Does God kill christians in judgement?
- Thread starter PeterJens
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This is another straw man argument from the straw man hater. Odd how the one who hates
a strategy so much ends up using it, poetic.
Paul is saying honour Christ in communion.
It does not get simpler than this. Upon this sacrifice eternity hinges. You as a believer
expect to be saved because you put faith in the Jesus and the cross, yet to honour
Christ in communion is below you.
But Pauls word cause hatred in hyper-grace people because it contradicts their faith.
So they will go to the ends of the earth to explain it away.
Again the man who claims his words cause so much antipathy in religious folk, shows
his antipathy against Paul. Again this is poetic.
It is also judgement against this heresy. I wish in some ways I do not have to bring
this message, but beware. The judgement you give will be measured back to you
For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.
Matt 7:2
The distortions and delusions that abound, lies, heresies, greed, worldliness is so
rampant it is accepted as part of a good christians life rather than the opposite.
Christs words are 100% compromised and lied about, teachers brought forward
and then disowned. What a sad people to call themselves the true people of
God, when they truly do not know what they are, just what they are not.
a strategy so much ends up using it, poetic.
Paul is saying honour Christ in communion.
It does not get simpler than this. Upon this sacrifice eternity hinges. You as a believer
expect to be saved because you put faith in the Jesus and the cross, yet to honour
Christ in communion is below you.
But Pauls word cause hatred in hyper-grace people because it contradicts their faith.
So they will go to the ends of the earth to explain it away.
Again the man who claims his words cause so much antipathy in religious folk, shows
his antipathy against Paul. Again this is poetic.
It is also judgement against this heresy. I wish in some ways I do not have to bring
this message, but beware. The judgement you give will be measured back to you
For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.
Matt 7:2
The distortions and delusions that abound, lies, heresies, greed, worldliness is so
rampant it is accepted as part of a good christians life rather than the opposite.
Christs words are 100% compromised and lied about, teachers brought forward
and then disowned. What a sad people to call themselves the true people of
God, when they truly do not know what they are, just what they are not.
If we are not cleansed of all unrighteousness, we cannot possess eternal life.
Eternal Life is Christ in us - it's not our lives made longer, it's His Life - which is eternal - placed within us.
That's why total forgiveness of all sin - past, present, and future, is necessary.
Complete and total forgiveness is backed up by this Scripture, or these very words of God could not be true:
“For I will forgive their wickedness
and will remember their sins no more.” (from Jer. 31, repeated in Heb. 8)
An excellent free audio that clearly communicates complete forgiveness can be found here:
-JGIG
L
Here is something a little more 'studious' that I just picked up on...I think it deserves some consideration as it contains biblical truth and application
With that proviso, how would the cruciform hermeneutic assess the Ananias and Sapphira debacle (Acts 5:1-10)? This couple said they had given all the money they’d made from a piece of property to the apostles when, in fact, they had kept some of the money for themselves. Peter first confronted Ananias, telling him that Satan had filled his heart and that he’d lied not only to people, but also to God. Ananias immediately dropped dead. His wife showed up three hours later and Peter confronted her as well. He gave her a chance to repent, but she stuck to her lie. Peter then pointed out that she had conspired with Ananias against the Lord and would now join him in the grave, at which point Sapphira fell over dead (Ac. 5:1-10).
There’s no denying that the passage depicts the death of this couple as a divine judgment. So, if the cross is the hermeneutical key to understanding God’s true character, the first question we must ask is, what does the cross reveal about the nature of Gods’ judgments? What it says, I contend, is that God judges sin by withdrawing from it, thereby allowing people to suffer its death consequences. God “delivered Jesus over” to suffer at the hands of wicked humans as well as Satan and other fallen powers. And when Jesus became our sin (2 Cor 5:21) and our curse (Gal 3:13), God the Father withdrew his presence from him, which is why Jesus experienced genuine God-forsakenness (Mt 27:46).
The cross reveals, and a wealth of biblical material confirms, that the essence of God’s “wrath” against sin is simply allowing evil to run its self-destructive course. The essence of sin is pushing God away, and since God is the source of life, sin is, by its very nature, choosing death. excerpt from a post by Greg Boyd
I think this has already been stated...I think by Grace? but I find this says it so clearly and I am in agreement with it...so, there yah go!
With that proviso, how would the cruciform hermeneutic assess the Ananias and Sapphira debacle (Acts 5:1-10)? This couple said they had given all the money they’d made from a piece of property to the apostles when, in fact, they had kept some of the money for themselves. Peter first confronted Ananias, telling him that Satan had filled his heart and that he’d lied not only to people, but also to God. Ananias immediately dropped dead. His wife showed up three hours later and Peter confronted her as well. He gave her a chance to repent, but she stuck to her lie. Peter then pointed out that she had conspired with Ananias against the Lord and would now join him in the grave, at which point Sapphira fell over dead (Ac. 5:1-10).
There’s no denying that the passage depicts the death of this couple as a divine judgment. So, if the cross is the hermeneutical key to understanding God’s true character, the first question we must ask is, what does the cross reveal about the nature of Gods’ judgments? What it says, I contend, is that God judges sin by withdrawing from it, thereby allowing people to suffer its death consequences. God “delivered Jesus over” to suffer at the hands of wicked humans as well as Satan and other fallen powers. And when Jesus became our sin (2 Cor 5:21) and our curse (Gal 3:13), God the Father withdrew his presence from him, which is why Jesus experienced genuine God-forsakenness (Mt 27:46).
The cross reveals, and a wealth of biblical material confirms, that the essence of God’s “wrath” against sin is simply allowing evil to run its self-destructive course. The essence of sin is pushing God away, and since God is the source of life, sin is, by its very nature, choosing death. excerpt from a post by Greg Boyd
I think this has already been stated...I think by Grace? but I find this says it so clearly and I am in agreement with it...so, there yah go!
yeah yeah yeah
juxtapose your own insecurities onto others
got it
many here have tried to be your friend...it's like hugging poison ivy...
juxtapose your own insecurities onto others
got it
many here have tried to be your friend...it's like hugging poison ivy...
express their view or faith on a christian website.
I do not have a problem with you sharing your position. I respect you deeply held
point of view. Yet again here you are attacking me.
These are not words of someone who loves but someone who has issues.
L
again, here you go making it about me
this, is about YOU...as the responses to your op testify
I could not care less if you have a problem with me giving my view or the view of a seagull in Maine
your silly attempts to drag people into PERSONAL confrontations undergirds EVERY SINGLE THREAD YOU HAVE CREATED AND INVADED
.
Originally Posted by PeterJens
JGIG - I welcome disagreement. I think again you have the whole thing the wrong way
round. You said my God is me. You said I made God in my image.
Why as a christian would you use words like this? They are so full of venom and condemnation.
I know you get angry. Does that not trouble you? What are you actually angry at?
Look at things from my point of view. I have 40 years in the church, know many different positions
and warmed by many insights and blessings from different people, yet you attack my very faith,
my whole foundation, personally.
So I am fishing sister. I am nothing unusual or anything deep or wakey. I just believe in Christ and
follow Him. Somehow he wants me to share and be a part of this situation, and blesses me whenever
I partake. So amen to the Lord.
Forgiving all future sin is completely out there. It is part of universalism, and the idea nothing has
consequences other than constrained by Gods corrective power. It is very fluffy and kind, except life
is brutal, hard and difficult. Now your group tones it down in part by saying the unsaved go to hell,
and judgement is only on believing or not believing in Christ.
So sin is off the agenda completely. Now to believers like me this is just heresy.
But call me what you want, respond how you feel led. Out of the heart the contributor types.
But that is my heart. Love is what matters, it is eternal, it is Christ, the Father and the Holy
Spirit but wrapped in holiness, purity, judgement and consequences.
But this is your dilemma. Peace has only come through denying responsibility and ownership
and walking in forgiveness without change. Because that is the only way your conscience and
guilt can be squashed. I feel sorry for you driven by this when Jesus loves you and has forgiven
already. In Christ we have freedom and victory, so Amen and Hallelujah
But back to this . . .
Perhaps you missed this, PeterJens. I would like an answer to my question, please.
Originally Posted by PeterJens
But the anger here is so palpable. But friends this is not mine.
So easily you condemn fellow believers it makes me wonder at the spirit at
work in your lives. Do you not believe you can be possessed by a spirit and
still be following the Lord? Maybe this is your reality after all.
Did you really just imply that I am demon-possessed because I dare to disagree with you, PeterJens?
Yes or no?
It's simply a one-word answer.
Enough with the spiritualized smoke screens, please.
You weren't 'fishing', you were saying something there.
You can say things like this to others, passing judgement on them:
Originally Posted by PeterJens
I know you do not care about these issue, because honesty and truth have left
you, but you cannot be clearer than this to show you have fallen into heresy.
But you are too lost to ever come back, which for 9 months has become clearer,
as we work through the issues one by one.
But when one makes an observation about what YOU believe based on what you write, you accuse them of 'attacking your very faith, your whole foundation, personally'? Oh, the drama.
Your church resume is impressive, but I've got three years on ya in the church - 43. And have been in leadership and ministry, and know many different views, and have had wonderful fellowship with many other believers. So if that's your measuring stick, I win, yay!
And I didn't attack your faith, I made an observation based on what YOU WRITE HERE.
But back to this . . .
Originally Posted by PeterJens
But the anger here is so palpable. But friends this is not mine.
So easily you condemn fellow believers it makes me wonder at the spirit at
work in your lives. Do you not believe you can be possessed by a spirit and
still be following the Lord? Maybe this is your reality after all.
Were you implying that I'm demon-possessed or not?
Yes or no?
Let your yea be yea and your nay be nay!
-JGIG
JGIG - I welcome disagreement. I think again you have the whole thing the wrong way
round. You said my God is me. You said I made God in my image.
Why as a christian would you use words like this? They are so full of venom and condemnation.
I know you get angry. Does that not trouble you? What are you actually angry at?
Look at things from my point of view. I have 40 years in the church, know many different positions
and warmed by many insights and blessings from different people, yet you attack my very faith,
my whole foundation, personally.
So I am fishing sister. I am nothing unusual or anything deep or wakey. I just believe in Christ and
follow Him. Somehow he wants me to share and be a part of this situation, and blesses me whenever
I partake. So amen to the Lord.
Forgiving all future sin is completely out there. It is part of universalism, and the idea nothing has
consequences other than constrained by Gods corrective power. It is very fluffy and kind, except life
is brutal, hard and difficult. Now your group tones it down in part by saying the unsaved go to hell,
and judgement is only on believing or not believing in Christ.
So sin is off the agenda completely. Now to believers like me this is just heresy.
But call me what you want, respond how you feel led. Out of the heart the contributor types.
But that is my heart. Love is what matters, it is eternal, it is Christ, the Father and the Holy
Spirit but wrapped in holiness, purity, judgement and consequences.
But this is your dilemma. Peace has only come through denying responsibility and ownership
and walking in forgiveness without change. Because that is the only way your conscience and
guilt can be squashed. I feel sorry for you driven by this when Jesus loves you and has forgiven
already. In Christ we have freedom and victory, so Amen and Hallelujah
But back to this . . .
Perhaps you missed this, PeterJens. I would like an answer to my question, please.
But the anger here is so palpable. But friends this is not mine.
So easily you condemn fellow believers it makes me wonder at the spirit at
work in your lives. Do you not believe you can be possessed by a spirit and
still be following the Lord? Maybe this is your reality after all.
Yes or no?
It's simply a one-word answer.
Enough with the spiritualized smoke screens, please.
You weren't 'fishing', you were saying something there.
You can say things like this to others, passing judgement on them:
I know you do not care about these issue, because honesty and truth have left
you, but you cannot be clearer than this to show you have fallen into heresy.
But you are too lost to ever come back, which for 9 months has become clearer,
as we work through the issues one by one.
But when one makes an observation about what YOU believe based on what you write, you accuse them of 'attacking your very faith, your whole foundation, personally'? Oh, the drama.
Your church resume is impressive, but I've got three years on ya in the church - 43
. And have been in leadership and ministry, and know many different views, and have had wonderful fellowship with many other believers. So if that's your measuring stick, I win, yay!And I didn't attack your faith, I made an observation based on what YOU WRITE HERE.
But back to this . . .
But the anger here is so palpable. But friends this is not mine.
So easily you condemn fellow believers it makes me wonder at the spirit at
work in your lives. Do you not believe you can be possessed by a spirit and
still be following the Lord? Maybe this is your reality after all.
Were you implying that I'm demon-possessed or not?
Yes or no?
Let your yea be yea and your nay be nay!
-JGIG
I agree with Greg Boyd's depiction of the wrath of God is Him letting the consequences of actions take their full course. Thanks for posting that.
I still believe that the couple were not Christians as the scripture doesn't come out and say it. I believe that Peter had a word of wisdom of the future of what was going to happen to the couple. I also don't believe that satan can fill the heart of a believer as that is where the Holy Spirit is now in the saint of God. Sealed.
And the fact that the "others dared not associate with them" - this shows there were some that were trying or wanting to join up with the believers that weren't really believers. Acts 5:13
If God was going to "judge" us for these types of sins - then most of us would be guilty in some form or other at one time in our life of doing something like this couple did. ( not the land thing but lying to Christians which is lying to the Holy Spirit )
Either way - God didn't kill them as religious teachings say.
I like a lot of Greg Boyd's views on the wrath of God and marrying that with the finished work of Christ. ( of course to Peter's mind he would be a heretic but what else is new? )
I still believe that the couple were not Christians as the scripture doesn't come out and say it. I believe that Peter had a word of wisdom of the future of what was going to happen to the couple. I also don't believe that satan can fill the heart of a believer as that is where the Holy Spirit is now in the saint of God. Sealed.
And the fact that the "others dared not associate with them" - this shows there were some that were trying or wanting to join up with the believers that weren't really believers. Acts 5:13
If God was going to "judge" us for these types of sins - then most of us would be guilty in some form or other at one time in our life of doing something like this couple did. ( not the land thing but lying to Christians which is lying to the Holy Spirit )
Either way - God didn't kill them as religious teachings say.
I like a lot of Greg Boyd's views on the wrath of God and marrying that with the finished work of Christ. ( of course to Peter's mind he would be a heretic but what else is new? )
This is why Romans 16:17 comes in useful in these situations. If their behavior remains the same as it has now in this case for over 9 months with no change - just avoid them. We can still post in the threads what we believe - just don't interact with them unless it is absolutely necessary.
I just expect to be insulted in this case and post my beliefs with the scriptures I think go with the theme of the thread.
He has insulted every person that came into the thread so far that had a different opinion then what he did and we just have to learn to accept it's going to happen until this behavior is dealt with in some form.
Romans 16:17 (KJV)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.
I just expect to be insulted in this case and post my beliefs with the scriptures I think go with the theme of the thread.
He has insulted every person that came into the thread so far that had a different opinion then what he did and we just have to learn to accept it's going to happen until this behavior is dealt with in some form.
Romans 16:17 (KJV)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.
L
yeah...I just came across his blog...and bookmarked it
I disagree that A & S were not saved...I won't hold it against you though...
well, my experience is that the devil can do far more than many Christians are wont to believe...but that can be another thread
I believe scripture supports that
now see, when I read (present and past tense read) Boyd's comments, I do not derive that understanding...God's punishment
I think he makes it amply clear that the end result of sin is death and he supports that view with an understanding of the totality of scripture, not just that particular incident
He is not saying God whacked them dead...but rather their desertion from truth is what killed them
I think we need to be a bit more careful about what we think God would and would not do...the very act of Him removing His presence results in the death we see
that brings to mind the verse of how we live and move and have our being IN Him
without the Spirit of God on this planet, it would return to chaos
that's probably enough LOL!
I disagree that A & S were not saved...I won't hold it against you though...
well, my experience is that the devil can do far more than many Christians are wont to believe...but that can be another thread
I believe scripture supports that
now see, when I read (present and past tense read) Boyd's comments, I do not derive that understanding...God's punishment
I think he makes it amply clear that the end result of sin is death and he supports that view with an understanding of the totality of scripture, not just that particular incident
He is not saying God whacked them dead...but rather their desertion from truth is what killed them
I think we need to be a bit more careful about what we think God would and would not do...the very act of Him removing His presence results in the death we see
that brings to mind the verse of how we live and move and have our being IN Him
without the Spirit of God on this planet, it would return to chaos
that's probably enough LOL!
It is simpler for me to just say what my take is.
You guys always turn this into you "insult" us etc. I know in your view I am black listed
except ofcourse with those who agree with the points I am making.
Jesus said "do not resist the evil person."
So God bless you all. And it has never been about me, it is about Christ and His working
in His people. I am surprised at how things get turned on their heads, but that is your
want.
And JGIG, you are what you are. I am not saying you are possessed or not, because I do
not know. I was responding to your personal attack saying I made God in my image.
I am surprised how listening to your words, there is no grace or even ability to see what I
am clearly saying.
Ananias and his wife died after they lied. Paul said people were ill and died after the eat
communion in an unworthy manner. Nothing has been shared that would say this is not
judgement from the Lord in my view.
And that is the point of the thread, nothing more, nothing less.
Thankyou for your contributions. God bless you all, even those who want to make
everything antagonistic.
You guys always turn this into you "insult" us etc. I know in your view I am black listed
except ofcourse with those who agree with the points I am making.
Jesus said "do not resist the evil person."
So God bless you all. And it has never been about me, it is about Christ and His working
in His people. I am surprised at how things get turned on their heads, but that is your
want.
And JGIG, you are what you are. I am not saying you are possessed or not, because I do
not know. I was responding to your personal attack saying I made God in my image.
I am surprised how listening to your words, there is no grace or even ability to see what I
am clearly saying.
Ananias and his wife died after they lied. Paul said people were ill and died after the eat
communion in an unworthy manner. Nothing has been shared that would say this is not
judgement from the Lord in my view.
And that is the point of the thread, nothing more, nothing less.
Thankyou for your contributions. God bless you all, even those who want to make
everything antagonistic.
Peter, here are YOUR WORDS which make YOU appear to not tolerate OUR points of view:
In this thread alone you have made these statements about those who disagree with you:
Originally Posted by PeterJens
It reminds me of brainwashed cults . . .
Originally Posted by PeterJens
I know you do not care about these issue, because honesty and truth have left
you, but you cannot be clearer than this to show you have fallen into heresy.
But you are too lost to ever come back, which for 9 months has become clearer,
as we work through the issues one by one.
Originally Posted by PeterJens
Emotionally you guys are so far from the heart of God, is staggers me.
Originally Posted by PeterJens
Your antipathy shows through very clearly.
I understand you think some principles that are clearly not scriptural, and any scriptures that
show this up must be wrong, is the definition of brain washing.
The church is mainly full of like minded people like me, and though some fall into the delusions
of the mystical which you hold to so dearly, life and spirituality soon break through.
One day you will learn about the discipline of the Lord, but then it will probably be too late.
Originally Posted by PeterJens
The most enthusiastic and loud shouters are happy to lie
and cheat, to put the emphasis in all the wrong places, and yet claim they know
Jesus really, yet deny all His major messages.
I am not surprised Jesus had to spend a lot of time praying and communing with
God, this level of antagonism is enough to make you think love does not matter at
all. But the cross is all about love conquers all, even the nutcase cultists.
Originally Posted by PeterJens
I am not interested in the details of Ananias and Sapphira. I am interested in those who
hold the Lord does not rebuke His people.
It is obvious hyper-grace fellowships hate the concept of rebuke.The pains in your life must be truly deep and so full for you to feel I am such a challenge to deserve this approach.
Originally Posted by PeterJens
You claim so proudly "I know God, I know I am free etc." but here you are ignoring
Gods word. But I know you have left this model behind, bought into the hyper-grace
school. Now to give this up is too much. It is your God.
I know you follow a different faith, you make it clearer every day with your antagonism
towards me and not answering God.
Now if you can answer this passage, my foundation, then we part as friends. If you do not
answer this passage, we part enemies, because you are in rebellion against Gods word.
Originally Posted by PeterJens
Why do things get so personal for you, really?
If you attack me, of course I will say, I do not understand.
Maybe people never tell you your attacks hurt. I mean if they were empty without intent
then I would not feel them. But I forgive you. I do not understand at all your approach.
Originally Posted by PeterJens
But the anger here is so palpable. But friends this is not mine.
So easily you condemn fellow believers it makes me wonder at the spirit at
work in your lives. Do you not believe you can be possessed by a spirit and
still be following the Lord? Maybe this is your reality after all.
Originally Posted by PeterJens
Is nothing sacred to you people? Shame on you. And you call Jesus your Lord.
You have no clue about honour or respect even at the simplest level.
Those who deceive and lie for whatever motives, are so convinced they would rather rubbish and slander
anyone who does not exactly agree with their views.
So rejoice brothers and sisters in our victorious Lord who led to the way through
the cross. And to those who would distort and change Gods words, His grace and
patience is very long,but judgement is coming.
Originally Posted by PeterJens
This shows how much you hate certain points of view.
"I cannot accept" - you want censorship. I am allowed to believe what I believe but
not share it. Sounds 100% what muslims want against christians.
It struck me as funny how you "super spiritual" people admit evil spirits need to be
cast out of them while believers. It then made me think, how on earth can you decide
if God in you is so defeated who is really speaking to your spirit.
Originally Posted by PeterJens
venom - It is not possible to be a friend of someone you say is not allowed to
express their view or faith on a christian website.
I do not have a problem with you sharing your position. I respect you deeply held
point of view. Yet again here you are attacking me.
These are not words of someone who loves but someone who has issues.
Peter, some serious self-examination is in order for you. You have implied that we are brainwashed, nutcase cultists. You've implied that we are too lost to ever come back, are liars and cheaters, that nothing is sacred to us, that we may be demon possessed, and that judgement is coming!
Yet we're attacking YOU?! And we're the ones with issues?!
Those here who have disagreed with you have brought reasoned, Scriptural reasons why. Anyone can read through the thread to see that's the case.
I am content to let the readers decide for themselves. What I'm not content to do is to let your ridiculous accusations about the posters here go unchallenged.
That does not mean censorship, as you assert above, it simply means that someone is calling you out on what you write. You're all for freedom of opinion as long as it's your opinion or agrees with your opinion. If someone disagrees with your opinion, then they're 'brainwashed nutcase cultists' with 'issues'!
Sheesh!
-JGIG
In this thread alone you have made these statements about those who disagree with you:
It reminds me of brainwashed cults . . .
I know you do not care about these issue, because honesty and truth have left
you, but you cannot be clearer than this to show you have fallen into heresy.
But you are too lost to ever come back, which for 9 months has become clearer,
as we work through the issues one by one.
Emotionally you guys are so far from the heart of God, is staggers me.
Your antipathy shows through very clearly.
I understand you think some principles that are clearly not scriptural, and any scriptures that
show this up must be wrong, is the definition of brain washing.
The church is mainly full of like minded people like me, and though some fall into the delusions
of the mystical which you hold to so dearly, life and spirituality soon break through.
One day you will learn about the discipline of the Lord, but then it will probably be too late.
The most enthusiastic and loud shouters are happy to lie
and cheat, to put the emphasis in all the wrong places, and yet claim they know
Jesus really, yet deny all His major messages.
I am not surprised Jesus had to spend a lot of time praying and communing with
God, this level of antagonism is enough to make you think love does not matter at
all. But the cross is all about love conquers all, even the nutcase cultists.
I am not interested in the details of Ananias and Sapphira. I am interested in those who
hold the Lord does not rebuke His people.
It is obvious hyper-grace fellowships hate the concept of rebuke.The pains in your life must be truly deep and so full for you to feel I am such a challenge to deserve this approach.
You claim so proudly "I know God, I know I am free etc." but here you are ignoring
Gods word. But I know you have left this model behind, bought into the hyper-grace
school. Now to give this up is too much. It is your God.
I know you follow a different faith, you make it clearer every day with your antagonism
towards me and not answering God.
Now if you can answer this passage, my foundation, then we part as friends. If you do not
answer this passage, we part enemies, because you are in rebellion against Gods word.
Why do things get so personal for you, really?
If you attack me, of course I will say, I do not understand.
Maybe people never tell you your attacks hurt. I mean if they were empty without intent
then I would not feel them. But I forgive you. I do not understand at all your approach.
But the anger here is so palpable. But friends this is not mine.
So easily you condemn fellow believers it makes me wonder at the spirit at
work in your lives. Do you not believe you can be possessed by a spirit and
still be following the Lord? Maybe this is your reality after all.
Is nothing sacred to you people? Shame on you. And you call Jesus your Lord.
You have no clue about honour or respect even at the simplest level.
Those who deceive and lie for whatever motives, are so convinced they would rather rubbish and slander
anyone who does not exactly agree with their views.
So rejoice brothers and sisters in our victorious Lord who led to the way through
the cross. And to those who would distort and change Gods words, His grace and
patience is very long,but judgement is coming.
This shows how much you hate certain points of view.
"I cannot accept" - you want censorship. I am allowed to believe what I believe but
not share it. Sounds 100% what muslims want against christians.
It struck me as funny how you "super spiritual" people admit evil spirits need to be
cast out of them while believers. It then made me think, how on earth can you decide
if God in you is so defeated who is really speaking to your spirit.
venom - It is not possible to be a friend of someone you say is not allowed to
express their view or faith on a christian website.
I do not have a problem with you sharing your position. I respect you deeply held
point of view. Yet again here you are attacking me.
These are not words of someone who loves but someone who has issues.
Yet we're attacking YOU?! And we're the ones with issues?!
Those here who have disagreed with you have brought reasoned, Scriptural reasons why. Anyone can read through the thread to see that's the case.
I am content to let the readers decide for themselves. What I'm not content to do is to let your ridiculous accusations about the posters here go unchallenged.
That does not mean censorship, as you assert above, it simply means that someone is calling you out on what you write. You're all for freedom of opinion as long as it's your opinion or agrees with your opinion. If someone disagrees with your opinion, then they're 'brainwashed nutcase cultists' with 'issues'!
Sheesh!
-JGIG
JGIG - until you express your point of view I do not know it.
Let me give you an example.
Jesus said we will not see death if we believe in Him.
Now clearly this is not true, as we will physically die or be transformed when
he returns. So another view needs to be taken.
So death is the 2nd death or relating to when we die we will arise and see
Him, for us without a break.
What I do notice is if I put a point the group does not like, I am told absolutely
it is wrong.
So absolutely Ananias was not killed by God.
Do you not see how exclusive such a statement is?
But if I say there are three possibilities and I go with God judged them, I am
being open about the options and where my choice is.
Do you not see the difference?
I will not change from this approach, because it is what openness is no matter
how you change my words or impression. God bless you.
Let me give you an example.
Jesus said we will not see death if we believe in Him.
Now clearly this is not true, as we will physically die or be transformed when
he returns. So another view needs to be taken.
So death is the 2nd death or relating to when we die we will arise and see
Him, for us without a break.
What I do notice is if I put a point the group does not like, I am told absolutely
it is wrong.
So absolutely Ananias was not killed by God.
Do you not see how exclusive such a statement is?
But if I say there are three possibilities and I go with God judged them, I am
being open about the options and where my choice is.
Do you not see the difference?
I will not change from this approach, because it is what openness is no matter
how you change my words or impression. God bless you.
Peter, here are YOUR WORDS which make YOU appear to not tolerate OUR points of view:
In this thread alone you have made these statements about those who disagree with you:
Originally Posted by PeterJens
It reminds me of brainwashed cults . . .
Originally Posted by PeterJens
I know you do not care about these issue, because honesty and truth have left
you, but you cannot be clearer than this to show you have fallen into heresy.
But you are too lost to ever come back, which for 9 months has become clearer,
as we work through the issues one by one.
Originally Posted by PeterJens
Emotionally you guys are so far from the heart of God, is staggers me.
Originally Posted by PeterJens
Your antipathy shows through very clearly.
I understand you think some principles that are clearly not scriptural, and any scriptures that
show this up must be wrong, is the definition of brain washing.
The church is mainly full of like minded people like me, and though some fall into the delusions
of the mystical which you hold to so dearly, life and spirituality soon break through.
One day you will learn about the discipline of the Lord, but then it will probably be too late.
Originally Posted by PeterJens
The most enthusiastic and loud shouters are happy to lie
and cheat, to put the emphasis in all the wrong places, and yet claim they know
Jesus really, yet deny all His major messages.
I am not surprised Jesus had to spend a lot of time praying and communing with
God, this level of antagonism is enough to make you think love does not matter at
all. But the cross is all about love conquers all, even the nutcase cultists.
Originally Posted by PeterJens
I am not interested in the details of Ananias and Sapphira. I am interested in those who
hold the Lord does not rebuke His people.
It is obvious hyper-grace fellowships hate the concept of rebuke.The pains in your life must be truly deep and so full for you to feel I am such a challenge to deserve this approach.
Originally Posted by PeterJens
You claim so proudly "I know God, I know I am free etc." but here you are ignoring
Gods word. But I know you have left this model behind, bought into the hyper-grace
school. Now to give this up is too much. It is your God.
I know you follow a different faith, you make it clearer every day with your antagonism
towards me and not answering God.
Now if you can answer this passage, my foundation, then we part as friends. If you do not
answer this passage, we part enemies, because you are in rebellion against Gods word.
Originally Posted by PeterJens
Why do things get so personal for you, really?
If you attack me, of course I will say, I do not understand.
Maybe people never tell you your attacks hurt. I mean if they were empty without intent
then I would not feel them. But I forgive you. I do not understand at all your approach.
Originally Posted by PeterJens
But the anger here is so palpable. But friends this is not mine.
So easily you condemn fellow believers it makes me wonder at the spirit at
work in your lives. Do you not believe you can be possessed by a spirit and
still be following the Lord? Maybe this is your reality after all.
Originally Posted by PeterJens
Is nothing sacred to you people? Shame on you. And you call Jesus your Lord.
You have no clue about honour or respect even at the simplest level.
Those who deceive and lie for whatever motives, are so convinced they would rather rubbish and slander
anyone who does not exactly agree with their views.
So rejoice brothers and sisters in our victorious Lord who led to the way through
the cross. And to those who would distort and change Gods words, His grace and
patience is very long,but judgement is coming.
Originally Posted by PeterJens
This shows how much you hate certain points of view.
"I cannot accept" - you want censorship. I am allowed to believe what I believe but
not share it. Sounds 100% what muslims want against christians.
It struck me as funny how you "super spiritual" people admit evil spirits need to be
cast out of them while believers. It then made me think, how on earth can you decide
if God in you is so defeated who is really speaking to your spirit.
Originally Posted by PeterJens
venom - It is not possible to be a friend of someone you say is not allowed to
express their view or faith on a christian website.
I do not have a problem with you sharing your position. I respect you deeply held
point of view. Yet again here you are attacking me.
These are not words of someone who loves but someone who has issues.
Peter, some serious self-examination is in order for you. You have implied that we are brainwashed, nutcase cultists. You've implied that we are too lost to ever come back, are liars and cheaters, that nothing is sacred to us, that we may be demon possessed, and that judgement is coming!
Yet we're attacking YOU?! And we're the ones with issues?!
Those here who have disagreed with you have brought reasoned, Scriptural reasons why. Anyone can read through the thread to see that's the case.
I am content to let the readers decide for themselves. What I'm not content to do is to let your ridiculous accusations about the posters here go unchallenged.
That does not mean censorship, as you assert above, it simply means that someone is calling you out on what you write. You're all for freedom of opinion as long as it's your opinion or agrees with your opinion. If someone disagrees with your opinion, then they're 'brainwashed nutcase cultists' with 'issues'!
Sheesh!
-JGIG
In this thread alone you have made these statements about those who disagree with you:
It reminds me of brainwashed cults . . .
I know you do not care about these issue, because honesty and truth have left
you, but you cannot be clearer than this to show you have fallen into heresy.
But you are too lost to ever come back, which for 9 months has become clearer,
as we work through the issues one by one.
Emotionally you guys are so far from the heart of God, is staggers me.
Your antipathy shows through very clearly.
I understand you think some principles that are clearly not scriptural, and any scriptures that
show this up must be wrong, is the definition of brain washing.
The church is mainly full of like minded people like me, and though some fall into the delusions
of the mystical which you hold to so dearly, life and spirituality soon break through.
One day you will learn about the discipline of the Lord, but then it will probably be too late.
The most enthusiastic and loud shouters are happy to lie
and cheat, to put the emphasis in all the wrong places, and yet claim they know
Jesus really, yet deny all His major messages.
I am not surprised Jesus had to spend a lot of time praying and communing with
God, this level of antagonism is enough to make you think love does not matter at
all. But the cross is all about love conquers all, even the nutcase cultists.
I am not interested in the details of Ananias and Sapphira. I am interested in those who
hold the Lord does not rebuke His people.
It is obvious hyper-grace fellowships hate the concept of rebuke.The pains in your life must be truly deep and so full for you to feel I am such a challenge to deserve this approach.
You claim so proudly "I know God, I know I am free etc." but here you are ignoring
Gods word. But I know you have left this model behind, bought into the hyper-grace
school. Now to give this up is too much. It is your God.
I know you follow a different faith, you make it clearer every day with your antagonism
towards me and not answering God.
Now if you can answer this passage, my foundation, then we part as friends. If you do not
answer this passage, we part enemies, because you are in rebellion against Gods word.
Why do things get so personal for you, really?
If you attack me, of course I will say, I do not understand.
Maybe people never tell you your attacks hurt. I mean if they were empty without intent
then I would not feel them. But I forgive you. I do not understand at all your approach.
But the anger here is so palpable. But friends this is not mine.
So easily you condemn fellow believers it makes me wonder at the spirit at
work in your lives. Do you not believe you can be possessed by a spirit and
still be following the Lord? Maybe this is your reality after all.
Is nothing sacred to you people? Shame on you. And you call Jesus your Lord.
You have no clue about honour or respect even at the simplest level.
Those who deceive and lie for whatever motives, are so convinced they would rather rubbish and slander
anyone who does not exactly agree with their views.
So rejoice brothers and sisters in our victorious Lord who led to the way through
the cross. And to those who would distort and change Gods words, His grace and
patience is very long,but judgement is coming.
This shows how much you hate certain points of view.
"I cannot accept" - you want censorship. I am allowed to believe what I believe but
not share it. Sounds 100% what muslims want against christians.
It struck me as funny how you "super spiritual" people admit evil spirits need to be
cast out of them while believers. It then made me think, how on earth can you decide
if God in you is so defeated who is really speaking to your spirit.
venom - It is not possible to be a friend of someone you say is not allowed to
express their view or faith on a christian website.
I do not have a problem with you sharing your position. I respect you deeply held
point of view. Yet again here you are attacking me.
These are not words of someone who loves but someone who has issues.
Yet we're attacking YOU?! And we're the ones with issues?!
Those here who have disagreed with you have brought reasoned, Scriptural reasons why. Anyone can read through the thread to see that's the case.
I am content to let the readers decide for themselves. What I'm not content to do is to let your ridiculous accusations about the posters here go unchallenged.
That does not mean censorship, as you assert above, it simply means that someone is calling you out on what you write. You're all for freedom of opinion as long as it's your opinion or agrees with your opinion. If someone disagrees with your opinion, then they're 'brainwashed nutcase cultists' with 'issues'!
Sheesh!
-JGIG
And all that was just in this thread?..Wow! Imagine how much this kind of behavior has been going on now for over 9 months and the need for implementing Romans 16:17 is needed more then ever.
It's actually astounding when you step back and look at things. This behavior comes from some that say "we are to walk in righteousness and purity" - no wonder the name of the Lord is blasphemed amongst the Gentiles - as Paul says.
We must understand most of us are in different points in our walk with God. Yes we have some like Peter, but we must remember when we started out in our walk we too had a lot of wrong answers.
Maybe Peter later on might change some of his views.
Now if i remember the question was about God removing us from this Earth. I do believe God does and will remove us if we are doing something that brings harm to the body of Believers. After all it was God who created us and its is God who will judge us. Its in His right to remove us.
This does not mean He will remove us but He can remove us. How many people down through the ages has God removed? We do not know.
Maybe Peter later on might change some of his views.
Now if i remember the question was about God removing us from this Earth. I do believe God does and will remove us if we are doing something that brings harm to the body of Believers. After all it was God who created us and its is God who will judge us. Its in His right to remove us.
This does not mean He will remove us but He can remove us. How many people down through the ages has God removed? We do not know.
Your assertion here in the OP is that God KILLS HIS CHILDREN.
You have not backed that up Scripturally.
Your points remain unproven according to Scripture itself - only your OPINION supports your OPINION.
Several posts have been made to SCRIPTURALLY support my and others' assertion that God DOES NOT KILL HIS CHILDREN.
I am content to let the reader decide.
It is all your own doing, PeterJens.
Trying to save face now, eh? Are you saying that you were not implying that I am possessed by a spirit (small 's')? Careful, Peter. You've kind of stuck yourself between a rock and a hard place. Tell the truth.
Elsewhere you write,
Originally Posted by PeterJens
You simply cannot be a part of the Kingdom and be possessed. It would be
like saying the Holy Spirit is less than demons, which is a total contradiction
to the faith and the cross.
. . . which I happen to agree with, but which also means you were accusing me of not being a believer. I either have the Spirit of God within or not, and if not, an evil spirit could be at work, that IS what you were saying, isn't it? But you attempt to protect yourself from scrutiny by phrasing it thus: "So easily you condemn fellow believers it makes me wonder at the spirit at work in your lives. Do you not believe you can be possessed by a spirit and
still be following the Lord? Maybe this is your reality after all."
And then you won't own up to what you're really implying.
That kind of behavior is dishonest and lacking in integrity.
You say that you were responding to a 'personal attack' saying that you made God in your image. Here's what I said in response to the following post of yours:
Originally Posted by PeterJens
Listened to Andrew Farley. This is just a continual repetition of forgiven for sin
done once for all. So ofcourse future sin is forgiven, so there can be no judgement
for bad behaviour like Ananias or eating communion without due respect.
It does not answer the question at all, it is just a distraction.
The enemy will always say, listen to your model of God not the word of God.
But you only know if you walk correctly in the Lord is through the word of God
in your heart.
Originally Posted by JGIG
PeterJens, here is the Word of God:
18 For Christ also suffered once for sins, the righteous for the unrighteous, to bring you to God. (from 1 Pet. 3)
9 We know that Christ, being raised from the dead, will never die again; death no longer has dominion over him. 10 For the death he died he died to sin, once for all, but the life he lives he lives to God. (from Rom. 6)
24 For Christ did not enter a sanctuary made with human hands that was only a copy of the true one; he entered heaven itself, now to appear for us in God’s presence. 25 Nor did he enter heaven to offer himself again and again, the way the high priest enters the Most Holy Place every year with blood that is not his own. 26 Otherwise Christ would have had to suffer many times since the creation of the world. But he has appeared once for all at the culmination of the ages to do away with sin by the sacrifice of himself. 27 Just as people are destined to die once, and after that to face judgment, 28 so Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many; and he will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who are waiting for him. (from Heb. 9)
27 Unlike the other high priests, he does not need to offer sacrifices day after day, first for his own sins, and then for the sins of the people. He sacrificed for their sins once for all when he offered himself. (from Heb. 7)
You ignore those Scriptures and see judgement for sins in other Scriptures where there are in reality natural consequences for bad behavior.
It is YOU who is creating a god in your own image, and not relying on what Scripture has to say about God, His Good News, and what the Blood of Christ and life in Him accomplished on mankind's behalf.
-JGIG
Your assertion was that God, in Christ, did not forgive our sins once for all, which opens the door to your opinion that GOD KILLS HIS OWN CHILDREN as punishment for sin. I replied with Scriptures that showed your assertion to be false.
God DOES NOT kill His own children as punishment for sin. Punishment for sin was doled out at the Cross. That God KILLS HIS OWN CHILDREN as punishment for sin is your opinion, conjured up in your own mind based on a false premise about Who God is and about the forgiveness that He's provided in Christ. You HAVE created a god that is not the God of the Bible - a god based on your own imaginings and not based on Scripture.
Do you think Paul ungracious, as well, when he advised those who wanted to live under the law to castrate themselves? Or do you think he was making a valuable, needed point by being blunt?
As Scripture states.
Scripture does NOT state that God KILLED HIS CHILDREN as punishment for their sin.
As Scripture states. Folks were being gluttonous and getting drunk. Both behaviors which can lead to physical death.
Scripture does NOT state that God KILLS HIS CHILDREN as punishment for their sin.
IN YOUR VIEW. You are drawing conclusions that are not written in Scripture, based on a false premise that not all sin was dealt with at the Cross and that God KILLS HIS OWN CHILDREN as punishment for sin.
That is ERROR, PeterJens, based on bad hermeneutics.
You have not backed that up Scripturally.
Your points remain unproven according to Scripture itself - only your OPINION supports your OPINION.
Several posts have been made to SCRIPTURALLY support my and others' assertion that God DOES NOT KILL HIS CHILDREN.
I am content to let the reader decide.
It is all your own doing, PeterJens.
Trying to save face now, eh? Are you saying that you were not implying that I am possessed by a spirit (small 's')? Careful, Peter. You've kind of stuck yourself between a rock and a hard place. Tell the truth.
Elsewhere you write,
You simply cannot be a part of the Kingdom and be possessed. It would be
like saying the Holy Spirit is less than demons, which is a total contradiction
to the faith and the cross.
. . . which I happen to agree with, but which also means you were accusing me of not being a believer. I either have the Spirit of God within or not, and if not, an evil spirit could be at work, that IS what you were saying, isn't it? But you attempt to protect yourself from scrutiny by phrasing it thus: "So easily you condemn fellow believers it makes me wonder at the spirit at work in your lives. Do you not believe you can be possessed by a spirit and
still be following the Lord? Maybe this is your reality after all."
And then you won't own up to what you're really implying.
That kind of behavior is dishonest and lacking in integrity.
You say that you were responding to a 'personal attack' saying that you made God in your image. Here's what I said in response to the following post of yours:
Listened to Andrew Farley. This is just a continual repetition of forgiven for sin
done once for all. So ofcourse future sin is forgiven, so there can be no judgement
for bad behaviour like Ananias or eating communion without due respect.
It does not answer the question at all, it is just a distraction.
The enemy will always say, listen to your model of God not the word of God.
But you only know if you walk correctly in the Lord is through the word of God
in your heart.
PeterJens, here is the Word of God:
18 For Christ also suffered once for sins, the righteous for the unrighteous, to bring you to God. (from 1 Pet. 3)
9 We know that Christ, being raised from the dead, will never die again; death no longer has dominion over him. 10 For the death he died he died to sin, once for all, but the life he lives he lives to God. (from Rom. 6)
24 For Christ did not enter a sanctuary made with human hands that was only a copy of the true one; he entered heaven itself, now to appear for us in God’s presence. 25 Nor did he enter heaven to offer himself again and again, the way the high priest enters the Most Holy Place every year with blood that is not his own. 26 Otherwise Christ would have had to suffer many times since the creation of the world. But he has appeared once for all at the culmination of the ages to do away with sin by the sacrifice of himself. 27 Just as people are destined to die once, and after that to face judgment, 28 so Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many; and he will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who are waiting for him. (from Heb. 9)
27 Unlike the other high priests, he does not need to offer sacrifices day after day, first for his own sins, and then for the sins of the people. He sacrificed for their sins once for all when he offered himself. (from Heb. 7)
You ignore those Scriptures and see judgement for sins in other Scriptures where there are in reality natural consequences for bad behavior.
It is YOU who is creating a god in your own image, and not relying on what Scripture has to say about God, His Good News, and what the Blood of Christ and life in Him accomplished on mankind's behalf.
-JGIG
Your assertion was that God, in Christ, did not forgive our sins once for all, which opens the door to your opinion that GOD KILLS HIS OWN CHILDREN as punishment for sin. I replied with Scriptures that showed your assertion to be false.
God DOES NOT kill His own children as punishment for sin. Punishment for sin was doled out at the Cross. That God KILLS HIS OWN CHILDREN as punishment for sin is your opinion, conjured up in your own mind based on a false premise about Who God is and about the forgiveness that He's provided in Christ. You HAVE created a god that is not the God of the Bible - a god based on your own imaginings and not based on Scripture.
Do you think Paul ungracious, as well, when he advised those who wanted to live under the law to castrate themselves? Or do you think he was making a valuable, needed point by being blunt?
As Scripture states.
Scripture does NOT state that God KILLED HIS CHILDREN as punishment for their sin.
As Scripture states. Folks were being gluttonous and getting drunk. Both behaviors which can lead to physical death.
Scripture does NOT state that God KILLS HIS CHILDREN as punishment for their sin.
IN YOUR VIEW. You are drawing conclusions that are not written in Scripture, based on a false premise that not all sin was dealt with at the Cross and that God KILLS HIS OWN CHILDREN as punishment for sin.
That is ERROR, PeterJens, based on bad hermeneutics.
Peter, here are YOUR WORDS which make YOU appear to not tolerate OUR points of view:
In this thread alone you have made these statements about those who disagree with you:
It reminds me of brainwashed cults . . .
I know you do not care about these issue, because honesty and truth have left
you, but you cannot be clearer than this to show you have fallen into heresy.
But you are too lost to ever come back, which for 9 months has become clearer,
as we work through the issues one by one.
Emotionally you guys are so far from the heart of God, is staggers me.
Your antipathy shows through very clearly.
I understand you think some principles that are clearly not scriptural, and any scriptures that
show this up must be wrong, is the definition of brain washing.
The church is mainly full of like minded people like me, and though some fall into the delusions
of the mystical which you hold to so dearly, life and spirituality soon break through.
One day you will learn about the discipline of the Lord, but then it will probably be too late.
The most enthusiastic and loud shouters are happy to lie
and cheat, to put the emphasis in all the wrong places, and yet claim they know
Jesus really, yet deny all His major messages.
I am not surprised Jesus had to spend a lot of time praying and communing with
God, this level of antagonism is enough to make you think love does not matter at
all. But the cross is all about love conquers all, even the nutcase cultists.
I am not interested in the details of Ananias and Sapphira. I am interested in those who
hold the Lord does not rebuke His people.
It is obvious hyper-grace fellowships hate the concept of rebuke.The pains in your life must be truly deep and so full for you to feel I am such a challenge to deserve this approach.
You claim so proudly "I know God, I know I am free etc." but here you are ignoring
Gods word. But I know you have left this model behind, bought into the hyper-grace
school. Now to give this up is too much. It is your God.
I know you follow a different faith, you make it clearer every day with your antagonism
towards me and not answering God.
Now if you can answer this passage, my foundation, then we part as friends. If you do not
answer this passage, we part enemies, because you are in rebellion against Gods word.
Why do things get so personal for you, really?
If you attack me, of course I will say, I do not understand.
Maybe people never tell you your attacks hurt. I mean if they were empty without intent
then I would not feel them. But I forgive you. I do not understand at all your approach.
But the anger here is so palpable. But friends this is not mine.
So easily you condemn fellow believers it makes me wonder at the spirit at
work in your lives. Do you not believe you can be possessed by a spirit and
still be following the Lord? Maybe this is your reality after all.
Is nothing sacred to you people? Shame on you. And you call Jesus your Lord.
You have no clue about honour or respect even at the simplest level.
Those who deceive and lie for whatever motives, are so convinced they would rather rubbish and slander
anyone who does not exactly agree with their views.
So rejoice brothers and sisters in our victorious Lord who led to the way through
the cross. And to those who would distort and change Gods words, His grace and
patience is very long,but judgement is coming.
This shows how much you hate certain points of view.
"I cannot accept" - you want censorship. I am allowed to believe what I believe but
not share it. Sounds 100% what muslims want against christians.
It struck me as funny how you "super spiritual" people admit evil spirits need to be
cast out of them while believers. It then made me think, how on earth can you decide
if God in you is so defeated who is really speaking to your spirit.
venom - It is not possible to be a friend of someone you say is not allowed to
express their view or faith on a christian website.
I do not have a problem with you sharing your position. I respect you deeply held
point of view. Yet again here you are attacking me.
These are not words of someone who loves but someone who has issues.
Peter, some serious self-examination is in order for you. You have implied that we are brainwashed, nutcase cultists. You've implied that we are too lost to ever come back, are liars and cheaters, that nothing is sacred to us, that we may be demon possessed, and that judgement is coming!
Yet we're attacking YOU?! And we're the ones with issues?!
Those here who have disagreed with you have brought reasoned, Scriptural reasons why. Anyone can read through the thread to see that's the case.
I am content to let the readers decide for themselves. What I'm not content to do is to let your ridiculous accusations about the posters here go unchallenged.
That does not mean censorship, as you assert above, it simply means that someone is calling you out on what you write. You're all for freedom of opinion as long as it's your opinion or agrees with your opinion. If someone disagrees with your opinion, then they're 'brainwashed nutcase cultists' with 'issues'!
Sheesh!
-JGIG
"Peter, here are YOUR WORDS which make YOU appear to not tolerate OUR points of view:"
JGIG - until you express your point of view I do not know it.
Let me give you an example.
Jesus said we will not see death if we believe in Him.
Now clearly this is not true, as we will physically die or be transformed when
he returns. So another view needs to be taken.
So death is the 2nd death or relating to when we die we will arise and see
Him, for us without a break.
What I do notice is if I put a point the group does not like, I am told absolutely
it is wrong.
So absolutely Ananias was not killed by God.
Do you not see how exclusive such a statement is?
But if I say there are three possibilities and I go with God judged them, I am
being open about the options and where my choice is.
Do you not see the difference?
I will not change from this approach, because it is what openness is no matter
how you change my words or impression. God bless you.
Ahhhh, classic avoidance. You quoted ONE LINE from my post (which I reposted in full above) and created another package of opinions (no Scripture) and wrapped it up with a 'God bless you' bow.
In no way did you deal with the insults and insinuations directed at those who disagree with you as 'brainwashed, nutcase cultists' who are 'too lost to ever come back, are liars and cheaters, that nothing is sacred to us, that we may be demon possessed, and to whom judgement is coming'!
It is not possible for you to deny your mistreatment of others, so you simply act like no one has noticed and showed it for what it is.
The premise of your OP is that God KILLS HIS OWN CHILDREN as punishment for sin.
You have yet to prove THAT POINT.
You have yet to answer my question (yes or no) regarding whether or not you were implying in a previous post that I'm demon possessed.
I am angry with you, PeterJens. You have mistreated many of us here. I am not sinning or attacking you in my anger - simply confronting your error and passive-aggressive abuse demonstrated here. You cannot seem to grasp your misconduct toward me and other posters here, which is very sad, because instead of having a Biblical discussion, where differing views are respectfully debated, interaction with you ALWAYS digresses into THIS TYPE OF MESS.
Very sad, indeed.
-JGIG