The forgotten teachings of Christ

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WheresEnoch

Guest
#141
#141
Mitspa said:
Well a child of God is justified by Christ, and in Him we cannot sin. I hope you see the difference between saying you don't sin and saying in Him you cannot sin?
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A fully mature child of God will certainly not sin.
The flesh will always be an obstacle to perfect submission in this life. Our flesh will always have thoughts which war against the Spirit, but the more mature we become the less and less they occur and the less and less they have any power over us whatsoever. We just get used to taking them captive immediately and dismissing them. Not giving them any place in our inner man for our desires become loving. We begin to despise those fleshly thoughts and they become more of an annoyance than anything. Like a little fly that buzzes around our head from time to time and is easily swatted away.
But in order to get to that point we have to pick up our cross and start following.
 
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WheresEnoch

Guest
#142
#142
The ultimate focus and goal is not obeying the law. It is becoming love.
Love for God, our fellow man and any other created being.
Love that is not dependent on the actions of others or our circumstances, but love that transcends all worldly understanding and wisdom
 
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Mitspa

Guest
#143
#143
WheresEnoch said:
A fully mature child of God will certainly not sin.
The flesh will always be an obstacle to perfect submission in this life. Our flesh will always have thoughts which war against the Spirit, but the more mature we become the less and less they occur and the less and less they have any power over us whatsoever. We just get used to taking them captive immediately and dismissing them. Not giving them any place in our inner man for our desires become loving. We begin to despise those fleshly thoughts and they become more of an annoyance than anything. Like a little fly that buzzes around our head from time to time and is easily swatted away.
But in order to get to that point we have to pick up our cross and start following.
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Right a believer in Christ cannot sin...Im not sure what your speaking of?
because this is true as well..

1Jo 1:8 ¶ If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
 
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WheresEnoch

Guest
#144
#144
Mitspa said:
Right a believer in Christ cannot sin...Im not sure what your speaking of?
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If you love sin, you will sin.
If you love God, why would you sin against Him?

We only start out by obeying the law.
When love becomes perfected in us, there is no more need for the law.
We become a law unto ourselves
 
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Mitspa

Guest
#145
#145
WheresEnoch said:
If you love sin, you will sin.
If you love God, why would you sin against Him?

We only start out by obeying the law.
When love becomes perfected in us, there is no more need for the law.
We become a law unto ourselves
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No ...the bible teaches that you get set free from sin by being set free from the law of Moses and coming under the law of faith and love.

Ro 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
 
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WheresEnoch

Guest
#146
#146
Mitspa said:
No ...the bible teaches that you get set free from sin by being set free from the law of Moses and coming under the law of faith and love.

Ro 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
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We need the law to remind us while we grow.
The Holy Spirit will constantly bring the law to mind throughout our day.
It is up to us to submit to the Holy Spirit.

It is true, we are set free from the law of Moses and come under the law of faith and of love.

The law of Moses is not something evil to be avoided, it is our schoolmaster.
The law of Christ(faith and love) requires more of us than the law of Moses for it requires us to delve into ourselves and put to death our inner man (flesh ,evil, sin, rebellion) through submission to the power of the Holy Spirit.

When we do that, sin no longer has any dominion over us. AKA we do not act on the sinful nature any longer.

We are slaves to the Spirit vs slaves to the flesh
 
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Sirk

Guest
#147
#147
So where are all these alleged "forgotten teachings of Christ"? I'm still waiting to be enlightened.
 
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Mitspa

Guest
#148
#148
WheresEnoch said:
We need the law to remind us while we grow.
The Holy Spirit will constantly bring the law to mind throughout our day.
It is up to us to submit to the Holy Spirit.

It is true, we are set free from the law of Moses and come under the law of faith and of love.

The law of Moses is not something evil to be avoided, it is our schoolmaster.
The law of Christ(faith and love) requires more of us than the law of Moses for it requires us to delve into ourselves and put to death our inner man (flesh ,evil, sin, rebellion) through submission to the power of the Holy Spirit.

When we do that, sin no longer has any dominion over us.
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Well we can study all the truth of God and include the law as a witness to Gods righteousness and love, but the law does not teach us how to walk in the Spirit, faith and love do that. Christ teaches us faith and love and the law can have a big part in seeing many truths, but it is not the core of the gospel.
 
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Mitspa

Guest
#149
#149
Sirk said:
So where are all these alleged "forgotten teachings of Christ"? I'm still waiting to be enlightened.
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They forgot them... they are having to look them up again :)
 
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WheresEnoch

Guest
#150
#150
The reason why the law of Moses is imperfect, is because it does not address the core problem within us.
Nor does it provide the payment for our sins
It only tells us when the evil in our heart flows out and causes us to sin.

And gave us a temporary "remedy" for those sins. Animal sacrifices
 
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The_highwayman

Guest
#151
#151
WheresEnoch said:
We need the law to remind us while we grow.
The Holy Spirit will constantly bring the law to mind throughout our day.
It is up to us to submit to the Holy Spirit.

It is true, we are set free from the law of Moses and come under the law of faith and of love.

The law of Moses is not something evil to be avoided, it is our schoolmaster.
The law of Christ(faith and love) requires more of us than the law of Moses for it requires us to delve into ourselves and put to death our inner man (flesh ,evil, sin, rebellion) through submission to the power of the Holy Spirit.

When we do that, sin no longer has any dominion over us. AKA we do not act on the sinful nature any longer.

We are slaves to the Spirit vs slaves to the flesh
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Yo Junior...

Gal 3.21-26 completely disagrees with you here...do not reply to me, reply to God it is his book...

[SUP]21 [/SUP]Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.
[SUP]22 [/SUP]But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.
[SUP]23 [/SUP]But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
[SUP]24 [/SUP]Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
[SUP]25 [/SUP]But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
 
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WheresEnoch

Guest
#152
#152
The_highwayman said:
Yo Junior...

Gal 3.21-26 completely disagrees with you here...do not reply to me, reply to God it is his book...

[SUP]21 [/SUP]Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.
[SUP]22 [/SUP]But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.
[SUP]23 [/SUP]But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
[SUP]24 [/SUP]Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
[SUP]25 [/SUP]But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
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Whats the disagreement about?
 
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The_highwayman

Guest
#153
#153
WheresEnoch said:
The reason why the law of Moses is imperfect, is because it does not address the core problem within us.
It only tells us when the evil in our heart flows out and causes us to sin.

And gave us a temporary "remedy" for those sins. Animal sacrifices
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No the Law was given to show us our SIN and to show us we needed a savior and to point the way to Christ....SIN was still a choice even before Moses and the Law of Moses....

Genesis 4.6-7
[SUP]6 [/SUP]And the Lord said unto Cain, Why art thou wroth? and why is thy countenance fallen?
[SUP]7 [/SUP]If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.
 
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Mitspa

Guest
#154
#154
WheresEnoch said:
The reason why the law of Moses is imperfect, is because it does not address the core problem within us.
Nor does it provide the payment for our sins
It only tells us when the evil in our heart flows out and causes us to sin.

And gave us a temporary "remedy" for those sins. Animal sacrifices
Click to expand...
Well the purpose of the law was to bring all men to Christ and those sacrifices was only a symbolic representative of Him at the Cross... But a believer who is born-again has a new heart.
 
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WheresEnoch

Guest
#156
#156
The_highwayman said:
No the Law was given to show us our SIN and to show us we needed a savior and to point the way to Christ....SIN was still a choice even before Moses and the Law of Moses....

Genesis 4.6-7
[SUP]6 [/SUP]And the Lord said unto Cain, Why art thou wroth? and why is thy countenance fallen?
[SUP]7 [/SUP]If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.
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Sure, but the law of Moses is not evil.
Jesus just fulfilled the ceremonial/sacrificial laws and then transferred the moral laws from applying to our outward actions to our inner man.
For those not perfected in love, does not the Holy Spirit remind you "Hey, do not steal. Do not commit adultery."?

It still teaches us while we are growing in Christ/love
 
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The_highwayman

Guest
#157
#157
WheresEnoch said:
Sure, but the law of Moses is not evil.
Jesus just fulfilled the ceremonial/sacrificial laws and then transferred the moral laws from applying to our outward actions to our inner man.
For those not perfected in love, does not the Holy Spirit remind you "Hey, do not steal. Do not commit adultery."?

It still teaches us while we are growing in Christ
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The law does not teach us anything, because Christ Fulfilled the law, fully....the Holy Ghost teaches you everything you need to know....including moral laws...

John 14.26
[SUP]26 [/SUP]But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.
 
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WheresEnoch

Guest
#158
#158
The_highwayman said:
The law does not teach us anything, because Christ Fulfilled the law, fully....the Holy Ghost teaches you everything you need to know....including moral laws...

John 14.26
[SUP]26 [/SUP]But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.
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Well I am willing to concede to you.
I just don't think the law of Moses was done away with.
It was fulfilled.
Many of the commandments of Christ are based on the law of Moses.
Where the law of Moses was imperfect, Christ perfected it.
Anyone who claims to be living by the law of faith and love,
yet is still choosing to break the moral laws of Moses (10 commandments),
is also breaking the commandments of Christ and is still subject to the law.

But of course only God knows the hearts of man, and everyone will be in a different place than others in their spiritual walk when their time is up. But I think it is very clear that anyone who continues in sin does not know Christ and He will not know you.
 
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WheresEnoch

Guest
#159
#159
Those who walk by the flesh and who are not born again, cannot keep Christ's commandments.
When we walk by the Spirit, we do not need any law.

The flesh can only understand the physical, it responds to the physical.
The Spirit transcends the physical and allows us to operate out of love in any circumstance by trusting that reality is not only what we can see with our eyes.
 
thecreationtutor

thecreationtutor

Senior Member
#160
Jun 30, 2011
2,521
35
0
#160
me thinks unless you see the point of view of the OP - you must not be saved
 
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