What happens when Believers don't obey the Gospel
- Thread starter endtimes
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Most catholic water baptized when it a baby, Lot of my neighbor are Catholic and a lot of them doing drug. Do you think they water baptism save them? A week ago 4 time sheriff come to me asking if I see a man by the name of Mr X, I think he do serious crime, but is only drug dealer. Another neighbor go to jail in the same reason. They are Hispanic Catholic that experience water baptism. I am not single out our Hispanic brother, but tray to show how water baptism not change anything.
Only baptism /immersion in Jesus will change our life.
You believe a man having faith in Jesus than die in 10 second before to to water baptism rebel against God? while drug dealer, rapist like some catholic core leader in vatican not rebel against God because they have been water baptism?
The greatest Law is Love. that Jesus said, not water baptism, and rapist doesn't have love.
Only baptism /immersion in Jesus will change our life.
You believe a man having faith in Jesus than die in 10 second before to to water baptism rebel against God? while drug dealer, rapist like some catholic core leader in vatican not rebel against God because they have been water baptism?
The greatest Law is Love. that Jesus said, not water baptism, and rapist doesn't have love.
K
The thing we must realize is that it all depends on where the heart is, and only God know our heart.
True faith believers will obey and keep the Lord's commandments, and if for some reason their life gets taken by an evil act or disease before they get baptized in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit while being dipped in water. Or before they are able to help others in need, for they maybe the one who is in need of help then the Lord will know where their heart is and if they are His or not.
Plus you can not take and say somebody can not be saved just because of a certain sin they commit. Even if a person was once a murderer, or a rapist for instance, if they turn and repent of those sins. They will be forgiven also.
Only blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is the only unforgivable sin, all other sins are forgivable no matter how bad they are.
Ya if one repent before he die, will be go to heaven no matter what sin they commit as long as not blasphemy Holy spirit.
My point is why ritual water baptism more important than Love? Jesus said love is the greatest law.
If no love when dying not go to heaven. If not going ritual baptism at the time of dying but there is love/Jesus than go to heaven.
My point is why ritual water baptism more important than Love? Jesus said love is the greatest law.
If no love when dying not go to heaven. If not going ritual baptism at the time of dying but there is love/Jesus than go to heaven.
K
The thing is that baptism is not more important than love. For even Jesus says that everything is fulfilled through love.
The reason in this is because if you obey the greatest command to love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, and mind you will keep and do His other commands.
The thing that people have a hard time handling is that obedience comes before saved.
Your faith in the Lord comes first by hearing the word, then through love and obedience you repent of your sins as command to be forgiven of them to be saved and not perish. Baptism and confession are other commands that follow, as well as helping those who need help including your enemies. Through love you will obey these commands.
The reason in this is because if you obey the greatest command to love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, and mind you will keep and do His other commands.
The thing that people have a hard time handling is that obedience comes before saved.
Your faith in the Lord comes first by hearing the word, then through love and obedience you repent of your sins as command to be forgiven of them to be saved and not perish. Baptism and confession are other commands that follow, as well as helping those who need help including your enemies. Through love you will obey these commands.
P
It's not more important, it is as important. Failing to do either will send you to hell if you willfully disregard them. Water baptism is an outward demonstration of an inward cleansing. You are showing the world that you now serve God. That is the reason for it. When you refuse to get baptized, you are, in effect, denying Christ and His sacrifice for you by Him. That is a bad thing to do.
Matthew 10:33 "But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven."
Never be ashamed of Christ.
Matthew 10:33 "But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven."
Never be ashamed of Christ.
I believe agape love come after abide in the vine. Not before.
Abide come after have faith in Jesus. If we don't have faith in Jesus why entrust and abide our self in Jesus.
the branch can't bear the fruit of itself. Mean it is impossible for non believer bear agape love. Pretending love by helping the poor may happen without abide in the vine. but Jesus said branch can't bear fruit of itself. And I trust Him.
Abide come after have faith in Jesus. If we don't have faith in Jesus why entrust and abide our self in Jesus.
the branch can't bear the fruit of itself. Mean it is impossible for non believer bear agape love. Pretending love by helping the poor may happen without abide in the vine. but Jesus said branch can't bear fruit of itself. And I trust Him.
K
That is pretty much what I said. We here the word and though hearing comes our faith, and by out faith comes love in Him. And by that love in Him comes our obedience to Him to follow His commands. The first command one must follow is the repentance of sins. If you do not obey the command to repent you can not be saved.
I don't know if ritual baptism as great as love, but Jesus said
[SUP]36[/SUP] Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
[SUP]37[/SUP] Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
[SUP]38[/SUP] This is the first and great commandment.
[SUP]39[/SUP] And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
[SUP]40[/SUP] On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
[SUP]36[/SUP] Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
[SUP]37[/SUP] Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
[SUP]38[/SUP] This is the first and great commandment.
[SUP]39[/SUP] And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
[SUP]40[/SUP] On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
P
You said initially you didn't Think it was as important. No, baptism is not greater than love. Willful disobedience is a sin.
Now you're just being ignorant. Of course water baptism always demonstrates obedience. Christ said to do it, and if you do it because He said to, you're being obedient. How hard is that to figure out? It goes without saying that your friend wasn't serious and never got saved.
Sounds like you're hanging out with the wrong people. You might want to be careful about some of that second hand smoke you're getting too close to.
Now you're just being ignorant. Of course water baptism always demonstrates obedience. Christ said to do it, and if you do it because He said to, you're being obedient. How hard is that to figure out? It goes without saying that your friend wasn't serious and never got saved.
Sounds like you're hanging out with the wrong people. You might want to be careful about some of that second hand smoke you're getting too close to.
He was my junior high class mate,
And I life in slum area. we are still in the world brother. I tray to demonstrate that water baptism not always demonstrate obedient. Give a food to the poor is not always obedient either.
Love always help if it possible, but help not always agape love. In my country corruptor help each other. The businessman give a money to government officer but not agape give, it is bribery.
And I life in slum area. we are still in the world brother. I tray to demonstrate that water baptism not always demonstrate obedient. Give a food to the poor is not always obedient either.
Love always help if it possible, but help not always agape love. In my country corruptor help each other. The businessman give a money to government officer but not agape give, it is bribery.
As I have said all along. Faith is the root and good works are the fruit of salvation. No fruit demonstrates that there is no root. Obedience/good works are the fruit, by product and demonstrative evidence of genuine saving faith, but not the essence of saving faith and not the means of our salvation.
E
Water baptism is a work. Do not fool yourself.
A person did not circumcise themselves. yet it was called a work (it was not even a work of the law it was a work before the law. started with abraham. so people can not use that excuse)
Replacing the work of God in HIS baptism, with the work of man and their baptism is another gospel. Paul said anyone teach another gospel. they are to be accursed. Please chose to heed his warning.
Not to mention. Water baptism is NOT part of the gospel. Paul n=made this clear. he was not sent to baptize, he was sent to give the gospel. If baptism was part of the gospel. Paul lied. because he was sent to baptize.
Jesus also said...
John 14:21
He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself unto him.
Mark 16:15-16Young's Literal Translation (YLT)
[SUP]15 [/SUP]and he said to them, `Having gone to all the world, proclaim the good news to all the creation;
[SUP]16 [/SUP]he who hath believed, and hath been baptized, shall be saved; and he who hath not believed, shall be condemned.
John 14:21
He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself unto him.
Mark 16:15-16Young's Literal Translation (YLT)
[SUP]15 [/SUP]and he said to them, `Having gone to all the world, proclaim the good news to all the creation;
[SUP]16 [/SUP]he who hath believed, and hath been baptized, shall be saved; and he who hath not believed, shall be condemned.