where did sin come from?
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Well, I think that rebellion comes from anger. Like people who rebel against the Government , because they are angry with it. Or, kids rebel against their parents because they are angry with them. I believe that Satan was rebelious against God due to jealousy and anger, because of who God was. So that anger consumed the enemy to the point of wanting to take mankind down with him. It is like in school the athletes stick with other athletes, and the smart kids hang with other smart kids etc. Well the enemy wants to hang with those like himself. Adam and Eve were the perfect couple. Innocent children, who disobeyed God, and had no idea of the serious consequences their disobedience would have. They did not obey because they did not trust what God told them not to do. There needs to be trust between parent and child. So when a parent tells a child , don't touch it's hot , if the child does not trust their parents they will touch, and with that disobedience , get burned. So I don't think that Adam and Eve was angry with God, I think they as liittle children alowed a thought to enter thier mind, and acted on it. The enemy made them feel deprived. God provided everything for them, but as children, they were inquisative and maybe impulsive and because of their disobedience the fall of man began. Wonder what would have happened if the obeyed God. Romans 5:19
C
Beautiful analogy! I love how you simplified what most have a hard time trying to explain!
UOTE=nonicknametouse;947545]Well, I think that rebellion comes from anger. Like people who rebel against the Government , because they are angry with it. Or, kids rebel against their parents because they are angry with them. I believe that Satan was rebelious against God due to jealousy and anger, because of who God was. So that anger consumed the enemy to the point of wanting to take mankind down with him. It is like in school the athletes stick with other athletes, and the smart kids hang with other smart kids etc. Well the enemy wants to hang with those like himself. Adam and Eve were the perfect couple. Innocent children, who disobeyed God, and had no idea of the serious consequences their disobedience would have. They did not obey because they did not trust what God told them not to do. There needs to be trust between parent and child. So when a parent tells a child , don't touch it's hot , if the child does not trust their parents they will touch, and with that disobedience , get burned. So I don't think that Adam and Eve was angry with God, I think they as liittle children alowed a thought to enter thier mind, and acted on it. The enemy made them feel deprived. God provided everything for them, but as children, they were inquisative and maybe impulsive and because of their disobedience the fall of man began. Wonder what would have happened if the obeyed God. Romans 5:19[/QUOTE]
UOTE=nonicknametouse;947545]Well, I think that rebellion comes from anger. Like people who rebel against the Government , because they are angry with it. Or, kids rebel against their parents because they are angry with them. I believe that Satan was rebelious against God due to jealousy and anger, because of who God was. So that anger consumed the enemy to the point of wanting to take mankind down with him. It is like in school the athletes stick with other athletes, and the smart kids hang with other smart kids etc. Well the enemy wants to hang with those like himself. Adam and Eve were the perfect couple. Innocent children, who disobeyed God, and had no idea of the serious consequences their disobedience would have. They did not obey because they did not trust what God told them not to do. There needs to be trust between parent and child. So when a parent tells a child , don't touch it's hot , if the child does not trust their parents they will touch, and with that disobedience , get burned. So I don't think that Adam and Eve was angry with God, I think they as liittle children alowed a thought to enter thier mind, and acted on it. The enemy made them feel deprived. God provided everything for them, but as children, they were inquisative and maybe impulsive and because of their disobedience the fall of man began. Wonder what would have happened if the obeyed God. Romans 5:19[/QUOTE]
E
1. Sin comes from Pride. All sin comes from the fact a person or being is chosing to hold self over God, and thus rejects the authority of God over their live. ie, they take things into their own hands,
2. God made it so no creature would ever do this again, by what he did on the cross. and how he accomplished it. He got Satan, the originator of the lie, Have it so Christ was nailed to the cross. Not knowing (the mystery) that doing so, he nailed the last nail in his own coffin. For Christ was proving to ALL creation it was satan who was th eliar. and it was God who was the God of love.
2. God made it so no creature would ever do this again, by what he did on the cross. and how he accomplished it. He got Satan, the originator of the lie, Have it so Christ was nailed to the cross. Not knowing (the mystery) that doing so, he nailed the last nail in his own coffin. For Christ was proving to ALL creation it was satan who was th eliar. and it was God who was the God of love.
amazingly, this is where the idea "God intentionally (this was actually the reason for creation!) created us with the ability to choose good and evil, so that we'd know what good was and because He wanted free will creatures to make well informed choices and love Him freely - [ergo God created evil for that purpose] inevitably goes.
it's just pelagianism, imo.
as for where sin originated, we're just not told.
it's just pelagianism, imo.
as for where sin originated, we're just not told.
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E
if we could possibly obey God and live, then Christ died in vein.
I find it amazing people think their goodness would appease a righteous God and allow him to just forget the sin which condemned them in the first place.. This is flat out wrong, and in itself is sin! only this sin will be unpardonable if it is not repented of before one dies!
I find it amazing people think their goodness would appease a righteous God and allow him to just forget the sin which condemned them in the first place.. This is flat out wrong, and in itself is sin! only this sin will be unpardonable if it is not repented of before one dies!
E
I take it in context. and use eph 1: 13 - 14.
[SUP]13 [/SUP]In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise, [SUP]14 [/SUP]who is the guarantee of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, to the praise of His glory.
[SUP]13 [/SUP]In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise, [SUP]14 [/SUP]who is the guarantee of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, to the praise of His glory.
Sin is what you DO Not what you Are!
Let no one say when he is tempted, “I am tempted by God”; for God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does He Himself tempt anyone. But each one is tempted when he is drawn away by his own desires and enticed. Then, when desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, brings forth death. James1:13-15
Having a Right Concept of Sin is essential to Preaching the Gospel of Repentance and faith proven by deeds. The multiple layers of deceptions so pervasive in the Professed Christian establishment today have rendered genuine Salvation from the corruption of sin impossible. Instead of Escaping the corruption that is in the world through lust people are deceived into thinking they can be justified in their sins. Under their false sense of assurance professing Christians THINK Sin is what they Are NOT what they DO!
Ability to Choose between good and evil actions is not a factor in the outcome of Salvation because all sin is the same, everything you do is sin and even temptation is sin. This paralyzes the conscience into a state of insensitivity toward wrong doing. The human mind loses its natural ability to accuse itself when temptation arises. So the ‘way of escape’ (1Cor10:13) is not an option and sin defiles the soul. (Heb12:15)
All because the Bible Pundits have mystified Sin as something that dwells or lurks within the flesh.
But the Bible is Crystal Clear that SIN is a result of the misuse of your Free Will succumbing to temptation. As James explains; ‘by his OWN DESIRES’ a person is drawn away and enticed. The Desire unites with the Will and the result is Sin! Freedom of CHOICE is in Play during the entire process. Sin becomes Transgression of the law 1John3:4, when you submit to the passions and desires of your flesh. It is NOT inevitable because of something desperately wicked or filthy dwells within you overcoming your capacity to make a choice.
James 2:10 ‘Whoever shall keep the whole law, but yet stumble in one point is guilty of all’, is NOT telling us that ALL SINS are the Same. He is expressing the Biblical definition of Transgression! If you violate the Commandment against adultery, but not the one against Murder, are you NOT a ‘Transgressor’ of the Law? (1Jh1:4) DO you see the Logic!? The same would be true if you robbed a bank, but you didn’t steal a car, would not the LAW convict you as a Transgressor of the entire system of law!? James is NOT giving man a license to pass off their wrong doings as ‘all the same’ he is directing them to Practice the PERFECT Law of Liberty, which is FAITH WORKING BY LOVE! (thereby upholding the entire law! Rom3:31, Matt22:37-40)
Professed Christians today are the Perfect example of a Pharisee; Clean on the outside, but defiled within. They take great pride in their ‘form’ of godliness but lack any inkling of a godly life. They sin daily in thought, word and deed because they are inclined to constantly submit to the passions and desires of their flesh. After LONG PRACTICED habit sin becomes an addiction Eph2:3 …. NOT a Nature (as in something inbred) but a Physical Concept of Growth. The Greek word used in this passage is our English word Physis literally Defined: ‘the principle or concept of growth and change in nature, considered as a source of growth, something that grows and develops.’
The PERFECT description of man Misusing his free will ability to choose between right and wrong! Temptation is presented, the Desire enticed, the idea conceived, the CHOICE is Made. Thus the wages of sin takes its inevitable toll on the human soul. The Temptation itself it NOT Sin; If that were true Christ Himself would be guilty of sin. Heb4:15 says; ‘He was in ALL POINTS tempted as We are, yet Without Sin!’ If a person has an inappropriate thought running across their mind it DOES NOT Prove he is desperately wicked or wretched within (as professed Christians have been taught) It means he was Created by God with the faculties of a Moral Conscience and natural desires and inclinations. Thus temptations come and thoughts are derived from our own natural affections and surrounding environment. They only become sin if we choose to indulge them.
OUR Part is to make the Conscience CHOICE NOT to Present our members as instruments of unrighteousness to sin but as instruments of Righteousness (Right actions) to GOD! Rom6:13. In that manner Sin will no longer have Dominion over you. (next verse 6:14) BUT if your free will ability has been render inoperative by the fallacy of Sin inbred as a malady you cannot overcome, you will CONTINUOUSLY choose the path of least resistance to indulge the lust of your flesh.
That’s why Professing Christians incessantly equate minor infractions in conduct with committing adultery, getting drunk, fornicating, lusting, fleshliness, uncleanness and all types of vile behavior. Since in their minds driving over the speed limit is the same as any other vile act, WHY not go all the way into unbridled lust of the flesh! Thus is the explanation why people who suppose they have accepted Jesus as their Savior and are eternally saved WALLOW in the Pig Pen of sin without Fear of future Judgment.
To Summarize:
They View Sin as what they are Not what they Do
All men are sinners by birth and all sin is the same including temptation
Sin is inevitable and no one can ever stop sinning
It’s all one Big Lump of Sin to God so why make any effort to change
Unraveling this Deception in the minds of the people under it is impossible until they see the folly of their ways and make a determined effort to STOP sinning and Seek out God in real Repentance. But many have been held captive by these lies for so long they are no longer capable of equating their ability to make the common choices of everyday life with putting forth an effort to OBEY God. It’s as though the natural functions of their brains have been disconnected from reality. HOW can they ever see Truth:
That NOT all Sin is the Same. That man is NOT Required to be as Perfect as God, Just Perfect in Obedience to God according to the strength of their mind, heart, and soul. That there are INDEED SINS unto Death, if committed will Disqualify a person from the Kingdom of God! That 1John1:8-9 is NOT teaching that all men are born sinners and you can merely Confess vile sins of the flesh (leading to death) and be forgiven time and again, no matter what you do. And how can ANYONE who has freely Chosen to believe that their Long Practiced Addiction to the Passions and desires of their flesh is a DISEASE they inherited by the mere fact of being born human?
As a Professing Christians supposedly Saved under this deception WHERE is the motivation going to come from to Obey God and Crucify the Passions and Desires of their Flesh in Repentance? HOW can they Forsake a ‘Nature’ inbred into their flesh? This is the very reason Alcoholics, drug addicts, those addicted to sexual perversions and people with vile dispositions can never break free of their captivity to these things. Religion and Society constantly tell them they have a Disease and the best they can hope for is learning to manage the addiction and accept the fact that no one is perfect and God will forgive them in the end. Just attend the focus group meetings, read the books and cope.
Since there is no possibility of actual Escape from the corruption of sin the professed Christian world has to cast a constant stream of dispersions on anyone who HAS OBEYED God, forsaken their sin in repentance and been truly Purified in heart and mind, as liars, evil judges, angry monsters and generally unloving, unforgiving people who don’t understand God’s gracious PROVSION (salvation in sin, magic cover for sin) and are attempting to Self Justify themselves by works.
Thereby ONE Fatal flaw in the minds of men has given over an ENTIRE generation to the Captivity of sin. They are ‘Carnal Sold under Sin’, so they Preach, Teach and fully Believe as Truth and stand on the brink of a hopeless disaster wretched, miserable, poor, blind and naked! Can a leopard change its spots? Can people so accustomed to doing Evil CHOOSE to do Good?
Courtesy standingthegap.org
Let no one say when he is tempted, “I am tempted by God”; for God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does He Himself tempt anyone. But each one is tempted when he is drawn away by his own desires and enticed. Then, when desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, brings forth death. James1:13-15
Having a Right Concept of Sin is essential to Preaching the Gospel of Repentance and faith proven by deeds. The multiple layers of deceptions so pervasive in the Professed Christian establishment today have rendered genuine Salvation from the corruption of sin impossible. Instead of Escaping the corruption that is in the world through lust people are deceived into thinking they can be justified in their sins. Under their false sense of assurance professing Christians THINK Sin is what they Are NOT what they DO!
Ability to Choose between good and evil actions is not a factor in the outcome of Salvation because all sin is the same, everything you do is sin and even temptation is sin. This paralyzes the conscience into a state of insensitivity toward wrong doing. The human mind loses its natural ability to accuse itself when temptation arises. So the ‘way of escape’ (1Cor10:13) is not an option and sin defiles the soul. (Heb12:15)
All because the Bible Pundits have mystified Sin as something that dwells or lurks within the flesh.
But the Bible is Crystal Clear that SIN is a result of the misuse of your Free Will succumbing to temptation. As James explains; ‘by his OWN DESIRES’ a person is drawn away and enticed. The Desire unites with the Will and the result is Sin! Freedom of CHOICE is in Play during the entire process. Sin becomes Transgression of the law 1John3:4, when you submit to the passions and desires of your flesh. It is NOT inevitable because of something desperately wicked or filthy dwells within you overcoming your capacity to make a choice.
James 2:10 ‘Whoever shall keep the whole law, but yet stumble in one point is guilty of all’, is NOT telling us that ALL SINS are the Same. He is expressing the Biblical definition of Transgression! If you violate the Commandment against adultery, but not the one against Murder, are you NOT a ‘Transgressor’ of the Law? (1Jh1:4) DO you see the Logic!? The same would be true if you robbed a bank, but you didn’t steal a car, would not the LAW convict you as a Transgressor of the entire system of law!? James is NOT giving man a license to pass off their wrong doings as ‘all the same’ he is directing them to Practice the PERFECT Law of Liberty, which is FAITH WORKING BY LOVE! (thereby upholding the entire law! Rom3:31, Matt22:37-40)
Professed Christians today are the Perfect example of a Pharisee; Clean on the outside, but defiled within. They take great pride in their ‘form’ of godliness but lack any inkling of a godly life. They sin daily in thought, word and deed because they are inclined to constantly submit to the passions and desires of their flesh. After LONG PRACTICED habit sin becomes an addiction Eph2:3 …. NOT a Nature (as in something inbred) but a Physical Concept of Growth. The Greek word used in this passage is our English word Physis literally Defined: ‘the principle or concept of growth and change in nature, considered as a source of growth, something that grows and develops.’
The PERFECT description of man Misusing his free will ability to choose between right and wrong! Temptation is presented, the Desire enticed, the idea conceived, the CHOICE is Made. Thus the wages of sin takes its inevitable toll on the human soul. The Temptation itself it NOT Sin; If that were true Christ Himself would be guilty of sin. Heb4:15 says; ‘He was in ALL POINTS tempted as We are, yet Without Sin!’ If a person has an inappropriate thought running across their mind it DOES NOT Prove he is desperately wicked or wretched within (as professed Christians have been taught) It means he was Created by God with the faculties of a Moral Conscience and natural desires and inclinations. Thus temptations come and thoughts are derived from our own natural affections and surrounding environment. They only become sin if we choose to indulge them.
OUR Part is to make the Conscience CHOICE NOT to Present our members as instruments of unrighteousness to sin but as instruments of Righteousness (Right actions) to GOD! Rom6:13. In that manner Sin will no longer have Dominion over you. (next verse 6:14) BUT if your free will ability has been render inoperative by the fallacy of Sin inbred as a malady you cannot overcome, you will CONTINUOUSLY choose the path of least resistance to indulge the lust of your flesh.
That’s why Professing Christians incessantly equate minor infractions in conduct with committing adultery, getting drunk, fornicating, lusting, fleshliness, uncleanness and all types of vile behavior. Since in their minds driving over the speed limit is the same as any other vile act, WHY not go all the way into unbridled lust of the flesh! Thus is the explanation why people who suppose they have accepted Jesus as their Savior and are eternally saved WALLOW in the Pig Pen of sin without Fear of future Judgment.
To Summarize:
They View Sin as what they are Not what they Do
All men are sinners by birth and all sin is the same including temptation
Sin is inevitable and no one can ever stop sinning
It’s all one Big Lump of Sin to God so why make any effort to change
Unraveling this Deception in the minds of the people under it is impossible until they see the folly of their ways and make a determined effort to STOP sinning and Seek out God in real Repentance. But many have been held captive by these lies for so long they are no longer capable of equating their ability to make the common choices of everyday life with putting forth an effort to OBEY God. It’s as though the natural functions of their brains have been disconnected from reality. HOW can they ever see Truth:
That NOT all Sin is the Same. That man is NOT Required to be as Perfect as God, Just Perfect in Obedience to God according to the strength of their mind, heart, and soul. That there are INDEED SINS unto Death, if committed will Disqualify a person from the Kingdom of God! That 1John1:8-9 is NOT teaching that all men are born sinners and you can merely Confess vile sins of the flesh (leading to death) and be forgiven time and again, no matter what you do. And how can ANYONE who has freely Chosen to believe that their Long Practiced Addiction to the Passions and desires of their flesh is a DISEASE they inherited by the mere fact of being born human?
As a Professing Christians supposedly Saved under this deception WHERE is the motivation going to come from to Obey God and Crucify the Passions and Desires of their Flesh in Repentance? HOW can they Forsake a ‘Nature’ inbred into their flesh? This is the very reason Alcoholics, drug addicts, those addicted to sexual perversions and people with vile dispositions can never break free of their captivity to these things. Religion and Society constantly tell them they have a Disease and the best they can hope for is learning to manage the addiction and accept the fact that no one is perfect and God will forgive them in the end. Just attend the focus group meetings, read the books and cope.
Since there is no possibility of actual Escape from the corruption of sin the professed Christian world has to cast a constant stream of dispersions on anyone who HAS OBEYED God, forsaken their sin in repentance and been truly Purified in heart and mind, as liars, evil judges, angry monsters and generally unloving, unforgiving people who don’t understand God’s gracious PROVSION (salvation in sin, magic cover for sin) and are attempting to Self Justify themselves by works.
Thereby ONE Fatal flaw in the minds of men has given over an ENTIRE generation to the Captivity of sin. They are ‘Carnal Sold under Sin’, so they Preach, Teach and fully Believe as Truth and stand on the brink of a hopeless disaster wretched, miserable, poor, blind and naked! Can a leopard change its spots? Can people so accustomed to doing Evil CHOOSE to do Good?
Courtesy standingthegap.org
E
I don't see this at all. It can not support your theory, there is no basis for that.
eph 1: 13 14 says we heard. We trusted, we believed. If we have no free will, we can do non of these things.. Faith is a trust in something which is not seen. it can not be forced on us, it must be chosen or rejected.
And no. it does not disreguard his soverignty over us. It proves his love for us, in that he died for us, even those who knew would reject him. no greater love has any man.. that he died for those he loved. Even if they did not love him back or even want him.. it still shows great love for the whole of creation to see. That was Gods plan to begin with.
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