What Would Stop a "Once Saved, Always Saved" Believer From Committing Suicide?

[Depleted]

Re: What Would Stop a "Once Saved, Always Saved" Believer From Committing Suicide?

Hello Everyone,

I apologize if this is a topic that has already been debated to death. I did a topic search on both "Once Saved, Always Saved" as well as the subject of suicide, but I didn't find the specifics of what I was hoping people could answer.

I grew up in a church that does not believe in Once Saved, Always Saved, but several people whom I currently know and highly respect believe in this teaching, and their influence has led me to try to study it as in-depth as possible.

If a person believes that nothing they can do will compromise their salvation, what would keep them from committing suicide, if they came to that point? Would they refrain because God commands us not to kill?

And what about, what I personally call, "The Saul Dilemma"--in the Bible, King Saul opted to commit suicide rather than fall into the hands of his enemies and be subjected to their torture (1 Samuel 31).

If you had the option of killing yourself vs. falling into the hands of your enemies (or, let's say, a long-term, painful, and terminal illness), what would you do?

Am I understanding correctly, or would someone who believes in Once Saved, Always Saved be at peace with the thought of killing themselves, and yet still making it to heaven?

(I'm asking because this is the complete opposite of what I was taught as a child--we were told that suicide was pretty much a guaranteed ticket to hell, although they did say that in the end, only God knows.)

I am very new to the Once Saved, Always Saved teaching, so I apologize if any of my questions seem naive or out of place. However, I have not found a clear answer to these issues in my studies and would appreciate any input you may have.

Thank you, and God bless.

I am, very much, a OSASer. It has everything to do with who is in control -- God or Man.

Who saves? God does! Does Man have any part of that salvation? Yes and no. No, in that Man contributed nothing to that salvation. Yes, in that Man is the receiver of that salvation. Sort of like if you skip a stone across the water, how much part in that action does the stone have? No stone, and nothing skips across the water.

We were dead in sin. Not fainted, not pressed down, not mixed up in. "Dead." Show me a dead man doing something for himself, and I'll show you God in action, not Man in action.

Okay, with me so far? (Not to be confused with "agreeing with me so far?" lol)

And then there is after salvation. Salvation is a one time act -- Jesus on that cross dying for whosoever-will-believe, aka those the Father has chosen. (Everyone knows John 3:16. Most ignore it keeps going on to John 3:17-21. At the end, God does the action, not Man.)

But, you're right. And then there is Saul. Jesus covered that too. The sower and the seed. Saul grew in rocky soil. What's the soil? God, right? Don't fall on deep rich soil, and you're gonna die without ever being saved. No doubt, Saul sucked up the nutrients from the soil, but his seed didn't land on soil. Soil landed on the rocks. Where the seed lands is also directed by God. What the seed does after that is also directed by God.

So after God saves, there is sanctification with the direct destination of glorification. (Doesn't feel direct, but always headed in that direction.) Sanctification is God setting us apart for his holiness. It is also us seeking his will in our lives to do that. (Good, rich, yummy soil from a plant's perspective.)

I'm really a OSASer. What people don't take into account is "and then what?" And then our roots dig deep into God's richness and will. We want to do God's will because God has put that into us. What's God's will? To trust him. To love him. To glorify him forever. If that isn't our goal, or if we do not persevere, then we were never saved in the first place.

And that is why I didn't kill myself. I teetered on the edge with that one to the point of knowing how to do it without anyone catching on that it was suicide. (I wanted to leave hubby my life insurance and hoped he wouldn't catch on that it was on purpose, although, looking back, I know he would have. What an evil thing suicide is for that person, and the people around her. To put that guilt onto someone else? NOT God's will!)

'kay? Did that help?

 

[Depleted]

Re: What Would Stop a "Once Saved, Always Saved" Believer From Committing Suicide?

My childhood church believed that if Saul was saved at one point, he lost his salvation through his disobedience to God and eventual suicide.

Am I misunderstanding, but would the Once Saved, Always Saved believers say that if Saul was truly saved, he still went to heaven, even though he "fell on his own sword"?

I know people who contemplate taking their own lives very seriously, and have for a long time.

Theoretically, if they are "true believers" or "truly saved"... their salvation cannot be lost, and they will still go to heaven?

This OSASer doesn't trust myself enough to say what happened to Saul. I don't think he was saved, because in the long-term, his actions said he wasn't. (You just don't go around trying to kill God's elect. Rather misses the whole point of trusting God.) But, until God gives me his list of the elect, I have no idea whom he has chosen and whom he has not chosen. Yeesh! Took a good 30+ years for me to come to terms with I'm elected. (I've seen many rocky-soil believers fade away in my life, and that has always taken me by surprise.)

So, whether God snatches someone to salvation at 11:59:59? At this point, I'm really counting on him to do that for my dad. I still have hope in God's mercy and trust his will. I don't even discount Judas being saved somewhere in that moment between jumping and the rope strangling him to death before he splattered across the ground.

 

[Depleted]

Re: What Would Stop a "Once Saved, Always Saved" Believer From Committing Suicide?

I should also add that I have also met people who have told me that no "true believer" in Christ would ever contemplate suicide, and anyone who does is "not a true Christian."

What conclusions have you drawn about these matters as a result of your own personal studies?

Well, since I was there, I'm in the camp that whoever says that is a moron.

(Please note: I did write that before finding out if anyone is a moron for that one. lol)

 

[Depleted]

Re: What Would Stop a "Once Saved, Always Saved" Believer From Committing Suicide?

Thank you for sharing this.

My childhood church taught that this is very reason why suicide would automatically send you to hell--because you were deciding something only God could decide (the time and manner of your death--murder), and therefore elevating yourself in a position above God (blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.)

They also taught that you would also go to hell because there would be no time to confess your sin or ask forgiveness for it, though I have to think that many, many believers have died in circumstances in which there is no time to confess or repent (drunk driving, etc.)

Why is that not the same for someone who chooses to lie, cheat, steal, dishonor parents, doesn't put God first, takes his name in vain, doesn't keep the Sabbath, and/or coveting? Why that one sin? Why are the other's lesser?

I also think anyone who tries to kill themselves isn't in their right mind, (including me.) I can't prove that scriptural. Feels more like common sense. But if someone's hallucination causes him/her to walk across I-95 at 5:30 PM on the Friday night before Memorial Day, (when our stretch of I-95 is at its busiest), is that suicide? No, sheer craziness. The same kind of craziness that is suicide.

Suicide really is that moment in time when we just cannot bear life any longer. Only by the grace of God can some of us teeter at that brink, and God snatches us back. He gives us a glimmer of hope. No that, and poof! We're a goner.

To confess your sins before you die causing salvation is to give another way besides Jesus. You save yourself. Can't be done. We're dead until Jesus saves us. And he is the only Way.

 

[Ariel82]

Re: What Would Stop a "Once Saved, Always Saved" Believer From Committing Suicide?

I should also add that I have also met people who have told me that no "true believer" in Christ would ever contemplate suicide, and anyone who does is "not a true Christian."

What conclusions have you drawn about these matters as a result of your own personal studies?

Elijah asked God to kill him....

 

[Depleted]

Re: What Would Stop a "Once Saved, Always Saved" Believer From Committing Suicide?

I am definitely trying to avoid the Bible pong, if at all possible.

The reason I'm asking these questions is because there are people I know and deeply love who consider suicide a viable option in this life, and either claim they don't care whether or not they make it to heaven, or think they can get there no matter what choice they make.

My intentions behind this thread are not to debate or try to claim superiority for any particular perspective...

To be completely honest, I'm writing this thread as someone who is broken-hearted for some of the people I know and love, and desperately wishing to give them some sort of wisdom or hope, because they cannot see any for themselves.

Immediately, my mind wants to give you exactly the right words to "tell 'em."

Dumb, dumb, dumb, DUMB!

Instead I pray this thread helps God give you those right words, or... better yet, God intervenes in his "I never thought he'd do it like that, but, boy, great way of doing it" way.

 

[Mike777]

Re: What Would Stop a "Once Saved, Always Saved" Believer From Committing Suicide?

Regarding suicide, clinic depression is a very real problem and true believers in Jesus Christ can struggle with it as well as suicidal thoughts, I know because I have battled with it for years. If anyone else struggles with this please seek help, it is a treatable problem, see a counselor and a psychologist, also utilize any resources of your local church. Most importantly seek the Lord, James 4 says draw near to God and he will draw near to you, study the Bible, some times a study of the Psalms can be a source of comfort and hope, invite positive people into your life. With that said suicide is a sin like any other sin and will be forgiven if we have truly accepted Jesus Christ into out heart and know him personally, I would not like to meet Christ that way, there is so much work to do for the Lord and so many people we can help and encourage, its also true that taking our mind off our self and helping others can make us feel better, Jesus said its more blessed to give rather than to receive, the word blessed there in the Greek means happy, its simply God's way that we serve and focus on others and it does make us happier people. The main verse mentioned, claiming suicide is an unforgivable sin is 1 Corinthians 3:16 however destroys God's temple God will destroy. This is a bad interpretation of this passage, read the entire context. This is not about the individual Christian but the Church Of God. There are so many passages in the Bible that teach that we do not lose our salvation by committing sins. Roman 8:1 There is no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. 1 Cor. 1:13,14 we are sealed by the holy spirit. Roams 8:29 God has predestined those who came to believe in Christ. Heb. 10:14 God has perfected forever those who have been set apart for God. John 10:28,29 No one shall snatch the believers from Christ's hand. As well as many others. I hope this was helpful.

 

[JesusRules1]

Re: What Would Stop a "Once Saved, Always Saved" Believer From Committing Suicide?

No person says Jesus is Lord except by the Holy Spirit,and no person comes to the Son except the Father draws them.

Many are called,but few are chosen.

The people that said,Lord why can't we dwell with you,for we labored for the kingdom,claimed Jesus as Lord,and were called,but they were not chosen,because Jesus said they did not do the will of the Father,but were workers of iniquity.

They have a form of godliness,but deny the power thereof,ever learning and never coming to the truth that they have to deny sin,not want sin,and allow the Spirit to lead them to abstain from sin.

A Spirit led life will not fulfill the desires of the flesh,will abstain from sin,because the person does not want sin,and means it,and God will not allow them to be tempted above measure,and will give them an escape from the temptation,and the Spirit will lead them to do good.The person does not want sin,and led by the Spirit they can abstain from sin,but it is because they make the choice to not want sin.

That does not mean they might not sin,but if a person truly does not want sin by the Spirit they have the power to beat the temptations of the flesh,for it is easier on them than the world.

It is the tree of the knowledge of good and evil,for we have a choice,and are not forced to sin,so we can choose the good,and if we choose the good by the Spirit we can do the good,and there is no excuse for those who believe we cannot abstain from sin,for it is not that we cannot abstain from sin,but we want to sin.

The two main things that we have to do according to the Bible,love people,and help them with their needs if we can,and do not pursue our wants in money,and material things,for people that believe God blesses with money and material things,from such withdraw yourself,they have erred from the faith,faith without works is dead,and the love of God is not in them,and to abstain from fleshy lusts,for such shall not inherit the kingdom of God,which the Bible warns the saints to not be deceived for whatever a person sows that is what they shall reap.

Love not the world,or the things of the world,and if any person does so they are not of the Father.

The difference between a person that has received the Spirit,and a person that has not,is the person that has received the Spirit might sin,but they know it is wrong,and they are not right with God because of their sin,but the person that has not received the Spirit will think it is alright to sin,and will hold unto sin,thinking it does not affect their relationship with God,and the person that received the Spirit might sin,but not hold unto it,but get rid of it,and keep going ahead allowing the Spirit to lead them,but the person without the Spirit will hold unto sin,and not put forth a great effort to beat sin,for they think they are alright.

But the thing that I have observed among those that claim OSAS is that they have a lot of worldliness about them,in to smoking and drinking alcohol,worldly entertainment,and things of the world,money and material things,and kind of live like the world,and Jesus at the same time,and believe they cannot abstain from sin.

But why is this if they have the Spirit and are sealed unto redemption,I only want to know,for I have not seen one different,and some downright nasty,swearing,and acting like the world,but believing OSAS,which I have observed Catholics,and Mormons,and Jehovah's witnesses,act more Christlike than a lot of them,so why is that when Jesus said you will know them by their fruits.

Some people that claim Jesus as Lord will not separate themselves totally from the world,some more in to the world than others,but still the world,and I have observed the OSAS people terrible at totally separating themselves from the world,and why is that.

All sin is unrighteousness,and we have to totally separate ourselves from the world,and you will know them by their fruits.

 

[Depleted]

Re: What Would Stop a "Once Saved, Always Saved" Believer From Committing Suicide?

A suicidal person is not in the right state of mind, so I would hardly believe that their thought process is OSAS doctrine, and therefore they then go ahead with taking their own life. Truth be told, how can suicide lead to hell (if suicide is a sin) if Christ died to pay for all the sins of the world? If someone who believed in Christ died through suicide, that sin has to be taken away by Christ's sacrifice. Otherwise, it puts into question the whole ordeal because Christ died for all sin, for all people.

Now, when I read your title (prior to reading your post) my initial thought was that you figured if someone believes in OSAS they might as well expedite the process and get to Heaven now. Why not, right? Well, the same could be said of people who think that we can fall away from the faith or lose our salvation through sinning.

How so? Well, if you can lose your salvation, in a number of ways (people have speculated) then that means the best option (best case scenario) is to believe in Christ and die as soon as possible. I mean, live on the edge, walk through ghetto neighborhoods, or sign up for war. The quicker you die, the better. Right?

You see, whether you believe in OSAS or that a believer can lose their salvation, in both scenarios death is a release. To the secure it simply means a faster reunion and to the insecure it simply means assurance. However, all of this needs to be put in perspective.

God's grace is sufficient. It, of course, isn't His will for His child to go down that path of mental illness and anguish, yet one can see the mercy in that He saved that person's soul. They lived Hell on earth (why else would they suicide?), and then God who is merciful and kind, would send them to Hell for eternity? It doesn't make sense, not only from the perspective of God's character, but the Gospel of Jesus Christ. Jesus died for all sin, and if suicide is considered a sin, well then there you go. Jesus paid its price, its penalty.

Now, you may be concerned and we go back to your initial question. "What would stop a OSAS believer from committing suicide?" God's intervention, and the love of those around them. Not only that, but the implication of their actions on those that they love. Such things are deterrents to suicide because of the ruin that one leaves behind. Even then, having such deterrents, the person may still follow through (sadly), but keep in mind that the person is not in the right state of mind. It isn't your fault, or God's, but rather it is the fault of the suicidal person's perception of their circumstance.
That perception itself being hopeless, and unforgiving.

Its a touchy subject, but one cannot place a sin above Christ's sacrifice, unless they wish to negate the sufficiency of His blood that was shed for all sin.

You had me until the fifth paragraph.

"God's grace is sufficient. It, of course, isn't His will for His child to go down that path of mental illness and anguish, yet one can see the mercy in that He saved that person's soul. They lived Hell on earth (why else would they suicide?), and then God who is merciful and kind, would send them to Hell for eternity? It doesn't make sense, not only from the perspective of God's character, but the Gospel of Jesus Christ. Jesus died for all sin, and if suicide is considered a sin, well then there you go. Jesus paid its price, its penalty."

If it isn't God's will to do exactly that -- "go down that path of mental illness and anguish" -- then God is inept and can't get his will? Saul was a fluke? All those people God had go crazy were flukes? He didn't really mean for that to happen, but couldn't stop it? He couldn't stop schizophrenia, bipolar, PTSD, depression, etc.? He's to inept? Sorry. Either God is completely sovereign or he doesn't exist/isn't God. There is no way -- ever -- someone will get me to worship an inept god. There is purpose, even in mental illness. And God wills it for the good of those who are his chosen and the bad for those who aren't ever going to be his chosen.

(I also disagree that Jesus died for all sin, but that's a different topic.)

 

[Depleted]

Re: What Would Stop a "Once Saved, Always Saved" Believer From Committing Suicide?

Hi Seoul,
The Bible tells us that those who are led by the Spirit of such there is no law. Gal.5:23 Reading Romans tells us that the law is written in our hearts., it's the law of the Spirit it's obedience of faith. Rom.2:15 We believers go by the law of faith Rom.3:27 We are not under the law of Mosses. Christ is the end of the law. The strength/power of sin is the law. 1Cor.15:56 The sting of death is sin, and the power of sin is the law; But thanks be to God who gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.

I don't understand how some seasoned Christians are always fighting to uphold the law when what we need to teach others to do is uphold the gospel of grace and truth given to us by Jesus. The law can't save us or keep us. The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are the sons of God. We are now in the beloved.

We love Him because He first loved us. We don't love Him out of fear but we have been made new and we are daily learning to love Him by His example. Those who are in love and get married GET to kiss and love each other., they don't feel that they HAVE to kiss and love each other., they deeply desire to do those things. It's a blessing to do those things not a burden.

Perfect love casts out fear. His is perfect love for us and it will cast out fear. When we know we are loved we have confidence in Him. We trust Him and follow close to Him. He is the Good Shepherd who gave His life for the sheep. My sheep know My voice and follow Me.

Have you never noticed every time you say something, you're aim is to scold people who are not just like you?
"[FONT=&quot]I don't understand how some seasoned Christians are always fighting[/FONT]"

No one was fighting, and yet, then there was that!

 

[Depleted]

Re: What Would Stop a "Once Saved, Always Saved" Believer From Committing Suicide?

Ben,

Thank you so much for this in-depth and thought-provoking post.

You really hit the nail on the head as well when you mentioned the point about reasoning that if one will be going to heaven no matter what, why not get there as soon as possible?

I have wondered this my whole life, since all I ever hear Christians talk about is how wonderful and perfect everything will be when we "get to be with Jesus."

I agree with that, of course, but I always figured, then why not try to get there as soon as absolutely possible? It has always seemed to me that the most glorious thing any Christian has to look forward to... is death. I say that in a mildly sarcastic way, because the "just wait 'til we're with Jesus" answer seemed to be given as a cookie-cutter solution to any problem someone presented when I went to Christian schools.

Thank you so much for your heartfelt and sensible post. I am going to read it several times in order to fully grasp what you were kind enough to take the time to write. God bless.

Life is like school. The purpose is to learn and apply it, but simply getting the diploma when we're still in first grade doesn't mean anything. We spend our lives to learn what God will have to teach us. And when he's done teaching us all that, then we are ready for graduation. No use going to the commencement ceremony without the lessons learned.

 

[Depleted]

Re: What Would Stop a "Once Saved, Always Saved" Believer From Committing Suicide?

I have a "long painful and terminal illness" and I believe in eternal security! What keeps me from committing suicide?

Let's see! God, my family, music, love, sunsets, my lake and mountains, flowers, kittens, grandchildren, friends, eating, studying Greek, traveling, diamonds, helping others, sharing the gospel, and a thousand other things!

Your whole hypothesis is wrong. What makes you think because someone is sick, or in pain immediately makes them want to die? God put a love of life in every person. When they lose that love of life, that is called depression, which is a mental illness. It can be treated with love, support, medication, therapy and prayer.

It is true most people get depressed when they are first diagnosed with a serious and life threatening illness. But it doesn't want to make them want to die! In fact, the sicker I get, the more I want to live!

So you have created this absurd scenario where people want to die because they know they are going to heaven? Far from it! I know hundreds of people with RA- both real life and in line. No one is planning to kill themselves. People seek to get better and live.

My cousin's wife got breast cancer and it metastasized. They went everywhere to get treatment, even Mexico when they exhausted conventional treatments. When the end grew near, she did not want to die, she wanted to live, to see her grandchildren grow up!

There was a man in my Seminary who got ALS. He never got depressed, but continued to work as an evangelist, which was his calling. As his body broke down, he continued to witness to the work of Christ in his life in Word and person. On his death bed, he led 3 of his caregivers to the Lord!

I could tell you stories like this forever! So perhaps, since your basic premise is totally wrong, perhaps losing your salvation is also wrong? Because a person who is dying needs love, support, and yes, pain control. I worked in long term care as a chaplain, and I never met one person who was actively dying, on palliative care, who wanted to end it sooner.

And I have met people who were physically healthy, but depressed and wanted to die. There is a lot of help for these people. But if they really were saved, and killed themselves, I have no doubt that God is big enough to forgive them even that sin! There is no place in the Bible where it says suicide is the only sin that can't be forgiven. That is just made up by people like your church you grew up in, who erroneously believed you can lose your salvation!

I wanted to live. I still do. But when the pain was so bad that was my one and only thought all day every day and far into the night, it got too much to bear. Doctors weren't listening. They thought it was fine to keep me at 8-12 range on the pain scale, (which only goes to 10, for those who don't know the pain scale), while they sent me to test after test, and each test took four weeks waiting for the appointment and another two weeks before seeing the doctor who usually told me it was negative. (Sometimes he told me what was wrong, but fixing that spot -- if it was even fixable -- was something like being told by a heavyweight boxer that I'm his sparing partner, and he won't hit me at the fifth punch in the third round. Nice to skip that punch, but the ones before that one and the ones after it weren't easier, simply because that one didn't hit.)

I wanted to live, but not at the cost of being in pain I simply could not bear forever. I held on for EIGHT months! That wasn't living. That was holding on to hope that God wouldn't leave me like that!

I also think church people saying that -- suicide means you go to hell -- are saying that just to give the one contemplating suicide a reason to live. Not a great thing to say, but I get the heart of that one. I did fear I'd kill myself the day before someone could lower my pain levels. Close to right. The worst was April of that year. The pain pill that finally helped was prescribed in mid May.

Been living again ever since.

 

[Depleted]

Re: What Would Stop a "Once Saved, Always Saved" Believer From Committing Suicide?

And I do not see the sin of suicide to be the same as calling the Spirit of God evil.
Also, God judges the heart so if a believer was to instantly die God knows the heart of the believer he knows if the person was truly seeking God or not. This is why even the drunk could be in their heart trying to follow God and constantly at battle within to give God the sin but all we see is a drunk. God knows the heart of and he knows his sheep.

You said you've done in-depth studies. Where do you get this stuff from then?

 

[dcontroversal]

Re: What Would Stop a "Once Saved, Always Saved" Believer From Committing Suicide?

You said you've done in-depth studies. Where do you get this stuff from then?

You remember how you used to get those mini comic books in a box of Cracker Jacks..............!

 

[joaniemarie]

Re: What Would Stop a "Once Saved, Always Saved" Believer From Committing Suicide?

Have you never noticed every time you say something, you're aim is to scold people who are not just like you?
"I don't understand how some seasoned Christians are always fighting"

No one was fighting, and yet, then there was that!

No.,

I have not "noticed" that because that is not my aim here on CC nor has it ever been. That is what "you" have said about me many times because you fancy yourself some kind of mind reader and feel constantly free to judge my heart. But in actuality you are clueless as to what my aims and goals and heart are about. Your accusations are as old and annoying as usual.

Hey, here's a novel idea for you Depleted!!! since it's on your mind so much .. MAYBE they are YOUR goals to scold and correct people like me who are not exactly like YOU!!

 

[Depleted]

Re: What Would Stop a "Once Saved, Always Saved" Believer From Committing Suicide?

I very much doubt the bible will answer these questions. I think you should seek an answer from the spirit himself, or ask him to send someone to you who'll answer them.

I'd tell you if I knew, but I don't.

That's surprising since I've thought seriously about committing suicide, I've researched and studied the bible to this problem but I came out short.

All I know is that God may be a multidimensional being who has already seen your life at the point of your suicide, and your life lived if you didn't commit suicide.

So it's like a line that splits, which we don't see but he does. It only would apply to those he creates that die before they make a choice or have it prevented (Such as abortion)

Now that's a way out non biblical answer, the best one I came up with.

Not a put down, but...
please, please give your life to God. You keep seeking answers from some spirit, when God is the only Spirit you want and he wrote the answers in his word. You keep thinking some spirit is going to stick answers that you want in your mind instead. I've seen quite a bit from whatever that spirit is in what you've contributed on this site. I'm positive that's NOT the Holy Spirit. So, seek God. Ask for his mercy. Follow him, instead of that spirit you keep listening to.

Please! It will make all the difference to you!

 

[Depleted]

Re: What Would Stop a "Once Saved, Always Saved" Believer From Committing Suicide?

By many possible ways we all have to die. But there is only one way to die peacefully

In your sleep

Every other way of dying creates unfortunate dilemma.

Not for nothing, but have always wanted to die right after the horizontal bop with my hubby -- both of us going at the exact same time. (I doubt I'll get that, but if what a great send off. lol)

 

[PrynceNY]

Re: What Would Stop a "Once Saved, Always Saved" Believer From Committing Suicide?

Not for nothing, but have always wanted to die right after the horizontal bop with my hubby -- both of us going at the exact same time. (I doubt I'll get that, but if what a great send off. lol)

The horizontal Bop?.... lord have mercy. lol

 

[Depleted]

Re: What Would Stop a "Once Saved, Always Saved" Believer From Committing Suicide?

Are you suggesting that suicide automatically sends you to hell if there isn't a once-saved-always-saved?
What if you stub your toe and say **** and then die? Still a sin.

PS: I don't believe in OSAS, but I am tired of people suggesting that suicide equals hell "because you can't repent"
...as if we always and immediately repent of all other sins we commit

I can't image how bad that toe stub would be that it kills you.

Seoul, it may seem crass that I'm joking around on this thread, but one of the things that has given hubby and me a joy in life is to purposely try to make each other laugh -- the good hearty laugh, not a mere chuckle -- each day. Life is worth living, if I can smile and laugh.

 

[Depleted]

Re: What Would Stop a "Once Saved, Always Saved" Believer From Committing Suicide?

You remember how you used to get those mini comic books in a box of Cracker Jacks..............!

No. I was always after the groovy ring! My brothers got the comic books.

(Your fault, Ariel. You got the word "groovy" stuck in my head. lol)