What happens when Believers don't obey the Gospel

Jackson123 · Nov 25, 2014

Yup, and water baptism not transform people. Baptism in Jesus will transform, it is symbolize in water. But we need, not only symbol, the real one.

almost every Catholic baptized in water since they are a baby.

And in real life, we see a lot of them doing drug.

In a small town were I use to life, must young Latino Catholic doing drug. I was life in slum Latino area. And they are baptized.

kennethcadwell · Nov 25, 2014

Jackson123 said:

Yes I know this, but be careful when you post scripture that states the truth is not in you in your words on what was said by an apostle or even Jesus himself with out posting the actual scripture. LOL
Because some on here will say you are judging others then, and heck they even say that if you post the actual scripture, or say taken out of context.

newbirth · Nov 25, 2014

eternally-gratefull said:

somewhere somehow your brain may be wired wrong.....
One person makes this statement...

What people need is a transformation, not simply a reformation. And, obeying the gospel is the path to take.

Unfortunately however, many that desperately need that transformation, are the very ones that "obey not" the gospel of Christ.

look at your ridiculous response......obeying the gospel is recommended by the writer.....you respond with water baptism and obeying rules...will not transform you....and you recommend ...
You will be transformed by the renewing of your mind. and only by being born of the spirit. made alivein christ, then letting God renew your mind on the inside out.
[SUP]the scripture does not teach .........[/SUP]
[SUP]

now this is how Paul advise us to think with renewed minds...keeping in mind God gave us power to become sons of God and Paul says [/SUP]......
[SUP] but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind,

3 [/SUP]For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

[SUP]4 [/SUP]For as we have many members in one body, and all members have not the same office:
[SUP]5 [/SUP]So we, being many, are one body in Christ, and every one members one of another.
[SUP]6 [/SUP]Having then gifts differing according to the grace that is given to us, whether prophecy, let us prophesy according to the proportion of faith;
[SUP]7 [/SUP]Or ministry, let us wait on our ministering: or he that teacheth, on teaching;
[SUP]8 [/SUP]Or he that exhorteth, on exhortation: he that giveth, let him do it with simplicity; he that ruleth, with diligence; he that sheweth mercy, with cheerfulness.

[SUP]9 [/SUP]Let love be without dissimulation. Abhor that which is evil; cleave to that which is good.
[SUP]10 [/SUP]Be kindly affectioned one to another with brotherly love; in honour preferring one another;
[SUP]11 [/SUP]Not slothful in business; fervent in spirit; serving the Lord;
[SUP]12 [/SUP]Rejoicing in hope; patient in tribulation; continuing instant in prayer;
[SUP]13 [/SUP]Distributing to the necessity of saints; given to hospitality.
[SUP]14 [/SUP]Bless them which persecute you: bless, and curse not.
[SUP]15 [/SUP]Rejoice with them that do rejoice, and weep with them that weep.
[SUP]16 [/SUP]Be of the same mind one toward another. Mind not high things, but condescend to men of low estate. Be not wise in your own conceits.
[SUP]17 [/SUP]Recompense to no man evil for evil. Provide things honest in the sight of all men.
[SUP]18 [/SUP]If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.
[SUP]19 [/SUP]Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord.
[SUP]20 [/SUP]Therefore if thine enemy hunger, feed him; if he thirst, give him drink: for in so doing thou shalt heap coals of fire on his head.
[SUP]21 [/SUP]Be not overcome of evil, but overcome evil with good.

endtimes · Nov 26, 2014

Jackson123 said:

Water baptism is part of what saves. It is part of the Death, Burial, Resurrection - the gospel of Jesus Christ.

If you were to bake a cake, flour is used, but is not the only ingredient. Likewise, water baptism is not the only ingredient in the Death, Burial, Resurrection gospel of Jesus Christ.

Further, water baptism is not to be used for infants, they are not of age to make there own decisions.

The Catholic church and many other denominations, baptize with sprinkling droplets of water on the forehead, whereby is not found in the Bible. Every water baptism in the Bible, was by full immersion into the water.

In fact, the word used is baptizō[SUP](G907)[/SUP] which means to dip repeatedly, to immerse, to submerge. Here is an example:

Matthew 3:16 And Jesus, when he was baptized[SUP]G907[/SUP], went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him:

When one is water baptized any other way, they have left the Bible and choose to do it mans way.

Thanks for your input.

God bless!

eternally-gratefull · Nov 26, 2014

endtimes said:

If thats true, then every OT believer, and alot of NT believers who has true faith in Christ, yet never had an opportunity to be water baptised will be in hell.

newbirth · Nov 26, 2014

eternally-gratefull said:

OT old covenant saints... 1 Peter 4:5-7King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]5 [/SUP]Who shall give account to him that is ready to judge the quick and the dead.
[SUP]6 [/SUP]For for this cause was the gospel preached also to them that are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit.

[SUP]7 [/SUP]But the end of all things is at hand: be ye therefore sober, and watch unto prayer.

New Covenant saints...
[SUP]38 [/SUP]Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
[SUP]39 [/SUP]For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

[SUP]40 [/SUP]And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.
[SUP]41 [/SUP]Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.

God gives everyone the opportunity....it is people like you who discourage them...

Jackson123 · Nov 26, 2014

endtimes said:

Water baptism is part of what saves. It is part of the Death, Burial, Resurrection - the gospel of Jesus Christ.

If you were to bake a cake, flour is used, but is not the only ingredient. Likewise, water baptism is not the only ingredient in the Death, Burial, Resurrection gospel of Jesus Christ.

Further, water baptism is not to be used for infants, they are not of age to make there own decisions.

The Catholic church and many other denominations, baptize with sprinkling droplets of water on the forehead, whereby is not found in the Bible. Every water baptism in the Bible, was by full immersion into the water.

In fact, the word used is baptizō[SUP](G907)[/SUP] which means to dip repeatedly, to immerse, to submerge. Here is an example:

Matthew 3:16 And Jesus, when he was baptized[SUP]G907[/SUP], went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him:

When one is water baptized any other way, they have left the Bible and choose to do it mans way.

Thanks for your input.

God bless!

If so, do you believe the owner of heaven/Jesus not save if not doing water baptism?

Jackson123 · Nov 26, 2014

I know a lot of people being baptized and not really death and bury they sin. Still doing drug, I life in slum area, People next to me, has a family, baptize catholic as a baby and selling a drug.

Matt1626 · Nov 27, 2014

The book if James says even the devil believes and he is in hell

Jackson123 · Nov 27, 2014

Matt1626 said:

Devil believe Jesus is Bod but instead of entrust to the Lord, he rebel.

Believe in this case not only believe Jesus is God but entrust to/have a faith to.

mailmandan · Nov 27, 2014

Jackson123 said:

Amen! In James 2:19, nobody is questioning the fact that the demons also believe "mental assent" that "there is one God" but they do not believe/entrust their spiritual well being to Christ; have faith/reliance upon Christ for salvation. Their trust and reliance is in Satan, as demonstrated by their rebellion in heaven and continuous evil works.

newbirth · Nov 27, 2014

mailmandan said:

therefore those who do believe/entrust their spiritual well being to Christ; have faith/reliance upon Christ for salvation. Their trust and reliance is in Christ, as demonstrated by their obedience on earth and continuous good works.

mailmandan · Nov 27, 2014

newbirth said:

Those who DO believe/entrust their spiritual well being to Christ; have faith/reliance upon Christ for salvation - DEMONSTRATE it by their obedience/continuous good works.

CRC · Nov 27, 2014

We all will "reap what we sow"!(Galatians 6:7)

Jackson123 · Nov 27, 2014

newbirth said:

if they have a time. If they die 10 second after how they demonstrate they faith? Jesus know they heart.

Jesus said the tree seen by it fruit. It is for a human consumption. Say a man come to us and pretend to be christian, ask money for his preaching travel. We don't know his heart he may just a crook preaching for money. Than Jesus said to examine his fruit.

God doesn't need to examine his fruit. He know his heart. He decide to put people to heaven by look at the heart.

newbirth · Nov 27, 2014

Jackson123 said:

In these law hang all the law an prophet.

Water baptism is only a symbol. I can understand people emphasis in water baptism and killing raping, etc.

Matthew 22:36-40New International Version (NIV)

36 “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?”
37 Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’[a] 38 This is the first and greatest commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’[b] 40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”
Footnotes:

Emanuela Orlandi, 15, Killed To Cover Up Vatican 'Sex Parties,' Claims Father Gabriele Amorth

By Michael Billera @http://twitter.com/#!/MichaelBillera on May 23 2012 10:39 AM

Father Gabriele Amorth, who was appointed by Pope John Paul II as the chief exorcist of the Vatican, claims that the a teenage girl who went missing in the 80s, Emanuela Orlandi, was murdered as part of underground Vatican sex parties with ties to the organized crime and foreign embassies.
Amorth said that in the summer of 1983, 15-year-old Orlandi was snatched from the streets of Rome and mysteriously vanished without a trace. He said she was forced to perform in sex parties.
This was a crime with a sexual motive, said Amorth, reported the Telegraph. Parties were organized, with a Vatican gendarme acting as the 'recruiter' of the girls. The network involved diplomatic personnel from a foreign embassy to the Holy See. I believe Emanuela ended up a victim of this circle.
For three decades, the fate of Orlandi has consumed Italian police investigators. In an effort to solve the cold case, police acted on an anonymous tip to a popular television show in which a supposed informant claimed Orlandi could be buried in a murdered gangster's tomb.
Last week, Italian authorities and forensic experts opened the tomb of mobster Enrico De Pedis's in their hunt for Orlandi's body. Bones not belonging to De Pedis were discovered in the crypt. Analysis is being done to determine if the bones belong to Orlandi.
De Pedis was a powerful and charismatic mobster who was ran a gang known as the Banda della Magliana. He was murdered at the age of 38 by members of his own crew after they had an internal dispute, reported the Sun.
Theories surrounding the missing Orlandi suggested that she was taken by De Pedis who wanted to put pressure on the Vatican to recover money that they were owed, reported the Sydney Morning Herald.
Another theory is that she was taken to be used as a bargaining chip in order to release Mehmet ali Agca, the Turkish gunman who attempted to assassinate Pope John Paul II, reportedly on orders from the KGB.
However, Father Amorth rejected these claims. Amorth said he is firm on his theory that the girl was abused and killed as that this was part all part of the conspiracy in the Vatican to cover up the sex parties.
'It led to the murder and then the hiding of her body, he said, reported the Daily Mail. Also involved is diplomatic staff from a foreign embassy to the Holy See.
The Vatican has yet to comment on Father Amorth's claims. However, they did say they have always co-operated with investigation into Emanuela Orlandi's murder.

what does this have to do with baptism......A man was baptised and wanted to pay for the ability to lay hands on people to receive the HS....
Catholics and Protestants killed many while professing it is in the name of God.....are those reasons to not be baptised....you get baptised because it is an ordinance of God...you make a decision that one should not be baptised because catholics are baptised.....catholics eat too ...then you should stop eating...

Acts 8:17-19King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]17 [/SUP]Then laid they their hands on them, and they received the Holy Ghost.
[SUP]18 [/SUP]And when Simon saw that through laying on of the apostles' hands the Holy Ghost was given, he offered them money,
[SUP]19 [/SUP]Saying, Give me also this power, that on whomsoever I lay hands, he may receive the Holy Ghost.

Jackson123 · Nov 27, 2014

newbirth said:

If you want to know reason not water baptism, I already told you. a man die 10 second after having a faith in Jesus.

I give you fact how catholic core leader who suppose make rule and teach salvation by faith and work, and doing horrible crime. Do you still believe his teaching?

that answered you question what is the correlation this fact with the teaching salvation by work.

endtimes · Nov 27, 2014

Jackson123 said:

Many today, are in rebellion because they reject the gospel. By rejecting the gospel, they cannot get into heaven.

Seabass said it best, he wrote in post #44...

And, I agree with that.

God bless!

endtimes · Nov 27, 2014

Jackson123 said:

It is not "faith only" in Jesus, but there is salvation by "obedience to the gospel". Which is to obey the Death, Burial, Resurrection.

Further, water baptism is not a work, I'm not trying to "earn" my way into heaven, it is simply obeying God's word. And, people that resist this are in rebellion. They are rejecting the gospel, and trying to do it mans way.

This is God's way...

Acts 2:37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?

Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

This is to obey the gospel...

1. Repent = death
2. Be water baptized = burial
3. Receive Holy Spirit = resurrection

Acts 2:41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.

God bless!

Jackson123 · Nov 27, 2014

endtimes said:

This article bellow is sample reject the bible brother. A man having faith in Jesus and die 10 second after, before water baptism is not reject the bible.

Emanuela Orlandi, 15, Killed To Cover Up Vatican 'Sex Parties,' Claims Father Gabriele Amorth

By Michael Billera @http://twitter.com/#!/MichaelBillera on May 23 2012 10:39 AM

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Father Gabriele Amorth, who was appointed by Pope John Paul II as the chief exorcist of the Vatican, claims that the a teenage girl who went missing in the 80s, Emanuela Orlandi, was murdered as part of underground Vatican sex parties with ties to the organized crime and foreign embassies.
Amorth said that in the summer of 1983, 15-year-old Orlandi was snatched from the streets of Rome and mysteriously vanished without a trace. He said she was forced to perform in sex parties.
This was a crime with a sexual motive, said Amorth, reported the Telegraph. Parties were organized, with a Vatican gendarme acting as the 'recruiter' of the girls. The network involved diplomatic personnel from a foreign embassy to the Holy See. I believe Emanuela ended up a victim of this circle.
For three decades, the fate of Orlandi has consumed Italian police investigators. In an effort to solve the cold case, police acted on an anonymous tip to a popular television show in which a supposed informant claimed Orlandi could be buried in a murdered gangster's tomb.
Last week, Italian authorities and forensic experts opened the tomb of mobster Enrico De Pedis's in their hunt for Orlandi's body. Bones not belonging to De Pedis were discovered in the crypt. Analysis is being done to determine if the bones belong to Orlandi.
De Pedis was a powerful and charismatic mobster who was ran a gang known as the Banda della Magliana. He was murdered at the age of 38 by members of his own crew after they had an internal dispute, reported the Sun.
Theories surrounding the missing Orlandi suggested that she was taken by De Pedis who wanted to put pressure on the Vatican to recover money that they were owed, reported the Sydney Morning Herald.
Another theory is that she was taken to be used as a bargaining chip in order to release Mehmet ali Agca, the Turkish gunman who attempted to assassinate Pope John Paul II, reportedly on orders from the KGB.
However, Father Amorth rejected these claims. Amorth said he is firm on his theory that the girl was abused and killed as that this was part all part of the conspiracy in the Vatican to cover up the sex parties.
'It led to the murder and then the hiding of her body, he said, reported the Daily Mail. Also involved is diplomatic staff from a foreign embassy to the Holy See.
The Vatican has yet to comment on Father Amorth's claims. However, they did say they have always co-operated with investigation into Emanuela Orlandi's murder.

What happens when Believers don't obey the Gospel

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