What of the dinosaurs?

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Nov 9, 2014
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There is no "missing day." That is a creationist fraud.

If you want to learn the origin of writing, see:

Black, Jeremy, Anthony Green, Tessa Rickards (illustrator)
2003 "Gods, Demons and Symbols of Ancient Mesopotamia" Austin: University of Texas Press.

Schmandt-Besserat, Denise
1992 "Before Writing Volume I: From counting to cuneiform" Austin: University of Texas Press

And for even older notations, see;
Marshack, Alexander
1991 "The Roots of Civilization" Singapore: Palace Press and Alabama: Books International

Don't worry. I know you won't really bother.
 
K

Kerry

Guest
Still listening to what a man says huh. Show which nations were born with a pen and not war.
 
K

Kerry

Guest
Israel was destroyed in 70 AD and has not existed until 1948 or the UN accepted them as a state in 1967 I think. but any way the bible predicted this did it not. The 23 Psalm declares that you have set a table for me in the presence of mine enemies is that not whats happening?
 
Nov 9, 2014
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Still listening to what a man says huh. Show which nations were born with a pen and not war.
There was tremendous violence at the formation of the new state of Israel. There is still great violence.

There was less at the creation of many other middle-east nations following the end of WWII. See:

"A Peace to End All Peace: The Fall of the Ottoman Empire and the Creation of the Modern Middle East"
by David Fromkin (2009 Holt Paperbacks; 20th Anniversary Edition edition)

Just recall the peaceful breakup of the former Soviet Union. Africa was carved into weak "nations" by the British, American, and French oil companies following WWI.
 
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K

Kerry

Guest
Oh and dinosaurs are pre adamic keeping with the them of the thread.
 
K

Kerry

Guest
There was tremendous violence at the formation of the new state of Israel. There is still great violence.

There was less at the creation of many other middle-east nations following the end of WWII. See:

"A Peace to End All Peace: The Fall of the Ottoman Empire and the Creation of the Modern Middle East"
by David Fromkin (2009 Holt Paperbacks; 20th Anniversary Edition edition)

Just recall the peaceful breakup of the former Soviet Union. Africa was carved into weak "nations" by the British, American, and French oil companies following WWI.
why change the subject unlees you have nothing, Israel was created with a pen just as the bible foretells or are you reaching.
 
K

Kerry

Guest
[h=1]Isaiah 66:8King James Version (KJV)[/h]8 Who hath heard such a thing? who hath seen such things? Shall the earth be made to bring forth in one day? or shall a nation be born at once? for as soon as Zion travailed, she brought forth her children.
 
Jun 5, 2014
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There are several problems that trash the effort to deny radioactive decay series in the ICR "reports" linked by Mr. Swords Guy.

The first obvious failure was "Unfortunately for the secularist, there are radiohalos formed from what appears to be primordial Po (polonium), rather than Po in the form of daughter isotopes from U decay." (This is the correct link to Creationist Silly Part 1, by the way).

The failure is of course that the creationists merely make the empty assertion without any evidence. This particular creationist fraud has been popular since Robert Gentry's publications in the 1970s. What he, now any later creationist was never ever able to explain was how they could tell the difference between "primordial" Polonium and the regular sort. The entire creationist fantasy is debunked by (PDF) Collins, Lorence G. "Polonium halos and myrmekite in pegmatite and granite." (1997). Then there is the basic error of the Helium content of zircons promoted by Russ Humphreys. Among the gross errors of fact are that the tested material was removed from very high pressure rock which alters Helium diffusion, and that the silly notion of "accelerated nuclear decay" would have melted the Earth, and slaughtered all life.

Then there is this little horse's gift to the pasture, "Unfortunately for the secularist, there are serious problems with the uniformitarian view as it is applied to radioactive dating. Recent experimental evidences verify that the decay rates of radioisotopes can vary significantly from the currently accepted values—by as much as 10[SUP]9[/SUP] times faster (that’s 1 billion times faster) when exposed to certain environmental factors." The "certain environmental factors" happen to be heated to a ionized plasma. That is correct, boys and girls. All we need to do to alter negative beta decay is turn the Earth into a glowing ball of electron free gas.

Sure- no problem.

That was followed by the comparatively minor lie that, "It is particularly interesting that the alpha-decay rates of [SUP]228[/SUP]Th are increased by as much as 10[SUP]4[/SUP] (10,000 times) under conditions which give rise to high pressure waves."

This cited a paper that was refuted by a half dozen later experiments. But even if it was not a failure as science, the "environmental conditions" in this case were a dissolved thorium oxide subjected to ultrasound cavitation.

Sure- no problem. Just liquefy the Earth in a giant blender in an ultrasound machine, and then there might be some effect that cannot be replicated by anyone. (2009. Piezonuclear decay of thorium. Physics Letters A. 373 (22): 1956-1958).
I understand that these "scientists" who work for ICR have to sign an oath that they won't publish or say anything contrary to ICR propaganda.

Intellectual dishonesty at it's finest.
 
Jun 5, 2014
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I Have a written document going back 6,000 years where is yours?
What is this 6,000-year-old document you keep yammering about?

The King James Bible 1611 isn't 6,000 years old, is it?

It appears to me that fossils are actually better evidence than written records, generally speaking.

What should I believe? The overwhelming scientific evidence that non-avian dinosaurs became extinct 65 million years ago or Ken Ham books about T. rex and children playing together?
 
Sep 30, 2014
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What is this 6,000-year-old document you keep yammering about?

The King James Bible 1611 isn't 6,000 years old, is it?

It appears to me that fossils are actually better evidence than written records, generally speaking.

What should I believe? The overwhelming scientific evidence that non-avian dinosaurs became extinct 65 million years ago or Ken Ham books about T. rex and children playing together?
Is there not evidence of Solomons temple ?
 
Nov 3, 2014
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"What is this 6,000-year-old document you keep yammering about?"


Now you are more intelligent than that JH

You know very well that the Bible "contains" the geneologcal record that Kerry is talking about

.... and you should believe that the universe and earth are of extreme age .... and not Ham's pseudo creation

You should also consider the biblical account ..... extreme aging, recent appearance of the human

Ham wants you to believe that the Lord just made things to "look old" when they are not really

.... the Lord needs not to resort to deception and would never
 
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Nov 3, 2014
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Dinosaurs have been around for billions of years .... until recently .... the Lord just did not want the dudes around to menace humans ..... where would all of the humans be if the dinos were allowed ..... eaten

Satan's play toys are extinct .... and now he is left with humans to deceive

.... don't let him fool you
 
Nov 9, 2014
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Is there not evidence of Solomons temple ?
There was a century of so-called "biblical archaeology" from ~1850 to ~1950 where ever dig "proved" the Bible. Following the establishment of the State of Israel, archaeology was propagandized even more, now used to justify the "original Jewish State" argument. However, there was finally a chance for scientific archaeology as well because Israel established a massive state funded survey of archaeological sites. The design, and professional work was finally done with legitimate scientific goals, rather then political or theological ones.

Of course, controversy was instant. One American archaeologist bridged the transition, William Dever. His 2001 book "What Did the Biblical Writers Know & When Did They Know IT?: What Archaeology can tell us about the reality of ancient Israel" (Grand Rapids: William B. Eerdmans Publishing Company) sumarizes his career and the "biblical archaeology" tradition. I was more interested in his later 2005 book, “Did God Have A Wife? Archaeology And Folk Religion In Ancient Israel" (Grand Rapids: William B. Eerdmans Publishing Company). There he examined the household archaeology related to the persistence of the pre-Temple worship of Israel's original polytheistic religion. For a biblical languages expert's book on the same topic, see Mark Smith's 2003 “The Origins of Biblical Monotheism: Israel's Polytheistic Background and the Ugaritic Texts” (Oxford University Press).

One of Dever's main targets was Israeli archaeologist Israel Finkelstein. He and Neil Silberman also published an important book in 2001, "The Bible Unearthed: Archaeology’s New Vision of Ancient Israel and the Origin of Its Sacred Texts" (New York: The Free Press). Their main argument was simply that there is no support for the "biblical archaeology" claims that every newly excavated courtyard was "Solomon's," or every burnt wall "proof" of some biblical battle.

A final note, both Dever, and Finkelstein expect their readers to be familiar with;
Mazar, Amihai
1992 "Archaeology of the Land of the Bible: 10,000-586 B.C.E." The Anchor Bible Reference Library NewYork: ABRL/Doubleday

to which you really should add;
Stern, Ephraim
2001 "Archaeology of the Land of the Bible, Vol. II: The Asserian, Babylonian and Persian Periods (732-332 B.C.E.)" The Anchor Bible Reference Library New York: ABRL/Doubleday

Killebrew, Ann E.
2005 “Biblical Peoples and Ethnicity: An Archaeological Study of Egyptians, Canaanites, Philistines, and Early Israel.” Society of Biblical Literature


But, this is not at all related to dinosaurs.
 
T

Tintin

Guest
Dinosaurs have been around for billions of years .... until recently .... the Lord just did not want the dudes around to menace humans ..... where would all of the humans be if the dinos were allowed ..... eaten

Satan's play toys are extinct .... and now he is left with humans to deceive

.... don't let him fool you
Not even evolutionists and theistic evolutionists believe dinosaurs have been around for billions of years. The number is closer to 165 million years (according to them).
 
T

Tintin

Guest
There is no "missing day." That is a creationist fraud.

If you want to learn the origin of writing, see:

Black, Jeremy, Anthony Green, Tessa Rickards (illustrator)
2003 "Gods, Demons and Symbols of Ancient Mesopotamia" Austin: University of Texas Press.

Schmandt-Besserat, Denise
1992 "Before Writing Volume I: From counting to cuneiform" Austin: University of Texas Press

And for even older notations, see;
Marshack, Alexander
1991 "The Roots of Civilization" Singapore: Palace Press and Alabama: Books International

Don't worry. I know you won't really bother.
Rubbish. Creationist fraud, indeed? There are some arguments that were used in the past, sure, that aren't valid anymore but they're also not encouraged by the main creation ministries. Why beat a horse that's already dead?
Finally, Genesis talks about the book of Adam, so I choose to believe that Adam was the one to invent writing. If we're talking post-Flood, then writing was likely continued by Noah or any member of his family and then passed down the lines, where the Sumerians developed their own script.
 
T

Tintin

Guest
The oldest fragments of stories told in the Bible's oldest bits are only from the Sumerian tablets of Atrahasis.

See;
Blenkinsopp, Joseph
1992 "The Pentateuch: An Introduction to the First Five Books of the Bible" The Anchor Bible Reference Library New York: ABRL/Doubleday

Dalley, Stephanie
2000 “Myths from Mesopotamia: Creation, The Flood, Gilgamesh, and Others, Revised” Oxford University Press

Killebrew, Ann E.
2005 “Biblical Peoples and Ethnicity: An Archaeological Study of Egyptians, Canaanites, Philistines, and Early Israel.” Society of Biblical Literature

Parker, Simon B. (Editor)
1997 "Ugarit Narrative Poetry" Translated by Mark S. Smith, Simon B. Parker, Edward L Greenstein, Theodore J. Lewis, David Marcus, Vol. 9 Writings from the Ancient World. Atlanta: Society of Biblical Literature

Sparks, Kenton L.
2005 “Ancient Texts for the Study of the Hebrew Bible” Peabody PA: Hendrickson Publishers

Speiser, E. A.
1962 "Genesis: Introduction, Translation and Notes" New York: Anchor Bible- Doubleday


I mention this because you are clearly ignorant of when the Bible was first formed, and in what languages it was first told, and what it says.
Bulldust! Do some research, man! Don't just read resources that agree with your stance, that's not cricket. Also, these nonsense has been dealt with in other threads. Do a search on CC and you'll find them. The Genesis account is the original, everything else is a copy or fabrication. I'm not even saying that the Genesis account was necessarily the first one to be written down but the real life event that gave way to myths etc. was communicated orally.
 
Sep 30, 2014
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There was a century of so-called "biblical archaeology" from ~1850 to ~1950 where ever dig "proved" the Bible. Following the establishment of the State of Israel, archaeology was propagandized even more, now used to justify the "original Jewish State" argument. However, there was finally a chance for scientific archaeology as well because Israel established a massive state funded survey of archaeological sites. The design, and professional work was finally done with legitimate scientific goals, rather then political or theological ones.

Of course, controversy was instant. One American archaeologist bridged the transition, William Dever. His 2001 book "What Did the Biblical Writers Know & When Did They Know IT?: What Archaeology can tell us about the reality of ancient Israel" (Grand Rapids: William B. Eerdmans Publishing Company) sumarizes his career and the "biblical archaeology" tradition. I was more interested in his later 2005 book, “Did God Have A Wife? Archaeology And Folk Religion In Ancient Israel" (Grand Rapids: William B. Eerdmans Publishing Company). There he examined the household archaeology related to the persistence of the pre-Temple worship of Israel's original polytheistic religion. For a biblical languages expert's book on the same topic, see Mark Smith's 2003 “The Origins of Biblical Monotheism: Israel's Polytheistic Background and the Ugaritic Texts” (Oxford University Press).

One of Dever's main targets was Israeli archaeologist Israel Finkelstein. He and Neil Silberman also published an important book in 2001, "The Bible Unearthed: Archaeology’s New Vision of Ancient Israel and the Origin of Its Sacred Texts" (New York: The Free Press). Their main argument was simply that there is no support for the "biblical archaeology" claims that every newly excavated courtyard was "Solomon's," or every burnt wall "proof" of some biblical battle.

A final note, both Dever, and Finkelstein expect their readers to be familiar with;
Mazar, Amihai
1992 "Archaeology of the Land of the Bible: 10,000-586 B.C.E." The Anchor Bible Reference Library NewYork: ABRL/Doubleday

to which you really should add;
Stern, Ephraim
2001 "Archaeology of the Land of the Bible, Vol. II: The Asserian, Babylonian and Persian Periods (732-332 B.C.E.)" The Anchor Bible Reference Library New York: ABRL/Doubleday

Killebrew, Ann E.
2005 “Biblical Peoples and Ethnicity: An Archaeological Study of Egyptians, Canaanites, Philistines, and Early Israel.” Society of Biblical Literature


But, this is not at all related to dinosaurs.
So your answer is no ? The Jews do not gather at the West wall of the temple ?
 
Sep 30, 2014
2,329
102
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One of Dever's main targets was Israeli archaeologist Israel Finkelstein. He and Neil Silberman also published an important book in 2001, "The Bible Unearthed: Archaeology’s New Vision of Ancient Israel and the Origin of Its Sacred Texts" (New York: The Free Press). Their main argument was simply that there is no support for the "biblical archaeology" claims that every newly excavated courtyard was "Solomon's," or every burnt wall "proof" of some biblical battle.
By the way I didn't ask you about " every new claim ", I asked about the temple.