saved by Justification alone?

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gotime

Senior Member
#101
Mar 3, 2011
3,537
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#101
This is the wonder of the Gospel, How a Holy God could love a bunch of sinners like us. Holiness dies for sinners.

This text blows me away:

2Co 5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Sin is the thing God hates most of all things. So how much must He love us in order to actually become that which he hates the most?

no wonder John said:

1Jn 3:1 Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God...
 
seed_time_harvest

seed_time_harvest

Senior Member
#102
Dec 9, 2011
13,761
1,731
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#102
gotime said:
It also helps to understand that Justification is not the goal of the believer. Rather it is the avenue to what Christ came to do.
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gotime said:
seed_time_harvest said:
I'm totally confused by that statement.[/QUOTE



Jesus died to sanctify us, But sanctification could not happen until we were justified.
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JESUS died so that mercy could be shown to those breaking the law and still satisfy the demands of the law(death)on our behalf and the sacrifice would be accepted by GOD and then Grace provided to those who believe In the WORD of GOD.

But I agree that as long as we remain alive in the flesh and on this earth we will be in the sanctification process which comes after we have been justified.

If we are not justified first by Grace through Faith in the WORD of GOD then sanctification would be an outward display that would not be based in truth.
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seed_time_harvest

seed_time_harvest

Senior Member
#104
Dec 9, 2011
13,761
1,731
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#104
seed_time_harvest said:
gotime said:
JESUS died so that mercy could be shown to those breaking the law and still satisfy the demands of the law(death)on our behalf and the sacrifice would be accepted by GOD and then Grace provided to those who believe In the WORD of GOD.

But I agree that as long as we remain alive in the flesh and on this earth we will be in the sanctification process which comes after we have been justified.

If we are not justified first by Grace through Faith in the WORD of GOD then sanctification would be an outward display that would not be based in truth.
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What I mean by justified is in right standing before GOD.
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dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#105
Dec 12, 2013
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#105
KennethC said:
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Rebuking your heresy is not doing crappy things to you, but rather sets forth your folly for all to see....if you really were saved you would have a little backbone and not be so easily offended!
 
passing_through

passing_through

Banned
#106
Feb 1, 2015
1,198
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#106
Justification is not a salvation factor, it doesn't save us, justification is a benefit of being saved, so the premise of the OP is wrong.
 
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gotime

Senior Member
#108
Mar 3, 2011
3,537
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#108
passing_through said:
Justification is not a salvation factor, it doesn't save us, justification is a benefit of being saved, so the premise of the OP is wrong.
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curious thought. so you thing you can be saved without justification? how so?
 
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gotime

Senior Member
#109
Mar 3, 2011
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#109
seed_time_harvest said:
seems like the title should have been named Is salvation by Faith alone?
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The title reflects a question on a concept I have heard and thus is exactly what it is meant to be. namely that one only needs to be justified to be saved nothing else is needed, eg sanctification by faith etc.

Besides I am not sure that there would be many if any who disagree on salvation being by faith alone.
 
K

Kefa54

Guest
#110
#110
Holman Christian Standard Bible
Ephesians 2:8...For you are saved by grace through faith, and this is not from yourselves; it is God's gift--

NOT..... For you are saved by grace through faith, (and Justification) this is not from yourselves; it is God's gift-- " Emphasis added."

How might I be justified if I don't know Jesus first?.


Kefa
 
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K

Kefa54

Guest
#111
#111
I am only justified through Christ. Without Christ there is no justification.

Holman Christian Standard Bible
Ro mans 5:1Therefore, since we have been declared righteous by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ.

Holman Christian Standard Bible
Romans 3:24 They are justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus.



Kefa
 
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FreeNChrist

Guest
#114
#114
KennethC said:
The issue though is what do you then classify as our works and what is His works ???

Because if you start smearing His teachings and commands that He gave to us to do into making them our works, we then have just messed up the meaning.
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"The Resurrection is the central theme in every Christian sermon reports in the Acts. The Resurrection, and its consequences were the "gospel" or good news which the Christian brought: what we call the 'gospels,' the narratives of Our Lord's llife and death, were composed later for the benefit of those who had already accepted the gospel. They were in no sense the basis of Christianity: they were written for those already converted. The miracles of the Resurrection, and the theology of that miracle, comes first: the biography comes later as a comment on it. Nothing could be more unhistorical than to pick out selected sayings of Christ from the gospels and to regard those as the datum and the rest of the New Testament as a construction upon it." (C.S. Lewis, Miracles )
 
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Kefa54

Guest
#115
#115
OK... #1 is
jus·ti·fi·ca·tion

noun
noun: justification

  • 1.
    the action of showing something to be right or reasonable.
    "the justification of revolutionary action"

    • good reason for something that exists or has been done.
      plural noun: justifications
      "there is no justification for an increase in charges"
      [TABLE="class: vk_tbl vk_gy"]
      [TR]
      [TD="class: lr_dct_nyms_ttl"]synonyms:[/TD]
      [TD]grounds, reason, basis, rationale, premise, rationalization, vindication, explanation; Moredefense, argument, apologia, apology, case
      "there's no justification for their rudeness"



      [/TD]
      [/TR]
      [/TABLE]






  • 2.
    Theology
    the action of declaring or making righteous in the sight of God.









gotime said:
what is justification? and is it all that is needed for salvation?

Biblical answers please, e.g. actually use your bible to back your answers cheers.
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I think we are looking for the #2 definition.

How am I (declaring or making righteous in the sight of God.) How?..Only through Christ.

Kefa
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#116
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,395
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#116
KennethC said:
Isaiah 64:5

Thou meetest him that rejoiceth and worketh righteousness, those thatremember thee in thy ways: behold, thou art wroth; for we have sinned: in those is continuance, and we shall be saved.

Shall be saved which means they are not saved yet here !!!
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Another out of context verse to push a works based salvation....Israel's physical preservation was based upon adherance to the law....it had nothing to do with eternal salvation...!
 
G

gotime

Senior Member
#117
Mar 3, 2011
3,537
88
48
#117
Kefa54 said:
OK... #1 is
jus·ti·fi·ca·tion

noun
noun: justification

  • 1.
    the action of showing something to be right or reasonable.
    "the justification of revolutionary action"
    • good reason for something that exists or has been done.
      plural noun: justifications
      "there is no justification for an increase in charges"
      [TABLE="class: vk_tbl vk_gy"]
      [TR]
      [TD="class: lr_dct_nyms_ttl"]synonyms:[/TD]
      [TD]grounds, reason, basis, rationale, premise, rationalization, vindication, explanation; Moredefense, argument, apologia, apology, case
      "there's no justification for their rudeness"


      [/TD]
      [/TR]
      [/TABLE]



  • 2.
    Theology
    the action of declaring or making righteous in the sight of God.








I think we are looking for the #2 definition.

How am I (declaring or making righteous in the sight of God.) How?..Only through Christ.

Kefa
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Glad you brought that up, many say that Justification is merely a declaration and while it is a declaration legally speaking it is also a making just. Which as you have rightly said is only through Christ.

He declares and makes us just. as it is written:

Rom 5:19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

and again:

2Co 5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

God does more than declare because if a man declares there is no power but when God speaks there is power to create that which is spoken. When God says be clean any who have faith will actually be clean.
 
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