Lies

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LaurenTM

Guest
#61
It is a sin to deceive, and telling a lie is to deceive.

If you cannot truthfully answer a question... just don't answer it.

Tell them you cannot talk about it. If you are under oath in a court of law, plead the 5th.




It would be an honor for any Christian to help the Jews... back then, or now.
thing is, it was a lie to hide them in the first place

the law at the time was to expose them

murder is also against God's law

is killing?

gets hard to quantify when the split hairs become thinner and thinner

would it be wrong to kill Germans if you could, who were about to gas thousands of Jews? or thousands of other ethnic groups that usually are forgotten in the extremes of trying to make a point?
 
A

Amazing-Grace

Guest
#62
AG? Did you ever get the answer you needed?
From the comments it looks like I'm going to have to tell it as it is regardless of the worry it will cause. I am reluctant to fib about it which is why I felt the need to ask here. Thanks for asking! :)
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
56,318
26,343
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#63
From the comments it looks like I'm going to have to tell it as it is regardless of the worry it will cause. I am reluctant to fib about it which is why I felt the need to ask here. Thanks for asking! :)
It would have been helpful if you had been more forthcoming with us about the circumstances.
 
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HisHolly

Guest
#64
Be honest and pray about the worry. Better to do that than create a web of fibs if questions arise.. I'll be praying for peace for all concerned..
From the comments it looks like I'm going to have to tell it as it is regardless of the worry it will cause. I am reluctant to fib about it which is why I felt the need to ask here. Thanks for asking! :)
 
A

Amazing-Grace

Guest
#66
LOL. Are you on another one of your witch hunts? She's certainly getting answers. She didn't like mine, though. Deceiving and deluding people with lies was called "trivial."
Magenta,it wasn't that I "didn't like" your answer as I have already explained. I would appreciate it if you didn't call me "she" and spoke about me as if I cannot see your words.
 
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Amazing-Grace

Guest
#67
Be honest and pray about the worry. Better to do that than create a web of fibs if questions arise.. I'll be praying for peace for all concerned..
Thank you Holly, I appreciate that.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
56,318
26,343
113
#69
Magenta,it wasn't that I "didn't like" your answer as I have already explained. I would appreciate it if you didn't call me "she" and spoke about me as if I cannot see your words.
You did not even have the decency to respond to my answer, and then when I further showed how people go off the rails when they have been lied to, in keeping with the direction the thread went with the help of DEPLETED you criticised me.

and I'm sorry you can't tell the difference.
And then you got snotty with me.

I am sorry you were so offended.
 

BenFTW

Senior Member
Oct 7, 2012
4,834
981
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#70
I was pondering this very question this morning. Not because a scenario has presented itself, but just a general thought of whether or not a lie is in fact sinful if it is done with the right intent. The truth prevails, but one must consider in acts of war when someone uses a decoy isn't that a form of deception? Is this just wise strategy or is this a sin against God? More often than not it seems that the intent behind the heart is the root of the problem. Even with lust Jesus went to the heart rather than the deed, not that one can commit fornication in purity.

That is a thought to consider, are there any other sins, besides lying, under certain circumstances that the absolute morality behind God's commands somehow waver? Take fornication, for example, and sorry if it sounds crude but say that a person is given the option to lay with another man and it could end a war. No bloodshed, no innocent lives or children dying, and no destruction beyond the temple of the one laying with another. This person who makes such a sacrifice for a nation, for peace, has this sin of fornication somehow been justified or rather should the burden of death be on their mind all their life had they only given themselves (if they rejected the offer)?

VVe can keep doing this with all the different sins and put them under circumstances that, maybe, allow for some breathing room. VVhile God's standard of righteousness is perfection, we must remember that God is a gracious and merciful God. He knows all things, including the heart. His grace is sufficient, not so that we may sin but because we do sin. Jesus paid the penalty for our sins and so we are justified before God on the basis of His mercy.

This question of whether a particular sin is justified under certain circumstances, while an intriguing thought, must be kept in line with the truth of Christ and Him crucified. God isn't ought to get you, but rather wishes have a relationship with you that is already possible through Christ. Is lying okay under certain circumstances? It seems to me that one is willing to sacrifice their self for the sake of others. If lying as a sin leads to death and one chooses to lie for the sake of another's life, is there somehow something righteous in this act of love/sacrifice?

I can't really give a straight forward answer beyond that God is merciful and just. He knows the heart and circumstances of all things. If one lies to save a life, to distract and deceive someone and give them false information does God in His mercy understand why a human would do such a thing, especially for a loved one? I'll leave that in your hands to determine.
 
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Amazing-Grace

Guest
#71
You did not even have the decency to respond to my answer, and then when I further showed how people go off the rails when they have been lied to, in keeping with the direction the thread went with the help of DEPLETED you criticised me.

And then you got snotty with me.

I am sorry you were so offended.
I did respond to your answer, you just quoted it. I don't like being called "she" and I don't think you would appreciate it either - there is no need for this, neither did I get "snotty", in fact my response wasn't dissimilar to your own. Yes I'm offended you have taken this direction toward what was originally a request for help with a situation.
 
H

HisHolly

Guest
#72
I do enjoy reading your posts. It's as though I've gone to the library or vintage shop and found an old book... Your style is quite lovely.
I was pondering this very question this morning. Not because a scenario has presented itself, but just a general thought of whether or not a lie is in fact sinful if it is done with the right intent. The truth prevails, but one must consider in acts of war when someone uses a decoy isn't that a form of deception? Is this just wise strategy or is this a sin against God? More often than not it seems that the intent behind the heart is the root of the problem. Even with lust Jesus went to the heart rather than the deed, not that one can commit fornication in purity.

That is a thought to consider, are there any other sins, besides lying, under certain circumstances that the absolute morality behind God's commands somehow waver? Take fornication, for example, and sorry if it sounds crude but say that a person is given the option to lay with another man and it could end a war. No bloodshed, no innocent lives or children dying, and no destruction beyond the temple of the one laying with another. This person who makes such a sacrifice for a nation, for peace, has this sin of fornication somehow been justified or rather should the burden of death be on their mind all their life had they only given themselves (if they rejected the offer)?

VVe can keep doing this with all the different sins and put them under circumstances that, maybe, allow for some breathing room. VVhile God's standard of righteousness is perfection, we must remember that God is a gracious and merciful God. He knows all things, including the heart. His grace is sufficient, not so that we may sin but because we do sin. Jesus paid the penalty for our sins and so we are justified before God on the basis of His mercy.

This question of whether a particular sin is justified under certain circumstances, while an intriguing thought, must be kept in line with the truth of Christ and Him crucified. God isn't ought to get you, but rather wishes have a relationship with you that is already possible through Christ. Is lying okay under certain circumstances? It seems to me that one is willing to sacrifice their self for the sake of others. If lying as a sin leads to death and one chooses to lie for the sake of another's life, is there somehow something righteous in this act of love/sacrifice?

I can't really give a straight forward answer beyond that God is merciful and just. He knows the heart and circumstances of all things. If one lies to save a life, to distract and deceive someone and give them false information does God in His mercy understand why a human would do such a thing, especially for a loved one? I'll leave that in your hands to determine.
 
D

Depleted

Guest
#73
From the comments it looks like I'm going to have to tell it as it is regardless of the worry it will cause. I am reluctant to fib about it which is why I felt the need to ask here. Thanks for asking! :)
There is still telling it kindly. (Hard for me, but doable.)

I'll be praying for you and that person.
 
A

Amazing-Grace

Guest
#74
There is still telling it kindly. (Hard for me, but doable.)

I'll be praying for you and that person.
:) Thanks depleted, prayer is always most welcome.
 
D

Depleted

Guest
#75
Are you saying we should have submitted to Adolf Hitler and the Nazis and let them rule the world?
Are you born again?

Because you spend an inordinate amount of time splitting hairs and seeing how much you can get others to turn from their Christian convictions.

Not much of a ministry. And definitely never leads to edification.
 
D

Depleted

Guest
#76
LOL. Are you on another one of your witch hunts? She's certainly getting answers. She didn't like mine, though. Deceiving and deluding people with lies was called "trivial."
​Who's the witch hunter?
 
D

Depleted

Guest
#77
It would have been helpful if you had been more forthcoming with us about the circumstances.
Half of this thread is about Jews and Nazis. And when people do tell the full story most advice is just as far into left field. Clearly being "more forthcoming" does not stop people on this site from taking off in any sort of direction. lol
 
D

Depleted

Guest
#78
Yeah, you're probably right. Those would have probably been my last words before they shoot me.
As the blood is gurgling out and your lying on the ground, feel free to wave at me. I'd be on the ground next to you, but already dead. I promise to wave back when we arrive in heaven though. :D
 
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Amazing-Grace

Guest
#79
I'm sorry that this thread has gone the way it has, it has veered off topic and has some of us bickering at one another....this saddens me and I'm partly to blame. TBH I only expected a handful of replies to answer my original question so I'll be happy to see it fade away now. Thanks all.
 
Dec 19, 2009
27,513
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#80
Are you born again?

Because you spend an inordinate amount of time splitting hairs and seeing how much you can get others to turn from their Christian convictions.

Not much of a ministry. And definitely never leads to edification.
What are you referring to?