Spiritual or Literal Temple

[trofimus]

Or maybe there is no such thing as... "The Antichrist"...

I think there is:

"As you have heard that the antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come. This is how we know it is the last hour."
1J 2:18

 

[KJV1611]

The wording of the scriptures testify that it is a literal temple,for it tells of the man of sin,the son of perdition,who is a man,a human,which also Judas Iscariot is known as the son of perdition,and this human steps in to the temple,and claims to be God,so it has to be a literal temple for a man cannot sit in us,let alone sit in more than one person.

Also he steps in to the temple of God,showing that he is God,which a person that is not saved is not a temple of God,for only the saints are a temple of God,so how can any person even if spiritual sit in them when they are right with God,and he exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshipped,which this would have to be a claim that can be seen by people,which the Bible says the last king will not acknowledge the God of his fathers,but in his estate he will honor the God of forces,and a God his fathers knew not,and will not regard any god,but magnify himself above all,which would have to be a human person in visible form to people.

The way the scriptures is worded it has to be a literal temple,which a man steps in to the temple and claims to be God,which he has gained the most power through nature than any other person will attain,and there is no personal God,so he is top dog,and he gets his power from Satan and deceives all who do not love God,which the first people he wants to deceive is the Jews,which they went back to animal sacrifices and he stepped in their temple and told them to stop,and he is their God and Messiah.

It really doesn't have to be a literal man making himself God. We all know that Christians today do this in that they are the authority of their own lives. I do agree that it COULD be a llteral man but it all hinges on - is the temple of God our bodies or a literal temple and that's the purpose of this thread, to try to figure that out.

 

[KJV1611]

I think there is:

"As you have heard that the antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come. This is how we know it is the last hour."
1J 2:18

It depends on which bible your read.

1 John 2:18 KJV
Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.

 

[trofimus]

It depends on which bible your read.

1 John 2:18 KJV
Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.

What would be the meaning of this sentence, if John was not talking about somebody specific in the first part?

But you are right "the" is not there in Greek.

 

[Ahwatukee]

How many people in the church today are sitting on the throne of God, showing themselves that they are God?

That verse is in the literal sense and not in the spiritual.

I've been looking for someone to post something to back up a literal temple in the last days and I don't think there is such a verse but I don't know everything.

"So when you see standing in the holy place 'the abomination that causes desolation,' spoken of through the prophet Daniel--let the reader understand--"

In the scripture above, Jesus refers to the abomination "standing in the holy place" which would be that room just outside of the holy of holy's. The context demonstrates that both Daniel and Jesus are referring to the literal temple. Also, from the time that Jesus quoted Daniel regarding the abomination, until the destruction of the temple, none of those characteristics have been fulfilled. God will pick up with Israel and her temple where he left off in fulfillment of that last seven years.

 

[KJV1611]

Good conversation, I wish I would have waited until I had more time to participate... I have to go for several hours but I'll be back later. I like DC's comment about the tabernacle planted and plan to check that out next.

 

[trofimus]

Good conversation, I wish I would have waited until I had more time to participate... I have to go for several hours but I'll be back later. I like DC's comment about the tabernacle planted and plan to check that out next.

Hey, I was just thinking if you even sleep sometimes.

 

[KJV1611]

Hey, I was just thinking if you even sleep.

LOL... I went to bed really early last night.

 

[trofimus]

What would be the meaning of this sentence, if John was not talking about somebody specific in the first part?

But you are right "the" is not there in Greek.

Correction:

It is not in the critical text.
It is in the Textus Receptus, though. So it is strange it is not in the KJV which is based on the TR.

Critical:
ἠκούσατε ὅτι ἀντίχριστος ἔρχεται (hoti antichristos)

Textus Receptus, byzantine editions and similar:
ἠκούσατε ὅτι ὁ ἀντίχριστος (hoti ho antichristos, "ho" = "the")

 

[garee]

Our Lord is not a one-dimensional god, there are layers of meaning in all scripture. We are given literal to relate to the spiritual. There are many layers of meaning.

What’s meant by one-dimensional? How many dimensions does a Spirit have? Did you mean he has many immutable attributes not seen by the eye?

When the veil was split it signified that there were many changes in the world, but not the one you tell of. Christ became our priest with access to the heart of God, no longer the priest who was restricted in his access. The saints came out of their sleep and were seen by men.

When the veil was rent, it revealed the Spirit of Christ, the Holy Spirit of God who has no form had put on the temporal sinful flesh of man (God is not a man) for a one time demonstration of a spiritual work(not seen) he performed as the Lamb of God slain from the foundation of the world. It represented the beginning of the last days. The end of temple worship .

The time of Jacobs’s trouble had come, a tribulation that the world had not yet seen.This is seeing the Jews were no longer used in types and shadows . The time of reformation had come. Therefore restoring the government of God back to the period of Judges when there was no outward representation. This caused confusion for an outward Jew.Not having an object seen that they could have their faith in respect to. Remember not all Israel is Israel.

They were seen by angels in heaven, the Holy City the New Jerusalem. A person can’t see a soul with no literal body. Flesh and blood will not enter that Holy city. It was the first resurrection.

 

[Spurgeoncy]

"The sun stopped shining. And the curtain of the temple was torn in two."
Luke 23:45

The end of the physical temple era. Now, the Holy Spirit abides in the church. And so the temple of God can be the church only.

If he opposes everything called God, then he will oppose the real "Temple Of God", the Church, and substitute a false Temple Of God. So it is physical.

How can he stand in the real Temple Of God if he opposes everything called God?

 

[garee]

It depends on which bible your read.

1 John 2:18 KJV
Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.

Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.

The fact that there were already many antichrists as there are today; signaling the beginning of the last days coincides also by that seen, a sign to the rebellious Jews, the renting of the veil.

We walk by faith not by sight comparing the spiritual word to the spiritual word in order to find the spiritual meaning hid from the lost.
2Jo 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

The Israel that are not Israel to this day reject he has come. Installing another veil only shows they are outward Jews and not inward born again of the Spirit of Christ.

The time of reformation had come. We are the temple of God, as the Spirit of Christ the Holy of Holies dwells in us. The need of an outward temple had come to a close. The veil is still rent.We know him no more after the flesh even though some did while He was here.

 

[garee]

If he opposes everything called God, then he will oppose the real "Temple Of God", the Church, and substitute a false Temple Of God. So it is physical.

How can he stand in the real Temple Of God if he opposes everything called God?

In that way it is pointing to the inward sanctuary. The Church the outward sanctuary. When a person tries to make the two one they commit blasphemy by denying Christ .They appose everything called God as the things of God by making them the things of men.

A clear distinction between the things of God and those of men must be made.

It could be physical if we walked by sight rather than by that not seen Christ's faith .

 

[trofimus]

If he opposes everything called God, then he will oppose the real "Temple Of God", the Church, and substitute a false Temple Of God. So it is physical.

How can he stand in the real Temple Of God if he opposes everything called God?

We cannot know the exact details how it will happen. But for example the middle ages RCC is a good example how it can be done, imho.

 

[garee]

We cannot know the exact details how it will happen. But for example the middle ages RCC is a good example how it can be done, imho.

I would agree the Pope would be considered one of the many anti-christs.

Before Paul's conversion as Saul he was also considered one, also following a law of the fathers in need of a daysman in the same way of a Pope.

 

[garee]

We cannot know the exact details how it will happen. But for example the middle ages RCC is a good example how it can be done, imho.

I would agree the Pope would be considered one of the many anti-christs.

Before Paul's conversion as Saul he was also considered one, also following a law of the fathers in need of a daysman in the same way of a Pope.

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

We read in 2 Thessalonians 2:4 “Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.”

Paul here is talking about the man of sin being revealed, the son who will go into destruction, who has “that Wicked” spirit working in him. Many believe this to be a single evil man figure is yet to come, but Paul clearly mentions this spirit working in many, and it “the mystery of iniquity already working”

2 Thessalonians 2:1-12 “ Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,[SUP]2 [/SUP]That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.[SUP]3 [/SUP]Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;[SUP]4 [/SUP]Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.[SUP]5 [/SUP]Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?[SUP]6 [/SUP]And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.[SUP]7 [/SUP]For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.[SUP]8 [/SUP]And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:[SUP]9 [/SUP]Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,[SUP]10 [/SUP]And with all deceivableness of unrighteousnessin them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.[SUP]11 [/SUP]And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:[SUP]12 [/SUP]That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness"

Note, in them, they, them, they all is speaking about more than one man. (but many)

But what about sitting in the Temple of God? I believe Paul was speaking in a mystery when he said this, as he was also playing off of other parts of scripture in order to do this. In Ezekiel 28:2 “Son of man, say unto the prince of Tyrus, Thus saith the Lord God; Because thine heart is lifted up, and thou hast said, I am a God, I sit in the seat of God, in the midst of the seas; yet thou art a man, and not God, though thou set thine heart as the heart of God:”

The Lord later goes on to say to this “man” in verse 13 “ Thou hast been in the garden of God;” Now we know the Prince of Tyrus was not in the garden of God, but man (Adam) was. But the Lord later goes on to call this man the “covering cherub.” So the message here is twofold.

The Lord is not just speaking to the prince of Tyrus alone, but to the spirit of “that Wicked” which entered into man (Adam) when sin entered into man. (man of sin)

So when you understand the spirit and the sin nature of the devil is working in the heart of man, then we can begin to see what Paul was saying about this “man of sin” sitting in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God”.

Paul also gave us clue to confirm this message in 1 Corinthians 6:19 “What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?

So our bodies are that temple God created for Himself to dwell in by His Spirit, but “that Wicked” spirit entered in, when sin entered in man= “man of sin”

And Paul goes on to say in 1 Corinthians 3:17 “If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.”

So whosoever has “that Wicked” spirit dwelling in them, (the temple of God) him shall God also destroy. (son of perdition) or son who goes into destruction.

 

[birdie]

I think the man of sin, the son of perdition was revealed when the falling away took place. Judas was a son of perdtition - he pretended to be a believer, he talked like a believer, looked like a believer and acted like a believer. The same holds true today and we can see this everywhere today in people that exalt themselves over all that is called God and CHANGE his word to fit their doctrine. I could be wrong but I don't think I am.

Yes, that's the idea KJV1611. The man of sin is not a single human being as people imagine. The term 'man of sin' is used because the true believers are built into something called 'the perfect man', the head of which is Christ, and the figurative arms and legs and body parts are the believers:

"Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:"

"That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works."

"Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus:"

"And his name through faith in his name hath made this man strong, whom ye see and know: yea, the faith which is by him hath given him this perfect soundness in the presence of you all."

God is making each true believer perfect as he sees fit, and he is making them all a part of the perfect body of Christ, his work which he perfected.

In similar manner, the man of sin is talking about the whole body of those who are associating with Christ. Judas was a picture of this. There is a big falling away from the true gospel that occurs as the church age progresses. Many fall away and only a remnant, pictured by Noah and his family and by Lot and his family find grace to continue as a part of the perfect man that God is building. We read (and this pertains to church age persons associating with Christ - called Israel here): "Esaias also crieth concerning Israel, Though the number of the children of Israel be as the sand of the sea, a remnant shall be saved:"

The Bible uses the terminology of "so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God" to mean that people will be claiming to Christians and claiming to have authority in Christ for what is really their own man-made notions and will be self-appointed by human organizations, calling themselves churches and so forth, claiming to be in Christ and claiming to be from God but not being. We find this: "And he said, Take heed that ye be not deceived: for many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and the time draweth near: go ye not therefore after them."

 

[Ahwatukee]

Yes, that's the idea KJV1611. The man of sin is not a single human being as people imagine.

Actually, the man of sin, the antichrist, the son of perdition, will indeed be a man. He will eventually be controlled by the beast, who is that angel of the Abyss who comes out at the 5th trumpet. Regarding this, please consider the following:

" But the beast was captured, and [with him] the false prophet who had performed signs on [his] behalf, by which he deceived those who had the mark of the beast and worshiped his image. [Both of them] were thrown [alive] into the fiery lake of burning sulfur. "

The fact that the scripture above refers to the beast and the false prophet as "the two of them" and as "He" and that they are both thrown "alive" into the lake of fire would demonstrate that the man of lawlessness is in fact a man just as the scripture proclaims.

 

[Blik]

Yes we are a temple of God if the Holy Spirit dwells in us.. But a temple of God can also be a physical bricks and mortar temple too.. As it was in Jerusalem..

You explain it well.

If we deny the literal that scripture tells us of we do not understand that actions have a spiritual side. We refuse to learn much of what scripture is telling us.

If we deny the spiritual of what scripture tells us and see only the literal we are not understanding what scripture is telling us.

We are the temple of God, but that does not mean that God has a plan for us in rebuilding the literal temple in Jerusalem.