Mormons / Latter Day Saints
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1 Timothy 4:1 (HCSB)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] Now the Spirit explicitly says that in later times some will depart from the faith, paying attention to deceitful spirits and the teachings of demons,
Matthew 24:23-27 (HCSB)
[SUP]23 [/SUP] “If anyone tells you then, ‘Look, here is the Messiah!’ or, ‘Over here!’ do not believe it!
[SUP]24 [/SUP] False messiahs and false prophets will arise and perform great signs and wonders to lead astray, if possible, even the elect.
[SUP]25 [/SUP] Take note: I have told you in advance.
[SUP]26 [/SUP] So if they tell you, ‘Look, He’s in the wilderness!’ don’t go out; ‘Look, He’s in the inner rooms!’ do not believe it.
[SUP]27 [/SUP] For as the lightning comes from the east and flashes as far as the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man.
AGAIN, give us the Chapter and Verse for your theologies, or they are bogus.
WHO is the Father to you?
Now the teachings about the coming economic collapse, is nothing new, Dr. John MacArthur was teaching about that coming world wide economic collapse back in 1978. And the Antichrist that rises to POWER by solving the enconomic crysis. That is STILL future, but perhaps SOON and very Soon.
I will not be here, I have been invited to the Wedding of Jesus Christ to the Church, and we leave just ahead of the Antichrist rising to full Power, but no man knows the day or the hour. http://christianchat.com/bible-disc...ng-out-bride-go-wedding-lamb.html#post1604022
2 Thessalonians 2:1-8 (NIV)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] Concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered to him, we ask you, brothers,
[SUP]2 [/SUP] not to become easily unsettled or alarmed by some prophecy, report or letter supposed to have come from us, saying that the day of the Lord has already come.
[SUP]3 [/SUP] Don't let anyone deceive you in any way, for that day will not come until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the man doomed to destruction.
[SUP]4 [/SUP] He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God's temple, proclaiming himself to be God.
[SUP]5 [/SUP] Don't you remember that when I was with you I used to tell you these things?
[SUP]6 [/SUP] And now you know what is holding him back, so that he may be revealed at the proper time.
[SUP]7 [/SUP] For the secret power of lawlessness is already at work; but the one who now holds it back will continue to do so till he is taken out of the way.
[SUP]8 [/SUP] And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will overthrow with the breath of his mouth and destroy by the splendor of his coming.
Revelation 3:10-11 (ASV)
[SUP]10 [/SUP] Because thou didst keep the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of trial, that hour which is to come upon the whole world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.
[SUP]11 [/SUP] I come quickly: hold fast that which thou hast, that no one take thy crown.
Even if we see the beginnings of the Collaspe, it will not get me down. I still have my Bow and my broadhead hunting arrows, and I still know how to hunt. Plus, I am not too proud to eat road-kill stew.
WHO is the Father to you?
Now the teachings about the coming economic collapse, is nothing new, Dr. John MacArthur was teaching about that coming world wide economic collapse back in 1978. And the Antichrist that rises to POWER by solving the enconomic crysis. That is STILL future, but perhaps SOON and very Soon.
I will not be here, I have been invited to the Wedding of Jesus Christ to the Church, and we leave just ahead of the Antichrist rising to full Power, but no man knows the day or the hour. http://christianchat.com/bible-disc...ng-out-bride-go-wedding-lamb.html#post1604022
2 Thessalonians 2:1-8 (NIV)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] Concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered to him, we ask you, brothers,
[SUP]2 [/SUP] not to become easily unsettled or alarmed by some prophecy, report or letter supposed to have come from us, saying that the day of the Lord has already come.
[SUP]3 [/SUP] Don't let anyone deceive you in any way, for that day will not come until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the man doomed to destruction.
[SUP]4 [/SUP] He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God's temple, proclaiming himself to be God.
[SUP]5 [/SUP] Don't you remember that when I was with you I used to tell you these things?
[SUP]6 [/SUP] And now you know what is holding him back, so that he may be revealed at the proper time.
[SUP]7 [/SUP] For the secret power of lawlessness is already at work; but the one who now holds it back will continue to do so till he is taken out of the way.
[SUP]8 [/SUP] And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will overthrow with the breath of his mouth and destroy by the splendor of his coming.
Revelation 3:10-11 (ASV)
[SUP]10 [/SUP] Because thou didst keep the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of trial, that hour which is to come upon the whole world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.
[SUP]11 [/SUP] I come quickly: hold fast that which thou hast, that no one take thy crown.
Even if we see the beginnings of the Collaspe, it will not get me down. I still have my Bow and my broadhead hunting arrows, and I still know how to hunt. Plus, I am not too proud to eat road-kill stew.
I can tell you what this means but remember you're still looking for Him in man made buildings. The kingdom is within me. The Lord lives in me if the kingdom is there. That which is outside of ourselves vanity and the chasing after the wind.
I simply attempt to manifest what I see in my heart. I want to believe Him and put it to the test. All that can happen to me is what all will go through one way or another.
I simply attempt to manifest what I see in my heart. I want to believe Him and put it to the test. All that can happen to me is what all will go through one way or another.
That is a formula for seeing and believing the doctrines of demons. HOW DO I KNOW THIS? HERE IS HOW THE BIBLE SAYS WE ARE TO DISCERN TRUTH:
Acts 17:11 (NIV)
[SUP]11 [/SUP] Now the Bereans were of more noble character than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true.
So far you are not telling me anything worth anything. Opinions, without supporting them with Scripture are WORTHLESS.
Here He is out in the Wilderness is a reference to NEW AGE Gurus, who claim to be the reincarnation of Christ, such as Lord Maitreya. Here He is in the Inner Rooms is reference to the Watchtower Publishing House. Jehovah Witnesses, who claim there was no physical resurrection, and He already returned as a Spirit, and indwells the Watchtower Publishing House controlling everything that is published there so that it is equal to the Word of GOD.
As far as the Kingdom being within you, NOT until you are born again, and you get down off the throne in your heart and willingly out of LOVE given Him that Throne as your GOD and LORD for the rest of your life.
Night.
Acts 17:11 (NIV)
[SUP]11 [/SUP] Now the Bereans were of more noble character than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true.
So far you are not telling me anything worth anything. Opinions, without supporting them with Scripture are WORTHLESS.
Here He is out in the Wilderness is a reference to NEW AGE Gurus, who claim to be the reincarnation of Christ, such as Lord Maitreya. Here He is in the Inner Rooms is reference to the Watchtower Publishing House. Jehovah Witnesses, who claim there was no physical resurrection, and He already returned as a Spirit, and indwells the Watchtower Publishing House controlling everything that is published there so that it is equal to the Word of GOD.
As far as the Kingdom being within you, NOT until you are born again, and you get down off the throne in your heart and willingly out of LOVE given Him that Throne as your GOD and LORD for the rest of your life.
Night.
From the BIBLE, YES.
THAT BRINGS UP A VERY GOOD POINT! WE NEED TO FIND OUR COMMON GROUND IN THE BIBLE TO KNOW WE UNDERSTAND EACH OTHER. SO I have a few questions for the three of you, to see if we can agree on some truths about the BIBLE.
Dan_473 AND daniel606 AND Flamingspirit
Do you respect and trust the BIBLE (Gen. 1:1 through Rev. 22:21), as the inspired Word of GOD?
Do you believe that in the original hand written manuscripts the BIBLE (Gen. 1:1 through Rev. 22:21), was inspired by GOD perfectly?
Do you believe that our All Powerful, HOLY GOD, has the ability to control the thoughts of Translation Teams who submit to the HOLY SPIRIT's leading, to KEEP HIS thoughts and intents (what it means by what it says) in the BIBLE as it is translated into any LANGUAGE?
Is this verse NOT proof that GOD intended HIS WORD the BIBLE to be translated into every language?
Matthew 28:19 (NIV)
[SUP]19 [/SUP] Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,
Do you therefore believe that Translating the BIBLE (Gen. 1:1 through Rev. 22:21) into the languages of the people, was and is a WORK that GOD Himself is involved in?
Now comes the stumbling block question.
Do you believe that anytime, any other writings or theologies CONTRADICT what the BIBLE (Gen. 1:1 through Rev. 22:21) actually says, that it is the BIBLE that is TRUTH and not the other writings or theologies?
I can answer "ABSOLUTELY YES!", to all of the above questions; CAN YOU?
If you can answer "ABSOLUTELY YES!" to all of the above questions too, then we really have something SOLID that we can build our discussions on. If not then we are wasting our time chasing our own tails.
One last question:
When interpreted correctly, do you believe that there are absolutely NO contradictions in the BIBLE?
Again, I can answer "ABSOLUTELY YES!"
THAT BRINGS UP A VERY GOOD POINT! WE NEED TO FIND OUR COMMON GROUND IN THE BIBLE TO KNOW WE UNDERSTAND EACH OTHER. SO I have a few questions for the three of you, to see if we can agree on some truths about the BIBLE.
Dan_473 AND daniel606 AND Flamingspirit
Do you respect and trust the BIBLE (Gen. 1:1 through Rev. 22:21), as the inspired Word of GOD?
Do you believe that in the original hand written manuscripts the BIBLE (Gen. 1:1 through Rev. 22:21), was inspired by GOD perfectly?
Do you believe that our All Powerful, HOLY GOD, has the ability to control the thoughts of Translation Teams who submit to the HOLY SPIRIT's leading, to KEEP HIS thoughts and intents (what it means by what it says) in the BIBLE as it is translated into any LANGUAGE?
Is this verse NOT proof that GOD intended HIS WORD the BIBLE to be translated into every language?
Matthew 28:19 (NIV)
[SUP]19 [/SUP] Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,
Do you therefore believe that Translating the BIBLE (Gen. 1:1 through Rev. 22:21) into the languages of the people, was and is a WORK that GOD Himself is involved in?
Now comes the stumbling block question.
Do you believe that anytime, any other writings or theologies CONTRADICT what the BIBLE (Gen. 1:1 through Rev. 22:21) actually says, that it is the BIBLE that is TRUTH and not the other writings or theologies?
I can answer "ABSOLUTELY YES!", to all of the above questions; CAN YOU?
If you can answer "ABSOLUTELY YES!" to all of the above questions too, then we really have something SOLID that we can build our discussions on. If not then we are wasting our time chasing our own tails.
One last question:
When interpreted correctly, do you believe that there are absolutely NO contradictions in the BIBLE?
Again, I can answer "ABSOLUTELY YES!"
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There are really 6 questions, here are your answers:
1) Yes, I trust the Bible as the inspired Word of God
2) You can't even answer that question perfectly, because we do not have them, but I lean heavily towards yes on that question.
3) When a translator submits to the Holy Spirit, then the translation goes well. I know from the church fathers writing around 150+AD that they literally cried at how bad the Greek and Hebrew translators of the Old Testament left out inspiring scriptures about the first and lowly Messiah. How they intentionally robbed the Holy Bible of precious revelation about Jesus Christ and his mission.
So if translating with the Holy Spirit as the guide, then perfection. When not, plain and precious scriptures can be altered or obliterated completely. It is a miracle that we have such a wonderful Bible after all these thousands of years.
4) Yes - I believe God is in the translation of the Bible into a peoples own vernacular.
5) Yes - This would not effect our discussion, since the only Book that I will use is the Bible, perhaps different translations of the Bible, but just the Bible. However, if you find anything in any other book that I revere as scripture that contradicts the Bible, I would be happy to discuss that with you and see if we can reconcile that issue. I'm betting I can, but I'm also betting you can't or won't.
6) Yes -When interpreted correctly, there are no contradictions in the Bible.
Now you have asked me a few questions, which I was happy to answer. Your turn.
Is Elohim, one of the names of the Eternal God?
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The foundation of the Church of Jesus Christ when Jesus established it, was not the "Bible". When Jesus ordained his 12 apostles, the church began. Jesus taught his apostles what they needed to do when he went away and they, with the help of the Holy Spirit, started to receive souls into the church on the day of Pentecost. Within a few days of Peters stirring speech on the day of Pentecost, 3000 people did what Peter told them to do. See Acts 2:38 They believed, they repented, they were baptized, and they received the gift of the Holy Ghost.
A short time later, the apostles were told by revelation from the Lord to add Deacons to help them in the work. And so 7 men were chosen to help and the second office in the church was functioning.
See Ephesians 2:20 The household of God is built upon the foundation of apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone. This is the sure foundation. Today the churches are built upon the foundation of a contracted pastor, the Bible, and Jesus is still an important part of their foundation. But the foundation is incomplete.
It is interesting to think of being a part of a church that at least has the same foundation that the original church had. I can't see how that doesn't strike you as being right? It is one of the biggest pluses to me of being a member of the Mormon church. These apostles go around the world to all the churches and make sure that we are all teaching the same correct doctrine. And believe me it is easy to start teaching false doctrine, just little by little and before you know it a church in Thailand is reverted back to its old Thailand teachings (for example), except the apostles come and stop the false teachings and keep things going the right way. Not only do we have apostles and prophets to guide us but we also have the quorum of the "seventy". See Luke 10:1 The Lord chose other "seventy" and sent them out 2 by 2 before his face into every city whither he himself would come. Today that same office in the church exists. They go out also to help the apostles and Jesus in the great mission of making sure that the expansion of the church goes correctly and there is order in the church. Jesus Christ of course is the chief corner stone and he communicates with the leaders of the church as to how to proceed in these trying days. It is comforting to know that the foundation of the church is so faithful and true. It should strike you as true, if you are a student of the original church. It should strike you as necessary if you are a student of the original church Living apostles and prophets and Jesus Christ is a fail-safe partnership, biblically written, biblically necessary, biblically called for. See Ephesians 4:11. Its interesting that most churches have pastors or evangelists, but don't seem to think they need the more important foundational members like the apostles and prophets.
See how it works and be amazed, the leadership of the Mormon church is Christ-Centered.
A short time later, the apostles were told by revelation from the Lord to add Deacons to help them in the work. And so 7 men were chosen to help and the second office in the church was functioning.
See Ephesians 2:20 The household of God is built upon the foundation of apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone. This is the sure foundation. Today the churches are built upon the foundation of a contracted pastor, the Bible, and Jesus is still an important part of their foundation. But the foundation is incomplete.
It is interesting to think of being a part of a church that at least has the same foundation that the original church had. I can't see how that doesn't strike you as being right? It is one of the biggest pluses to me of being a member of the Mormon church. These apostles go around the world to all the churches and make sure that we are all teaching the same correct doctrine. And believe me it is easy to start teaching false doctrine, just little by little and before you know it a church in Thailand is reverted back to its old Thailand teachings (for example), except the apostles come and stop the false teachings and keep things going the right way. Not only do we have apostles and prophets to guide us but we also have the quorum of the "seventy". See Luke 10:1 The Lord chose other "seventy" and sent them out 2 by 2 before his face into every city whither he himself would come. Today that same office in the church exists. They go out also to help the apostles and Jesus in the great mission of making sure that the expansion of the church goes correctly and there is order in the church. Jesus Christ of course is the chief corner stone and he communicates with the leaders of the church as to how to proceed in these trying days. It is comforting to know that the foundation of the church is so faithful and true. It should strike you as true, if you are a student of the original church. It should strike you as necessary if you are a student of the original church Living apostles and prophets and Jesus Christ is a fail-safe partnership, biblically written, biblically necessary, biblically called for. See Ephesians 4:11. Its interesting that most churches have pastors or evangelists, but don't seem to think they need the more important foundational members like the apostles and prophets.
See how it works and be amazed, the leadership of the Mormon church is Christ-Centered.
K
Oh lil sis, Now I am concerned about you, I love your faith and I do not want to detour it in anyway. But, I must be blunt with you, the SDA does not believe nor have anything to do with Jesus. I know that it is hard for you, but it is the truth. The SDA or Mormon church is headed by 3 families that are extremely wealthy and got that way by loaning money to the mob to build Vegas.
Lil sis, it's a works based religion and a money taker. The temple is a collage of wealth and few ever see it.
I fear for you lil sis.
Lil sis, it's a works based religion and a money taker. The temple is a collage of wealth and few ever see it.
I fear for you lil sis.
AMEN we have common Ground. AND AMEN that GOD was able to keep HIS WORD as pure as He did. Proof of that is the Dead Seas Scrolls are proving how well the WORD was kept the same.
A Lot of HIS names are simply descriptive characteristics of GOD's Character.
Names Of God
That site is a one page explanation of the names of GOD, and they have quite a few more than even I knew. Yes, any name starting with EL is a reference to GOD. AND certainly Elohim, is GOD and one that I have known for many, many years. QUOTE: "EL" is another name used for God in the Bible, showing up about 200 times in the Old Testament. El is the simple form arising from Elohim, and is often combined with other words for descriptive emphasis. - See more at: Names Of God
As for the book of Mormon, and other LDS add-on books, they contradict a great number of things in the Bible, that is just one of the reasons that I know it was not inspired by God. This site points out quite a few of the Contradictions: Terminology Differences (Main)
No the Mormon Church teaches a False Christ, that is different than the Christ of BIBLE, even your late Prophet said from the pulpit in in Salt Lake City, that the LDS Church teaches a different Jesus Christ than the rest of the Churches. LDS teaches the Jesus Christ of the Book of Mormon, and NOT THE JESUS CHRIST OF THE BIBLE. Mat. 24:24
The Bible teaches there is ONLY ONE GOD, and never has there been a second one, and NEVER will there be a second. Isa. 43:10-11
LDS teaches that the Father was once a man, and the BIBLE says NO, GOD has always been a spirit. John 4:24, Heb. 9:14, Gen. 21:33
LDS teaches that the SON of GOD means He is the offspring of GOD, while the BIBLE teaches that is a Title, for the one who has the right to inherit all that the Father has including HIS DEITY, AND that He who has seen Jesus has seen the Father. John 16:15, John 14:9, John 10:30, John 1:1 & 14
I know you are sincere when you say you think you teach the same Jesus Christ. Yes LDS does use Christian Terminology, but LDS changes the meaning of the terms, therefore LDS is NOT Christian.
The Bible teaches there is ONLY ONE GOD, and never has there been a second one, and NEVER will there be a second. Isa. 43:10-11
LDS teaches that the Father was once a man, and the BIBLE says NO, GOD has always been a spirit. John 4:24, Heb. 9:14, Gen. 21:33
LDS teaches that the SON of GOD means He is the offspring of GOD, while the BIBLE teaches that is a Title, for the one who has the right to inherit all that the Father has including HIS DEITY, AND that He who has seen Jesus has seen the Father. John 16:15, John 14:9, John 10:30, John 1:1 & 14
I know you are sincere when you say you think you teach the same Jesus Christ. Yes LDS does use Christian Terminology, but LDS changes the meaning of the terms, therefore LDS is NOT Christian.
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This post was about the true foundation of the original Church of Jesus Christ about 30 AD. Do you have a comment on that. I have listed several Bible scriptures that teach us what the true foundation was in 30 AD, and why the church in 30 AD needed living apostles and prophets, as well as pastors and evangelists and teachers etc.(although pastors and evangelists and teachers are not part of the foundation mentioned in Ephesians 2:20). I confidently assume if the church in 30 AD needed this foundation, it is just as important today to have the same foundation. Of course the foundation is not complete without Jesus Christ being the chief corner stone.
a well written essay! Jesus taught his apostles here on earth, in John he also says he has more to tell them, but they can't handle it now... so, a major question... how does the spirit fill in what they couldn't deal with back then? does he tell apostles, who then tell us, or does he tell individuals?... Paul is added to the apostles, making the number thirteen... is the catholic church right that new apostles can be added if one dies and the number can be increased if needed? and the office of apostle continues to today? how does first presidency and prophet... Munson, is it?... fit into early church layout? then the big question... are the rcc apostles the proper heirs, the LDS, another group, or none of the above?
another thing I like to do is compare the theory of spirit led apostles to the practice... in the rcc, it looks to me like men interested in worldly power worked their way in... though, to its credit, the rcc hasn't made any sudden changes that I know of... the lds said no blacks in priesthood, declared it strongly, then a revelation happened and it changed... do I have the story right? also, and I wish I could find this myself, but I heard someone quoting Smith as saying you don't have to believe in any certain thing to be Mormon... it was up to each person...