the truth in the words of paul...

followjesus · Jul 24, 2016

dude look !!!

matthew 28:19-20 "…19Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit, 20and teaching them to obey all that I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”

this is AFTER THE CROSS, Jesus commanding His followers to go to ALL NATIONS AND TEACH THEM TO OBEY EVERYTHING I HAVE COMMANDED YOU."

its Jesus man after the resurrection, his final instruction before he went back to the father. you suppose now all the sudden paul changed all that? you would definitely have to show some scripture authorizing pauls authority to undo Jesus words before that's gonna float.

this great commission ensures that any doctrine has to be centered on Jesus and His commands or teachings. its the foundation of eb=verything after the cross, thou it didn't change when he was on earth going to the cross, but for your sake, cant you see that this commission shows a good doctrine approved by Jesus not just to a group but to the entire world or all nations? if any octrine omits what Jesus taught it is absolutely false in every way. its just doctrine telling you that paul has some authority over Jesus. its Just the gog making you have to reason how what Jesus said doesn't apply, because it doesn't fit with unwarranted salvation your following a doctrine, Not the gospel

followjesus · Jul 24, 2016

Grace777x70 said:

followjesus said:

you just did it again Jesus said this " if you do not forgive others, God will not forgive you"

you ARE omitting that as well as any other condition because it doesn't go with the gog.

but you are omitting it by saying, I'm not ommitinbg it, it just doesn't apply to Christians. its omission this is exactly why I cant discuss with you. your stuck in a fallacy and defend it to the death. Jesus said plainly if you do not forgive you will not be forgiven. he said this MORE than once, even taught a parable on it. lol the great commission " go teach all nations to obey all I have commanded you"

so are you ommitimg that we MUST forgive now that were forgiven or we will not be forgiven? your omitting that from your doctrine, right? just own it man instead of saying no I'm not I'm "dividing the word" just sayit truthfully, what Jesus said, cant apply because it doesn't fit the gog

Grace777x70 · Jul 24, 2016

followjesus said:

Your doctrine is that you don't believe in eternal security and you are entitled to believe whatever you want so you see everything through the eyes that one can lose their salvation in Christ - even thought Jesus said that the Holy Spirit will be in you forever and never leave you.

I would call those Christians that were not forgiving baby Christians and walking as mere men - and so did Paul to the Corinthians. But what did Paul do when speaking to the Corinthians?

Paul told the Corinthians who they were in Christ..then corrected their behavior...he didn't say you were all unsaved now...

..he told them who they were in Christ..saints..they have His righteousness, holiness..etc.

These are the very same people that were causing divisions and strife amongst each other. Men going to have sex with the temple prostitutes, believers taking each other to court, people getting drunk at Communion..etc.

Paul called them carnal Christians and yet at the same time called them "saints" - that they have the righteousness of God, that they were complete in Him, that they had the mind of Christ, that they were holy...etc...that Christ was confirmed as being in them.

Then Paul goes on to say in verse 8 " who will also confirm you to the end, blameless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ."

Paul gives them their true identity in Christ then goes on to describe what this true life in Christ will look like. Paul says later on to "Awake to righteousness and sin not" This is a call to see who you are in Christ and in seeing this - sin will fall off of us like dead leaves off a tree.

1 Corinthians 1:1-9 (NASB)

[SUP]2 [/SUP] To the church of God which is at Corinth, to those who have been sanctified in Christ Jesus, saints by calling, with all who in every place call on the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, their Lord and ours:

[SUP]4 [/SUP] I thank my God always concerning you for the grace of God which was given you in Christ Jesus,

[SUP]5 [/SUP] that in everything you were enriched in Him, in all speech and all knowledge,

[SUP]6 [/SUP] even as the testimony concerning Christ was confirmed in you,

[SUP]7 [/SUP] so that you are not lacking in any gift, awaiting eagerly the revelation of our Lord Jesus Christ,

[SUP]8 [/SUP] who will also confirm you to the end, blameless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ.

[SUP]9 [/SUP] God is faithful, through whom you were called into fellowship with His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord.

1 Corinthians 1:30-31 (NASB)
[SUP]30 [/SUP] But by His doing you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification, and redemption,

[SUP]31 [/SUP] so that, just as it is written, "LET HIM WHO BOASTS, BOAST IN THE LORD."

John146 · Jul 24, 2016

followjesus said:

Do you know that Jesus told the disciples to preach the gospel of the kingdom only to the Jews and stay away from the Gentiles? Do you know that Jesus instructed them to follow the teachings of Moses' law as taught by the pharisees? Btw, the only authority Paul had was given him by the Lord Jesus. The things that Paul taught had never been made known before. When did Jesus preach the gospel of His own death, burial and resurrection?

Grace777x70 · Jul 24, 2016

followjesus said:

Grace777x70 said:

There is no condition for receiving forgiveness of sins after the cross when Jesus took all the sins away. Go back and read the post where there are word-for-word accounts of the real gospel of the grace of God being preached. There is no "condition" after the cross.

Nowhere do Peter and Paul say "If you don't forgive neither will God forgive you when preaching the gospel". You are completely tossing out the finished work of Christ for the forgiveness of sins.

You would think that Paul would have mentioned it at least once in his 13 letters to the churches about this " If you don't forgive - you will not be forgiven thing". Not once does he mention that.

followjesus · Jul 24, 2016

Grace777x70 said:

Your doctrine is that you don't believe in eternal security and you are entitled to believe whatever you want so you see everything through the eyes that one can lose their salvation in Christ - even thought Jesus said that the Holy Spirit will be in you forever and never leave you.

I would call those Christians that were not forgiving baby Christians and walking as mere men - and so did Paul to the Corinthians. But what did Paul do when speaking to the Corinthians?

Paul told the Corinthians who they were in Christ..then corrected their behavior...he didn't say you were all unsaved now...

..he told them who they were in Christ..saints..they have His righteousness, holiness..etc.

These are the very same people that were causing divisions and strife amongst each other. Men going to have sex with the temple prostitutes, believers taking each other to court, people getting drunk at Communion..etc.

Paul called them carnal Christians and yet at the same time called them "saints" - that they have the righteousness of God, that they were complete in Him, that they had the mind of Christ, that they were holy...etc...that Christ was confirmed as being in them.

Then Paul goes on to say in verse 8 " who will also confirm you to the end, blameless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ."

Paul gives them their true identity in Christ then goes on to describe what this true life in Christ will look like. Paul says later on to "Awake to righteousness and sin not" This is a call to see who you are in Christ and in seeing this - sin will fall off of us like dead leaves off a tree.

1 Corinthians 1:1-9 (NASB)

[SUP]2 [/SUP] To the church of God which is at Corinth, to those who have been sanctified in Christ Jesus, saints by calling, with all who in every place call on the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, their Lord and ours:

[SUP]4 [/SUP] I thank my God always concerning you for the grace of God which was given you in Christ Jesus,

[SUP]5 [/SUP] that in everything you were enriched in Him, in all speech and all knowledge,

[SUP]6 [/SUP] even as the testimony concerning Christ was confirmed in you,

[SUP]7 [/SUP] so that you are not lacking in any gift, awaiting eagerly the revelation of our Lord Jesus Christ,

[SUP]8 [/SUP] who will also confirm you to the end, blameless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ.

[SUP]9 [/SUP] God is faithful, through whom you were called into fellowship with His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord.

1 Corinthians 1:30-31 (NASB)
[SUP]30 [/SUP] But by His doing you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification, and redemption,

[SUP]31 [/SUP] so that, just as it is written, "LET HIM WHO BOASTS, BOAST IN THE LORD."

bruce ? do Jesus words apply to His followers? or "Christians" or only the ones that seem to have no condition? that's how you all divide the word lol you omit anything that doesn't jive with jp again I don't read your spiels I know all those scriptures already, and also know the contect of them so again I think were to the point of no fruit, why not exercise self control and go argue elsewhere or go convert others I'm not biting on the lure the hooks too sharp

followjesus · Jul 24, 2016

John146 said:

do you know that Jesus told all his followers what to go forth into all the world and teach? yes you do, because I just gave you that scripture. you guys never do address anything. if Jesus told His followers go teach my commands to all nations teach them to obey all I have commanded you, all nations you really honestly are going to hold that the 4 gospels aren't meant for Christians? you guys are wasting time yours and mine. I choose Jesus, Love paul his servant, But the king, the savior, the Lord, the one to follow is Just JESUS. the words to NOT EVER OMIT are Jesus words. Jesus even saved Samaritans in His ministry.......

point is if the commission says what it says, then all teachers of THE GOSPEL need to be teaching the things Jesus taught to ALL NATIONS even to the end of the age. there is no Christianity apart from Jesus.

John146 · Jul 24, 2016

followjesus said:

What Paul taught was the Lord's words revealed to him after his conversion. What Jesus gave Paul had never been known before Paul taught it. I never would take the "great commission" as my commission. There are things the Lord taught during His public ministry concerning the physical kingdom promised to His physical people Israel that do not apply to us His spiritual children in the spiritual kingdom. You must differentiate the two. It's called rightly dividing the word of truth. There are right divisions to be made to avoid doctrinal errors.

Grace777x70 · Jul 24, 2016

followjesus said:

Jason I have already answered you 3x times now. It is obvious you don't want to believe what I say - even though you don't actually read what I am saying...so this is just a complete waste of time.

I will give the links here where I have answered your question each time.

http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/139224-truth-words-paul-4.html#post2716935

http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/139224-truth-words-paul-4.html#post2716960

http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/139224-truth-words-paul-4.html#post2716972

http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/139224-truth-words-paul-4.html#post2716979

http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/139224-truth-words-paul-5.html#post2716989

http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/139224-truth-words-paul-5.html#post2716999

Anyway - if you don't read what I post - instead you want to tell me what I believe - the this is just useless so I'll leave you to continue talking with others.

Bless you and have a great night! Jesus loves you dearly and the Father is not going to "un-born" you ever as a son of His. Jesus' work was complete and He doesn't need our help to save ourselves. He is our Savior forever. His blood speaks of better things. Let's grow up in Him and be a blessing to others.

John146 · Jul 24, 2016

followjesus said:

do you know that Jesus told all his followers what to go forth into all the world and teach? yes you do, because I just gave you that scripture. you guys never do address anything. if Jesus told His followers go teach my commands to all nations teach them to obey all I have commanded you, all nations you really honestly are going to hold that the 4 gospels aren't meant for Christians? you guys are wasting time yours and mine. I choose Jesus, Love paul his servant, But the king, the savior, the Lord, the one to follow is Just JESUS. the words to NOT EVER OMIT are Jesus words. Jesus even saved Samaritans in His ministry.......

point is if the commission says what it says, then all teachers of THE GOSPEL need to be teaching the things Jesus taught to ALL NATIONS even to the end of the age. there is no Christianity apart from Jesus.

You cannot read the four gospels and come away with the meaning of the death, burial and resurrection. If not for Paul's epistles, we would not have the full understanding of the gospel we preach today.

followjesus · Jul 24, 2016

John146 said:

everything paul taught ? like those who live like this WILL NOT INHERIT THE KINGDOM OF God? or those who live like this has no inheritance in the Kingdom of Christ and of God? or " "you must rid yourselves of all such things as these? or "those who sow to please the sinful nature will reaop destruction, those who sow to please the spirit will reap eternal life? or the many many many things paul taught that we are supposed to DO?

I totally reject the dfalse doctrine that Jesus is now irrelevant and pauls our authority completely reject it, BUT again for your sake, what of all the things paul taught of not inheriting the kingdom because of actions?

wait, that's right, that's something else I "just don't get" inheritance is some rewards that we lose, but were still saved no matter what, still have eternal life no matter what right? naw.....imna say the same I did to bruce to you. I'm not disrespecting you guys, its just a waste of time for you and I to do this it just fuels the same debate, we should all find people who can be edified rather than hang out and argue our "doctrines" which really is silly, because it all fits together like a glove when you don't omit it, just accept whats there, but theres no agreement between myself and the gog keepers, I'm convinced 100 percent its a herecy, from the forked tongue of satan appearing as an angel of light, a distortion of grace and a mocking of the cross.

I have nothing against either of you honestly, its that doctrine you cling to that's offensive to me. as is any which eliminates Jesus from Christianity. so ill just scroll past your comments on issues like this, matbe if you want, fellowship and discuss fishing or hunting or whatever activity but I cannot dic=scuss doctri ne or the bible with people who just omit anything that they think isn't right, its Gods wordm Hes right that's why we have all of it. even law is beneficial n it we see how much has been done in Christ. I thank God I'm not bound to the mosaic law without mercy. and I'm just as thankful that Jesus taught me how to act in Hois kingdom. still learn daily as I stay in His word and in doing that knowing its trut not omitting it because I don't agree with Jesus, hes made a new man from a dead body. ill stick with what took my bonds and handed me a real true relationship with God through Christ in me.

so you are free to continue commenting anytime, but I'm not gonna waste time when you guys just omit anything jp doesn't approve, or what the gospel actually says. God Loves you tho that's certain

followjesus · Jul 24, 2016

Grace777x70 said:

naw you do the same as always man you say I don't omit anything, but omit anything that places condition upon you. but ya were good to just let it go. your judgements of me or any other person means nothing man, as mine shouldn't mean anything to you either. theres no fruit, you guys just omit, but then when you omit and someone says wait what about this the answer is " pre cross pauls the authority ect. you just are doing the same thing as in January when I got here, why continue no fruit self control man just scroll on past like I do with your posts, good peaceful solution. you and I bruce are in 2 different worlds serving 2 different gospels, no wonder theres no agreement. I wont omit, you will, but then say you never would.

the question was that you never answered at all was are Jesus words meant for the church. to that I got a speil like usual you don't omit but those things just don't apply to Christians= omission of Jesus words which are spirit and life......you guys all omit all the gog keepers do the same exact thing, to support that, now theres all the new "only paul" doctrine, well what your doctrine does is omit Jesus and His sound teachings that are ETERNALLY the very same gospel that saved peter, paul, john sand any other person who accepts the actual gospel of Jesus Christ. not just a misteaching called the gospel of Grace, that's not what paul taught. and to your

truith in the words of paul reference, address those scriptures since you apparently have a point about the op??? all those probly just mean something else too tho he isn't really saying if you serve all those acts of the sinful nature youll die, hes somehow saying no matter what your all saved. " I love you, you love me, were a ha pp ee fam I ly, wioth a GREAT big hug and a kiss from me to you....wont ...you...say you love me too" yay

UnderGrace · Jul 24, 2016

I find this to be so true. For those who do not believe in the eternal assurance of the believer and consider it heresy, it just changes the entire way they see scripture. Some even used scripture that is not even related to the security of salvation and use to confirm that salvation can be lost.

I am so cautious now, because I have seen how easy it is to be entrenched in something, and then it colors everything that way.

Thank God if we are open God can deliver us from our wrong beliefs, although for myself it always felt like it was such waste that I believed the wrong way when I could have been believing the right way all along and would have been much more at peace!!

followjesus · Jul 25, 2016

UnderGrace said:

romans 14:11 it is written,

as surely as I live says the Lord, every knee will bow before me, every tongue will confess to God."
so then each of us will give an account of Himself to God."

romans 2:5-11 " but because of your stubbornness and unrepentant heart, you are storing up wrath for yourself on the day of Gods wrath, when his righteous judgements will be revealed. GOD WILL GIVE TO EACH PERSON ACCORDING TO WHAT HE HAS DONE. TO THOSE WHO PERSIST IN DOING GOOD SEEK GLORY, HONOR AND IMMORTALITY, HE WILL GOIVE ETERNAL LIFE. BUT FOR THOSE WHO ARE SELF SEEKING AND WHO REJECT THE TRUTH AND FOLLOW EVIL, THERE WILL BE WRATH AND ANGER. there will be trouble and distress for every huiman being who does evil first for the jew, then the gentile."

just one more example from paul

p_rehbein · Jul 25, 2016

followjesus said:

I did not "like" your comment, but, not because I did not "like" the Scriptures you quoted. I do not know what the two of you are arguing about, so don't want to give the impression I am supporting one side or the other, and I am not sure which translation you quoted from. While I surely believe that the Scriptures quoted are Biblical truth, they do not sound like the King James version, and I have not yet looked at the KJV to see if there are any minor connotative meanings to one or more of the words in the Scriptures you quoted that would make me reassess my opinion.

Anyway, just saying the Scriptures quoted are (in my opinion) Biblical Truth.

followjesus · Jul 25, 2016

p_rehbein said:

1 Corinthians 6:8-10 "Instead, you yourselves cheat and do wrong, and you do this to your brothers and sisters. Or do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor men who have sex with men[SUP] [/SUP]nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God."

ephesians 5:5 " For of this you can be sure: No immoral, impure or greedy person--such a person is an idolater--has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.

romans 8:13 "For if you live according to the flesh, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live."

matthew 16:27 "For the Son of Man will come in His Father's glory with His angels, and then He will repay each one according to what he has done.

p_rehbein · Jul 25, 2016

followjesus said:

Ok, OK already...........

I said I "like" the Scriptures............

Are they from the NSV or what other translation? Because I checked the KJV, and they are not from it. Not saying they HAVE TO BE to be "liked," just saying...............

Anyway,

followjesus · Jul 25, 2016

1 timothy 4:2-4 " Preach the Word; be prepared in season and out of season ; correct, rebuke and encourage - with great patience and careful instructions. for the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. instead to suit thoier own desires, they will gatther around them a great number of teachers to say what thier itching ears want to hear. they will turn thier ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths"

2 peter 2 :1-3 " But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. they will secretly introduce destructive heresies, EVEN DENYING THE SOVEREIGN LORD WHO BOUGHT THEM- bringing swift destruction on themselves. MANY WILL FOLLOW their shameful ways and will bring the way of truth into disrepute. in their greed these teachers will exploit you wuth stories they have made up. their condemnation has long been hanging over them, and their destruction is not sleeping."

2 john 1:9" Anyone who runs ahead and does not continue in the teaching of Christ does not have God; whoever continues in the teaching has both the Father and the Son."

john 7:16-17 "Jesus answered, “My teaching is not my own. It comes from the one who sent me. Anyone who chooses to do the will of God will find out whether my teaching comes from God or whether I speak on my own

1 timothy 6:3-5"These are the things you are to teach and insist on. If anyone teaches otherwise and does not agree to the sound instruction of our Lord Jesus Christ and to godly teaching, they are conceited and understand nothing. They have an unhealthy interest in controversies and quarrels about words that result in envy, strife, malicious talk, evil suspicions and constant friction between people of corrupt mind, who have been robbed of the truth"

2 john 1:6 And this is love, that we walk according to His commandments. This is the very commandment you have heard from the beginning, that you must walk in love

1 john 2:3-4 "By this we can be sure that we have come to know Him: if we keep His commandments. If anyone says, “I know Him,” but does not keep His commandments, he is a liar, and the truth is not in him.…

1 john 3:22 "and we will receive from Him whatever we ask, because we keep His commandments and do what is pleasing in His sight."

[SUB][SUP]
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followjesus · Jul 25, 2016

p_rehbein said:

kjv "But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God; Who will render to every man according to his deeds: To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life: But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath, Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile; But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile: For there is no respect of persons with God.

niv "But because of your stubbornness and your unrepentant heart, you are storing up wrath against yourself for the day of God’s wrath, when his righteous judgment will be revealed. God “will repay each person according to what they have done.”[SUP] [/SUP]To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life. But for those who are self-seeking and who reject the truth and follow evil, there will be wrath and anger. There will be trouble and distress for every human being who does evil: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile; but glory, honor and peace for everyone who does good: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile. For God does not show favoritism.

Grace777x70 · Jul 25, 2016

Thank God that John told us in his epistle exactly what God's commandments are now in the New Covenant which we are in now after the death and resurrection of our Lord Jesus Christ.

1 John 3:23 (NASB)

[SUP]23 [/SUP] This is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us.

Thank you Jesus that we believe in all that you accomplished for us on the cross and in your eesurrection. That we have died with you on the cross and we were raised to newness of life in You.

We can love because you first loved us and the Holy Spirit has poured your love into our new hearts! Without You we can do nothing. You are the Vine we are the branches - bear Your fruit in and through us to a hurt and dying world as we behold your glory as in a mirror.

the truth in the words of paul...

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