Grace alone or grace plus works?

[seed_time_harvest]

The same GOD that spoke In the Old covenant Is the same GOD that spoke the New covenant and since GOD does not change should we try to keep the law and be under grace?

Some believe that salvation Is by Grace through faith alone but some believe That salvation Is by Grace by Grace through faith plus works.where do you stand on this Issue?

 

[trofimus]

I think works are needed.

Repentance is a work too. And you cant be saved without a repentance.

I do not think that some measurement of works is needed to be saved. But some change truly is needed.

 

[Lynx]

Is this competition for the Not By Works thread... or is it a replacement, since the Not By Works thread has gone so far off the rails that it is no longer even on the right continent?

 

[Lynx]

To answer the question - I think it's the wrong question, and therefore not answerable. One is saved by grace. After being saved, grace manifests works.

So if one claims to be saved, but no works show up, is one saved? Maybe, maybe not. That's between the person and God. But the person who was saved and does not manifest any works sure is lazy.

 

[Jackson123]

By faith we invite Jesus into our heart than Jesus Will bear fruit through us AS a branch.

work is a fruit, produce by vine not branch.

the whole procedure, I call It grace.

or we may say grace produce work.

 

[PennEd]

I think works are needed.

Repentance is a work too. And you cant be saved without a repentance.

I do not think that some measurement of works is needed to be saved. But some change truly is needed.

If by "repentance" you mean acknowledging you are a sinner in need of a Savior I'm with you, although I wouldn't classify it as a work.

However some people make repentance of individual sins a necessary condition for BEFORE salvation. If we had the ability to repent (turn from) individual sins BEFORE accepting Christ, Jesus died for nothing and we wouldn't need Him.

 

[trofimus]

If by "repentance" you mean acknowledging you are a sinner in need of a Savior I'm with you, although I wouldn't classify it as a work.

However some people make repentance of individual sins a necessary condition for BEFORE salvation. If we had the ability to repent (turn from) individual sins BEFORE accepting Christ, Jesus died for nothing and we wouldn't need Him.

Repentance, in Greek, means "to change one´s mind". I mean this.

 

[Snoozy]

If by "repentance" you mean acknowledging you are a sinner in need of a Savior I'm with you, although I wouldn't classify it as a work.

However some people make repentance of individual sins a necessary condition for BEFORE salvation. If we had the ability to repent (turn from) individual sins BEFORE accepting Christ, Jesus died for nothing and we wouldn't need Him.

jonah 3:10 And God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way; and God repented of the evil, that he had said that he would do unto them; and he did it not.

people can turn from individual sins before accepting Christ. thats how it was in the bible times

 

[Marcelo]

....should we try to keep the law and be under grace?

....some believe That salvation Is by Grace through faith plus works. where do you stand on this Issue?

I feel that salvation is by genuine grace through genuine faith. Good works are a consequence of being in a state of justification -- not the cause of being justified. If we don't have good works something must be wrong with us.

 

[PennEd]

jonah 3:10 And God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way; and God repented of the evil, that he had said that he would do unto them; and he did it not.

people can turn from individual sins before accepting Christ. thats how it was in the bible times

They heard the word Jonah preached to them, admitted (agreed with God that they were sinning, and petitioned Him.
God didn't change His mind about what He was going to do. He always knew THEY were going to change THEIR mind.

So we sin. Pre conversion we didn't really care about it except to the extent we'd get caught.
The Gospel is preached to us. We believe it and agree in mind with God that we are sinners in need of Him to save us. At that point the Holy Spirit seals us with His Presence and gives us the POWER to stop sinning.

 

[Issachar92]

Try to type in "faith alone" on a bible software and see what comes up.

James 2:24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.

Faith alone debunked by one verse. Thats cold!

 

[Issachar92]

They heard the word Jonah preached to them, admitted (agreed with God that they were sinning, and petitioned Him.
God didn't change His mind about what He was going to do. He always knew THEY were going to change THEIR mind.

So we sin. Pre conversion we didn't really care about it except to the extent we'd get caught.
The Gospel is preached to us. We believe it and agree in mind with God that we are sinners in need of Him to save us. At that point the Holy Spirit seals us with His Presence and gives us the POWER to stop sinning.

The Gospel in reverse.

Bible says repentance comes first. You say repentance comes after.

Rev 2:5 Remember therefore from whence thou art fallen, and repent, and do the first works; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will remove thy candlestick out of his place, except thou repent.

Mark 1:15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.

 

[notmyown]

we are saved BY GOD. full stop!

for the truly saved, works will follow, because GOD is faithful.

i cannot understand why this is so hard to grasp. lol

 

[Laish]

Repentance, in Greek, means "to change one´s mind". I mean this.

Not wanting to be a stickler here ,but how is it a work? Ok Thinking about it as I post . How do you define a work ? This is probably my problem in understanding you .
Blessings
Bill

 

[notuptome]

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

Paul writing to the Ephesians does not conflict with nor contradict James.

James states that if is a lifeless faith that produces no works for Christ. Jesus said we are branches that bear the fruit which the vine produces in us. If we have no fruit do we have a connection to the vine? Fruit declared in Gal 5:22-23.

To make works necessary to bring grace to fruition is to frustrate grace. Mercy stands by the power and determinate will of the Father.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[PennEd]

The Gospel in reverse.

Bible says repentance comes first. You say repentance comes after.

Rev 2:5 Remember therefore from whence thou art fallen, and repent, and do the first works; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will remove thy candlestick out of his place, except thou repent.

Mark 1:15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.

Yes. Repent of your beliefs, AND believe the Gospel.

It's about belief in Jesus NOT YOUR work of repenting of your sin.

Were you able or unable to stop sinning before being born again?
Paul says not only were we completely unable, but that we were DEAD. A dead man can't do anything but be dead.

 

[notuptome]

Yes. Repent of your beliefs, AND believe the Gospel.

It's about belief in Jesus NOT YOUR work of repenting of your sin.

Were you able or unable to stop sinning before being born again?
Paul says not only were we completely unable, but that we were DEAD. A dead man can't do anything but be dead.

Romans 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

The Greek conveys that to confess is to believe the same as. In this case believing the same as the scripture teaches about Christ's death, burial and resurrection.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[MichaelOwen]

Remember, when you have faith, and you are saved, your going to exhibit the works of Christ, they will be made manifest in you by the Holy Spirit, our Comforter. If one is not showing the works, that can mean one of two things ; Either that person wasn't truly saved to start, OR that person is out of fellowship with God, either way, that's a dangerous place to be.

 

[seed_time_harvest]

I think works are needed.

Repentance is a work too. And you cant be saved without a repentance.

I do not think that some measurement of works is needed to be saved. But some change truly is needed.

Hello trofimus,I think quite a few members here and abroad believe the exact same way.

Thanks for your reply.

 

[Jackson123]

Try to type in "faith alone" on a bible software and see what comes up.

James 2:24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.

Faith alone debunked by one verse. Thats cold!

To my knowledge Martin said: faith that save is never alone,

when you save you are like a branch that Will produce a fruit/work. But work is not save you, work is product of faith.

can you produce a work/pure loving work?

Jesus say No, branch can not bear fruit of itself, vine produce fruit.

so yes faith that save Will manifest in a good work, but good work not save you, faith is

[h=1]“We are saved by faith alone, but the faith that saves ​is never alone”[/h]
― Martin Luther
tags: christianity, faith, inspirational, religion