Woman who left her husband - what is her solution?

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Ariel82

Guest
#61
#61
trofimus said:
What about the rest?

To the married I give this command (not I, but the Lord):
1. A wife must not separate from her husband.
2. But if she does, she must remain unmarried or else be reconciled to her husband. And a husband must not divorce his wife.

What if one of the partners is unfaithful does that cancel their marriage automatically or not?

Why does Paul use "separate" for women and "divorce" for men? Women cannot divorce?
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I squirm at being blunt, but the first is telling the woman not to withhold sex as a punishment for her husband, not "separate" also may refer to refusing to fix food, emotional separation,,etc.

Men back then financial supported women, so most would not divorce the man,

Husbands must provide for their wife, but not if he divorced her.

Again seems more marriage counseling.

Still reading the thread and then I will look for bible verses,
 
trofimus

trofimus

Senior Member
#62
Aug 17, 2015
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#62
Ariel82 said:
I squirm at being blunt, but the first is telling the woman not to withhold sex as a punishment for her husband, not "separate" also may refer to refusing to fix food, emotional separation,,etc.

Men back then financial supported women, so most would not divorce the man,

Husbands must provide for their wife, but not if he divorced her.

Again seems more marriage counseling.

Still reading the thread and then I will look for bible verses,
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OK, such explanation seems reasonable to me...
 
A

Ariel82

Guest
#63
#63
trofimus said:
I agree totally.


What about various "vows" and "promises" made in relationships so common today? How do those qualify?
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Fornication unless they make the vows of marriage before God.

For me to tell someone "I love you and I will be with you forever" is a vow before God and many people speak those words too lightly. Like an engagement vow..

I always expected more of myself but admit to lowering my standards a few times, to my regret.

I just need to insert that this is what I believe is God's ideals and sometimes I fall short, but by His grace and mercy it's what I strive to live and teach my kids to treasure.
 
trofimus

trofimus

Senior Member
#64
Aug 17, 2015
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#64
OneFaith said:
There's two meanings of "divorced." In our language it does not matter who divorced who- we call both of them "divorced." But this is talking about the divorcer and the divorcee. The divorcee is the one who was divorced by their spouse. And there is only one reason for divorce- your spouse had sex with another.

Therefore, yes, if anyone knowingly marries the ex-wife who cheated on her husband commits adultery. And he can't remarry her even if her second husband is out of the picture, because she had been having sex with another man (her second husband, not to mention possible others).

Don't you see that it matters that you stay sexually clean? STDs are a punishment for sexual sin. The more partners you have the more risk. Either you stay with your spouse your whole life, or if you become a widow or a widower you marry one other. But a cheater is most likely going to have multiple partners.

The one who cheated and was divorced (in this case the wife), may never marry again without going against God. They are to remain single the rest of their lives, as punishment. The one who is innocent (in this case the husband) is free to remarry another the same as a widow/widower is free to marry another.

No one is to marry the one who was divorced for cheating. The one who divorced the other was involved in a divorce, but they were not the one divorced.
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Thanks, it seems you thought it through.

Three questions:

1. "if anyone knowingly marries the ex-wife who cheated..."
- how can anybody know this with certainity when he meets divorced woman? She can lie as much as she wants. What if he marries her just because he trusted her lies?

2. Is it anywhere in the Bible, that men and women can both divorce, remarry or to have multiple partners (in OT) under the same rules? Or is it only a cultural thing.

3. What if somebody had sexual relationships before any marriage? How does this problem influence marriage?
 
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trofimus

trofimus

Senior Member
#65
Aug 17, 2015
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#65
Ariel82 said:
For me to tell someone "I love you and I will be with you forever" is a vow before God and many people speak those words too lightly. Like an engagement vow..
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If this happened (and it is quite a common thing), what then? Are they free to marry somebody else? Or What? :)
 
GandalfTheWhite

GandalfTheWhite

Senior Member
#66
Jan 25, 2015
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#66
God gave Israel (his bride) a bill of divorce because she prostituted with other gods.

We have to understand that God will not break His own law and if a husband gives his wife a bill of divorce and declare her free, she can go remarry. That is Biblical.

The only thing is after the divorce they cannot be one again... unless one die and rose again after three days :)
 
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Ariel82

Guest
#68
#68
Hmmm finding it is difficult..

We have this. Shows how a father can protect his daughter from a rapist or abusive man.

Exodus 22:16 -17
New International Version
"If a man seduces a virgin who is not pledged to be married and sleeps with her, he must pay the bride-price, and she shall be his wife.

If her father absolutely refuses to give her to him, he must still pay the bride-price for virgins.
 
trofimus

trofimus

Senior Member
#69
Aug 17, 2015
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#69
GandalfTheWhite said:
God gave Israel (his bride) a bill of divorce because she prostituted with other gods.

We have to understand that God will not break His own law and if a husband gives his wife a bill of divorce and declare her free, she can go remarry. That is Biblical.

The only thing is after the divorce they cannot be one again... unless one die and rose again after three days :)
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Can you post verses that say that a prostitute is free to marry another man after she was divorced?
 
W

wonderwoman

Guest
#70
#70
*grabs popcorn..

Then if she keeps up with the abusive/unfaithful man, then they will argue everyday, barter bad words and dirty thoughts.. mean she lives in the sin too for cursing her husband n being grumpy... it also will be bad for the children...
 
trofimus

trofimus

Senior Member
#71
Aug 17, 2015
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#71
Ariel82 said:
Hmmm finding it is difficult..

We have this. Shows how a father can protect his daughter from a rapist or abusive man.

Exodus 22:16 -17
New International Version
"If a man seduces a virgin who is not pledged to be married and sleeps with her, he must pay the bride-price, and she shall be his wife.

If her father absolutely refuses to give her to him, he must still pay the bride-price for virgins.
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1. Why does he have to pay the bride-price when he is taking her as his wife, anyway?

2. If her father refuses, what does it mean for the life of the seduced girl?

3. What does "seduce" mean, I do not think its a rape.
 
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trofimus

trofimus

Senior Member
#72
Aug 17, 2015
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#72
wonderwoman said:
*grabs popcorn..

Then if she keeps up with the abusive/unfaithful man, then they will argue everyday, barter bad words and dirty thoughts.. mean she lives in the sin too for cursing her husband n being grumpy... it also will be bad for the children...
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Thats true... and popcorn is not healthy for your body.
 
A

Ariel82

Guest
#73
#73
trofimus said:
What is an engagement? When does it start? How does it end? Do same rules as for marriage apply?
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In the old testament it's punishable by death for a man to raped an engaged woman because it calls her "wife of another man" Deuteronomy 22 (haha just read it looking for the other scriptures)

So she hasn't had sex but they are promised.

After they have sex, they are married. ( okay will have to find it. Lol I read the Bible yearly so the verses get all mashed together in my head, but I am pretty sure I read it. Too specific for me to make up. However that does not guarantee that I understood the verses "correctly".)
 
GandalfTheWhite

GandalfTheWhite

Senior Member
#74
Jan 25, 2015
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#74
trofimus said:
Can you post verses that say that a prostitute is free to marry another man after she was divorced?
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Deuteronomy 24

1 When a man hath taken a wife, and married her, and it come to pass that she find nofavour in his eyes, because he hath found some uncleanness in her: then let himwrite her a bill of divorcement, and give it in her hand,and send her out of his house.
2 And when she is departed out of his house, she may go and be another man's wife.
3 And if the latter husband hate her, andwrite her a bill of divorcement, and giveth it in her hand,and sendeth her out of his house; or if the latter husband die, which took her to be his wife;
4 Her former husband, which sent her away, may not take her again to be his wife,after that she is defiled; for that is abominationbefore the LORD: and thou shalt not cause the land to sin, which the LORD thyGod giveth thee for an inheritance.
 
trofimus

trofimus

Senior Member
#75
Aug 17, 2015
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#75
GandalfTheWhite said:
Deuteronomy 24

1 Whena man hath taken a wife, and married her, and it come to pass that she find nofavour in his eyes, because he hath found some uncleanness in her: then let himwrite her a bill of divorcement, and give it in her hand,and send her out of his house.
2 Andwhen she is departed out of his house, she may go and be another man's wife.
3 Andif the latter husband hate her, andwrite her a bill of divorcement, and giveth it in her hand,and sendeth her out of his house; or if the latter husband die, which took her to be his wife;
4 Herformer husband, which sent her away, may not take her again to be his wife,after that she is defiled; for that is abominationbefore the LORD: and thou shalt not cause the land to sin, which the LORD thyGod giveth thee for an inheritance.
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Exactly these verses were canceled by Christ.
Christ said this place came from Moses, not from God. She is not free to remarry now.

I am not sure about the return to the husband though. The NT does not talk about it.
 
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Ariel82

Guest
#76
#76
Deuteronomy 22:28 ►
New International Version
If a man happens to meet a virgin who is not pledged to be married and rapes her and they are discovered,

he shall pay her father fifty shekels of silver. He must marry the young woman, for he has violated her. He can never divorce her as long as he lives.
 
trofimus

trofimus

Senior Member
#77
Aug 17, 2015
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794
113
#77
Ariel82 said:
Deuteronomy 22:28 ►
New International Version
If a man happens to meet a virgin who is not pledged to be married and rapes her and they are discovered,

he shall pay her father fifty shekels of silver. He must marry the young woman, for he has violated her. He can never divorce her as long as he lives.
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OK, but this seems to say the opposite - he must marry her and he must stay with her. So her protection from rapist is in what? :)
 
A

Ariel82

Guest
#78
#78
trofimus said:
Exactly these verses were cancelled by Christ. Christ said this place came from Moses, not from God. She is not free to remarry now.
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So in your mind Christ came to enslave us to new rules?

I thought Jesus came to set us free and to show how to walk in love with Him.

I thought Jesus was about redeeming people and showing them a better way.

I thought he looked at the spirit of the commandments and not the letter of the law.

I thought Jesus was the man who refused to stone the adulterous woman?
 
A

Ariel82

Guest
#80
#80
trofimus said:
So you believe that sex produces marriage?
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I believe a vow before God and sex, produces marriage.

Just sex is fornication.

I believe God holds us accountable for every word we speak.
 
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