that it has hewn a log by it's own effort. The axe is a tool.

Maybe it would not benefit anyone for me to go further. If the first two verses I addressed make one want to reject Peters entire opening, I don't see what good could come of addressing the rest of the vss you give...

The Holy Spirit does give us the ability to be holy, But He isn't a dictator, and we have to choose to live holy.

Being holy, isn't a polite suggestions, It's a command, "BE YE HOLY", And Peter wasn't talking to the Holy Spirit, he was talking to us.
To trouble with the false grace teachers, is, They only give God's part, and they say for us to do something, is being legalistic and is a work, and not grace.

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

The Holy Spirit does give us the ability to be holy, But He isn't a dictator, and we have to choose to live holy.

Being holy, isn't a polite suggestions, It's a command, "BE YE HOLY", And Peter wasn't talking to the Holy Spirit, he was talking to us.
To trouble with the false grace teachers, is, They only give God's part, and they say for us to do something, is being legalistic and is a work, and not grace.

Give me an example of the things you do so that you will be holy. Maybe then I will understand you.

 

[Willie-T]

Give me an example of the things you do so that you will be holy. Maybe then I will understand you.

Exactly!

I honestly don't think he has the slightest idea what is meant by "Be Holy."

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

Exactly!

I honestly don't think he has the slightest idea what is meant by "Be Holy."

Not helpful, willie.
Send your wife in here mister grumbly.