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O
All I can say is by Faith you will have understanding. The Lord used this so you would know what the after life would be about.
This scripture tells you something:
[SUP]23 [/SUP]And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.
It tells you afar off. Meaning in the future.
You will just have to either receive or keep searching
This scripture tells you something:
[SUP]23 [/SUP]And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.
It tells you afar off. Meaning in the future.
You will just have to either receive or keep searching
N
I just gave some scripture in a Thread just below this one. I posted like Three post there with some notes.
LINK >
http://christianchat.com/bible-disc...surely-they-only-sleep-jesus.html#post1214430 <
LINK >
http://christianchat.com/bible-disc...surely-they-only-sleep-jesus.html#post1214430 <
Firstly, Annihilationism and the Belief in Soul Sleep are theologically different and are not the same thing. Secondly, it is not impossible to me to see Christ give a parable that in essence cannot be fully understood. None of us know what happens immediately after death, since none of us have experienced it. However, I am sure that in the end, we (Christians and the Pre-Christ Saints) will be in the New World, and the unbeliever will be in the lake of Fire.
I don't consider myself a Christian -- I'm an atheist. That is why I can compare the bible with observed phenomena and find the bible to be wrong.
I made my case for the non-existence of a soul by observing that what is thought to be part of the soul (memory) is natural and can be affected by its physical environment, which is something that we wouldn't expect of a spiritual entity. My argument was not merely an assertion, like "The soul is not what Christians think it is", but rather I cited a well-known and widely-experienced phenomenon that lends evidence to my conclusion. In response I got only an assertion. I feel cheated.
I made my case for the non-existence of a soul by observing that what is thought to be part of the soul (memory) is natural and can be affected by its physical environment, which is something that we wouldn't expect of a spiritual entity. My argument was not merely an assertion, like "The soul is not what Christians think it is", but rather I cited a well-known and widely-experienced phenomenon that lends evidence to my conclusion. In response I got only an assertion. I feel cheated.
D
Blain, I certainly do agree that the bible teaches that when our bodies die we remain in a conscious and alert state as a spirit.
I have asked the question of why would Jesus tell a "parable" if it contained false theology (As the JW's and SDA's and others believe) on three separate threads several times each and still not a single person that believes in soul sleep or annihilationism ---and not once have they given me an answer.
It is as if they are starting to see their error or at least I hope so.
B
Dear brother Dan,
May our God & Savior Jesus Christ grant us to learn from Him as we consider what are errors of mortals.
1. "Soul sleep" and "Annihilation of the soul" are not the same concept, neither are those ideas practiced by the same group of people.
2. "Soul sleep" is the belief among Seventh Day Adventist, who DO believe in the Holy Trinity and believe the full truth of the deity of Jesus Christ.
3. "Soul sleep" is the belief that upon death, the body decays in the grave, but the soul doesn't yet "return to God Who gave it" (Eccl. 12:7). Instead, the soul, literally, continues to exist "asleep" in the grave (or somewhere not heaven; see Job 14, Psalm 49:15) until the resurrection at the "advent" or return of Christ.
4. "Annihilation of the soul" is the erroneous belief among Jehovah Witnesses and Christadelphians, who DO NOT believe in the Holy Trinity AND DENY the deity of Jesus Christ. That in itself is a very good indicator where the "annihilation" thought is heading!
5. "Annihilation" is the reprobate idea that upon death of the body, the soul, literally, ceases to exist ever again. In other words, that "person" is poof! gone forever. They erroneously believe that God will recreate other people with a different soul (since the previous soul went poof!), and all this recreation will happen when God repopulates the new Earth.
6. "Annihilation" is a blend of Hinduism reincarnation with Judeo-Christian thought; hence, the importance of why those folks rely on "works" to buster their salvation.
7. As for Lazarus and the Rich man, whether that passage of Scripture is a parable or not, it remains a legitimately valid part of Holy Scripture, and the passage should carry the same weight as the rest of the holy thoughts Jesus spoke.
The Lord is good and faithful is He who calls us.
May our God & Savior Jesus Christ grant us to learn from Him as we consider what are errors of mortals.
1. "Soul sleep" and "Annihilation of the soul" are not the same concept, neither are those ideas practiced by the same group of people.
2. "Soul sleep" is the belief among Seventh Day Adventist, who DO believe in the Holy Trinity and believe the full truth of the deity of Jesus Christ.
3. "Soul sleep" is the belief that upon death, the body decays in the grave, but the soul doesn't yet "return to God Who gave it" (Eccl. 12:7). Instead, the soul, literally, continues to exist "asleep" in the grave (or somewhere not heaven; see Job 14, Psalm 49:15) until the resurrection at the "advent" or return of Christ.
4. "Annihilation of the soul" is the erroneous belief among Jehovah Witnesses and Christadelphians, who DO NOT believe in the Holy Trinity AND DENY the deity of Jesus Christ. That in itself is a very good indicator where the "annihilation" thought is heading!
5. "Annihilation" is the reprobate idea that upon death of the body, the soul, literally, ceases to exist ever again. In other words, that "person" is poof! gone forever. They erroneously believe that God will recreate other people with a different soul (since the previous soul went poof!), and all this recreation will happen when God repopulates the new Earth.
6. "Annihilation" is a blend of Hinduism reincarnation with Judeo-Christian thought; hence, the importance of why those folks rely on "works" to buster their salvation.
7. As for Lazarus and the Rich man, whether that passage of Scripture is a parable or not, it remains a legitimately valid part of Holy Scripture, and the passage should carry the same weight as the rest of the holy thoughts Jesus spoke.
The Lord is good and faithful is He who calls us.
I
Thessalonians 4
13Brothers and sisters, we do not want you to be uninformed about those who sleep in death, so that you do not grieve like the rest of mankind, who have no hope. 14For we believe that Jesus died and rose again, and so we believe that God will bring with Jesus those who have fallen asleep in him. 15According to the Lord’s word, we tell you that we who are still alive, who are left until the coming of the Lord, will certainly not precede those who have fallen asleep.
This scripture makes me want to believe that when one dies the spirit returns to God. When Jesus returns God will send with Christ those spirits which will be reunited with the dead in which results in a transformed body which then becomes a soul once again.
Just my thoughts.
13Brothers and sisters, we do not want you to be uninformed about those who sleep in death, so that you do not grieve like the rest of mankind, who have no hope. 14For we believe that Jesus died and rose again, and so we believe that God will bring with Jesus those who have fallen asleep in him. 15According to the Lord’s word, we tell you that we who are still alive, who are left until the coming of the Lord, will certainly not precede those who have fallen asleep.
This scripture makes me want to believe that when one dies the spirit returns to God. When Jesus returns God will send with Christ those spirits which will be reunited with the dead in which results in a transformed body which then becomes a soul once again.
Just my thoughts.
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L
This is a parabolic story. When someone dies and is saved his body goes to the grave until the resurrection but his spirit goes to heaven. When the rich man (unsaved) died he was dead in body and spirit. The Bible teaches that the wages of sin is death which when one says eternal death it means dead forever more. This being so if the rich man was dead and buried were would he get his eyes to look up to heaven? Hence this would have to be a parabolic.
D
Instead of answering the question I posed you simply added why you do not believe a human soul or spirit can survive death as Jesus claimed in his story/parable of Lazarus the beggar and the rich man.
If as you believe, humans do not survive death, why would Jesus tell a story/ parable of human spirits surviving death? In plain English, why would Jesus tell a story that includes false doctrine as you apparently believe?
If as you believe, humans do not survive death, why would Jesus tell a story/ parable of human spirits surviving death? In plain English, why would Jesus tell a story that includes false doctrine as you apparently believe?