Speaking in Tongues Controversy

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Oct 12, 2013
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#1
There is controversy regarding speaking in tongues. The purpose for this is to show that there is more than one mode of tongues, and tongues are for everyone that is born of the spirit. The different modes are by gift of the spirit (1Corinthians), or by intercession (Romans), or upon first receiving the Holy Spirit (Acts). We begin with the book of Corinthians:

1 Corinthians 12:7 But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.
[8] For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit;
[9] To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;
[10] To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues:

Tongues and the interpretation takes place within a gathering of believers, usually taking place in church. Being moved by the Holy Spirit, a person stands up, speaks in tongues and sits down. A second person then stands up, speaks in tongues and sits down, and so a third. Then comes the interpretation. This is all done in an orderly fashion. The message is for time and place, and is for the edification of that body of believers.



However, that is not the only mode of tongues, and thereby controversy through misunderstanding. Lets turn to the book of Romans:

Romans 8:26 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.

This speaks of an intercessory mode of tongues. With this we make intercessory prayer, and have confidence that our prayers are in God’s will.

Intercessory tongues isn't a gift, but a mode or operation whereby the spirit moves. For example: Let's say that we walk into the Lord's house and we have a need that must be met. A saint begins to pray for us in tongues (as the Holy Ghost gives the utterance). This saint has never seen us before nor knows our need. But God knows. This is something on a personal level. This is something that meets a personal need.



The amazing thing about tongues, is that the Lord wants us to know it is available to everyone that has, or will have, the Holy Spirit as seen in the book of Acts. Which brings us to speaking in tongues as initial evidence of receiving the Holy Spirit the Bible way:

Acts 2:1 And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.
[2] And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.
[3] And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.
[4] And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

Throughout the book of Acts, everyone that received the Holy spirit had received with speaking in tongues as the spirit gave the utterance. Now, within the controversy there are some quick to point out a few scriptures whereby it is simply not recorded either one way or the other. However, they cannot provide a single scripture that says someone failed to speak in tongues. We do have tons of scripture that folks did speak in tongues, but simply a non-statement does NOT mean that anyone has not spoken, it is simply not mentioned.

Here is a scriptural example:
This is an account of the exact same event. Only one account offers more information than the other. See if you can spot it:

Matthew 26:51 And, behold, one of them which were with Jesus stretched out his hand, and drew his sword, and struck a servant of the high priest's, and smote off his ear.

John 18:10 Then Simon Peter having a sword drew it, and smote the high priest's servant, and cut off his right ear. The servant's name was Malchus.

You are correct, it was John that lists the name of the servant who's ear was smote off, AND lists the name of the person that had drew the sword. We have observed that the other scripture did not mention these facts, but where it is not mentioned does not mean that it did not happen.



Lets continue and find out how we can receive what God has offered to us:

Acts 2:12 And they were all amazed, and were in doubt, saying one to another, What meaneth this?
[13] Others mocking said, These men are full of new wine.
[14] But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judaea, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words:
[15] For these are not drunken, as ye suppose, seeing it is but the third hour of the day.
[16] But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;
[17] And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:
[18] And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:

Acts 2:37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
[38] Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
[39] For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.


Question: Why didn't Peter lead them through a sinner's prayer? Why didn't Peter say to accept Jesus as their personal saviour? Why didn't he say to simply "believe"? If there was ever a time to do all that, this certainly would have been it.

That is what happened on the birth day of the New Testament Church. The book of Acts did not end, there was no "Amen". It continues to this day. God's plan for salvation has not altered, it remains the same.

Let's turn to the book of Matthew...

Matthew 16:24 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.
[25] For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it.

If we are to take up our cross and follow Jesus we would have to do what he did. We would have to symbolize his death, burial, and resurrection. And, that is exactly what Peter said to do.

1. Repent = symbolic death
2. Be water baptized = symbolic burial
3. Receive Holy Spirit = symbolic resurrection

Romans 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
[5] For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:



Friend, I followed Acts 2:38 as per Peter's instructions. I had repented. I then found a church that would baptize me full immersion, and in Jesus name. After I was baptize, I could not fill myself with the Holy Spirit (as seen in the book of Acts), I tarried with faith that God would fulfill His promise (Acts 2:39).

Then, at church one Easter morning, after altar call, I went up front (as I always have) and raised my hands up to the Lord and closed my eyes, but this time was different. This time, when I raised up my hands and closed my eyes, I saw words with my eyes closed, and these words were not English. As I tried to pronounce what I thought these words might sound like, I was filled with the Holy Spirit, and I began to speak these words as though it were a language, fluently. Then, joy came down from above and rested upon me and then dissipated after a few minutes. I later remembered that joy is some of the fruit of the Holy Spirit. What happened that day changed my life forever.


I have spoken to people from around the world and find it amazing, those that do not speak in tongues, presume to be the foremost authority on the subject. Please don't let anyone tell you that you cannot receive something, that God himself, has waiting.

 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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#2
Psalm 52
Why boastest thou thyself in mischief, O mighty man?
the goodness of God endureth continually.
Thy tongue deviseth mischiefs; like a sharp rasor, working deceitfully.
Thou lovest evil more than good; and lying rather than to speak righteousness.
Selah.
Thou lovest all devouring words, O thou deceitful tongue.
God shall likewise destroy thee for ever,
he shall take thee away, and pluck thee out of thy dwelling place, and root thee out of the land of the living.
Selah.
The righteous also shall see, and fear, and shall laugh at him:
Lo, this is the man that made not God his strength;
but trusted in the abundance of his riches, and strengthened himself in his wickedness.
But I am like a green olive tree in the house of God:
I trust in the mercy of God for ever and ever.
I will praise thee for ever, because thou hast done it:
and I will wait on thy name;
for it is good before thy saints.

 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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#3
would that my tongue could be controlled even in a language we all understand.
 
Jun 30, 2011
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#4
I don't understand the logic behind everyone has to speak in tongues as proof that they are indwelt by the Holy Spirit.

If you do not have the Holy Spirit, you do not have salvation

A perverse and adulterous nation looks for a sign

Entire denomination built on 2 brothers asking what are physical signs of the Holy Spirit indwelling a believer - the only answer they cam up with is tongues - and of course within a short period of time they were speaking in tongues

Jewish Pentacost and Gentile Pentecost - 2 Separate and important events

There is a way that seems right to a man, and in the end is death

I have no problem with someone who actually has that gift, or think he does

The problem I have is when people go outside Ephesians 4:1-6 and say that unless you speak in tongues you do not have the Holy Spirit... sure they will say, oh no you can be saved without that - but the Bible teaches contrary

If I was a mod i would erase all threads on this topic
 
Jun 30, 2011
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#5
I would also add - this idea that everyone speaks in tongues also creates a lot of division - as we all know, and creates a lot of confusion - the reading of scripture is pretty plain: God does not author this confusion - people do ... God does not author division people do ... when they are taken away by the pride of life, the lusts of the flesh, and the lust of the eye
 
Oct 12, 2013
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#6
I don't understand the logic behind everyone has to speak in tongues as proof that they are indwelt by the Holy Spirit.
It's not about any proof as far as I'm concerened, although that certainly would be proof. I look at it this way, when a women is in a hospital room giving birth to a new baby, when the baby comes forth (baby is born) there is movement and sound and life. So it is also according to the spirit. That is how we are born of the spirit, and we know a new born saint is crying "Abba Father". The Apostle goes on to say that we are babes drinking only milk, but we grow and eat the meat of the word. All these scriptures are for the same doctrine, Born Again.
 
T

The_highwayman

Guest
#7
I don't understand the logic behind everyone has to speak in tongues as proof that they are indwelt by the Holy Spirit.

If you do not have the Holy Spirit, you do not have salvation

A perverse and adulterous nation looks for a sign

Entire denomination built on 2 brothers asking what are physical signs of the Holy Spirit indwelling a believer - the only answer they cam up with is tongues - and of course within a short period of time they were speaking in tongues

Jewish Pentacost and Gentile Pentecost - 2 Separate and important events

There is a way that seems right to a man, and in the end is death

I have no problem with someone who actually has that gift, or think he does

The problem I have is when people go outside Ephesians 4:1-6 and say that unless you speak in tongues you do not have the Holy Spirit... sure they will say, oh no you can be saved without that - but the Bible teaches contrary

If I was a mod i would erase all threads on this topic

You would be correct as far as those Pentecostal Denominations that have core doctrines or statements of faith tthat state matter of factly that the initial evidence of the Baptism of the Holy ghost is speaking in tongues.

That in of itself created and continues to create division. What makes more suspect is that the Largest Denomination that touts this, added to the 16 core beliefs based on personal interpretation of what was written in Acts 2.
 
A

abbiejean

Guest
#8

Friend, I followed Acts 2:38 as per Peter's instructions. I had repented. I then found a church that would baptize me full immersion, and in Jesus name. After I was baptize, I could not fill myself with the Holy Spirit (as seen in the book of Acts), I tarried with faith that God would fulfill His promise (Acts 2:39).

Then, at church one Easter morning, after altar call, I went up front (as I always have) and raised my hands up to the Lord and closed my eyes, but this time was different. This time, when I raised up my hands and closed my eyes, I saw words with my eyes closed, and these words were not English. As I tried to pronounce what I thought these words might sound like, I was filled with the Holy Spirit, and I began to speak these words as though it were a language, fluently. Then, joy came down from above and rested upon me and then dissipated after a few minutes. I later remembered that joy is some of the fruit of the Holy Spirit. What happened that day changed my life forever.


I have spoken to people from around the world and find it amazing, those that do not speak in tongues, presume to be the foremost authority on the subject. Please don't let anyone tell you that you cannot receive something, that God himself, has waiting.

I did too. While serving in the army. Was baptized in Jesus Name and filled with the Holy Ghost, spoke in tongues while being held in the arms of a precious dear sister in the Lord. What a service!!. I believe it 'cuz I've experienced it and NO ONE is gonna change my mind on that truth. :) God has made Himself real to this gal.

When I hear discussions regarding it not being truth...I just walk on pass, don't even enter therein or get involved. I know what I know. Bible declares when the Spirit of Truth is come, it will lead and guide into ALL truth. Jesus said, "I am the Way, the Truth and the Light."

I won't debate it, won't argue it, but I do embrace it as Truth. 100% sent from heaven...Truth.

Bless you, bro. Praise God for them altar calls, huh?!? :) :) I've wept at a few of 'em myself. Wonderful times while in the presence of the Lord. :) God is good. So very good!

In Jesus Name,

Abbie Jean
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
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#9
Classic example of feeling trumping what scripture has spoken. I would ask abbiejean what language did you speak?

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 

jb

Senior Member
Feb 27, 2010
4,940
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#10
Speaking in Tongues Controversy
A controversy ONLY arises in the mind of the person who doesn't believe the gift of tongues is still operational in the Church today and so doesn't have a clue what they are talking (or writing) about!

So, for those who are open minded you can find a study Here on the nine (spiritual) gifts of the Holy Spirit (including the gift of tongues)...

Yahweh Shalom...
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
36,886
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#11
Classic example of feeling trumping what scripture has spoken. I would ask abbiejean what language did you speak?

For the cause of Christ
Roger
i'd rather know what was said, translated into English, so the church could be edified.

but what language would be interesting too :)

if these things aren't known, i'm not sure but that the experience was worthless to anyone but abbiejean.
in any case, God may do as He pleases.
 

Nautilus

Senior Member
Jun 29, 2012
6,488
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#12
well if the general language of tongues wasnt along the lines of 'shamanahiya lammarammdingdong babalumagoozi' and maybe was an actual language, then I might consider it to be real. Instead I feel it's just an illusion of people trying to appear more holy than they are.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
36,886
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#13
A controversy ONLY arises in the mind of the person who doesn't believe the gift of tongues is still operational in the Church today and so doesn't have a clue what they are talking (or writing) about!
i don't think that's uniquely true. i don't say tongues are gone from the face of the earth, but a controversy arrives in my mind when tongues are encouraged more than interpretation. how many testimonies are there about speaking in tongues on this forum without any explanation of what the Spirit said ?

i'm much more concerned with what God has to say than with the lilt of His voice. so it's not for me troubling that some are given to speak in tongues. what bothers me is that i know the enemy can also possess a man's tongue, that many deceiving spirits are gone out into the world, and that i hear more about strange languages than i do about translations. maybe that's because i'm American though; few Americans speak more than one language.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
36,886
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#14
i had a surgery about 15 years ago under anesthesia.
they tell me as i was coming out of the OR and coming to, i was speaking to the nurses and everyone in Spanish.
i have no clear memory of this in my conscious mind.

i do know and understand Spanish; i grew up learning a little bit at home and taking a few courses in high school and college, but i'm not at all what anyone would call fluent.

i don't think i was speaking in tongues. who knows? was i?
 
Dec 9, 2013
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#15
The problem with tongues is that anyone can do it and you have no way of saying they're not.

I should clarify anyone who claims to be a spirit filed christian can do it.

I spoke in tongues during a very brief time in my life.
 

breno785au

Senior Member
Jul 23, 2013
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#16
I remember years ago after a prayer meeting which involved praying in tongues, a man from Ghana got up and said to one of our sisters, while you were praying you started speaking my mother language you kept saying the Lord is coming soon. - I always thought that to be quite profound.
 
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abbiejean

Guest
#17
i'd rather know what was said, translated into English, so the church could be edified.

but what language would be interesting too :)

if these things aren't known, i'm not sure but that the experience was worthless to anyone but abbiejean.
in any case, God may do as He pleases.
Amen and Amen! :)

Thank you, posthuman. :)
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
15,050
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#18
i'd rather know what was said, translated into English, so the church could be edified.
Especially in an English speaking church.
but what language would be interesting too :)
I should think it essential to be biblical.
if these things aren't known, i'm not sure but that the experience was worthless to anyone but abbiejean.
in any case, God may do as He pleases.
Ok this one really rots my socks. Let it be known that what pleases God is to honor His word. God never acts contrary to His word even though the corrupt mind of man toys with the though of what "if". It is impossible to think for a moment that God would act outside of His word. God is perfectly consistent in His actions toward men.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
E

Ecclesiastik

Guest
#19
I'm not sure why people who claim to honor the Bible put stipulations on spiritual gifts that the Bible does not. Paul even said "Do not forbid tongues".
 
T

The_highwayman

Guest
#20
Something to Ponder in Acts 2

Was the Spirit enabling Peter to speak in different languages to all those people?

-OR-

Did the Spirit open the ears of all who HEARD Peter , so that they all understood in their own language?

I do not speak Spanish at all,yet while on a crusade to Costa Rica and while praying in tongues for a man and his wife I was ministering to, they could understand everything I was saying and not either one of them could speak English.

The usher helping me was from Costa Rica and lived their his whole life and was bi-lingual and spoke both English and Spanish and was interpreting for me. The first thing he said to me was that the couple heard me and understood me! He further told me later after the service that i never spoke Spanish to them ever.

That made me re-think Acts 2, I was never speaking in Spanish, I was speaking in my prayer tongues, so did the Spirit open the ears of my hearers to hear and understand my prayer language in Spanish?

This is where the cessation doctrine loses ground and quickly. I have witnessed the same thing above happen to me in different countries and languages. I have also witnessed it happen to other folks that did not know the language of the people they were ministering to and never, not once, or ever did I hear them speaking in the native language of the place we were in, I only heard what some Christians love to call gibberish.

2 things happened in Acts 2 and its a shame many Christians chose to explain it away or disbelieve it altogether.

Cessation doctrine calls God a liar, ebcause God never changes and is the same yesterday, today and forever. If it worked in the upper room and needed then, it is needed now.