A Biblical treatment of the oneness doctrine.

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W

watchmen

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#141
Apr 23, 2009
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#141
Definition_Christ said:
Yes I agree with you there 1Covenant. I believe the Father is eternal and the Son is eternal. As well as the Holy Spirit being eternal. They are all separate distinct Persons, but they are ONE being.
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They may be distinct, but they are not separate nor are they ''persons'' but one in person. You are right about they fact that they are one being and not three, that is a starts :)
 
MahogonySnail

MahogonySnail

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#142
Jan 8, 2009
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#142
You are right about they fact that they are one being and not three, that is a starts
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But you've just defined one part of the Trinity doctrine: "one in being with the father".
 
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watchmen

Banned
#143
Apr 23, 2009
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#143
Definition_Christ said:
I'll give you an example of what I mean.
John 17:11
I will remain in the world no longer, but they are still in the world, and I am coming to you. Holy Father, protect them by the power of your name—the name you gave me—so that they may be one as we are one.

So that they may be ONE as we are ONE. So that they are in perfect unity/agreement, as we are in perfect unity/agreement.
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In this phrase Jesus is referring to the Son and the Father, you have to understand Christology, as well as the dual nature of Jesus to really grasp the Oneness of God. You seem to understand the dual nature of Jesus, but simply cannot get over the dominant teaching of the Trinity in our churches. I do understand this when God first revealed this truth to me I whole heartedly wanted to reject it. But it was coming straight from God I couldn't reject His leading.
 
MahogonySnail

MahogonySnail

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#144
Jan 8, 2009
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#144
so that they may be one as we are one.
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So was Jesus saying that all the disciples were one person was He?, as you say He was saying that the Father and Himself were one person?
 
1

1Covenant

Guest
#145
#145
Definition_Christ said:
Yes I agree with you there 1Covenant. I believe the Father is eternal and the Son is eternal. As well as the Holy Spirit being eternal. They are all separate distinct Persons, but they are ONE Being.

I'll give you an example of what I mean.
John 17:11
I will remain in the world no longer, but they are still in the world, and I am coming to you. Holy Father, protect them by the power of your name—the name you gave me—so that they may be one as we are one.

So that they may be ONE as we are ONE. So that they are in perfect unity/agreement, as we are in perfect unity/agreement.

Does Jesus mean so that they may be ONE as in so they may be one single person? Or does Jesus mean let them be ONE as in ONE being but many members. I say members because I am talking about the Body of Christ, One Body but many members.

Rom 12:4 For as we have many members in one body......

So if you believe Jesus is ONE with the Father as in ONE person or member. than you are saying that is how the body of Christ is. Because that is what Jesus is comparing. He is saying SO THAT THEY MAY BE ONE as we are ONE. Where as you and I are both members of the Body, we are ONE body but not ONE member.
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I agree...........
 
1

1Covenant

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#146
#146
watchmen said:
So when was the first time in scripture that God was reffered to as the Father? By Christ after the incarnation. God is truly eternal, however you may have a point about His role as Father to the Son.
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It was just a point of order. As a Trinitarian I can use it that way because of what I believe but for you it was a little inconsistent. Again, just a note.
 
1

1Covenant

Guest
#147
#147
watchmen said:
you have to understand...the dual nature of Jesus to really grasp the Oneness of God.
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Curious...Staying within this subject of the dual nature of Jesus. Who died on the cross?
 
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watchmen

Banned
#148
Apr 23, 2009
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#148
1Covenant said:
Curious...Staying within this subject of the dual nature of Jesus. Who died on the cross?
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The man Jesus Christ the Son of God. This has been thuroughly discussed check out page 6 of this thread.
 
J

Jezreel

Guest
#150
#150
Do you any of you notice that oneness and trinitarians all quote the same texts to prove their understanding of the Godhead?!! I notice that in the new covenant, it calls the holy spirit at times "the spirit of Christ" other times in this scripture it says, "God has sent the spirit of his SON into your hearts crying Abba Father". So, since we know there is only one spirit and God and father that is in all above all and through all, it should not be hard to understand.
 
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watchmen

Banned
#152
Apr 23, 2009
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#152
Jezreel said:
Do you any of you notice that oneness and trinitarians all quote the same texts to prove their understanding of the Godhead?!! I notice that in the new covenant, it calls the holy spirit at times "the spirit of Christ" other times in this scripture it says, "God has sent the spirit of his SON into your hearts crying Abba Father". So, since we know there is only one spirit and God and father that is in all above all and through all, it should not be hard to understand.
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I agree it shouldn't
 
MahogonySnail

MahogonySnail

Banned
#154
Jan 8, 2009
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#154
Do you any of you notice that oneness and trinitarians all quote the same texts to prove their understanding of the Godhead?!! I notice that in the new covenant, it calls the holy spirit at times "the spirit of Christ" other times in this scripture it says, "God has sent the spirit of his SON into your hearts crying Abba Father". So, since we know there is only one spirit and God and father that is in all above all and through all, it should not be hard to understand.
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Exactly, that's why Trinitarians say, One God, One Spirit, revealed to us in three persons. There is no argument with Trinitarians that there is One God who is One Spirit. "These three are one".
 
J

Jezreel

Guest
#155
#155
It depends on how you were both brainwashed to believe I guess (humor here, very "little" humor) Pastors on both sides of the fence will give their interpretations to the same scriptures. I DO BELIEVE IN BAPTISM IN THE NAME OF JESUS CHRIST BECAUSE THAT IS THE NAME OF THE FATHER AND SON AND HOLY SPIRIT, OR GHOST) Pentecostals call it, "holy ghost" and charasmatics call it, "holy spirit". Both oneness and trinitarians need to love one another and recognize that they love the same God which they do. This can go on and on and on. We have all been indoctrinated by the great whore and we all have to "come out of her my people".
 
D

Definition_Christ

Guest
#156
#156
lol...wow... lol
 
L

Leilaii425

Guest
#157
#157
Jezreel said:
It depends on how you were both brainwashed to believe I guess (humor here, very "little" humor) Pastors on both sides of the fence will give their interpretations to the same scriptures. I DO BELIEVE IN BAPTISM IN THE NAME OF JESUS CHRIST BECAUSE THAT IS THE NAME OF THE FATHER AND SON AND HOLY SPIRIT, OR GHOST) Pentecostals call it, "holy ghost" and charasmatics call it, "holy spirit". Both oneness and trinitarians need to love one another and recognize that they love the same God which they do. This can go on and on and on. We have all been indoctrinated by the great whore and we all have to "come out of her my people".
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How high is the fence??? Are the pastors neighbors or do they just happen to both be standing one either side of the fence?
 
W

watchmen

Banned
#159
Apr 23, 2009
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#159
MahogonySnail said:
Exactly, that's why Trinitarians say, One God, One Spirit, revealed to us in three persons. There is no argument with Trinitarians that there is One God who is One Spirit. "These three are one".
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The emboldened part of your statement is where your confusion comes in. He may have been revealed in 3 different ways, but God is but one person or being for a better word.
 
W

watchmen

Banned
#160
Apr 23, 2009
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#160
Jezreel said:
It depends on how you were both brainwashed to believe I guess (humor here, very "little" humor) Pastors on both sides of the fence will give their interpretations to the same scriptures. I DO BELIEVE IN BAPTISM IN THE NAME OF JESUS CHRIST BECAUSE THAT IS THE NAME OF THE FATHER AND SON AND HOLY SPIRIT, OR GHOST) Pentecostals call it, "holy ghost" and charasmatics call it, "holy spirit". Both oneness and trinitarians need to love one another and recognize that they love the same God which they do. This can go on and on and on. We have all been indoctrinated by the great whore and we all have to "come out of her my people".
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This brainwashing statement even though you might have meant as a joke and indoctrinated would be a better word, it doesn;t work with me. Because I was brought up/indoctrinated as a trinitarian, and it was God through His word and the leading of His Spirit that lead me to the Oneness doctrine.

P.S. I do love trinitarians, I simply disagree with what they teach.
 
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