Jews & Gentiles

[PeteWaldo]

All of us do not come from Adam. Some are from the serpent. But Eve is the mother of all of us.
There are two posterity. One is from Adam and one is from the serpent.

Gen 4:1 And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the LORD.

For those unfamiliar with this doctrine, most of the folks I have run into have been indoctrinated into Serpent Seed by a guy named Arnold Murray. But one that I ran into was from Murray's mentor, William Branham's, "Branhamism". Anytime I find something peculiar like this I do searches with the name of the group accompanied by - ex or former - and you can often learn about deep inside it, from those who held it with their whole hearts.

Murray indoctrinates through a TV show that reaches no small number of people. You can listen to that simple sounding, velvet tongued, wolf in sheep's clothing, on youtube. I had never heard of the doctrine until I did a video on anti-Zionism, and then they came out of the woodwork. Most of them were not up front about it but beat around the bush. The more questions I asked the more kinda cryptic quasi-Christian answers I got.

Murray claims that Eve had sex with the serpent in the garden of Eden who wasn't a serpent but Lucifer himself, and produced a line of Kenites, that somehow survived the flood (I think some suggest as part of the pairs of animals, that happened to be human).

After a lot of chats with Murray's followers, it seemed to boil down to, the easiest way for one of his followers to spot a Kenite, is not just because they are Jews that happen to have been born in or live in Israel, but basically everyone that believes that the restoration of Jews to Israel, is of the Lord.

If I mischaracterized that loose definition of a "Kenite", could you please correct me crosspreacher?

 

[Crazy4GODword]

Jews are from Judah. But if your speaking about Hebrews the 10 tribes of israel, Abraham is the father of them all back in Genesis. Although today Jews are most likely Hebrews doesnt really matter anymore of keeping that one tribe since most mixed and some lost. It's more of if your a Hebrew your a Jew. But modern times a Jew is considered one by orthodox through your mother side and on top of that she has to practice it for you to be one. Now being an Ashkenazi, which pretty much dominant in America, it's weird how some would consider a Jew in their context.

 

[crosspreacher]

Gen 4:1 And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the LORD.

For those unfamiliar with this doctrine, most of the folks I have run into have been indoctrinated into Serpent Seed by a guy named Arnold Murray. But one that I ran into was from Murray's mentor, William Branham's, "Branhamism". Anytime I find something peculiar like this I do searches with the name of the group accompanied by - ex or former - and you can often learn about deep inside it, from those who held it with their whole hearts.

Murray indoctrinates through a TV show that reaches no small number of people. You can listen to that simple sounding, velvet tongued, wolf in sheep's clothing, on youtube. I had never heard of the doctrine until I did a video on anti-Zionism, and then they came out of the woodwork. Most of them were not up front about it but beat around the bush. The more questions I asked the more kinda cryptic quasi-Christian answers I got.

Murray claims that Eve had sex with the serpent in the garden of Eden who wasn't a serpent but Lucifer himself, and produced a line of Kenites, that somehow survived the flood (I think some suggest as part of the pairs of animals, that happened to be human).

After a lot of chats with Murray's followers, it seemed to boil down to, the easiest way for one of his followers to spot a Kenite, is not just because they are Jews that happen to have been born in or live in Israel, but basically everyone that believes that the restoration of Jews to Israel, is of the Lord.

If I mischaracterized that loose definition of a "Kenite", could you please correct me crosspreacher?

No I can't correct you brother. It's up to God. But I read about William Branham interpretation of the serpent seeds and I believe Him. God bless.

 

[Ariel82]

sorry ShyforHim, your thread has been hijacked.

 

[PeteWaldo]

No I can't correct you brother. It's up to God. But I read about William Branham interpretation of the serpent seeds and I believe Him. God bless.

Would you say that as a very rough guide, among the Serpent's Seed are Jews in Israel, as well as Christians that believe the restoration of Jews to Israel, is of the Lord? The term for it coined in the late 19th century is "Zionists".

 

[Ariel82]

can't you "gentlemen" take this to another thread? someone start a thread that says Serpent seed doctrines... if you don't know how, i"ll start one for you, but I don't expect to post much in it. .........its false, its not in the Bible, what more is there to discuss?

 

[PeteWaldo]

can't you "gentlemen" take this to another thread? someone start a thread that says Serpent seed doctrines... if you don't know how, i"ll start one for you, but I don't expect to post much in it. .........its false, its not in the Bible, what more is there to discuss?

You are disrespecting a posters right to follow his doctrine and point out how he divides Jews and Gentiles into yet two more divisions. I can't see how this is not very much on this particular subject. The core of his doctrine. Some that claim they are Jews are of the Satan's Serpent Seed Cain and some that claim they are Jews are of Able. (I think same for Gentiles). You just don't happen to be familiar with it, nor perhaps agree with his doctrine any more than I do.

 

[Crazy4GODword]

Jews are from Judah. But if your speaking about Hebrews the 10 tribes of israel, Abraham is the father of them all back in Genesis. Although today Jews are most likely Hebrews doesnt really matter anymore of keeping that one tribe since most mixed and some lost. It's more of if your a Hebrew your a Jew. But modern times a Jew is considered one by orthodox through your mother side and on top of that she has to practice it for you to be one. Now being an Ashkenazi, which pretty much dominant in America, it's weird how some would consider a Jew in their context.

Cont... So Jews aren't really a race anymore, you have to practice the belief to be one. Ask a rabbi today, of course you will get different answers since you have a disvison of orthodox and reform jews but it will point to one specific answer. They must practice it just as a Christian practice Christianity. It's religion. Back in the day it was a race because they were an isolated people from the rest of the world and they were called Hebrews. But physically you have to believe in it and it's proper if your mother practiced it before you according to modern answers. Now being Ashkenazi, they can trace their ancestry back to Canaan and Palestine pretty much. But I wouldn't really get into that if I were you it would confuse you since you don't know much about the tanach OT.

 

[PeteWaldo]

can't you "gentlemen" take this to another thread? someone start a thread that says Serpent seed doctrines... if you don't know how, i"ll start one for you, but I don't expect to post much in it. .........its false, its not in the Bible, what more is there to discuss?

But it would be good if he started his own thread on it so we could help him out. Unless there are rules against it or something like that.

 

[crosspreacher]

Would you say that as a very rough guide, among the Serpent's Seed are Jews in Israel, as well as Christians that believe the restoration of Jews to Israel, is of the Lord? The term for it coined in the late 19th century is "Zionists".

No, but it is not that the word of God has taken no effect. For they are not all Israel who are Israel.

 

[crosspreacher]

can't you "gentlemen" take this to another thread? someone start a thread that says Serpent seed doctrines... if you don't know how, i"ll start one for you, but I don't expect to post much in it. .........its false, its not in the Bible, what more is there to discuss?

But it is false for you but not for me

 

[PeteWaldo]

No, but it is not that the word of God has taken no effect. For they are not all Israel who are Israel.

So then "Zionists" are just as likely of the seed of Able, as anti-Zionists are?

 

[crosspreacher]

Zionist or not, I think they must receive Christ to be saved. And we receive Him if we are predestined to.

 

[PeteWaldo]

Zionist or not, I think they must receive Christ to be saved. And we receive Him if we are predestined to.

That didn't answer my question.
Let's try it this way. Are Christian Zionists just as likely to be of the seed of Able as Christian anti-Zionists?

 

[RedTent]

The Jew and gentile question in the bible is not easy to comprehend. A study of it has us go off on all kinds of directions, some pretty silly. I’m going to try to go back to how it started and tell it simply.

God created the race WAY back when God found that people were mixed up about Him, and getting some strange ideas that amounted to idol worship, cults,etc. So God took one man who seemed trainable (Abraham) and used him to create a race (Jews) that God would use to train about who God was. God told these people not to marry outside the race He created. At the same time, it was as much following the One True God that determined who was a Jew. A woman not born from Jewish parents named Ruth was considered so Jewish because of her acceptance of God that she became a grandparent of Christ.

Anyone not accepted in the Jewish race was called a gentile. Gentiles did not accept the One God as their creator; they had other varying ideas of God.

Although people could join the Jews, people not of that race weren’t easily accepted until Christ was crucified. If they were accepted they became known as Jews. After that time God had men go out to recruit gentiles. Then it REALLY gets complicated. God said they could believe in the One True God through Christ and not need to be Jews like it they had decided before. People are still fighting about it.

Many of the Jews didn’t and don’t accept that their Messiah and Christ are the same, they think the Messiah is still to come. This divides them even more, now. So after Christ, being Jewish is more a matter of the family you were born in, your beliefs have little to do with it. Jews can be Christians, one of the many sects who believe the messiah is still to come, or atheist.

 

[PeteWaldo]

The Jew and gentile question in the bible is not easy to comprehend. A study of it has us go off on all kinds of directions, some pretty silly. I’m going to try to go back to how it started and tell it simply.

God created the race WAY back when God found that people were mixed up about Him, and getting some strange ideas that amounted to idol worship, cults,etc. So God took one man who seemed trainable (Abraham) and used him to create a race (Jews) that God would use to train about who God was. God told these people not to marry outside the race He created. At the same time, it was as much following the One True God that determined who was a Jew. A woman not born from Jewish parents named Ruth was considered so Jewish because of her acceptance of God that she became a grandparent of Christ.

Anyone not accepted in the Jewish race was called a gentile. Gentiles did not accept the One God as their creator; they had other varying ideas of God.

Although people could join the Jews, people not of that race weren’t easily accepted ........

I was of that impression to. But I have also learned that Jews were a heavily proselytizing faith up until a Roman ruler prohibited it in the 2nd century AD. Perhaps just as God arranged to have the temple torn down by Romans - every stone just as Jesus prophesied - He perhaps arranged to end proselytizing into Judaism, as suggested by the actual parable of the fig tree withering and producing no fruit.
Yet it would seem God still preserved them as a group, and restored them to their land - even in unbelief - for the sake of His holy name. Fulfilling what is usually recognized as the "parable of the fig tree" when the fig tree puts on leaves.
http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/60682-return-jews-israel.html

For folks with eyes willing to see, Daniel pinned the years of the return of control of Israel by Jews in 1948, and their control of Jerusalem in 1967 - mathematically - in two parallel problems that span 2500 years.

........ until Christ was crucified. If they were accepted they became known as Jews. After that time God had men go out to recruit gentiles. Then it REALLY gets complicated. God said they could believe in the One True God through Christ and not need to be Jews like it they had decided before. People are still fighting about it.

Many of the Jews didn’t and don’t accept that their Messiah and Christ are the same, they think the Messiah is still to come. This divides them even more, now. So after Christ, being Jewish is more a matter of the family you were born in, your beliefs have little to do with it. Jews can be Christians, one of the many sects who believe the messiah is still to come, or atheist.

 

[PeteWaldo]

Zionist or not, I think they must receive Christ to be saved. And we receive Him if we are predestined to.

You didn't answer the last question I asked. Maybe you have been out for a couple hours, but I would appreciate an answer. In the following I am hoping to at least inspire that first spark of cognitive dissonance, as I am concerned about your spiritual well being, my friend.

First in regard to predestination, the God I serve says:

2Pe 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

But He can, perhaps, loose patience with those who receive no love of truth.
Perhaps you believe God created people in a manner, so that some would have a genetic propensity toward having a tougher time of coming into repentance, than others. I don't believe such a view would be consistent with the verse I just quoted.

Now regarding the verse that you ignored, for obvious reasons, and the purpose of this post:

Gen 4:1 And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the LORD.

Now Moses was inspired to write inform us that Adam was sexually united with Eve, and that she conceived, and that the child that resulted from that union was Cain. On top of that, it also indicates that Eve had "gotten a man from the LORD".

Would you please exegete that verse for us, in the way that you understand it.

 

[homwardbound]

its not really important anymore who your physical ancestors are but who your Spiritually following. Abraham's spiritual descendents are those who believe in his Seed who is Christ Jesus. the genealogy was important because the prophecy of JESUS coming from the line of Judah, via David. Its mainly about Jesus, but some people will try and convince you differently...

Yes in Christ a new Covenant, a new Priesthood and new Laws first love God as much as he loves you and then one will love thier neighbor as they view Chrsit loving them, unconditionally if they see the unconditional LOve of God 1 Cor 13 ans ask to receive this type of Love then they will if ones motive is pure, not wanting to use and abuse WOW!!!!!! the Mercy Ariel is amazing is it not?

 

[homwardbound]

Lately I've been confused about this one thing. Don't we all come from Adam? If so, why some are Gentiles and others are Jews? When did Jews become Jews? I don't know OT so good yet so I'd like an explanation, something small that explains it.

P.S.- Please, don't post long texts because there's a high probability I won't read it.

God bless![/QUOTE
All of us do not come from Adam. Some are from the serpent. But Eve is the mother of all of us.
There are two posterity. One is from Adam and one is from the serpent.

Wow!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! how can this be when the whole wrold was flooded in the days of Noah. All that lived were Noah his three sons and their wifes hMMM!!!! so we all are descendants fro Adam and Eve period

 

[homwardbound]

Serpent seed, dual seed or two-seedline is a controversial doctrine according to which the serpent in the Garden of Eden mated with Eve, and the offspring of their union was Cain. This belief is still held by some adherents of Christian Identity, who claim that the Jews, as descendants of Cain, are also descended from the serpent.[1][2] The idea has also existed in several other non-racial contexts, and major proponents include Daniel Parker (1781–1844),[3] William M. Branham (1909–1965)[4] and Arnold Murray (1929- ). However, Murray teaches that the Kenites (and not the Jews) were the offspring of Cain. Murray teaches that the Jews descended from Adam through Seth and so on.[5]

The doctrine that Eve mated with the serpent, or with Satan, to produce Cain also appears in early Gnostic writings such as the Gospel of Philip (c. 350); however, this teaching was explicitly rejected as heresy by Irenaeus (c. 180) and later mainstream Christian theologians. A similar doctrine appeared in Jewish midrashic texts in the 9th century and in the Kabalah. It is considered a false doctrine by mainstream Protestant denominations.[citation needed] Catholic theologians point to the fact that the Bible states that the original sin is that of Adam and Eve eating a forbidden fruit.[6]

Serpent seed - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia < click

so according to Kabalah, gentiles are from the serpent, especially blacks.

according to these others, it's either jews or some other unknown lizard people.

stop the madness

And this whole theology is wiped out by the flood, Noah was in the lineage of Adam and his three Sons were in the lineage of Noah, So today no matter what exactly happened back then is and has been wiped out, The bond and free woman allegory is shown after the flood and through Abraham, oh an the Nephilim that was therer in the day was also wiped out